The TT Football Club

[Ross K]

Originally Posted by crosscourt

Is Joe Cole playing well enough to be in contention for England? I met him completely by chance at Christmas and was impressed. He had obviously not settled at Liverpool but was enjoying a change of lifestyle and approach at Lille.

You met him? Intriguing. Do tell us more.

[crosscourt]

I had taken my son into town for some reason and we had lunch in a cafe on Marylebone High Street. A familiar looking man came in wearing a t-shirt (even though it was damp and cold) sweatpants and carrying his possessions in a Sainsbury's bag. He looked like an athlete -- very fit indeed -- but my first thought was that he might be a tennis player because he was slightly built. He sat at the table next to us and we struck up a conversation. He had been training in Regent's Park -- sprinting it turned out -- and had returned to his flat to find that he had forgotten his key and that his partner had gone shopping. It took me a while to work out who he was. Luckily my son didnt work it out. If he had he would probably have compared Joe unfavourably to Lampard (my son's hero).

We chatted for 40 minutes or so. He hadn't settled at Liverpool and enjoys playing for Lille. He was very enthusiastic about the Lille coach -- Garcia (sp?) -- and about the French approach to football which he has found liberating. He said on a number of occasions that he thinks the culture of English football is too fearful by comparison. He clearly liked the emphasis the French put on technique. He had loved Chelsea and Mourinho who he clearly considered a brilliant manager. My feeling was that he thought that only Mourinho had a realistic chance of toppling Barcelona at present but also that the Chelsea of three ot four years ago might have been the team to do it. He was pretty clear that a physically strong team that could play one up and get behind the Barcelona defence and then hold the ball up -- by which I understood him to mean a team with Drogba -- had the best chance to beat them. But he was also hugely admiring of Barcelona and Guardiola. He thought that Germany would be hard to beat in the summer.

We talked about a lot of other stuff -- training in France, their winter break (the reason why he had Christmas in London) my son, law, rugby, growing up in London, how brilliant the Eurostar is to get to France and so on but also about some guys he knows who run a gym in Queen's Park and stuff like that, as well as how pleased he was that his daughter speaks French and English.

I was struck by what a sane, outward looking and affable man he seemed. If I had to guess I would imagine that Chelsea players spend their free time in "private drinking clubs" in Knightsbridge, or at Annabel's, in the company of very thin East European girls. But he couldnt have been further from that stereotype.

[Feña14]

Originally Posted by crosscourt

I had taken my son into town for some reason and we had lunch in a cafe on Marylebone High Street. A familiar looking man came in wearing a t-shirt (even though it was damp and cold) sweatpants and carrying his possessions in a Sainsbury's bag. He looked like an athlete -- very fit indeed -- but my first thought was that he might be a tennis player because he was slightly built. He sat at the table next to us and we struck up a conversation. He had been training in Regent's Park -- sprinting it turned out -- and had returned to his flat to find that he had forgotten his key and that his partner had gone shopping. It took me a while to work out who he was. Luckily my son didnt work it out. If he had he would probably have compared Joe unfavourably to Lampard (my son's hero).

We chatted for 40 minutes or so. He hadn't settled at Liverpool and enjoys playing for Lille. He was very enthusiastic about the Lille coach -- Garcia (sp?) -- and about the French approach to football which he has found liberating. He said on a number of occasions that he thinks the culture of English football is too fearful by comparison. He clearly liked the emphasis the French put on technique. He had loved Chelsea and Mourinho who he clearly considered a brilliant manager. My feeling was that he thought that only Mourinho had a realistic chance of toppling Barcelona at present but also that the Chelsea of three ot four years ago might have been the team to do it. He was pretty clear that a physically strong team that could play one up and get behind the Barcelona defence and then hold the ball up -- by which I understood him to mean a team with Drogba -- had the best chance to beat them. But he was also hugely admiring of Barcelona and Guardiola. He thought that Germany would be hard to beat in the summer.

We talked about a lot of other stuff -- training in France, their winter break (the reason why he had Christmas in London) my son, law, rugby, growing up in London, how brilliant the Eurostar is to get to France and so on but also about some guys he knows who run a gym in Queen's Park and stuff like that, as well as how pleased he was that his daughter speaks French and English.

I was struck by what a sane, outward looking and affable man he seemed. If I had to guess I would imagine that Chelsea players spend their free time in "private drinking clubs" in Knightsbridge, or at Annabel's, in the company of very thin East European girls. But he couldnt have been further from that stereotype.

Are you a Chelsea fan too then, if your son's hero is Lampard? He has great taste in players either way.

Great to hear you had a good chat with Cole aswell, he grew up as a Chelsea fan and he was always worshipped by the fans, alongside Terry I would say, which tells you alot.

[forthegame]

No one's talking about Aresnal?

[Feña14]

Originally Posted by forthegame

No one's talking about Aresnal?

I'm trying not to say too much about it! Considering it will probably be us in that position next Tuesday

[forthegame]

Originally Posted by Feña14

I'm trying not to say too much about it! Considering it will probably be us in that position next Tuesday

C'mon Feña, have faith!

BTW, it's only Napoli!

[PED]

That was just brutal. Ibra and Robinho....

I'd love to complain about the pitch but it didn't bother Milan at all.

We had nothing.

Walcott sucks BTW

[PureAlph4]

Originally Posted by PED

We had nothing.

+1

Tbh, I don't think the scale of the defeat surprised anyone. With this Arsenal team there is very little difference between conceding one and conceding four (it's mainly just a question of how clinical / persistent the opposition are). Once we concede the first against a good team, and they stick to a sound tactical plan, the game is up. The current Milan team is far from outstanding, but they were disciplined, utilised tactics proven to be successful vs Arsenal / at this level of CL, and had the personnel to exploit chances.

Arsene tried to set up to dominate possession / overload the midfield (with Arteta as the junction box and Rosicky as the distributor), and for the first 15 minutes we held the ball nicely (but naturally with little threat). But as ever once the brittle dam was breached by a moment of individual brilliance, there were no tactics, nor even the tools to respond.

I'm not even really disappointed about it, as it followed a completely foreseeable script. I'm indifferent about the FA Cup in our current state, and ideally we would just have to concentrate on the league and the chase for 4th spot, but equally as important just trying to slowly move the team forward by fully cementing the players of the future (Wilshere, Ramsey, Ox) who will hopefully restore us to a serious football club within 2-4 years.

We have plenty of very talented players, but unlike teams like Chelsea (as long diagnosed by Fena) and Liverpool, I think it's quite difficult to actually pin down exactly what needs to be done to create a team that can challenge. With us it's not just about filling gaps in the squad where we patently lack depth / quality; it's something much deeper involving a collective frail mentality, an array of personal weaknesses that when combined on top of each other within a team create huge vulnerability, and a philosophy within the club (evidently stemming from AW) that refuses to embrace the notion that a broad range of tactics are valid in order to generate your best chance of winning.

I'm still a huge advocate of Wenger, and fully believe that he be given full reign to move through this transition phase, but there is just a hint of staleness emerging, that goes beyond any considerations of budget limitations and economic pragmatism. I don't even really have much of an opinion right now of how the team can be moved forward significantly.

[Breaker]

Spurs and United would be best equipped to face Milan of the English teams..width and pace could catch them out, if not their midfield is just too strong and if they keep getting the ball into Ibra they're fantastic, Van Bommel was on a different planet from the Arse midfielders.

[lucknowrocks]

Originally Posted by PureAlph4

+1

I don't even really have much of an opinion right now of how the team can be moved forward significantly.

I do. Arsene needs to adapt. buy mvilla, hazard, gourcouff, a defender or two. sell rosicky and arshavin. hope wilshire hasn' regressed too much. homer pick, grab dempsey as well. only way to move forward is to make a splash. no more 16 yr olds with potential for the next couple of years. also, bring dein back

[Feña14]

Originally Posted by forthegame

C'mon Feña, have faith!

BTW, it's only Napoli!

I'm not too confident!

Torres can't get it done against 2 defenders, I don't think he'll do too well against Napoli's 3 centre backs. I don't have faith in Sturridge and Mata tracking the 2 wing backs either. Then you have Hamsik, Cavani and Lavezzi against Luiz and maybe Cahill if Terry isn't back. Napoli have started winning again after a poor run so yeah, the match up doesn't look good. I enjoy watching Napoli, so i'll probably just enjoy it for what it is more than the result.

[Ross K]

Dire night for the gooners. Must say, despite the occasional good displays (and let's hope they don't produce one against us in our up-coming game), Arsenal/Wenger do still strike me as, well, a sinking ship.

[crosscourt]

Originally Posted by Feña14

Are you a Chelsea fan too then, if your son's hero is Lampard? He has great taste in players either way.

Great to hear you had a good chat with Cole aswell, he grew up as a Chelsea fan and he was always worshipped by the fans, alongside Terry I would say, which tells you alot.

I'm not a Chelsea fan but my son and all his friends are and they all love Lampard. He is their absolute hero. My son still asks about the disallowed goal from the Germany game in South Africa -- he just cant believe that something like that would happen to Lampard. When I ask him why he idolises a one-paced flat track bully who can only play in acres of space and disappears on the big occasion he just shrugs his shoulders and says "just because".

cc

[Feña14]

Originally Posted by crosscourt

I'm not a Chelsea fan but my son and all his friends are and they all love Lampard. He is their absolute hero. My son still asks about the disallowed goal from the Germany game in South Africa -- he just cant believe that something like that would happen to Lampard. When I ask him why he idolises a one-paced flat track bully who can only play in acres of space and disappears on the big occasion he just shrugs his shoulders and says "just because".

cc

Flat track bully who disappears in the big games?

No chance!

I remember him scoring huge goals against Bayern Munich (the chest down, turn and fired past Khan).
The goal from level with the corner flag against Barcelona in the Nou Camp.
The man of the match performance against Liverpool in the semi's of the Champions League, days after his Mom died.
The man of the match performance in the Champions League final where he wrestled back the initiative from Man Utd and scored the equaliser.
His 2 late goals to get the 4-4 draw against Liverpool at Stamford Bridge in one of the greatest Champions League games of all time.
The FA Cup winning goal against Everton with his left foot from 25 yards out.
The almost impossible assist to Drogba for the winner against Man Utd in the FA Cup final.
His 2 goals against Bolton when they were a top 5 team to win the League for the first time in 50 years.
The goal against Liverpool at Anfield that effectively won us the title in Ancelotti's first season.

He's done it time and time again when it mattered for us. I remember hearing Rijkaard talk after a Champions League game against Barcelona when they had Deco, Xavi and Iniesta in midfield, it was one of the best midfield battles you could ever wish to see, the ball was zipping round at a pace most players wouldn't even be able to get their head around, but he went at all 3 of them virtually on his own and came out on top. The Barcelona manager gave him huge praise, it's a shame people in England don't really appreciate him.

[crosscourt]

Apologies -- the comments about Lampard were meant as a joke. And I wouldn't tease my son like that.

[Feña14]

Originally Posted by crosscourt

Apologies -- the comments about Lampard were meant as a joke. And I wouldn't tease my son like that.

There's no joking when it comes to Lampard!

He gets so much stick from Liverpool fans, and London fans who support teams other than Chelsea. I've always found it interesting how Man Utd fans seem to appreciate him, he's hurt them alot over the years so they're probably well placed to know what he's capable of.

[NickC]

Originally Posted by Feña14

There's no joking when it comes to Lampard!

He gets so much stick from Liverpool fans, and London fans who support teams other than Chelsea. I've always found it interesting how Man Utd fans seem to appreciate him, he's hurt them alot over the years so they're probably well placed to know what he's capable of.

He's also scored some amazing goals as you said. My favorite was from 3 seasons ago when he scored that left-footed one-timed chip against Hull City. Amazing goal.

[Feña14]

Originally Posted by NickC

He's also scored some amazing goals as you said. My favorite was from 3 seasons ago when he scored that left-footed one-timed chip against Hull City. Amazing goal.

Great goal yeah, remember his winner against Stoke with the last kick of the game? It saved Scolari for a few more games, but it was a great goal

[crosscourt]

I am a United fan and while I think Lampard is a very good player the idea that he has hurt us stretches a point. The only team that I can think of that has really hurt us - come off better over the medium to long term - is Barcelona. All the rest have had their moments but no more. The player who has really hurt us is Messi. it is true that in the early days of the Champions League we struggled against teams like Juventus but that problem was solved long ago. Arsenal and Chelsea have been powerful rivals at home and in Europe. City are now. But United have reinvented themselves more successfully than any other team in Europe in the last 15 years. Whether they can keep going is another matter.

[crosscourt]

Originally Posted by Ross K

Dire night for the gooners. Must say, despite the occasional good displays (and let's hope they don't produce one against us in our up-coming game), Arsenal/Wenger do still strike me as, well, a sinking ship.

Wenger for England then? It wasn't that long ago that he and not arry was the people's choice. So has he lost his mojo or has his relationship with Arsenal simply run its course?