Pros think Rafa is the GOAT

[MSK]

Originally Posted by dafinch

Yup. Seems the OP was dishonest on multiple counts: first, he took the victor's comment out of context and left out a teensy, weensy qualifier, and second, he said "pros," as in, plural. Who are these other "pros?"

Murray believes Nadal is the GOAT.

He probably has a better claim to decide than anyone else in the world.

EDIT : Also how can the greatest of all time, never had a winning head to head against Murray?

[sureshs]

And Murray was never a Fed fart - and that is the reason he can defeat Fed. I suspect he respects Nadal more than he does Fed.

[Mike Sams]

Originally Posted by kalyan4fedever

This guy looks physically bigger than Rafa. He must've had his Rosol moment. Probably saw Rafa in person for the first time and thought "Why should I be scared of this little man? He's not so big!"

[Mike Sams]

Originally Posted by sureshs

And Murray was never a Fed fart - and that is the reason he can defeat Fed. I suspect he respects Nadal more than he does Fed.

Murray hates Federer because Federer always makes fun of him.

[Mike Sams]

Originally Posted by sureshs

LOL Rafa says that to pay the obligatory respects. He doesn't respect Federer and that is pretty obvious. It was Fed who created the pseudo bro bonding when he realized he could not beat him.

Nobody except Djokovic has ever pushed Nadal to his limits across all surfaces the way Federer has. Nadal has tremendous respect for Federer's game. I don't know what he thinks about Federer personally but in terms of tennis, Nadal doesn't deny Federer's quality.

[veroniquem]

Originally Posted by Mike Sams

Nobody except Djokovic has ever pushed Nadal to his limits across all surfaces the way Federer has. .

I would have to contest that, at least in slams (which are the most important events, I think we can all agree on that.). There is only one of the 4 where Fed has pushed Rafa to his limits: Wimbledon. He's never even taken Rafa to a 5th at RG (Isner has and Sod got a win). He has never beaten Rafa at AO (unlike Djoko or Tsonga) and the 5th set they played at AO was considerably easier for Rafa than the one he played vs Verdasco. The players who have pushed Rafa at USO (other than Djoko obviously) are Murray and Delpo. In a nutshell, other than grass, Fed has never really pushed Rafa in slams, certainly not to his limits.

[axel89]

Agreed Rafa = Goat

[Crisstti]

Originally Posted by Povl Carstensen

No, he just did better than the competition, including Nadal.

He definitely had easier opposition.

[cc0509]

Originally Posted by Crisstti

He definitely had easier opposition.

Easier opposition than Zeballos or Rosol? At least Federer did not lose to clowns in finals ranked 70 and below when he was in his prime. Nadal can't be the GOAT just based on that alone, not to mention about 10 other reasons.

[hersito]

Originally Posted by cc0509

... lose to clowns in finals ranked 70 and below when he was in his prime...

So ******* are as disrespectful to other players as *********s, bad for nadal and federer and every other players that have ***** in the fan base to have such annoying fans.

[Towser83]

Originally Posted by MSK

Murray believes Nadal is the GOAT.

He probably has a better claim to decide than anyone else in the world.

EDIT : Also how can the greatest of all time, never had a winning head to head against Murray?

Federer won their first match

Originally Posted by veroniquem

I would have to contest that, at least in slams (which are the most important events, I think we can all agree on that.). There is only one of the 4 where Fed has pushed Rafa to his limits: Wimbledon. He's never even taken Rafa to a 5th at RG (Isner has and Sod got a win). He has never beaten Rafa at AO (unlike Djoko or Tsonga) and the 5th set they played at AO was considerably easier for Rafa than the one he played vs Verdasco. The players who have pushed Rafa at USO (other than Djoko obviously) are Murray and Delpo. In a nutshell, other than grass, Fed has never really pushed Rafa in slams, certainly not to his limits.

Nadal has a lot of random one off losses to players, but Djokovic and Federer are the players who have tested him most consistantly.

As far as slams go, the AO 2009 final, Federer did push Nadal. It went 5 sets and ok the final set was fairly easy but Nadal was very close to going 2 sets to one down. They've never played at te US Open, and at RG he's only ever been beaten once and went 5 sets once. They were kind of one off matches (what did Soderling ever do to Nadal on clay apart from that one match?) In contrast the Rome 2006 final was over a healthy nadal unlike RG 2009, and he was better in that match than he was vs Isner as well. Even MC and RG in 2006, while 4 set matches, were close and could have even gone 5.

So yes other people have pushed him more, but consistantly? His main concerns have always been Federer and then Djokovic.

[Hawkeye7]

Originally Posted by MSK

Murray believes Nadal is the GOAT.

He probably has a better claim to decide than anyone else in the world.

EDIT : Also how can the greatest of all time, never had a winning head to head against Murray?

Too much love and adoration has been clouding his judgement. It wouldn't surprise me if Andy was one of Rafa's ***** here.

I don't believe in GOAT discussions at all, but to claim that 11 > 17 is just wrong. At the end of the day, people remember the titles you won and not silly H2H statistics.

[helloworld]

Rafa owns the big 4. He's the best of the current era. Give him 5 more healthy years and he'll turn Fed's record into dust.

[Crisstti]

Originally Posted by Hawkeye7

Too much love and adoration has been clouding his judgement. It wouldn't surprise me if Andy was one of Rafa's ***** here.

I don't believe in GOAT discussions at all, but to claim that 11 > 17 is just wrong. At the end of the day, people remember the titles you won and not silly H2H statistics.

It's not wrong. There is way more than just statistics, whether it be slam count or h2h.

Originally Posted by cc0509

Easier opposition than Zeballos or Rosol? At least Federer did not lose to clowns in finals ranked 70 and below when he was in his prime. Nadal can't be the GOAT just based on that alone, not to mention about 10 other reasons.

Federer has never had the injury problems Nadal has had.

[mariecon]

Originally Posted by helloworld

Rafa owns the big 4. He's the best of the current era. Give him 5 more healthy years and he'll turn Fed's record into dust.

B.S. He hasn't won a tournament off of clay since 2010. He will never catch up to Federer just winning RG.

[cc0509]

Originally Posted by Crisstti

Federer has never had the injury problems Nadal has had.

So you are saying the only reason Nadal had these bad losses to lesser players is due to his injuries? What about his losses to Youzhny and Davydenko in finals, was Nadal injured then too?

The fact is Nadal at this point in time cannot be considered the GOAT, only the clay GOAT.

[veroniquem]

Originally Posted by Towser83

Federer won their first match



Nadal has a lot of random one off losses to players, but Djokovic and Federer are the players who have tested him most consistantly.

As far as slams go, the AO 2009 final, Federer did push Nadal. It went 5 sets and ok the final set was fairly easy but Nadal was very close to going 2 sets to one down. They've never played at te US Open, and at RG he's only ever been beaten once and went 5 sets once. They were kind of one off matches (what did Soderling ever do to Nadal on clay apart from that one match?) In contrast the Rome 2006 final was over a healthy nadal unlike RG 2009, and he was better in that match than he was vs Isner as well. Even MC and RG in 2006, while 4 set matches, were close and could have even gone 5.

So yes other people have pushed him more, but consistantly? His main concerns have always been Federer and then Djokovic.

Djoko has pushed Rafa to his limits in 3 out of 4 slams. Fed in 1. No comparison imo. I would go so far as to say that Djoko has managed to challenge Rafa the way Fed has always wanted to but has never been able to, especially at AO. Same thing with masters actually. Djoko has beaten Nadal 10 times in masters ( and in 7 out of the 9 ), Fed only 4 times (and in only 3 different ones). Fed's only claim to fame against Rafa is Wimbledon (and even there, he lost their last encounter) and WTF.

[Mike Sams]

Originally Posted by helloworld

Rafa owns the big 4. He's the best of the current era. Give him 5 more healthy years and he'll turn Fed's record into dust.

Give every player 5 healthy years including Hewitt, Nalbandian, Haas, Soderling, etc and they'll show you something too.

[cc0509]

Originally Posted by helloworld

Rafa owns the big 4. He's the best of the current era. Give him 5 more healthy years and he'll turn Fed's record into dust.

He does not have that kind of time. He is almost 27. He may have a couple more good years if he is lucky.

[dafinch]

Originally Posted by MSK

Murray believes Nadal is the GOAT.

He probably has a better claim to decide than anyone else in the world.

EDIT : Also how can the greatest of all time, never had a winning head to head against Murray?

Murray said that? Really? Why don't you bring up the link that says that....