Was I really out of line here?

[drakulie]

^^^LOL. You are truly hysterical.

[goober]

Originally Posted by seleswannabe

I am captain of a women's 3.0 team. Today, at the end of our 1.5 hours drill (we had 6 attendees) we played 1 doubles match and 1 singles match. I played singles against this gal who is maybe 3 years older than me, decent doubles player but is basically a lobbing backboard in singles. She has gotten many wins for our team this way, so I'm not complaining.
At any rate, I have a tough time just lobbing back and forth since I get extremely bored and annoyed. I like to play attacking tennis. So, after playing a passive and tight first service game from me and her holding serve @ 40-0 I decided to go for a bit more on my serve and my shots. After all, I run up against people like this a lot in matches and sometimes have a tough time playing my game vs. "theirs". So, I was really putting some kick on my serve and attacking the net. I ended up winning 6-1 pretty quickly. Afterward, in front of the entire team she laid into me saying that practice is supposed to be about "fun" and that is EXACTLY what she does not like about singles. The kicker was when she said, "you could at least give me a serve I can return". I actually took that as a compliment I apologized and she spat back that she was not looking for an apology. Was I really that much of a "you know what"? After all I am just a 3.0 player, I can't move mountains.

I am impressed that you can actually hit a kick serve as a 3.0. I really haven't seen that and I bet a lot of 3.0s you face probably haven't either. Anyways your opponent has a bad attitude. She should be glad that she got to practice against a good serve and a good player. You can have fun in beatdowns if you take it as a learning experience.

[Spokewench]

Originally Posted by canadave

However, I still think that as captain, you need to not just destroy someone 6-1 in a practice match against one of your players and walk away.

That being said--yeah, I agree with you and Cindy, if the losing player is just stamping her feet because she's upset she lost, then that's not cool.

I'm a captain of 4 teams. Two 3.0s and two 3.5s. I have most always in the past tried to build up my teammates when I can and if I am a better player, I will not try to trounce them all the time; but occassionally, I believe they need a wake-up call too. Otherwise, they believe they are doing really well and don't know realize that they should be working on their game too. So, sometimes, I will play full out. I think at times you owe it to your players to do that so that they will try to up their game.

I always appreciate it when I play people better than me that they just play their game and that gives me the opportunity to see faster/harder, more spin serves, more variety in shots and gives me the opportunity to figure out how to handle them.

Winning is not everything, learning is sometimes more important.

spoke

[sureshs]

Originally Posted by Cindysphinx

If you kick her off the team (or retailiate in any way), it will be a Big Fat Scandal in your little tennis world. You will be the Bad Guy who Abused Her Power. It will be the talk of town, I assure you.

I agree. I don't understand how kicking her off the team is even an option. She did nothing wrong but complain about a set which she thought was more for practice but her captain thought was a serious one. What is the big deal here?

[blakesq]

No, you were not out of line. Your opponent is simply a sore loser.

[Cindysphinx]

Originally Posted by drakulie

^^^LOL. You are truly hysterical.

Aw, thanks man! I aims to please.

[Moz]

Originally Posted by seleswannabe

I apologized and she spat back that she was not looking for an apology.

I can't believe you apologised, are you some sort of doormat?

[GPB]

Seleswannabe, you asked if you were out of line for playing the way you wanted to play. No, SHE was out of line for trying to force you to play her way. She said practice should be fun, right? Well apparently lobbing back and forth isn't what you call fun. Don't worry about it!

[beernutz]

Originally Posted by seleswannabe

I am captain of a women's 3.0 team. Today, at the end of our 1.5 hours drill (we had 6 attendees) we played 1 doubles match and 1 singles match. I played singles against this gal who is maybe 3 years older than me, decent doubles player but is basically a lobbing backboard in singles. She has gotten many wins for our team this way, so I'm not complaining.
At any rate, I have a tough time just lobbing back and forth since I get extremely bored and annoyed. I like to play attacking tennis. So, after playing a passive and tight first service game from me and her holding serve @ 40-0 I decided to go for a bit more on my serve and my shots. After all, I run up against people like this a lot in matches and sometimes have a tough time playing my game vs. "theirs". So, I was really putting some kick on my serve and attacking the net. I ended up winning 6-1 pretty quickly. Afterward, in front of the entire team she laid into me saying that practice is supposed to be about "fun" and that is EXACTLY what she does not like about singles. The kicker was when she said, "you could at least give me a serve I can return". I actually took that as a compliment I apologized and she spat back that she was not looking for an apology. Was I really that much of a "you know what"? After all I am just a 3.0 player, I can't move mountains.

Missed opportunity, you should have told her it *was* fun.

[Gemini]

Originally Posted by sureshs

I agree. I don't understand how kicking her off the team is even an option. She did nothing wrong but complain about a set which she thought was more for practice but her captain thought was a serious one. What is the big deal here?

I agree with you both but part of the problem is in the perception of what practice is for. The loser considers practice to be about fun. I'm not going to argue that, but a "fun" practice is defined differently by different people apparently.

[JRstriker12]

Originally Posted by canadave

LOL....well, I wouldn't want to phrase it quite as obnoxiously as that woman you mention! That's pretty bad--and pretty obnoxious

I don't know. I guess I wouldn't be good on a tennis team then. I've played on teams, and played tennis, and as far as I'm concerned in practice with teammates you try to work on your own skills but also offer to debrief with your teammate if you see they're having difficulties. I think that's preferable to simply destroying them without comment. But I'll defer to you folks, since I don't have the tennis team experience to speak authoritatively on the subject.

FWIW - I may be really annoying to play someone, beat them, then give an out pouring of "advice" - seeing as you are both on the same level (in this case - 3.0). If they ask for a de-brief or advice afterwards, then sure.

I would definitely go all out in a practice match - it's the best time to simulate the real feeling of presure that you will face in a real match - something that's hard to do in drills.

Save, working on "skills" for the drills. The practice match is the time to put those skills you practiced in action under a real tennis situation. It's easy to do A, B, and C off of feeds, but a lot hard to do it when the ball isn't being fed to you.

In this case - sounds like a pusher/lob queen didn't like that she got crushed. If someone exposes a hole in your game, it's a great time to take note and work on it at next practice. For example - if she couldn't return those serves, come back next week and spend 15 minutes working on trying to return that type of serve and grow your game.

Not trying to gang up on you canadave- I can see your point in a way - but I think the player who threw a fit needs to change her thinking about improving her game. Sounds like she took it as a personal insult, instead of an opportunity to improve.

[drakulie]

Originally Posted by Cindysphinx

Aw, thanks man! I aims to please.

[sureshs]

Originally Posted by Gemini

I agree with you both but part of the problem is in the perception of what practice is for. The loser considers practice to be about fun. I'm not going to argue that, but a "fun" practice is defined differently by different people apparently.

There are many unwritten rules in just "hitting," as an example. You feed to the other guy, the other guy should not hit a winner but feed it back to you, and then each one can attempt to move the other from side to side, while drop shots are frowned upon. This is one example.

[seleswannabe]

Just got back and wow, I did not expect such a response from my post. Just wanted to make a couple of points:
*This "match" was the last 10 minutes of our team drill, with two coaches watching. Our coach and one other pro were watching. She never stopped to asked for help and they never offered any.
*Our coach is notorious for setting lineups based on the outcomes of these end of practice matches. We frequently discuss this as a team, so we "all" take them seriously, not just me.
*Her comments annoyed me but are pretty much the norm for her. Four different team members have personally told me and our coach they flat out refuse to play with her.
*sureshs - I like your comment about bragging about my serve Honestly, if you saw my serve you would probably fall over laughing.

[Cindysphinx]

Originally Posted by seleswannabe

Just got back and wow, I did not expect such a response from my post. Just wanted to make a couple of points:
*This "match" was the last 10 minutes of our team drill, with two coaches watching. Our coach and one other pro were watching. She never stopped to asked for help and they never offered any.
*Our coach is notorious for setting lineups based on the outcomes of these end of practice matches. We frequently discuss this as a team, so we "all" take them seriously, not just me.
*Her comments annoyed me but are pretty much the norm for her. Four different team members have personally told me and our coach they flat out refuse to play with her.
*sureshs - I like your comment about bragging about my serve Honestly, if you saw my serve you would probably fall over laughing.

Oh, I see. You made her look bad with the coach watching.

I feel her pain, but that's just too bad.

I want to hear the follow-up to all of this, seleswannabe. What on earth will she say when the new line-up comes out and she is benched or playing a lower position? Inquiring minds want to know!!

[seleswannabe]

Oh and Cindy, my teammates just stood there. They are used to her comments and outbursts and know it's best to just ignore her.

[lovin'it]

this is what i sometimes hate about team tennis type settings, but before you get upset with her (and i am ALL OVER YOUR SIDE) just know this is her defensive mechanism for losing. some would sulk, some would accuse you of cheating...this was just her way, and it sounds like your teammates have seen it before.

truly, i think you learn more about people on the tennis court than sometimes knowing them for quite awhile!

don't hang your head, we all want to win, and there is an appropriate, sportman-like way to do it, and you did that. it was NOT a drill where you try to keep a ball going twenty hits...she just had to come up with SOMETHING, and this was her way...

nauseating...(excuse me!!)

[Steady Eddy]

Let's keep this real simple. Recall: "If you don't play to win, then why keep score?" So you're keeping score, (why?), and you should only hit shots that she likes? That's the opposite of how competition works. If you don't want to do it that way, then just play points. I've often practiced where we just play out points but don't keep score. Just switch servers after every 4 points. But if you're keeping track of who's winning...then you're competing.

Originally Posted by Cindysphinx

If you kick her off the team (or retailiate in any way), it will be a Big Fat Scandal in your little tennis world. You will be the Bad Guy who Abused Her Power. It will be the talk of town, I assure you.

I'm not sure. Maybe it's the mood I'm in now, but it might be fun to try some stuff. You can: tell her she's not playing, then call her at the last minute to play, maybe tell her, "We had a default 'cause of you.", or do the opposite, schedule her in, but then cancel her at the last minute. Keep her confused about where she stands with you, this is better than dropping her or clearing the air. I've had bosses who were truly great at this, keeping you off balance.

Will this make you the bad guy? I doubt that for several reasons. First most people are obsessed with their own lives and don't care what happens to other people. Also, you wouldn't be dropping her, so there's nothing too obvious going on. And, to others, if they see anything, just a catfight they'd want to stay away from, if they'd take a side, it's more likely yours, because you're the captain. Finally, anything more she'd say would make her look like she's holding a grudge, she got angry for no reason, you forgave, and she's still picking nits, no one will buy what she's selling. The argument to let her get away with this has more to do with timidness. You don't have to be so timid here, it's nice to win at tennis, and it's nice to win in other areas too, especially with people who start trouble with you in the first place.
Machiavelli

[JavierLW]

Originally Posted by Steady Eddy

Let's keep this real simple. Recall: "If you don't play to win, then why keep score?" So you're keeping score, (why?), and you should only hit shots that she likes? That's the opposite of how competition works. If you don't want to do it that way, then just play points. I've often practiced where we just play out points but don't keep score. Just switch servers after every 4 points. But if you're keeping track of who's winning...then you're competing.


I'm not sure. Maybe it's the mood I'm in now, but it might be fun to try some stuff. You can: tell her she's not playing, then call her at the last minute to play, maybe tell her, "We had a default 'cause of you.", or do the opposite, schedule her in, but then cancel her at the last minute. Keep her confused about where she stands with you, this is better than dropping her or clearing the air. I've had bosses who were truly great at this, keeping you off balance.

Will this make you the bad guy? I doubt that for several reasons. First most people are obsessed with their own lives and don't care what happens to other people. Also, you wouldn't be dropping her, so there's nothing too obvious going on. And, to others, if they see anything, just a catfight they'd want to stay away from, if they'd take a side, it's more likely yours, because you're the captain. Finally, anything more she'd say would make her look like she's holding a grudge, she got angry for no reason, you forgave, and she's still picking nits, no one will buy what she's selling. The argument to let her get away with this has more to do with timidness. You don't have to be so timid here, it's nice to win at tennis, and it's nice to win in other areas too, especially with people who start trouble with you in the first place.
Machiavelli

Exactly, some people are obsessed with how everyone perceives them because they dont realize that nobody cares..... (or they are so busy rattling on about other people that they assume everyone else does the same....)

Still wouldnt kick her off the team though. Players spend around $65 to join some of these teams plus whatever they paid to help pay for courts, balls, etc..... It's more of a business then anything.

The way I figure it is Im really careful to avoid picking up players that act like that, but if I get one, that's my fault, Im just going to have to put up with it.

(and it's not really all that awful as long as you understand where they are coming from)

[Gemini]

Agreed.......