Rude to Return Out Service Ball to Server Especially When It's Obviously a Fault?

[Overdrive]

Wow, I didn't know this is a big deal.
No one told me about this before, I guess I better stop returning out serves before someone at a tournament next week might get on me about it...

[clintontiger]

Wow, I dont post much but ya'll are making way to much out of this. It takes no longer to clear the returned out ball than it does to clear the serve that is out that hits off the back of the fence. Ya'll must have never been to a college match, every out serve is hit back. No one ever complains. Plus a obvious out serve to you might not be so obvious to them. You can't tell if the ball is two feet out if you are serving. Your two foot out ball is probably more like 4 inches.

[amorris525]

Originally Posted by clintontiger

Wow, I dont post much but ya'll are making way to much out of this. It takes no longer to clear the returned out ball than it does to clear the serve that is out that hits off the back of the fence. Ya'll must have never been to a college match, every out serve is hit back. No one ever complains. Plus a obvious out serve to you might not be so obvious to them. You can't tell if the ball is two feet out if you are serving. Your two foot out ball is probably more like 4 inches.

Correct. One can only guess these people are referring to relatively slow serves where you actually do have time to think about what you are doing

[Cindysphinx]

I have had people return serves I mishit that struck my court and bounced over the net.

I have had people return let cord serves that bounced three feet over the net and landed out.

I have had people return serves that landed on the doubles sideline.

Come on, folks. Follow the Code.

[Rjtennis]

I think I hit/chip balls back all the time but its not like I'm chasing down every out serve and taking big cuts at the ball. I've never had anyone say anything to me so I guess it's not an issue. In fact ive never heard of this being an issue in any match. On first serves it's just instinct to get the ball back. You don't raelly have time to think about it.

[tennis tom]

Originally Posted by Overdrive

Wow, I didn't know this is a big deal.
No one told me about this before, I guess I better stop returning out serves before someone at a tournament next week might get on me about it...

You're learning a lot on this glorious Sunday on the internets Grasshopper. Of course you didn't know about this, your former coach didn't even know the difference between an under-grip and an over-grip.

[tennis tom]

Originally Posted by Rjtennis

... I've never had anyone say anything to me so I guess it's not an issue. In fact ive never heard of this being an issue in any match. On first serves it's just instinct to get the ball back. You don't raelly have time to think about it.

Maybe no one mentioned it but they took note of it. If you ever play in Monte Carlo with the Princess, she will make note of it. You better work on your tennis manners if this eventuality will ever come your way. If you do this against a real player you'll be hearing about it.

Good tennis is about breaking yourself of hacker instinct bad habits. There's always time, you just have to develop your mind more fully.

[tennis tom]

Originally Posted by clintontiger

... Ya'll must have never been to a college match, every out serve is hit back. No one ever complains.

That's why they're playing in college and not on the Pro-Tour. It's the details that'll kill ya'.

[tamdoankc]

So you're actually in your service motion as the ball is coming back? So if the returner is catching or stopping the fault you're already serving the second ball. That could be another problem itself.

[clintontiger]

Yes, that's the reason there not playing pro, because they hit back out serves. Sure

[Brian11785]

This might be the issue on which what feels intuitively proper varies the most from "The Code." My thinking is "what will keep play moving the quickest?" Letting the ball hit my back fence or hitting it into the net (in singles) so that I will likely have to further delay the second serve by taking 10 seconds to retrieve it (coupled with the realities of playing on public courts and/or ones without fences between them, so loose balls all over the court can be a hassle....interrupt play on adjacent courts, you risk having your ball stolen/mistaken, etc.) makes "The Code" feel relatively impractical here. When I am playing doubles, I almost always dump a return of an out serve into the net for my partner to pick up. But in singles, bunting it back to the server is generally what I prefer done to me and what I generally do as well. I have never been called out on it in my two years of playing flex and city league singles. I dunno. Maybe my opponent silently hates me for it.

In fact, I don't think I've ever been called out on anything (or heard someone else get called out for anything) like this. Had a guy politely tell me to watch my feet while serving once. That's about it.

[Govnor]

People will find anything to complain about, really.

[sam_p]

This scenario is exceedingly common in doubles and even more so at higher level doubles. The returner is usually focused on returning the serves while the partner is more responsible for calling the service line. This leads to many returns of long serves over the course of a long match - it is simply unavoidable. Yet somehow no one seems to take this particularly to heart. If on a particular instance it leads to an unusual delay, you give them 2 and start over. Not a big deal and if someone just keeps wailing away on obviously out serves they'll just seem like a total tool - to all three other players on the court.

[MeHere2PlayTennis]

Originally Posted by sam_p

This scenario is exceedingly common in doubles and even more so at higher level doubles. The returner is usually focused on returning the serves while the partner is more responsible for calling the service line. This leads to many returns of long serves over the course of a long match - it is simply unavoidable. Yet somehow no one seems to take this particularly to heart. If on a particular instance it leads to an unusual delay, you give them 2 and start over. Not a big deal and if someone just keeps wailing away on obviously out serves they'll just seem like a total tool - to all three other players on the court.

I agree. It is very common. I have only found people taking it personal in mixed when an unintentional return goes down the line at the female player.

Otherwise unless you hit it into another court, for the most part I don't feel like hitting it over has been a huge problem. As the code states I guess it depends on what is considered a obviously not in play.

[Mauvaise]

This is one of those things that annoys me as a server and I won't do as a receiver, but just seems too petty to actually complain about during a match.

[tennis tom]

The two best choices are to catch it and pocket it or gently hit it to the net. I changed that from "into the net" to near the net. Letting it roll behind you to your fence can cause delays if the ball ricochets off a fence post or a curb on a poorly planned court. A well constructed court will have a depression at the back fence, maybe with a drainage system to hold the ball. When you let it roll behind you, on windy days it can come back at you and you could step on it. Letting it ricochet behind you makes your opponent responsible for watching out for you.

Frankly, there are some people who are so indifferent to stopping and controlling balls going behind them, I don't care anymore if they step on them and crack a femur. I've never heard a femur cracking but have heard from others that it makes quite a sound. The good news is the femur, the biggest bone in the body, will heal good as new in thirty days, barring complications.

I'll warn them a few times if they're in harms way but if they don't care about there welfare why should I. I know several players who are very nonchalant about this, acting like they are real tough guys, not caring about the loose ball caroming off the angled concrete wall behind them. I no longer care if they injure themselves--if they don't care about their bones, ligaments and tendons, why should I have to constantly be warning them.

Some players are so skilled they can consistently hit the ball into their opponents corner or back to them at a pace where it can be easily caught without delaying the rhythm of the servers swing--most here can't. Hitting it to the net so it rests there a few inches from the net is a skill that can be learned if you want to just like learning how to type.

Probably the best option is catching it and pocketing the ball because on really windy days, if you hit it to the net you'll be spending a lot of your energy chasing it around so it doesn't roll onto the adjoining court disturbing that match.

If you hit it back to your opponent, you stand the chance that they will do a fake fumble and you will be obligated to offer them two--why give them that opportunity? Everything has a reason, it's not only good tennis etiquette.


When you're warming up serves with your opponent, you do stop and catch his serves with your racket until you have all three and not slug each one back, don't you?-- (except to signal that you are ready after hitting two minutes of warm-up) serves).

[Cindysphinx]

Originally Posted by Mauvaise

This is one of those things that annoys me as a server and I won't do as a receiver, but is just seems too petty to actually complain about during a match.

+1. I will never complain about it either. I will not complain about anything opponents do in matches, really. I do not want to lose my focus, I didn't come there to have arguments, and I do not want my opponent to know they are dancing on my last nerve.

However . . . .

I am thiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiis close to scolding one of my regular partners. She is the worst OOR ("Obviously Out Returner") I have ever seen. She returns all out serves as hard as she can. By the end of the match, opponents are looking at me and rolling their eyes because it is so very ridiculous.

I am not sure quite what to do about this. I have not told her directly "Hey! Stop wailing on serves that are going out!" I have, as captain, told the whole team via email about OORs and quoted the Code. This seems to make no difference to the habitual OOR.

I even said during a match once, "OMG! That opponent is returning my serves that are way out. That is so *rude!*" Nope, didn't make a difference.

There just never seems to be a good time to raise it with her. Don't want to call her out at the beginning of a match and throw her off. Seems weird to raise it afterward. I keep waiting for an opponent to say something so I can then stand there nodding my head, but it doesn't happen.

[tennis tom]

Originally Posted by Cindysphinx

...I am not sure quite what to do about this.

...There just never seems to be a good time to raise it with her. Don't want to call her out at the beginning of a match and throw her off.

Cindy, she doesn't care about throwing others off with her rude behavior, why worry about throwing her off except that it may cost the match if you should get into her head? Subtly obviously is not working here, you're going to have to take this bull-***** by the horns and have a little chat with her, maybe during a team practice. If she's offended, that's the way the cookie is going to crumble. You have many partners to choose from, so you lose this one. BE DIRECT with her! Let us know how it turns out, call her now and let us know. Have her come onto the board so we can smack some sense into her--is she cute?

[Relinquis]

be direct and call her out on it... if it doesn't work, just continue the point and win it. if she stops, make a big deal about it.

this works... try it.

[AceKing]

Originally Posted by Brian11785

This might be the issue on which what feels intuitively proper varies the most from "The Code." My thinking is "what will keep play moving the quickest?" Letting the ball hit my back fence or hitting it into the net (in singles) so that I will likely have to further delay the second serve by taking 10 seconds to retrieve it (coupled with the realities of playing on public courts and/or ones without fences between them, so loose balls all over the court can be a hassle....interrupt play on adjacent courts, you risk having your ball stolen/mistaken, etc.) makes "The Code" feel relatively impractical here. When I am playing doubles, I almost always dump a return of an out serve into the net for my partner to pick up. But in singles, bunting it back to the server is generally what I prefer done to me and what I generally do as well. I have never been called out on it in my two years of playing flex and city league singles. I dunno. Maybe my opponent silently hates me for it.

In fact, I don't think I've ever been called out on anything (or heard someone else get called out for anything) like this. Had a guy politely tell me to watch my feet while serving once. That's about it.

^^ This. Common sense should trump The Code. I play in 2 separate outdoor locations that have 8 courts across, with no separation of courts. I also play mostly singles with 4.0 & 4.5 men. If I allowed 1st serve faults to go by me, many of them would bounce off the back fence with spin and angle & end up rolling into the courts next to me. I don't allow this to happen, I bunt obvious faults back to the server. My opponents do the same. I would find it annoying if they didn't (same goes for the players on the courts next to me).

edit: I'm not condoning taking a full cut at a return that is obv out, I'm talking about bunting the ball back to the server so he can easily catch it.