Do you consider this poor sportsmanship?

[JRstriker12]

Originally Posted by Annika

This is my opinion. I am 65 yrs old and a single's player. When I ask someone to play singles, whatever their age, I expect them to play as well as they can. And if they don't take advantage of using dropshots, then you better believe as soon as I get a chance, I will use them. As a senior when I see a shot that's impossible to return for one reason or another, I will let it go. We do gain wisdom ya know.

The best thing to do if you HAVE TO use an underhand serve, is to tell your opponent/s well before you start the match. I can remember once when I played in a USTA match and my partner could only serve underhanded due to her recent surgery. She told us as soon as we arrived on the court. Our opponents weren't thrilled. I didn't mind as much because she was my partner.

I've played against some people with a wicked underhand serve. In one local league match we were playing mixed and one older woman just had this nasty, low bouncing, slicing underhand serve. It was her normal serve. She game me more problems returning than the heat her partner was hitting on his serve.

[tennis tom]

Originally Posted by Ali

Personally I would never use an underarm server. It shows a lack of integrity on your behalf and also a lack of sportsmanship.

Then you're removing one quiver from your arsenal. It's perfectly legal and can be very effective as the previous poster has said.

I had a doubles match this year on grass, and one of our opponent's, an older chap, used it very effectively against my partner. Our opponent was frustrated because we were winning and pulled out an excellent slice under-handed serve. My parter did not return one of them but
fortunately I could read it and returned it so it was a wash point wise. But, in no way did I take offense that he used every shot he could muster to win. It's no different then returning any other shot. If you observe your opponent's motion carefully you can read if they are going to employ it. I think when it's used in conjunction with fast-serving is when it get's dicey.

I have used it but as an insult when my opponent was an a-hole or on occasion as a joke amongst friends. I bet if one's mortgage depended on it and that was the only shot left, (a la Michael Chang) many of us would "stoop" to the under-hander.

[blakesq]

That is the stupidest thing I have read all day.

Originally Posted by Ali

Personally I would never use an underarm server. It shows a lack of integrity on your behalf and also a lack of sportsmanship.

[ProgressoR]

Originally Posted by blakesq

That is the stupidest thing I have read all day.

I take it you just logged on to TT and have not read any other threads yet.

I feel like posting that sentence about 8 times every time I visit the forums.

[cghipp]

Originally Posted by ProgressoR

I take it you just logged on to TT and have not read any other threads yet.

I feel like posting that sentence about 8 times every time I visit the forums.

LOL - SO true.

[bigfoot910]

Drop shots would be ok, as long as they were done in moderation, just like playing a regular opponent (like hitting a drop shot volley if there is an opening). I definitely wouldn't be doing it every other ball. It is just unsporting, but like a previous poster said, they are playing on the singles ladder, so obviously they are playing for some competitive spirit.

The underhanded serve, that's just underhanded. I don't do that to anyone, I feel like it is disrespectful to an opponent. People may disagree, but I feel like if I am going to win, I am going to do it fair and square not trying to trick someone using dirty tactics...

[Steady Eddy]

Confusing. Is it also bad form to hit to someone's backhand because it's weak? Maybe it's best to alternate winning points so that no one's feelings get hurt? Why keep score if one player isn't allowed to hit some legal shots according to other people's very subjective understanding of what's fair?

[cghipp]

Originally Posted by Steady Eddy

Confusing. Is it also bad form to hit to someone's backhand because it's weak? Maybe it's best to alternate winning points so that no one's feelings get hurt? Why keep score if one player isn't allowed to hit some legal shots according to other people's very subjective understanding of what's fair?

I am extremely farsighted, so it would be totally unfair for someone to hit a hard shot at me at net... (Note to self: Make sure everyone in the club knows about this!)

[spot]

I don't get the hatred towards an underhand serve. If I hit big topspin groundstrokes and someone moves back so that the ball will drop into their hitting zone then its not a problem to hit a dropshot and make them cover the part of the court they have conceded right? But if I hit big topspin serves and someone moves back so that the ball will drop into their hitting zone then hitting an underhand serve to make them cover the part of the court they have conceded is now showing a lack of integrity?

[cghipp]

My only problem with the underhand serve is that I think the receiver has a right to know when the ball is coming, and when someone pulls an underhand serve out of nowhere, it's kind of like quick serving them because they're waiting for your racquet to go up to hit the ball. I know that this is absolutely not part of the rules - it's just the way I feel about it. Of course I wouldn't do that for any other kind of shot (Hey, look out for my wicked dropper!), but when I'm starting the point I feel a little different about it. Your opponent should know when the point is starting.

In the match I referred to earlier, at State, I absolutely should have swallowed my pride and tried to serve underhand. Maybe the reason I didn't do it was that I was so "frozen" with nerves, I was afraid I wouldn't be able to get that in, either.

[North]

Originally Posted by spot

I don't get the hatred towards an underhand serve.

Yeah, I don't get it either. Underhand serves certainly drive me up the wall - very frustrating. I play this one guy from time to time who will unpredictably hit very hard flat serves that come blasting at me, so I have to back way up to return the serve, alternating with dinky little drop shot serves that land 2 or 3 feet from the net. When I move forward to get to those little dinks he starts blasting again - drives me crazy.

Also frustrating is lack of pace, frequent changes of pace on groundstrokes, crazy varied spins, moonballs, drop shots..... Yet I have no qualms about either myself or an opponent choosing any of these shots to win most efficiently. What I really don't get is questioning the integrity of people who use underhand serves. If I can't handle a serve like that then it's just one more thing I have to get better at.

[Austinthecity]

Personally, I have been raised and trained to the way of the thinking of a lot of the other posters. I think the underhand serve pushes the limit of sportsmanship and can be a drop in tennis etiquette. Have I used it? Sure. But here are some scenarios:

-If I am playing around with a buddy on court I might underhand serve to get a laugh. In this case, if I aced him and he asked to replay, I would. This scenario is strictly to pull a laugh.

-I played dubs a while back and one of the opponents was getting angry to the point of dangerous. He would give us balls back by hitting them as hard as he could and they would usually hit the fence first. I proceeded to underhand ace him.

-I played 3.5 states in the past and there was a self rated 3.5 who was clearly a ringer. He just graduated high school and was going to UGA to be on the practice squad. I had no chance against him and underhand served him. He won the point and kind of looked at me questioningly and I responded, "that's all I got." He got a laugh out of it. He ended up getting DQ'd and bumped to 5.0

Personally, I wouldn't use an underhand in a match against someone who's not a close buddy. However, I started playing the devil's advocate and thinking about it and I wonder if things that are now acceptable in other sports were once considered in the same boat as the underhand serve in tennis:

Was it ever looked down upon in baseball to intentionally walk someone to close the gap if there was a runner on 2nd?

Was it ever looked down upon in football to just kneel for 4 downs when you basically have the game won with 2 minutes left and the other team doesn't have any timeouts?

[cghipp]

Originally Posted by Austinthecity

Was it ever looked down upon in baseball to intentionally walk someone to close the gap if there was a runner on 2nd?

I was a fast-pitch softball pitcher in school, and I HATED intentional walks.

Was it ever looked down upon in football to just kneel for 4 downs when you basically have the game won with 2 minutes left and the other team doesn't have any timeouts?

I hate that, too! To me it isn't sporting. It's similar to when a tennis team will default/retire from remaining lines after they've clinched the match.

[spot]

I used an underhand serve on a huge point against a big hitter in doubles. i was just pounding his backhand with topspin serves and he moved back so it would drop into his hitting zone. I was up 40-30 on set point and on a first serve I just underhand dropped it over to his backhand. It wasn't a wicked drop- he got to it but had to reach and lift it up and over the net and but put it at least 5 feet long. After having so much trouble taking high backhands, having to adjust to one he had to move in and scoop was just very difficult for him. It was a demoralizing point and I think we went on to win the second set 6-1.

He wasn't covering that part of the court so thats where I hit it. I didn't quick serve him- I just hit it to the part of the court he decided not to cover. I can't for the life of me see whats the least bit unethical about it.

I can understand losing points to an underhanded serve being exeptionally frustrating. I can understand if you feel its unethical to quickserve someone when they aren't expecting it. But I can't understand why people want to act like the underhand serve by itself is illegal and only allowed through some kind of loophole.

[cghipp]

Originally Posted by spot

He wasn't covering that part of the court so thats where I hit it. I didn't quick serve him- I just hit it to the part of the court he decided not to cover. I can't for the life of me see whats the least bit unethical about it. ...

If you're referring to my post, I didn't say it was unethical. I just don't like to/want to/feel good about doing it.

[Cindysphinx]

Originally Posted by cghipp

My only problem with the underhand serve is that I think the receiver has a right to know when the ball is coming, and when someone pulls an underhand serve out of nowhere, it's kind of like quick serving them because they're waiting for your racquet to go up to hit the ball. I know that this is absolutely not part of the rules - it's just the way I feel about it. Of course I wouldn't do that for any other kind of shot (Hey, look out for my wicked dropper!), but when I'm starting the point I feel a little different about it. Your opponent should know when the point is starting.

Maybe you've put your finger on why the idea bugs me also. Serving is fraught with expectations and rituals. Receiver has to get ready. Server has to look that Receiver is ready. Receiver can ask server to wait briefly by holding up a racket. Server will show Receiver new balls. If Receiver isn't ready and doesn't move, it doesn't count. Servers have predictable rituals, like number of ball bounces. Servers often apologize when they catch a toss -- they've thrown off the Receiver's rhythm.

And despite all of that based on rules and customs, we have the server suddenly being able to surprise the receiver out of nowhere with an underhand serve. Receiver, who was expecting to split on the toss and read the toss, suddenly gets an underhand serve. If it works, it is 50% due to the element of surprise.

It just doesn't fit with everything else that accompanies serving, you know?

That said, I do have one teammate who will underhand serve in practice. She does it when the sun is in her eyes. This bugs me to no end, not because of custom or etiquette. It is because she is so focused on winning a point in a practice match that she is wasting the chance to practice serving into the sun.

[blakesq]

Once a receiver is ready to receive a serve, he cannot become unready just because you underhand serve him. I play according to the rules of tennis, if pepole think i am being unfair or unsporting for using an underhand serve, then tennis is probably not the sport for them, they should probably just go back home and play with their dolls.

Originally Posted by cghipp

My only problem with the underhand serve is that I think the receiver has a right to know when the ball is coming, and when someone pulls an underhand serve out of nowhere, it's kind of like quick serving them because they're waiting for your racquet to go up to hit the ball. I know that this is absolutely not part of the rules - it's just the way I feel about it. Of course I wouldn't do that for any other kind of shot (Hey, look out for my wicked dropper!), but when I'm starting the point I feel a little different about it. Your opponent should know when the point is starting.

In the match I referred to earlier, at State, I absolutely should have swallowed my pride and tried to serve underhand. Maybe the reason I didn't do it was that I was so "frozen" with nerves, I was afraid I wouldn't be able to get that in, either.

[cghipp]

Originally Posted by blakesq

Once a receiver is ready to receive a serve, he cannot become unready just because you underhand serve him. I play according to the rules of tennis, if pepole think i am being unfair or unsporting for using an underhand serve, then tennis is probably not the sport for them, they should probably just go back home and play with their dolls.

Wow, are you just trying to be a jerk? I am well acquainted with the rules concerning the serve, AS I MENTIONED EARLIER. I don't care what you do, or what my opponent does. I'm talking about they way I feel about WHAT I DO.

[Cindysphinx]

Originally Posted by blakesq

Once a receiver is ready to receive a serve, he cannot become unready just because you underhand serve him. I play according to the rules of tennis, if pepole think i am being unfair or unsporting for using an underhand serve, then tennis is probably not the sport for them, they should probably just go back home and play with their dolls.

Of course you can serve underhand. Go for it, man!

In fact, if you do underhand serve, I will never forget you. Why, I remember the one and only guy (a 4.0) I have ever seen underhand serve in 7.0 mixed. Man, he was such a tool! Snotty attitude about announcing the score, took huge cuts at the ball but missed wildly, tried to hit me with overheads. Just not a nice guy. My partner and I were winning, so in the second set this guy hits an underhand serve to my partner. Trouble was, he did it on a second serve and DF, IIRC. Yup, that leaves a good impression: The unmistakable stench of someone who is losing a tennis match.

Yeah. I remember that guy and his underhand serve . . . .

[blakesq]

Please explain what you mean by: "Snotty attitude about announcing the score"?

Originally Posted by Cindysphinx

Of course you can serve underhand. Go for it, man!

In fact, if you do underhand serve, I will never forget you. Why, I remember the one and only guy (a 4.0) I have ever seen underhand serve in 7.0 mixed. Man, he was such a tool! Snotty attitude about announcing the score, took huge cuts at the ball but missed wildly, tried to hit me with overheads. Just not a nice guy. My partner and I were winning, so in the second set this guy hits an underhand serve to my partner. Trouble was, he did it on a second serve and DF, IIRC. Yup, that leaves a good impression: The unmistakable stench of someone who is losing a tennis match.

Yeah. I remember that guy and his underhand serve . . . .