"Pain Free" by Pete Egoscue

[Frank Silbermann]

I have the book now and am reading it. He teaches that the mis-alignments which cause wear and pain are cost by improper or inadequate movement, which leads to inadequate muscles, which leads to misuse of the body.

My only complaint is that there doesn't seem to be any recognition that some people's bones simply may not be ideally formed or shaped. For example, is it even possible for someone such as Pancho Segura (who suffered from rickets as a child) to walk forward properly using his knees and hips while his feet point straight ahead? What if a bone that should be straight is bent or twisted to a greater or lesser degree?

[Povl Carstensen]

Interesting book. I have used some of his exercises for the back and foot (plantar fasciitis). His chapter on shoes is also interesting reading concerning minimal shoes. He basically says, concerning shoes, less is more.

[charliefedererer]

There will always be exceptions.

So yes, specialized therapy would be required for someone with rickets.

How many people do you actually know who suffer from rickets?

How many people do you actually know abnormally shaped bones?




"When all you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail."

Pete Egoscue's advice will not apply to all.

Some may say that makes his advice wrong.

I'll bet his books and therapy have helped a lot - probably most.

And probably not harmed very many.


Hopefully Posture Guy, who is an Egoscue therapist who frequently posts here will weigh in.

[Posture Guy]

saw this thread through a google alert. Gotta love technology.

Charlie hit the nail on the head. And the OP's point is sound. Some people DO have congenital or trauma-related deviations from the postural blueprint. I'm an example. I was in a near fatal car accident back in 1992. Went form 70 mph to 0 in less than a second. Fractured several bones in my spine, my sternum, lots of soft tissue damage, and on it goes. There is a segment of my spine that is supposed to articulate at least a little bit and does not move at all. So there are some of our exercises where when I do them, it ain't pretty.

The goal with EVERYONE is to bring them back to as close to the postural and functional blueprint as their situation permits. No one has perfect posture, everyone has 'their stuff', but the question is, can it get better? I've yet to meet the person where the answer was no.

Sometimes in people's heads, perfection is the enemy of better. I'm a big fan of better.

[Frank Silbermann]

Originally Posted by Posture Guy

..Some people DO have congenital or trauma-related deviations from the postural blueprint. ...The goal with EVERYONE is to bring them back to as close to the postural and functional blueprint as their situation permits. No one has perfect posture, everyone has 'their stuff', but the question is, can it get better? I've yet to meet the person where the answer was no.

Sometimes in people's heads, perfection is the enemy of better. I'm a big fan of better.

Well, that makes much more sense. In fact, quite a few people do have bowed legs, knock-knees, feet that are angled in the direction of clubfoot but not so much that they are unable to pronate the sole to the floor -- not from neglect, but since infancy. But often those led to accommodations that are less than optimal.

[vegasgt3]

I do some egoscue stretches and they have eliminated my knee pain.

[Posture Guy]

Frank....yes.

And what I've found is that let's take someone, for example, with bowledggedness (varus knee stress). What tends to happen is over time, it gets more pronounced as their motion patterns "feed" the muscles that are already over-engaged in supporting this posture, thus amplifying it. We'll see folks with bowledggedness or knock knees (valgus knee stress) where it will get significantly better through corrective exercises, as we're now able to strip away the layer of it that is NOT congenital, but is instead lifestyle-driven. And the more neutral a position we can get the knee in, the longer that knee will last and the more it will be able to do.

[sixftlion]

I love Pete Egoscue's stuff. I read his books long time ago, tried many exercises in my training and eventually adopted some of it into my style. The majority of my clients get great relief with some of the simple exercises, too.

PostureGuy is correct that a lot of the "born with" stuff is just something that was very mild sometimes long time ago and that with time and incorrect movement grew into something huge. It's never too late to start correcting things. It can take longer if the person has had the problem for long time, but any improvement is better than nothing. Patience and discipline to do the work is the key. Sometimes people give up way too early.

[Povl Carstensen]

I have done the same. "Lifted" some exercises that seem to work for me. In one sense the exercises can seem a bit different and difficult, so I can understand that some people work as instructors in it. On the other hand, the great thing is that they mostly are different than your regular stretches and so forth, so it is a inspiring supplement to more conventional exercises.

[Posture Guy]

One piece of advice: if you're doing stuff from the book, do the exercises in order. Don't treat them as a 'buffet'. One sets you up for the next, etc... They're not just thrown together, but have a method to their madness, so to speak.

And sixftlion, thanks for chiming in! And I haven't forgotten about you, I'm gonna get you that article. Just had an 'interesting' year. Had an accident in May, tore some stuff up in my right (dominant) shoulder, had surgery in July but they found some stuff in the shoulder they had not obtained consent to optimally deal with while they were in there, things they didn't expect, so we tried to work around it but no joy. Getting cut on again in a couple of weeks. Will get back to you shortly after that.

And the moral of that long story is try not to get into accidents while doing high speed racing go karts.

[Fee]

Might be time for me to check out the book and the woman's book from the library again. My right shoulder and neck is acting up again, no one ever really told me what was wrong with it the last time.

[akind]

Thank you for sharing the info. Looks like a really good book. I will let my friend (who has severe tendonitis) know about it... the ebook is not that expensive!

[robbyh]

I hurt my hip this fall playing tennis. It was kind of odd because it felted real deep in the muscle but I could still play tennis. the league is over and I have been using the egoscue method to try and straighten out my body but when I do those exercises they do not hurt but hours later my hip will start hurting. Should I quit doing those exercises or is the hurting means it is working?
Thanks for any advice.

[vin]

Originally Posted by Frank Silbermann

What if a bone that should be straight is bent or twisted to a greater or lesser degree?

I think the best you can do is to become as familiar as possible with the limitations and potential consequences imposed by whatever structural deviations you might have. This may simply mean fine tuning your technique and/or fitness training, or depending on the severity of your issue, perhaps even evaluating the risk/reward ratio of even playing a physically demanding sport like tennis.

One thing I would pay particular attention to is if the structural deviation predisposes to overuse of any particular muscles as this is something that you have control over.

If possible, find someone with a good understanding of functional anatomy and movement dysfunction to help you through this. If you're brave enough to dig in yourself, Diagnosis and Treatment of Movement Impairment Syndromes by Shirley Sahrmann would be a good place to look. It's not easy reading, though. Especially if your anatomy knowledge is limited.

[tennis forlife]

The book helped me with osteoarthritis pain in big toe. I do the general routine daily and the tennis one twice a week. The air-bench is brutal, but I never give up and after feel like steel all day. Currently, I need help with a low-intensity shoulder pain that came out of nowhere. It doesn't bother me when I play. It hurts to raise my arm palm-up about two feet from my body. Can anyone help?

[tennis forlife]

Sorry. I meant palm-down. If I have my arm at my side and lift straight out slowly, at about 2" there is a pretty sharp pain, in addition to a constant sort of low pain. HELP!

[Chas Tennis]

Originally Posted by tennis forlife

Sorry. I meant palm-down. If I have my arm at my side and lift straight out slowly, at about 2" there is a pretty sharp pain, in addition to a constant sort of low pain. HELP!

2 inches or 2 feet as in your first reply?

If your palms are down and you get pain when you raise your arm one common possibility is impingement. Rotating the shoulder internally - upper arm bone rotates around it axis - as you are doing and raising the arm causes less clearance under the acromion because a bony attachment on the upper arm squeezes shoulder structures such as the supraspinatus tendon.

Search TW for recent threads and especially see the Ellenbecker video on shoulder anatomy and impingement.

See a Dr for a diagnosis. I believe, but do not know, that the shoulder can experience impingement damage without much early pain.

[danix]

Just got wind of the egoscue thing and am going to check it out. Might be too late for me, but maybe not.

[corbind]

Originally Posted by danix

Just got wind of the egoscue thing and am going to check it out. Might be too late for me, but maybe not.

Is it working?

[danix]

Haven't found the book yet, will have to order it off amazon.