Federer Chop backhand slice---It doesn't work

[5263]

Originally Posted by Nostradamus

Here are fundamentals of slice backhand

http://www.fuzzyyellowballs.com/vide...-fundamentals/

wow, that is really some bare basics there.

[luvforty]

wrist and racket does NOT stay in the same relationship.

[Cheetah]

Originally Posted by luvforty

wrist and racket does NOT stay in the same relationship.

pretty much. fed has wrist extension while it's above his shoulders. (cupped). most players don't do that. but as soon as he starts swinging his wrist goes immediately back to neutral and stays that way until after contact.

extending the wrist while above your head serves no purpose since contact is not made with an extended wrist and there is no wrist flexation in a slice so it's just a little quirk.

[luvforty]

fair enough, just wanted to clear this up... i have seen lots people cup the wrist and let it stay cupped thru the swing and the ball pops up.

[Cheetah]

... and i will add that if you're hitting one of those swervy slices on a low ball then you will have some wrist radial deviation in order to make the low contact.

[Cheetah]

Originally Posted by luvforty

fair enough, just wanted to clear this up... i have seen lots people cup the wrist and let it stay cupped thru the swing and the ball pops up.

fair enough. i've seen it too. important part is at contact wrist is pretty neutral and contact not too far out in front almost on side and a degree of across in the swing. the across helps the face stay on a consistent plane so you don't open it up plus it adds some margin w/ the spin.

[luvforty]

Originally Posted by Cheetah

... and i will add that if you're hitting one of those swervy slices on a low ball then you will have some wrist radial deviation in order to make the low contact.

yup - Navratilova calls that 'throwing the wrist out'...... well, actually due to the momentum of the racket, that deviation inevitably happens, but more visible when the contact is low.

[Cheetah]

yea. some players don't even for low balls. personal pref i guess.
like lubicic here. he's getting crazy spin on these low slices but it appears he's not breaking his wrist.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NpD8m_X5qSM&t=12s

[10isfreak]

Originally Posted by 5263

his extreme downward aspect is probably a bit much for most players to handle
and even leads him to a few UEs in bad situations too.
Take his across the ball aspect and use that with a less aggressive downward
drive and see if that doesn't fix things..

What I explained about the forehand is worthy of attention here... the more downward you swing, the lower the ball flies. Federer makes contact pretty high when he hits with extreme downward action and people exaggerate it too much when they try to copy him.

As you move the ball up your strike zone, a slice should be hit with a more vertical swing... as the ball get lower, players tend to hit it more horizontally. This is a consistent hypothesis with my previous posts and I‘d like it to be further researched... but as it happens, hitting more accross the ball, aiming for more side spin enables player to get some lift on low balls. Hitting way downward drives the ball right into the net, so it‘s hard to do like Fed... if you go too far, you get the net.

[luvforty]

^^ no.. swing path and face angle are 2 different things.

[Wodz]

I can execute this shot perfectly and find that most players have absolutely no idea how to pull this off. Usually because they are trying to hard and skip on the basics. I see a lot of people starting a slice below their armpit and take an aggressive stab at the ball.

I think Cheetah's post is perfect. Focus on those steps slowly and DO NOT RUSH! Stay very relaxed while attempting this shot

[NLBwell]

Originally Posted by luvforty

OP you are not doing it right.

The Fed slice is a superior technique comparing to the Kenny slice, in the context of the modern rackets.

No, it is not. It is a different shot for different purposes.
That is like saying a heavy topspin shot is superior than a medium topspin shot. One is not superior, you use them in different situations.

[luvforty]

name one pro today who hits the kenny slice

[NLBwell]

Everyone on low balls they want to hit back deep into the court with some velocity. Sometimes they put a lot of sidespin on them, and sometimes not depending upon what they want to do.

[sureshs]

Originally Posted by NLBwell

No, it is not. It is a different shot for different purposes.
That is like saying a heavy topspin shot is superior than a medium topspin shot. One is not superior, you use them in different situations.

That is right. His slice was in lieu of an attacking top spin backhand of today. It was a slice drive, intended to serve as more than a neutralizing shot, almost a weapon. You can still see that being hit by older players who used to be on the tour or college.

[luvforty]

Originally Posted by NLBwell

Everyone on low balls they want to hit back deep into the court with some velocity. Sometimes they put a lot of sidespin on them, and sometimes not depending upon what they want to do.

that is the later portion of a chop swing, not a kenny slice.

[Relinquis]

what is a kenny slice? never heard that term before.

[luvforty]

ken rosewall

[luvforty]

yandell has something interesting

http://www.tennisplayer.net/public/a...n_pro_slice_1/

[5263]

Originally Posted by luvforty

yandell has something interesting

http://www.tennisplayer.net/public/a...n_pro_slice_1/

You can really see here how the players who work across the contact like
modern technique, get way more spin than the old style, where the instruction
was to push out more down the target line.
What you can't see is how much better control they have as well.
Nice link!