Silent Bans - A Real thing?

[cc0509]

Originally Posted by Vrad

Amazing that someone can actually believe what you are saying after the whole Lance Armstrong scandal.

And unlike cycling, which is a team sport, tennis is an individual one, where everyone sticks to their own schedules and stuff. If Armstrong could have kept it silent for so long, it is laughable to believe that a tennis player could not.

+1...........

[TMF]

If Armstrong was a pro tennis player, he can stay away from tennis for 7 months.

[gsharma]

Originally Posted by SLD76

mustard is a doping apologist extraordinaire.

he also dislikes big govt and bureacracy.

And you like big government and bureaucracy? Just had to ask.

Why would ANYONE like bureaucracy and big government is beyond me.

Btw, nice job making an ad hominem attack on someone you dislike and straying from objective arguments.

OP, interesting tidbit, thanks for the info.

[single_handed_champion]

Originally Posted by cc0509

No it doesn't. It says this:

"She received a 6 month ban and went back on tour. The governing body of tennis, the ITF, were informed fully of what had happened, yet in the 6 years that have passed nothing has happened."

That means the ITF never announced that this player was banned. She probably went off of tour announcing some sort of injury and nothing was ever mentioned about any ban.

Umm.. what? The ITF did not ban her? I thought the ITF headed the anti-doping programme.

Anyway, this page has no mention of Sprem. http://www.itftennis.com/antidoping/news/decisions.asp

[mariecon]

Originally Posted by gsharma

Real men have a one-handed backhand

This I certainly agree with!!!

[Mustard]

Originally Posted by SLD76

mustard is a doping apologist extraordinaire.

I'm not. I want blood tests at every tournament, for every single player.

Originally Posted by SLD76

he also dislikes big govt and bureacracy.

I'm a Marxist.

[mariecon]

I vote for a blood passport for every player.

[Hood_Man]

Originally Posted by mariecon

I vote for a blood passport for every player.

I vote Dick Pound for President!

[Mustard]

Originally Posted by Tennis_Hands

It is a matter of will and intention.

Capitalism = Making corporate profit for shareholders at society's expense is the main aim of society
Regular doping tests = Eating into corporate profits

Cycling has been compelled into stricter doping tests because so many cyclists have tested positive or been found guilty of taking banned substances, scandals which have damaged business. How many Tour de France podium finishers since the 1990s have tested positive or been found guilty? A clear majority, so cyclists at the elite of the sport have been caught in the scandals, with Lance Armstrong being by far the biggest of all. What's the biggest case in tennis? Probably Mariano Puerta, because Puerta tested positive on two seperate occasions, at 2003 Vina del Mar and at the 2005 French Open. Puerta is also the only player to have tested positive for a banned substance after a major tennis final, i.e. at the 2005 French Open. And then there's Petr Korda testing positive at 1998 Wimbledon, just 5 months after winning the Australian Open (where he had tested negative after beating Rios). But tennis is nowhere near the doping scandals like that we've seen in sports like cycling and athletics, and the ITF seems to maintain a lot of control over the anti-doping policies inside tennis.

Now, as the ITF and the ATP are both very strongly connected to the profit making that goes with tennis as a business, there's a clear conflict of interest. Causing a doping scandal = Loss of corporate profit, so there's a clear incentive to bury positive tests to safeguard future business, if they can get away with it due to a lack of transparency. The only solution is to give control of anti-doping matters to a non-profit organisation that is completely unconnected to the profit making side of a sport, and to blood test every single player at every single tournament.

[CMM]

Originally Posted by cc0509

No it doesn't. It says this:

"She received a 6 month ban and went back on tour. The governing body of tennis, the ITF, were informed fully of what had happened, yet in the 6 years that have passed nothing has happened."

That means the ITF never announced that this player was banned. She probably went off of tour announcing some sort of injury and nothing was ever mentioned about any ban.

You skipped the first part. I can also quote only this

The governing body of tennis, the ITF, were informed fully of what had happened, yet in the 6 years that have passed nothing has happened.

Which, in my opinion, means the ITF were informed that Del Moral and TennisVal had something to do with the doping case and nothing happened to them.

[cc0509]

Originally Posted by CMM

You skipped the first part. I can also quote only this
Which, in my opinion, means the ITF were informed that Del Moral and TennisVal had something to do with the doping case and nothing happened to them.

That is not my interpretation and is obviously not the interpretation of the footfault blogger because the blogger is talking about a ban that was not known publicly and which the ITF kept hidden.

[Tennis_Hands]

Originally Posted by Mustard

Capitalism = Making corporate profit for shareholders at society's expense is the main aim of society
Regular doping tests = Eating into corporate profits.

It is a bit more complicated than that, I am afraid.

Originally Posted by Mustard

Cycling has been compelled into stricter doping tests because so many cyclists have tested positive......

Um. You have it backwards. They tested positive BECAUSE there was an effort to catch the cheats. The very essence of the problem, that tennis has, is, that the effort in tennis is insufficient.

By the way, I find it disturbing, that you consider the absence of more caught dopers in tennis a sign, that the sport is clean.

Not that a caught finalist, Major champion and scandal with covered positive doping tests (Agassi) are peanuts.

But, then again, you consider that someone set LA up, so, I am wasting my time, discussing this topic with you.

Originally Posted by Mustard

Now, as the ITF and the ATP are both very strongly connected to the profit making that goes with tennis as a business, there's a clear conflict of interest. Causing a doping scandal = Loss of corporate profit, so there's a clear incentive to bury positive tests to safeguard future business, if they can get away with it due to a lack of transparency. The only solution is to give control of anti-doping matters to a non-profit organisation that is completely unconnected to the profit making side of a sport, and to blood test every single player at every single tournament.

You clearly have no idea what WADA is.

The only way to hinder its work is, if entire Governments refuse to cooperate (like Spain does at the moment).

Originally Posted by Mustard

every single player at every single tournament.

Stupid, but not unexpected from you.

[BrooklynNY]

Originally Posted by cc0509

That is not my interpretation and is obviously not the interpretation of the footfault blogger because the blogger is talking about a ban that was not known publicly and which the ITF kept hidden.

Right, that was my interpretation.

Anyway, I stumbled upon this on twitter and thought it would be interesting to see what you all thought as this topic has come up before, but just in most peoples imagination.

This is also speculation and imagination, but it is the best 'evidence' or factors that to lend some credibility to the idea, not sure how much though, but still.
Anyway, I've been offline the past few day and it's interesting to see some spirited discussion.

[LaneMyer]

Originally Posted by citybert

When Michael Jordan retired for 2 years, many people were convinced that it was a silent ban for his gambling problems maybe even him betting on his own team. It's possible and I believe there is even a book written about this. There is some evidence of this but no smoking gun, only he knows and David Stern.

around here in Chicago it was widely known that MJ was betting on a sport (his voice was heard on a recording device where Jordan was inquiring about a point spread) but there was no proof it was a Bulls or NBA game. Some believed it to be a North Carolina game. But yeah it was pretty obvious that MJ accrued a silent ban just from his press conference.

At the press conference when he was asked if he would ever return he said, " Five years down the road, if the urge comes back, if the Bulls will have me, if David Stern lets me back in the league, I may come back."

I don't think anyone could possibly believe Jordan would give up an NBA salary and everything around it in order to ride a Greyhound and stay in Motel 6s to play Double A baseball for $400 a week.

[citybert]

Originally Posted by LaneMyer

around here in Chicago it was widely known that MJ was betting on a sport (his voice was heard on a recording device where Jordan was inquiring about a point spread) but there was no proof it was a Bulls or NBA game. Some believed it to be a North Carolina game. But yeah it was pretty obvious that MJ accrued a silent ban just from his press conference.

At the press conference when he was asked if he would ever return he said, " Five years down the road, if the urge comes back, if the Bulls will have me, if David Stern lets me back in the league, I may come back."

I don't think anyone could possibly believe Jordan would give up an NBA salary and everything around it in order to ride a Greyhound and stay in Motel 6s to play Double A baseball for $400 a week.

Yes and many have said his fathers murder may have something to do with it. Punishment from Him not paying up. Tons of money but he prob just said Im MJ and i dont owe you anything.

Believe what you want but again only he knows for sure.

[Vlad_C]

Interesting how every time a thread on doping comes up, it is immediately hijacked by some with all sorts of irrelevant/irrational posts, and any attempt at a serious discussion quickly degenerates into paranoia and insanity.

[Speranza]

Originally Posted by Tennis_Hands

It is a bit more complicated than that, I am afraid.

Um. You have it backwards. They tested positive BECAUSE there was an effort to catch the cheats. The very essence of the problem, that tennis has, is, that the effort in tennis is insufficient.

By the way, I find it disturbing, that you consider the absence of more caught dopers in tennis a sign, that the sport is clean.

Not that a caught finalist, Major champion and scandal with covered positive doping tests (Agassi) are peanuts.

But, then again, you consider that someone set LA up, so, I am wasting my time, discussing this topic with you.

You clearly have no idea what WADA is.

The only way to hinder its work is, if entire Governments refuse to cooperate (like Spain does at the moment).

The Spanish Government consisting of people who are currently being accused of taking illegal payments?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-21305154

And now Australia openly admits that there is a doping problem:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-21363100

Originally Posted by Vlad_C

Interesting how every time a thread on doping comes up, it is immediately hijacked by some with all sorts of irrelevant/irrational posts, and any attempt at a serious discussion quickly degenerates into paranoia and insanity.

I hope you don't think the above links are irrational or paranoid.

[Vrad]

Originally Posted by Speranza

And now Australia openly admits that there is a doping problem:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-21363100

I hope you don't think the above links are irrational or paranoid.

But, but, but, TT members had assured me that it would be impossible to hide doping, and that it couldn't be widespread...

Smh.

Anyone who thinks any tennis player is above suspicions is in denial. About the most you can say is that from external appearances, some certainly show far greater signs of being on PEDs than others.

[cc0509]

Originally Posted by Vrad

But, but, but, TT members had assured me that it would be impossible to hide doping, and that it couldn't be widespread...

Smh.

Anyone who thinks any tennis player is above suspicions is in denial. About the most you can say is that from external appearances, some certainly show far greater signs of being on PEDs than others.

Only stupid people think that.

[Speranza]

Originally Posted by Vrad

But, but, but, TT members had assured me that it would be impossible to hide doping, and that it couldn't be widespread...

Smh.

Anyone who thinks any tennis player is above suspicions is in denial. About the most you can say is that from external appearances, some certainly show far greater signs of being on PEDs than others.

Originally Posted by cc0509

Only stupid people think that.

Stupid? Not necessarily. In denial? Yes.

People believe that which they want to.