Bela Karolyi incensed about underage rules

HappyAndFriendlyAlways · 08-11-2008, 12:43 AM

1 china girl looked 10 yrs old. what a scam!

By BARRY WILNER, AP Sports Writer Aug 10, 6:41 am EDT

BEIJING (AP)—Bela Karolyi seethed as he watched the Chinese women compete Sunday.

Not because of how good they were in qualifications, finishing 1.475 points ahead of the American team that often trains at his Texas ranch. What bothered the most famous man in gymnastics was “China’s arrogance” for using girls he wasn’t even sure were teenagers yet.

“They are using half-people,” Karolyi said. “One of the biggest frustrations is, what arrogance. These people think we are stupid.

“We are in the business of gymnastics and we know what a kid of 14 or 15 or 16 looks like. You don’t have to be a gymnastics coach to know what they look like at 16.”

Karolyi, working the games for NBC, believes the international federation’s rules that gymnasts must turn at least 16 during the Olympic year are flawed. Karolyi’s complaints are nothing new. But when they come moments after the Chinese have competed at the Olympics, well, they come across more loudly than ever.

“What kind of slap in the face is this?” he asked. “They are 12, 14 years old, max. And they line them up for the world … and having the government back them.

“Since they forced an age limit, it has gotten worse and worse. The FIG is running away from the age problem. They set an age limit and now they can’t control it.”

International Gymnastics Federation (FIG) officials have accepted the passports of the Chinese women, which indicate all are old enough to compete. Karolyi is originally from Romania, and he says falsifying documents is a common practice in countries such as Romania, Russia and other former Soviet bloc nations.

The solution, he said, is to not have any age limit. He believes if a gymnast is good enough to earn a spot at the Olympics or world championships, that athlete deserves to go. He said some juniors today are just as proficient as the age-eligble competitors. Nastia Liukin, for example, would certainly have made the squad for the Athens Games four years ago had she not been 14.

Karolyi’s wife, Martha, the national coordinator for the U.S. women’s team, agrees that if there are any questions about age, just eliminate the restrictions being broken.

“If it’s true,” she said of any nation using underage gymnasts, “the only situation is to lift up the age limit. It would be an even playing field for everyone.”

Bela Karolyi praised the Chinese for their skills on the various apparatus, and for their competitiveness. His issue is not with the athletes, of course, but with those who would use them as pawns in the chase for medals.

Very young pawns.

“They do good gymnastics and are a good service for the sport,” he said of the Chinese. “They have the ultimate effective training program. That’s why I am more upset that they are cheating. They don’t need cheating. They would be just as good a lineup of eligible athletes.”

albino smurf · 08-11-2008, 07:33 AM

A couple of those kids didn't even look like they were ten yet.

Gemini · 08-11-2008, 08:03 AM

Yeah..I watched some of the female gymnastics last night and I was SHOCKED at how young the Chinese female gymnasts "appear" to be. I'm with Karolyi on this one.

chess9 · 08-11-2008, 08:27 AM

Just because 3 of them are still breast feeding is no reason to suspect they are underage! Now, that basket of Huggies may be a bit more damning....

-Robert

Dedans Penthouse · 08-11-2008, 08:43 AM

It was rediculous; the lil' zygotes were "teething" the still rings.

HappyAndFriendlyAlways · 08-11-2008, 08:43 AM

possibly the rule will be lifted next time around, and no age limit for all would be better

10sfreak · 08-11-2008, 07:24 PM

Just what is the justification for the age limit anyway, and why 16?

El Diablo · 08-11-2008, 07:33 PM

I don't see much justification....these kids are working like crazy at the sport from a precocious age anyway.

bluetrain4 · 08-12-2008, 07:05 AM

I agree it's not right that China is probably breaking the rules. But, two points:

(1) Karolyi shouldn't be so incensed about age issues. The age rules are ostensibly in place to protect the gymnasts. But, some of his former gymnasts have complained of his strict tactics, including physical abuse and a regimen of near starvation. I know this isn't the same as outright breaking the international rules. But, complaints from Bela (as goofy and light-hearted as he may seem on TV) ring hollow.

(2) The rules only apply to competition. What good do they do? All of the what the age 16 rule is trying to protect - the well-being of the child that comes from the pressure of serious training, possible abuse (mental, physical, emotional) from coaches and handlers (not saying it happens uniformly) - happens during training.

There are no rules on how young girls can be to train with their national teams. And, in China, they are taken at a young age and hauled off to training centers where they literally live gymnastics. So, if that is allowed, what difference does it make if they compete in an actual international competition? I mean, the legit 16 year olds didn't just get that good at age 16. They had been training for years before, and were subject to all the pressures and potential abuses that such training involves.

So, if the 12 year olds are the best, let them compete. Or, don't let them train at all.

Enlightened Coelacanth · 08-12-2008, 07:19 AM

The point is it's an agreed upon restriction that the whole Olympic community presumably has to abide by (whether it makes perfect sense or not).
It reminds me of the swimmers that the Soviet Union and East Germany used to churn out that looked like a bunch of Brian Urlachers in Speedos. Is there a requirement to conform to the rules or not?
Many of the Chinese gymnasts looked like they should be in elementary school. Not the Olympics.

Puma · 08-13-2008, 08:46 AM

You said it right EC.

I just cannot get excited about the Olympics anymore, or at least the events that are "judged". Swimming, track and field events are timed and are much more fair.

It just seems to me the whole spirit of competetion is tainted. And for sure after the Olympics there are sure to be stories about someone testing positive for some substance. Then we get the whole caugh medicine story again.

travlerajm · 08-13-2008, 08:56 AM

Being smaller is a big advantage in gymastics due to physics.

Smaller things spin faster than big things.

If they lift the age limit, before long, you won't see many female gymnasts older than 12.

travlerajm · 08-13-2008, 09:00 AM

Has anyone noticed that world records seem a little too easy to break in the swimming events?

Either the pool is shorter, or the water has been spiked with a viscosity reducer.

albino smurf · 08-13-2008, 09:02 AM

Quote:

If they lift the age limit, before long, you won't see many female gymnasts older than 12.

Should this matter to me? Why not have the only people who are interested in it participate in it?

Gemini · 08-13-2008, 10:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by travlerajm

Has anyone noticed that world records seem a little too easy to break in the swimming events?

Either the pool is shorter, or the water has been spiked with a viscosity reducer.

I noticed that it as well. I'm just trying to chalk it to that new Speedo Lazr that everyone's talking about but for 5 teams to break the original 4x100 Freestyle relay World Record...that's pretty scary and sketchy at the same time.

Still..this gymnastics thing has me worried from the perspective that someone in China supposedly has info/evidence that some of the female Chinese gymnasts birth records do not match up with their passport data. Supposedly the birth records show that the gymnasts in question are not of legal age to compete.

If it's ever found out that these girls are not of legal age, then it casts an even darker shadow than the one that's currently nagging China (See Fake Fireworks & "Pretty Face for the Pretty Voice").

kreative · 08-13-2008, 10:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by travlerajm

Has anyone noticed that world records seem a little too easy to break in the swimming events?

Either the pool is shorter, or the water has been spiked with a viscosity reducer.

1) New swimsuits that are "welded" at the seams makes it virtually like shark skin
2) The pool is 9 feet deep instead of 6 feet previously used. Deeper water means less resistance.
3) There are extra lanes on either side of the pool plus gutters to reduce turbulence.

Regarding the young gymnasts, some of the advantages I've read include increased flexibility, lighter (weight) making it easier to perform manuevers, and less fear (the younger, the more resilient and fearless).

08-11-2008, 12:43 AM	#1
HappyAndFriendlyAlways Banned Join Date: May 2008 Location: ♣ We are pure Light, pure Love, pure Divine consciousness. Posts: 421	Bela Karolyi incensed about underage rules 1 china girl looked 10 yrs old. what a scam! By BARRY WILNER, AP Sports Writer Aug 10, 6:41 am EDT BEIJING (AP)—Bela Karolyi seethed as he watched the Chinese women compete Sunday. Not because of how good they were in qualifications, finishing 1.475 points ahead of the American team that often trains at his Texas ranch. What bothered the most famous man in gymnastics was “China’s arrogance” for using girls he wasn’t even sure were teenagers yet. “They are using half-people,” Karolyi said. “One of the biggest frustrations is, what arrogance. These people think we are stupid. “We are in the business of gymnastics and we know what a kid of 14 or 15 or 16 looks like. You don’t have to be a gymnastics coach to know what they look like at 16.” Karolyi, working the games for NBC, believes the international federation’s rules that gymnasts must turn at least 16 during the Olympic year are flawed. Karolyi’s complaints are nothing new. But when they come moments after the Chinese have competed at the Olympics, well, they come across more loudly than ever. “What kind of slap in the face is this?” he asked. “They are 12, 14 years old, max. And they line them up for the world … and having the government back them. “Since they forced an age limit, it has gotten worse and worse. The FIG is running away from the age problem. They set an age limit and now they can’t control it.” International Gymnastics Federation (FIG) officials have accepted the passports of the Chinese women, which indicate all are old enough to compete. Karolyi is originally from Romania, and he says falsifying documents is a common practice in countries such as Romania, Russia and other former Soviet bloc nations. The solution, he said, is to not have any age limit. He believes if a gymnast is good enough to earn a spot at the Olympics or world championships, that athlete deserves to go. He said some juniors today are just as proficient as the age-eligble competitors. Nastia Liukin, for example, would certainly have made the squad for the Athens Games four years ago had she not been 14. Karolyi’s wife, Martha, the national coordinator for the U.S. women’s team, agrees that if there are any questions about age, just eliminate the restrictions being broken. “If it’s true,” she said of any nation using underage gymnasts, “the only situation is to lift up the age limit. It would be an even playing field for everyone.” Bela Karolyi praised the Chinese for their skills on the various apparatus, and for their competitiveness. His issue is not with the athletes, of course, but with those who would use them as pawns in the chase for medals. Very young pawns. “They do good gymnastics and are a good service for the sport,” he said of the Chinese. “They have the ultimate effective training program. That’s why I am more upset that they are cheating. They don’t need cheating. They would be just as good a lineup of eligible athletes.”

08-11-2008, 08:27 AM	#4
chess9 Hall Of Fame Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: 1.d4 Posts: 4,262	Just because 3 of them are still breast feeding is no reason to suspect they are underage! Now, that basket of Huggies may be a bit more damning.... -Robert __________________ "I cannot speak well enough to be unintelligible."-Jane Austen

08-11-2008, 08:43 AM	#5
Dedans Penthouse Professional Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 1,462	No Iron Cross? It was rediculous; the lil' zygotes were "teething" the still rings. __________________ ILC OWNED AND OPERATED - 100% Aspartame-free "All I need are some tasty waves, a cool buzz, and I'm fine" - Jeff Spicoli

08-11-2008, 07:33 PM	#8
El Diablo Hall Of Fame Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 1,596	I don't see much justification....these kids are working like crazy at the sport from a precocious age anyway. __________________ Vantage 100 PolyStar Energy

08-12-2008, 07:19 AM	#10
Enlightened Coelacanth Rookie Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 344	The point is it's an agreed upon restriction that the whole Olympic community presumably has to abide by (whether it makes perfect sense or not). It reminds me of the swimmers that the Soviet Union and East Germany used to churn out that looked like a bunch of Brian Urlachers in Speedos. Is there a requirement to conform to the rules or not? Many of the Chinese gymnasts looked like they should be in elementary school. Not the Olympics. __________________ Freelance educator, philosopher and illuminator. "Cost of my advice? Nothing. Putting advice into action? Priceless."