A selection of Suzanne Lenglen’s singles results (1919-1926)

[boredone3456]

Originally Posted by Limpinhitter

Here's a fascinating video with high speed film of Lenglen's strokes starting at about 2:00. And, some match play near the end.

http://www.britishpathe.com/record.php?id=75159

I think this was on here before, this footage, did you post this before? If so, thank you for reposting it because it is an amazing thing to watch. If not, well thank you for finding it and posting it for us, its doesn't give us a ton of evidence compared the vast amount of videos of current players, but enough to make some comparisons and guesses...awesome.

[Limpinhitter]

Originally Posted by CEvertFan

That was absolutely fascinating! - I'd never seen this footage before.

What did you think of the size of that racquet and the huge, all wooden, grip?

[pc1]

Originally Posted by Limpinhitter

What did you think of the size of that racquet and the huge, all wooden, grip?

Is the grip all wooden? I thought it may have been a regular grip but looked wooden because of the black and white film.

[hoodjem]

I did not see any leather strap winding around. It looked all grooved wood to me, except for the buttcap.

[pc1]

Originally Posted by hoodjem

I did not see any leather strap winding around. It looked all grooved wood to me, except for the buttcap.

You could be right. I thought perhaps it wasn't grooved but some material that may have looked look wood in black and white film.

[Limpinhitter]

Originally Posted by pc1

Is the grip all wooden? I thought it may have been a regular grip but looked wooden because of the black and white film.

It's all wood with grooves in it. There is no butt cap, that's a leather strap. I went to Don Budge's tennis academy in the early 70's, and his racquet had the same type of grip as shown in the video. His racquets were custom made for him by Rawlings. They weighed 16 oz, and grip and was 5 1/4" around. According to Budge, who was 59 at the time, he had no calluses on his hand after playing tennis for over 50 years because he always used a wood grip, never the "new" leather grips, and that wood grips never get slippery with sweat. Also, a local tennis shop has about 50 vintage racquets hanging from the ceiling. One of them has this classic grooved wood grip with the leather strip on the butt. Very nostalgic.

[newmark401]

Originally Posted by pc1

Is the grip all wooden? I thought it may have been a regular grip but looked wooden because of the black and white film.

Re the racket she used, here is an excerpt from "Lawn Tennis for Girls" (1920), by Suzanne Lenglen. This excerpt is taken from chapter 2, “Equipment”. The whole book can be downloaded free here: http://www.kobobooks.com/ebook/Lawn-...Cpw/page1.html

“As you cannot play without a racket, let us go at once to a first-class maker and choose a really good racket.

“A great deal of care is needed in selecting a racket. So many beginners and poor players sacrifice goodness to cheapness. This is the worst kind of economy.

“You will never become a good player or enjoy your tennis with a poor weapon. Much of the bad play of girls is caused by bad rackets, loosely strung, ill-balanced, with awkward handles and clumsy frames.

“A good racket gives confidence. Armed with it a player feels she can and must do it credit. It will never do for her to disgrace her good racket by bad play. She is on her mettle, which is, of course, the right attitude.

“The first consideration is weight, which will vary according to the age of the player. I myself never use a heavier racket than 13½ ounces.

“After weight, balance. The evenly-balanced racket is best for all-round purposes. The usual balance is from 12½ to 13½ inches, measuring from end to handle. An evenly-balanced racket will remain balanced; if heavy in the head the head will sink, if light in the head the handle will sink.

“For volleying, service and overhead strokes, a light-headed racket is best. For driving and baseline play a racket with the weight in the head is the best. I warn players against using too heavy a racket. It hampers their wrist play, and few girls have strong wrists.

“Now for the size of the handle. The big handle has passed away, as extremes always do. A good circumference is five inches. The great thing is to have a comfortable handle which the fingers can easily span. Too big a handle cramps the wrist and interferes with volleying and all deft shots. A big handle also upsets the balance of the racket.

“See that your racket is tightly strung with medium gut, not thin, nor thick. These are regulation terms, rackets being strung with gut of three thicknesses. By ‘tightly’ I do not mean like a board. If you flick your nails sharply over the face of your racket and it gives a nice musical ring, you may assume that the strings are of the right tautness.

“Avoid a clumsy frame. The long, narrow and the very wide frame are both to be avoided. You must strike the happy medium.

“Many players use grips of various kinds on their handles. I never do. I am opposed to a rubber grip, as it heats the hand and causes blisters. Many of the Colonial and some English players use surgical whipping; it gives a good grip. A well-shaped handle, sufficiently rough, is, in my opinion, best for all players except those with very dry hands.

“If your hands get damp in hot weather, and your racket slips, a pinch of sawdust, supplied at all tournaments, is the simple remedy.

“Some players use rosin, and certainly this gives a clinging grip. After all, it is largely a matter of individual taste, always providing that the artificial grip does not disturb the balance of the racket.

“If your handle gets too smooth and slippery, it is very simple to rough this with a file.”

[Limpinhitter]

Originally Posted by newmark401

Re the racket she used, here is an excerpt from "Lawn Tennis for Girls" (1920), by Suzanne Lenglen. This excerpt is taken from chapter 2, “Equipment”. The whole book can be downloaded free here: http://www.kobobooks.com/ebook/Lawn-...Cpw/page1.html

“As you cannot play without a racket, let us go at once to a first-class maker and choose a really good racket.

“A great deal of care is needed in selecting a racket. So many beginners and poor players sacrifice goodness to cheapness. This is the worst kind of economy.

“You will never become a good player or enjoy your tennis with a poor weapon. Much of the bad play of girls is caused by bad rackets, loosely strung, ill-balanced, with awkward handles and clumsy frames.

“A good racket gives confidence. Armed with it a player feels she can and must do it credit. It will never do for her to disgrace her good racket by bad play. She is on her mettle, which is, of course, the right attitude.

“The first consideration is weight, which will vary according to the age of the player. I myself never use a heavier racket than 13½ ounces.

“After weight, balance. The evenly-balanced racket is best for all-round purposes. The usual balance is from 12½ to 13½ inches, measuring from end to handle. An evenly-balanced racket will remain balanced; if heavy in the head the head will sink, if light in the head the handle will sink.

“For volleying, service and overhead strokes, a light-headed racket is best. For driving and baseline play a racket with the weight in the head is the best. I warn players against using too heavy a racket. It hampers their wrist play, and few girls have strong wrists.

“Now for the size of the handle. The big handle has passed away, as extremes always do. A good circumference is five inches. The great thing is to have a comfortable handle which the fingers can easily span. Too big a handle cramps the wrist and interferes with volleying and all deft shots. A big handle also upsets the balance of the racket.

“See that your racket is tightly strung with medium gut, not thin, nor thick. These are regulation terms, rackets being strung with gut of three thicknesses. By ‘tightly’ I do not mean like a board. If you flick your nails sharply over the face of your racket and it gives a nice musical ring, you may assume that the strings are of the right tautness.

“Avoid a clumsy frame. The long, narrow and the very wide frame are both to be avoided. You must strike the happy medium.

“Many players use grips of various kinds on their handles. I never do. I am opposed to a rubber grip, as it heats the hand and causes blisters. Many of the Colonial and some English players use surgical whipping; it gives a good grip. A well-shaped handle, sufficiently rough, is, in my opinion, best for all players except those with very dry hands.

“If your hands get damp in hot weather, and your racket slips, a pinch of sawdust, supplied at all tournaments, is the simple remedy.

“Some players use rosin, and certainly this gives a clinging grip. After all, it is largely a matter of individual taste, always providing that the artificial grip does not disturb the balance of the racket.

“If your handle gets too smooth and slippery, it is very simple to rough this with a file.”

Very interesting. I wonder if they had the ability to gauge the tension of their stringing with any accuracy. In any event, I've seen enough of them to recognize them. That was a wood grip with a leather strip on the butt that she was holding in that video. I would also proffer that Lenglen's reference to a "well-shaped grip, sufficiently rough," and "the artificial grip . . . disturb[ing] the balance of the racket," are evidence that her preferred grip was the wood handle that the racquet is made out of.

[Limpinhitter]

Here are some samples of wood handle racquets with leather butt strips for sale on ****:

http://cgi.*********/Antique-Vintage...item588876de91

http://cgi.*********/ANTIQUE-SMITH-C...item3a58db32f7

http://cgi.*********/VINTAGE-SPALDIN...item33575f2eb8

http://cgi.*********/RARE-ANTIQUE-SP...item3a5977d157

http://cgi.*********/VINTAGE-WOOD-TE...item1c0eb0c994

PS: Oh well, this site blocks the use of the word e-b-a-y. So, the links don't work. Just do an e-b-a-y search for vintage wood racquet

[CEvertFan]

Originally Posted by Limpinhitter

What did you think of the size of that racquet and the huge, all wooden, grip?

A short handled, small faced racquet. What was also interesting was how Lenglen really put all of her body weight behind each shot to a more extreme level than I've ever seen, her amazing balance and the ease with which she moved.


Hard to believe Lenglen became one of the best players ever considering that she had so many health issues as a child and even as an adult.

[newmark401]

Originally Posted by CEvertFan

A short handled, small faced racquet. What was also interesting was how Lenglen really put all of her body weight behind each shot to a more extreme level than I've ever seen, her amazing balance and the ease with which she moved.


Hard to believe Lenglen became one of the best players ever considering that she had so many health issues as a child and even as an adult.

I’m not so sure that Suzanne Lenglen had as many health issues either as a child or as an adult that some people seem to think. Certainly I’ve never read about them. My impression is that she had something of a nervous temperament, but this didn’t cause her to lose any singles matches after her fifteenth birthday, not even as a professional when the usual pressures associated with winning did not apply. (That said, Suzanne was determined to win all of the matches she played against the American player Mary K. Browne during her professional tour of the United States, which took place from October 1926 to 1927, and during the professional matches Suzanne played in Great Britain in the summer of 1927.)

It would be nice if there was a book entitled “Suzanne Lenglen in her own Words”, so that I could read what she really felt and thought, not second-hand accounts of what she allegedly said or thought or felt. So many myths have grown up around her that it’s virtually impossible now to separate reality from fantasy.

Mary K. Browne once asked Suzanne whether it was true that her father used to place handkerchiefs around one side of the court and get Suzanne to hit them from the other side in other to develop and improve her accuracy. Suzanne replied, no, this was not true, her father had never done such a thing. Suzanne didn’t know where that story had come from, but people were always making up stories like that about her.

[krosero]

Originally Posted by Limpinhitter

Here's a fascinating video with high speed film of Lenglen's strokes starting at about 2:00. And, some match play near the end.

http://www.britishpathe.com/record.php?id=75159

Great footage, thanks for that! Love the way Suzanne moves.

[Limpinhitter]

Originally Posted by krosero

Great footage, thanks for that! Love the way Suzanne moves.

Watching her play, isolated, in these videos, I wonder, did SL invent the split step? I don't recall seeing anyone do it before she did it. Her shot preparation was as energetic as anyone I've seen to this day.

[krosero]

Originally Posted by Limpinhitter

Watching her play, isolated, in these videos, I wonder, did SL invent the split step? I don't recall seeing anyone do it before she did it. Her shot preparation was as energetic as anyone I've seen to this day.

Well who knows if it's possible to pinpoint when something like that started. For example R.N. Williams was taking McLoughlin's "cannonball" serve on the rise in 1914, and I would have to think a split step was used. I guess the only way to know for sure is to find footage.

[pc1]

Originally Posted by krosero

Great footage, thanks for that! Love the way Suzanne moves.

There's really one flashy shot where she's jumping with her back to the net and flicking a backhand while she's in the air at the baseline that was pretty impressive. I suppose now a lot of players would use the between the legs shot but I kind of like the way she hits her shot better.

[krosero]

Originally Posted by pc1

There's really one flashy shot where she's jumping with her back to the net and flicking a backhand while she's in the air at the baseline that was pretty impressive. I suppose now a lot of players would use the between the legs shot but I kind of like the way she hits her shot better.

I do too. And today I was playing some tennis, had a high backhand smash to make. Well I had these images from the film reel still in my head, after watching them last night. I told myself to not be so stiff, to move a little like Suzanne, lol. And the smash came off great; my arms opened up in follow-through, the ball went where I wanted, with power. Normally I just do that shot with my arm, without too much involvement from my body. It just felt liberating to move like that.

[pc1]

Originally Posted by krosero

I do too. And today I was playing some tennis, had a high backhand smash to make. Well I had these images from the film reel still in my head, after watching them last night. I told myself to not be so stiff, to move a little like Suzanne, lol. And the smash came off great; my arms opened up in follow-through, the ball went where I wanted, with power. Normally I just do that shot with my arm, without too much involvement from my body. It just felt liberating to move like that.

It's really feels unbelievable what you can incorporate something you saw from a great player into your game. I would have felt ecstatic if I could make a shot like that.

[CEvertFan]

Originally Posted by newmark401

I’m not so sure that Suzanne Lenglen had as many health issues either as a child or as an adult that some people seem to think. Certainly I’ve never read about them. My impression is that she had something of a nervous temperament, but this didn’t cause her to lose any singles matches after her fifteenth birthday, not even as a professional when the usual pressures associated with winning did not apply. (That said, Suzanne was determined to win all of the matches she played against the American player Mary K. Browne during her professional tour of the United States, which took place from October 1926 to 1927, and during the professional matches Suzanne played in Great Britain in the summer of 1927.)

It would be nice if there was a book entitled “Suzanne Lenglen in her own Words”, so that I could read what she really felt and thought, not second-hand accounts of what she allegedly said or thought or felt. So many myths have grown up around her that it’s virtually impossible now to separate reality from fantasy.

Mary K. Browne once asked Suzanne whether it was true that her father used to place handkerchiefs around one side of the court and get Suzanne to hit them from the other side in other to develop and improve her accuracy. Suzanne replied, no, this was not true, her father had never done such a thing. Suzanne didn’t know where that story had come from, but people were always making up stories like that about her.

During her youth, she suffered from numerous health problems including chronic asthma, which also plagued her at a later age. Because his daughter was so frail and sickly, Charles Lenglen, the owner of a carriage company, decided that it would be good for her to compete in tennis and gain strength.

[CEvertFan]

Originally Posted by krosero

I do too. And today I was playing some tennis, had a high backhand smash to make. Well I had these images from the film reel still in my head, after watching them last night. I told myself to not be so stiff, to move a little like Suzanne, lol. And the smash came off great; my arms opened up in follow-through, the ball went where I wanted, with power. Normally I just do that shot with my arm, without too much involvement from my body. It just felt liberating to move like that.

That's a very cool story.

[newmark401]

Originally Posted by CEvertFan

During her youth, she suffered from numerous health problems including chronic asthma, which also plagued her at a later age. Because his daughter was so frail and sickly, Charles Lenglen, the owner of a carriage company, decided that it would be good for her to compete in tennis and gain strength.

I'm not sure where the idea of Suzanne Lenglen as a sickly child first originated, but it's true that a personality like her tends to attract a lot of speculation. At this distance in time it is very difficult to separate fact from fiction, but Alan Little's biography is a good source for facts. In it he writes that the young Suzanne liked to swim, run, ride horses, walk on stilts, play diabolo, etc. and that she even took dance lessons to improve her footwork after she had decided to take up tennis seriously.

By 1926, Suzanne was very famous and the stories, whether true or not, were multiplying at a rapid rate, so much so that, in January of that year, the British publication "Lawn Tennis and Badminton" wrote a piece on Suzanne, part of which was entitled "Fantastic Stories", which went as follows:

"Fantastic story after fantastic story has been invented and planted on Mlle Lenglen. There are no rumours too wild or bizarre about her which certain papers of the 'stunt' variety do not jump at and print without even the decent precautions of enquiring whether there is an atom of truth in them. Mlle Lenglen must be sick and tired of issuing denials of stories, the majority of which reflect unfavourably on her."

It appears that Suzanne Lenglen herself read the article from which the above excerpt comes because she wrote the following letter to the editor soon afterwards and it was printed in a later editon of the sports journal:

"Villa Ariem, Avenue de Russie, Nice 2524

"21-1-1926

"Dear Sir,

"I can't tell you how I appreciate your nice article about me in your last issue!

"I am not surprised of your kindness to me because 'Lawn Tennis and Badminton' has always been nice to me!

"Thank you so much!

"Yours the most sincerely

"Suzanne Lenglen"