Swingweight - the most important spec

[movdqa]

> Arm is not supposed to be using much muscle to swing the racket.

That's true with higher SW racquets but I think that those using lighter racquets are using arm swingspeed to generate power and spin. It's an adjustment both ways. When I first used the PDR, I was wondering where the power was because I was used to plowthrough and a relatively slow swing which doesn't work that well with a PDR.

[Power Player]

I agree. My Blade only started feeling light to me once I consistently involved my torso in every shot and used my offhand properly on my forehand. And to be honest, I may prefer that weight - who knows.

But my first foray back into 12oz land was really fun with this stick. I did not have any issues with the weight, and my serve seemed to move the same. I just focused on hitting the ball with my body and everything was fine. It takes a while to figure out ideal weights, so I am still messing around.

One thing is that the higher SW makes tennis easier in a way. It just ensures you will hit a ball back that is deep. With a stock blade, it takes more rotation and effort to not cough up a short ball on my backhand side if Im pulled wide. The high SW version gives me a lot more pop for my effort. I hit a pretty compact and flat backhand, and it was very easy to crack it deep even if pulled wide.

Forehand is where I question my lead placement. I have it at 12, and since the Blade is already polarized in stock form, I felt it twisting on my forehand sometimes. I also felt like the lead at 12 lent itself more towards brushing the ball, and I like to hit through it. I still was able to adjust and hit my forehand, but I am thinking lead at 3 and 9 suit me better.

Either way, I will have it set up so my SW is around 345, which I feel is pretty high, but not insane.

[fgs]

power player,

there are also other options like 11 and 1 o'clock! that was what i liked most back in the time of my nblades. adds up a bit on torsional stability without giving too much in in respect to polarization.

[kaiser]

Originally Posted by Power Player

According to RPNY, swing weight is the most important spec in a racquet in today's game.

Many people advocate using the highest SW possible. This makes sense. The question is really - how high can you go?

The next question is - how good is your technique? Or more like - how loose is your arm? I feel like the only way to use a higher SW racquet is with a loose arm. You have to commit to this style of hitting, but it is how the best players hit. If anyone has gotten this going, they will feel it - the louder, richer crack of the ball and the effortless power you get from using your core and keeping your arms as relaxed as possible.

Once you get to that point the final challenge is what weight is ideal for keeping your contact point consistent. By that I mean, what weight helps you make contact without flopping your wrist and losing your contact point?

I think if that gets dialed in, you may find your ideal SW is higher than you think. Or maybe not. I am still messing with it. It is safe to say that at 331, I feel I can go higher. So I plan to hop it up to ~345 and see if I can handle that.

The best way to figure this stuff out so far for me is to have 2 identical racquets and a go to string setup. Use the same string and tension and keep one racquet stock and the other as your experiment.

The goal for me is to get a SW that helps me stay in control on my swing, but also does not tire me out over the match. Sometimes with lighter sticks it can be tempting to over-swing in pressure situations.

If anyone has done this, feel free to chime in.

My main point is that I believe most racquet makers know rec players arm the ball too much and therefore keep the SWs around 330 or less. It also is not a must, so many players with good technique simply may prefer a lower SW.

This is all an experiment for me. What I am looking for is a heavier SW to keep my swing more relaxed and also to pull my racquet even deeper when I drop the racquet on serve.

I have played specced out sticks with pro level SWs, and there was a lot of things I really liked about the racquets set up that way. I believe a more realistic weight for me is probably around 345/345 for weight/SW, but even that could be too heavy or too light. I will need to experiment over some time and see how it goes.

Hey PP, interesting experiment! I was actually on the verge of starting a similar experiment in the other direction, towards lower swing weight. For the past three years I have been playing with my 4D200 Tours with SW probably in the high 340s. I totally understand what you're saying about being able to play with a totally relaxed swing using your core and a loose arm. It's a magical feeling, especially at the end of a session with my coach as we play some points and I'm completely in the zone. However... when I play a singles match, which I don't do very often these days, I tend to get tight and my swing is liable to break down. This is, of course, primarily me, but I would like to rule out the possibility that my current rackets are limiting me, so I would like to try out something slightly more forgiving with a slightly lower SW. I'm trying to get my hands on a Donnay Gold 99 which I could easily lead up to SW between 320 and mid 340s. In the mean time, I will be following your experiment with great interest...

[Power Player]

Kaiser you bring up great points. Only way I can tell is over time. I will say that I have 2 Blades strung the same at the same tension. One is stock and one is 355 grams, Sw of 343. Basically a very nice weighting that is not overkill.

I think the only way to find ideal weighting is to start with a lighter stick with a decent SW and play with it for a while until it just gets to where you know the racquet and have an established string setup and tension.

there are a ton of advantages to heavy sticks, but if I am late or fatigued, they are not available to me.

Also, I have to factor in the hot summers here.

One thing I do notice is that with lighter sticks, I have to swing harder. It drains me of energy faster. With the heavier stick I can swing more relaxed and still hit a deep ball. The challenge is to maintain good head speed to keep the ball in the lines.

We shall see how it goes.

[Sreeram]

I don't think if the arm gets tired means we are arming the ball. The arm swings the racquet as well in a FH else why is the arm finishing windshield wiper flow when the torso has finished turning? The weight behind the short should not be supplied by the arm but the whole torso swinging with the arm. Hence arm can get tired as well.

The probability of a payer arming the ball is higher with a lighter racquet than a heavier one.

[JackB1]

Originally Posted by Power Player

Kaiser you bring up great points. Only way I can tell is over time. I will say that I have 2 Blades strung the same at the same tension. One is stock and one is 355 grams, Sw of 343. Basically a very nice weighting that is not overkill.

I think the only way to find ideal weighting is to start with a lighter stick with a decent SW and play with it for a while until it just gets to where you know the racquet and have an established string setup and tension.

there are a ton of advantages to heavy sticks, but if I am late or fatigued, they are not available to me.

Also, I have to factor in the hot summers here.

One thing I do notice is that with lighter sticks, I have to swing harder. It drains me of energy faster. With the heavier stick I can swing more relaxed and still hit a deep ball. The challenge is to maintain good head speed to keep the ball in the lines.

We shall see how it goes.

Again....no black/white answer when it comes to heaviness. As you add more and more weight, there will always be a point you hit where there will be diminishing returns. The trick is figuring out where that point is for your own self.

[JackB1]

Originally Posted by Sreeram

I don't think if the arm gets tired means we are arming the ball. The arm swings the racquet as well in a FH else why is the arm finishing windshield wiper flow when the torso has finished turning? The weight behind the short should not be supplied by the arm but the whole torso swinging with the arm. Hence arm can get tired as well.

The probability of a payer arming the ball is higher with a lighter racquet than a heavier one.

that may be true, but the weight of a racquet will not fix someone's techinque. If you "arm the ball" with a light racquet, you will do the same thing with a heavier one, but it will have more magnified consequences.

[klementine79]

Been thinking about this, come to some conclusions.

Personally, I either need a
1- high swing weight, low static weight stick

or

2- low'sh swing weight, high static weight stick

I don't know. Not playing as much as I'd like to these days, so the mind starts to over think certain things. Guess I gotta move to florida.

[naturallight]

Sorry if this is already been covered, but what is a good rule of thumb for how much additional static weight impacts swingweight? For example if I add 0.2 ounces (5.7 g) at 3 or 9 o'clock, how much will swingweight increase? 10 pts?

[Gee]

Originally Posted by naturallight

Sorry if this is already been covered, but what is a good rule of thumb for how much additional static weight impacts swingweight? For example if I add 0.2 ounces (5.7 g) at 3 or 9 o'clock, how much will swingweight increase? 10 pts?

Here you go:
http://www.racquettech.com/store/lea...nedswtbal.html

[Power Player]

I'd go with 6 grams which is 4 6 inch strips. It will add roughly 12 points.

[kaiser]

Originally Posted by Power Player

Kaiser you bring up great points. Only way I can tell is over time. I will say that I have 2 Blades strung the same at the same tension. One is stock and one is 355 grams, Sw of 343. Basically a very nice weighting that is not overkill.

I think the only way to find ideal weighting is to start with a lighter stick with a decent SW and play with it for a while until it just gets to where you know the racquet and have an established string setup and tension.

there are a ton of advantages to heavy sticks, but if I am late or fatigued, they are not available to me.

Also, I have to factor in the hot summers here.

One thing I do notice is that with lighter sticks, I have to swing harder. It drains me of energy faster. With the heavier stick I can swing more relaxed and still hit a deep ball. The challenge is to maintain good head speed to keep the ball in the lines.

We shall see how it goes.

Having seen a vid of you hitting, I don't doubt that you have the strength and the strokes to benefit from a high SW. I think the biggest challenge is in the footwork, one has to be in position and prepared early in order to involve one's core properly in one's strokes.

Personally, when on court I've never felt my Tours to be too heavy for me, it's only when I'm on this forum (which is far too often these days...) that I start wondering that they may be limiting me. Indeed, I've discussed this with three different coaches I worked with over the past year, and none thought my rackets were too heavy for me. Yes, perhaps a lighter stick might help me in tight situations, but I'm a big guy (1m96, 97 kg) with long strokes, so the consensus was I need a heavier racket.

[Irakli]

PP,

I remember you trying MgR/I thing (I was following that thread as I was looking to try it myself) and thus going up high in the swingweight, but then I also remember you saying the high swingweight didn't work for you for certain reasons.

Absolutely no offence, just out of curiosity, why do you try to go up again? What has changed?

I'm also trying to dial in the “best” working swingweight for me, but I’m still in trial and error period, so this thread got me really interested…

Regards,
Irakli

[Power Player]

Not much has changed. It is looking like my ideal SW is between 335-340 from this experimentation.

The MgR stick was just too heavy at the time. But I always revisit heavier sticks now and then as I play with a more and more loose arm.

I plan to put 2 grams at 12 on each stick for now and go from there. I'll have them at 335 SW which swings really well on the Blades.

[TheLambsheadrep]

After reading a ton of stuff on the boards from Travlerajm and xFullCourtTenniSx, I went head first (yet knowing my limits) into racquet weight customizing. I brought my first set of racquets to 360g and 330SW, and my second set to 360g and 350SW (they were about an oz heavier and had a higher SW than the first set at both set's original specs). I thought I was all good and mission accomplished, but then I read the posts about Mgr/I and realized my racquets needed to be +13oz for it to be achieved. I didn't think I was ready for that, but then I got a POG recently that weighed in stock at about 13.5oz and 365W, and when I measured everything I needed to get Mgr/I, it came out right about at the optimized number, STOCK! So after I hit with it more and realized I could handle the weight, I went to a racquet from the first set of racquets that I had not customized yet. It is now 380g (A LOT of lead all the way up and down the handle) and 365SW, balance roughly 7pts HL. It feels so great, and a year ago I never would have thought this would be a good idea.

Moral of the story - Travlerajm's insight on massive weight and swing weight can be utilized, but I would recommend working your way up to it. It's just like an actual work out, if you're just starting and try to bench 300lbs, you're going to hurt yourself and probably be discouraged enough to give it up. The one thing I don't like about weight customization is that it should be specific to you, and that can require a lot of trial and error. Especially if lead is under the grip, it's a long process of taking off the grip, removing, adding, or relocating tape, taping the grip back up, measuring the new specs, then trying it out again. Sometimes you liked it the way it was better or just think the new specs aren't good either...judgements can be made in haste...The whole thing from start to finish takes patience, be 100% sure of that. This is what I did though - while it is important to get your results specific to you, you may not know where to start. I personally had no idea what might be the best for me initially. But don't we all want to be like the pros or at least want to feel what they're swinging? On talk tennis there is so much info about one specific player's racquet specs and even averages for the tour by certain years. I found out that 360g is about average for pro weight, and since that was relatively close to my second set of racquets, that's how I wanted to start. That thinking may not be for everyone, but that's what I did and it worked fine and began my learning experience

[YesTennis]

I've been thinking about the new Wilson Blade 98 (16X19). The SW seems to be in the optimal range that most here are talking about. Any reason why it is on 1 point HL. As a "players frame," it seems that most would prefer more HL in order whip or increase the racquet head speed. Has anyone tried it or have any thoughts?

[PED]

Originally Posted by Power Player

I plan to put 2 grams at 12 on each stick for now and go from there. I'll have them at 335 SW which swings really well on the Blades.

PP, so are you going to use the blade stock plus 2g or will the 2g be inaddition to the 350 or so gram setup?

[Power Player]

Originally Posted by YesTennis

I've been thinking about the new Wilson Blade 98 (16X19). The SW seems to be in the optimal range that most here are talking about. Any reason why it is on 1 point HL. As a "players frame," it seems that most would prefer more HL in order whip or increase the racquet head speed. Has anyone tried it or have any thoughts?

It's a light stick. Weighs in around 325 before dampener and grip. So balancing it like that makes it more solid.

Originally Posted by PED

PP, so are you going to use the blade stock plus 2g or will the 2g be inaddition to the 350 or so gram setup?

No, stock plus 2 grams in handle and 2 grams at 12.

I figure I can always add 2 more grams down the road if needed.