Doubles positioning before the point starts

[Cindysphinx]

Originally Posted by chatt_town

Lucky,

Do you not agree though that you can have your hips and feet turned toward the net person and still watch the server? It would seem to me that it is just two extra steps you have to take when you can already be in that position before the ball is served.

If you turned with hips and feet facing the the server, once he strikes the ball you then have to pivot both feet to the net person and as most if not all of us have footwork issues at times...doesn't it just cause an issue where it doesn't have to be? There is nothing the server can do to you at that point. Your focus it seems would be on the serviceline first and then the net person.


P.S....how did I do Cindy?

Those are two of the most magnificent paragraphs I have ever seen!!

[spot]

Originally Posted by chatt_town

Nah bro...not at a-4. I haven't run across one man that would double bagel her in a singles match and that's not me taking up for her. I'm just telling you these guys are for the most part spinning serves in. Even he at times got his serve hammered by her if he missed the T or the corner. lol Once the serve comes back many of those guys would have movement issues with her. We were at line 2.

I understand what you are saying about those guys at AA and even many at A-1 and A-2. We played 3 and 4 when we won city finals at A-1 and A-2 mixed. She pretty much handled those guys serves and we broke them at will. I was the one at times having problems holding serve is why many of them even stayed in matches. Since my serve is weak I really concentrate more on my return and volley as it relates to doubles. I think we lost 4 matches in 3 years playing every week for two different seasons each year. We did drop one this year to a couple that lobbed us to death. We have to address that. We do it to everyone but never had it done to us to the extent we got it a couple of weeks ago. lol

Are you on the kind of team where the women play AA for women's season and the guys play lower? I know a LOT of people on teams at the A4 and A5 levels. Just thinking of the line 1 and 2 girls and the line 1 and 2 guys there is a huge discrepancy. I really have no clue what teams you are facing where the line 1 and 2 guys are just spinning serves in. I think you are probably just a bit delusional about what you should be able to expect from a line 2 woman when it comes to returning serve against a good team.

I guess I just come at this from a different POV. I know only a few teams where the women are rated higher than the guys. If they are rated evenly I would still expect the guy to be at a huge advantage. If a 4.5 guy and a 4.5 girl were to play singles I'd expect the score to be right around 6-0 6-0. If you were to play against your wife what do you think the score would be?

[LuckyR]

Originally Posted by chatt_town

Lucky,

Do you not agree though that you can have your hips and feet turned toward the net person and still watch the server? It would seem to me that it is just two extra steps you have to take when you can already be in that position before the ball is served.

If you turned with hips and feet facing the the server, once he strikes the ball you then have to pivot both feet to the net person and as most if not all of us have footwork issues at times...doesn't it just cause an issue where it doesn't have to be? There is nothing the server can do to you at that point. Your focus it seems would be on the serviceline first and then the net person.


P.S....how did I do Cindy?

Yes, you are, of course correct. You can face one way and turn your head to look at multiple locations over the course of the flight of the serve.

My matches are not televised so I don't actually know for certain how much of my shifting is head vs footwork. My post was based on my assumption that I am doing a majority of my shifting using footwork. This is in part because I try to always be on the move, as my tactics include opportunity poaching (as opposed to called poaches).

But regardless, my point when speaking of "positioning" in my post, was more about where to stand on the court, not so much about which way to face once you are there.

[chatt_town]

A 4.0 guy will beat a 4.5 woman. I've never lost to her and I'm rated 4.0. What I mean by spinning serves in is this. Most men even at a-1 can't get the first serve bombs in on a consistent basis. If they do...sure the woman has a problem returning it and for that matter so does the man. I'm talking about percentages. I've never played AA but I've watch some of the matches and you are right in that a guy would and could give a woman some serious problems but I've also seen some women that b*otch slap men's kick serves as well @ AA....rare but I have seen it. From the matches that I've seen even @ AA, I'd be surprised if men get more than 50 percent of their first serve(bombs) in. They are mostly serving high percentage big kick serves. I watched the team that won the AA-3 this past fall(Terril Mill). I know and have seen those guys...They are serving up kick serves more than anything. So it's not like you got John Isner or Andy Roddick coming at you at any level.

As far as being delusional...I don't think so at all. I've played in 4 city finals from A-4 to A-1. I've seen pretty much what goes on. You didn't ask how my wife would do against a 4.5 man. You said that guys at a-4 at lines 1 and 2 would double bagel woman. I'm telling you that not only would these guys we faced not double bagel her...at least a couple of them would lose to her. You know just as well as I do that there are some guys that don't even play singles not to mention they are in horrible shape(pulling their shirt back down after every serve or point etc).

I'm at the top of the food chain in 4.0 for the most part and I can tell you that I wouldn't lose in singles to any of the guys that I just played including the team that beat us. Doubles is much different than singles. It's not as simple as saying a woman would lose to a man just because she is a woman. A fat@$$ man that does not play singles playing a good woman that is in shape and does play singles would have some serious problems. So I think what we have a difference of opinion is the level that the men are at this a-4 level. Now we only have 7 teams...so there may be some studs in our division. We will find out in a few weeks in the playoffs.

As far as what kind of team we are on, we are on the kind of team where friends play with each and while we want to win, it's not the number 1 priority. I think my wife is the only AA player on the roster. Most of those women come from like a-6 or a-7. We don't sit around and use formulas & ***** trying to get to play B-1 with Div 1 college players. Truth is we may not come close to winning city but for this to be winter Tennis, we are having a blast. If more people would approach it that way, it would be more fun.

P.S There is a kick @$$ Water's Edge team that is kicking eveyone in. So tell any of your friends at A-1 to watch out.lol They have a much better team than we had when we won A-1 mixed.

Originally Posted by spot

Are you on the kind of team where the women play AA for women's season and the guys play lower? I know a LOT of people on teams at the A4 and A5 levels. Just thinking of the line 1 and 2 girls and the line 1 and 2 guys there is a huge discrepancy. I really have no clue what teams you are facing where the line 1 and 2 guys are just spinning serves in. I think you are probably just a bit delusional about what you should be able to expect from a line 2 woman when it comes to returning serve against a good team.

I guess I just come at this from a different POV. I know only a few teams where the women are rated higher than the guys. If they are rated evenly I would still expect the guy to be at a huge advantage. If a 4.5 guy and a 4.5 girl were to play singles I'd expect the score to be right around 6-0 6-0. If you were to play against your wife what do you think the score would be?

[chatt_town]

We are going to have to work on getting your area a local T.V station man. That's bad. Everyone else is getting their matches televised. I just watched a 8.0 mixed match that Cindy played last night on the Tennis channel.

Seriously, what you are saying makes sense. I will add though that the way your are facing is apart of positioning. You could be standing in the exact area that you say you are but if you are facing the back fence(exaggeration) when the serve is coming you certainly wouldn't be in a position to defend if the net person cut the return off. So I think we see it pretty much the same way. You just may not see it as big of a deal to turn your hips and feet to the net person...Hell your footwork is probably better than most.

Originally Posted by LuckyR

Yes, you are, of course correct. You can face one way and turn your head to look at multiple locations over the course of the flight of the serve.

My matches are not televised so I don't actually know for certain how much of my shifting is head vs footwork. My post was based on my assumption that I am doing a majority of my shifting using footwork. This is in part because I try to always be on the move, as my tactics include opportunity poaching (as opposed to called poaches).

But regardless, my point when speaking of "positioning" in my post, was more about where to stand on the court, not so much about which way to face once you are there.