Pacific Classic Gut 1.30 x MSV Co-Focus 1.23

[Smasher08]

Before:


After:


I've beet trying various poly mains since last October, including Lux, Sonic Pro, Focus Hex, and Turbotwist, and to various degrees have had quite a few arm issues cropping up, mostly minor. And about 5/6 weeks ago I put some string savers into a Turbotwist - Irradiated hybrid which stiffened it up dramatically and my shoulder started killing while serving. Unfortunately since more than a month of using Turbotwist - Spiral Flex (and frequent resting) hasn't gotten me to a point where I feel comfortable serving again, I decided that for whatever reason poly mains weren't for me and I wanted to try the most arm-friendly, spinny combination I could find.

Gut.

I'd tried gut twice before in the past: once in the mid 90s when I was a 3.5 and I really didn't notice anything different or special about it, and once about 2 years ago . . . when a stringer put in some that had way too much give and not nearly enough spin that I had them cut out after 2 hours(!). So thanks to some of the posts here at talk tennis, as well write ups about Fed and Djoker's setups, I was drawn to hybriding gut with poly crosses for spin.

While I was initially leaning towards trying Silverstring crosses, two big shout-outs go to Tennis Warehouse University's string friction rankings and the posts of talk tennis member TimothyO for turning me towards MSV crosses in general and Co-Focus in particular.

I'd wanted to start by trying a budget gut, figuring that if it was arm-friendly enough and at least comparable to Intellitour 17 (my personal reference string that I used for 7/8 years) then I'd be getting something that was good enough for my purposes and it didn't matter that the budget gut didn't perform nearly as well as VS.

I couldn't get a set of budget gut quickly so I found Pacific Classic Gut 16g and pulled the trigger. Had it strung at 51 x 48.


Initial Impressions

My stringer notched it ever so slightly in a few places but nothing that appeared to go through the coating or seemed problematic. Just tapping the stringbed against the palm of my hand was a revelation: no vibrations going through to my racket arm, just proper contact feel.

Felt great.

I hit the court for an hour today doing moderate paced hitting with a friend who's a 3.5. The first 3-4 minutes were weird as it felt slippery and gloopy and biological, like hitting with a jellyfish. The ball pocketing and trampolining were like nothing I'd encountered before since I've used predominantly stiff(ish) feeling strings, and although I didn't notice any special spin being put on like with MSV Focus Hex, I sure noticed that more balls were dropping in and bouncing higher than expected. After 10-15 minutes I'd adjusted enough to it that I began to feel comfortable plowing through my groundies, especially my backhands. A few forays up to the net revealed very comfortable feel and placement, combined with almost effortless power.

On my forehands especially, I noticed that I wasn't feeling any vibrations coming through to my arm anymore so I bit the bullet and tried a couple of serves --- slowly. Even without doing my full second serve motion, I immediately noticed the balls kicking up a good six feet high, about a foot higher than expected. My shoulder still wasn't ready to go full tilt, but this was clearly very promising.

And the strings may still be a few hours away from settling in and hitting their stride.


Specific Impressions

String movement: none
Spin potential: very good to excellent
Power: good to very good
Feel: very good to excellent
Arm-friendliness: outstanding

(Reference string: Intellitour 17g)

I'll be playing at least a couple more times before next weekend with stronger partners who'll really put me through my paces, and I'll update then.

And if anyone has any questions or items they'd like me to include in this review, please by all means ask.

[OldButGame]

This may not have much relevance,..but i just used MSV Co-Focus in a full bed the other night,....and REALLY liked it!!....(in an AG200,....16L,....48lbs).

[WilsonPlayer101]

Smasher, thanks for the review and info. How do you think MSV Hepa-Twist would have been in this hybrid instead of Co-Focus. Thanks.

[Smasher08]

I've never used heptatwist but according to the posts of TimothyO who has, they're made from the same material and the only difference is the texture.

I'd imagine that the hepta might play slightly spinnier at the beginning, but at the expense of sawing through the mains, which won't happen with co-focus.

[Smasher08]

Update - 6 hours

Loving how good it is on my arm, but a little mixed feelings about it too.

String movement: none
Fraying: virtually none
Power: excellent
Feel: very good
Arm-friendliness: outstanding
Spin: so-so

I was hitting with a 4.0 friend and he felt that there was a lot less spin than the Turbotwist and Focus Hex hybrids that I've been using over the past 9 months. On regular topspin shots he thought the ball was bouncing up about a foot to a foot and a half less high.

Similar situation when playing a 5.0 friend. He was jumping on more of my shots because they seemed to be bouncing lower, but what compensated for this is that I was better able to take his replies and blow groundies by him.

I can't figure out the spin, or lack thereof. It's definitely not the kind of hard, jump-up, in-your-face spin that you get from textured polys. but at the same time, I can't help but notice all the groundies I'm ripping that look like they're sailing long and suddenly drop in. It must be due to some kind of spin, but I can't seem to put gobs of spin onto the ball. Even when I'm slicing it's not nearly what it was with poly mains.

I am, however, pretty impressed with how the strings seem to reward just ripping your shots. And the longevity seems good too, but I'll be in a better position to start reviewing that after the 10 hour mark

In the meantime I've decided to borrow a page from Fed and put in some string savers to see if they'll help generate the spin I'm missing.

[Smasher08]

Update - 11 hours

Putting in the string savers has definitely changed the feel of the stringbed and made it stiffer -- it's like the poly crosses have asserted themselves more. It also feels like someone tightened the strings by a couple of pounds.

After hitting against a 5.5 guy and a 5.0 girl I've noticed more spin because of them, still not as much as with poly mains, but definitely more. And even though the stringbed plays stiffer, any vibrations were fine with my shoulder.

As for durability, so far, after 11 hours, I'm pretty happy. No notching, no significant fraying, and it looks like there's plenty of life left in it.

String movement: still none
Fraying: slight, like little fuzz
Power: very good
Feel: very good
Arm friendliness: excellent
Durability: so far so good
Spin: decent

I suspect that since the strings I'm comparing these to were all 1.20 and 1.18, the 1.30 gauge thickness is probably a factor in the spin production. I suspect that in order to get both the spin and durability I'm looking for, I may need to go down to 1.28g and drop the tension 1-2 lbs in the future.

In the meantime, my shoulder is pretty happy with these strings.

[NLBwell]

Was this a constant pull stringer 10% tighter?

[Smasher08]

Sorry NLBwell, I'm not sure what you're asking about.

If it helps, I don't string myself.

[NLBwell]

OK, thanks anyway. Constant pull stringing machines tend to string 10% tighter than other machines.

[a0f6459]

Originally Posted by Smasher08

Before:


After:


I've beet trying various poly mains since last October, including Lux, Sonic Pro, Focus Hex, and Turbotwist, and to various degrees have had quite a few arm issues cropping up, mostly minor. And about 5/6 weeks ago I put some string savers into a Turbotwist - Irradiated hybrid which stiffened it up dramatically and my shoulder started killing while serving. Unfortunately since more than a month of using Turbotwist - Spiral Flex (and frequent resting) hasn't gotten me to a point where I feel comfortable serving again, I decided that for whatever reason poly mains weren't for me and I wanted to try the most arm-friendly, spinny combination I could find.

Gut.

I'd tried gut twice before in the past: once in the mid 90s when I was a 3.5 and I really didn't notice anything different or special about it, and once about 2 years ago . . . when a stringer put in some that had way too much give and not nearly enough spin that I had them cut out after 2 hours(!). So thanks to some of the posts here at talk tennis, as well write ups about Fed and Djoker's setups, I was drawn to hybriding gut with poly crosses for spin.

While I was initially leaning towards trying Silverstring crosses, two big shout-outs go to Tennis Warehouse University's string friction rankings and the posts of talk tennis member TimothyO for turning me towards MSV crosses in general and Co-Focus in particular.

I'd wanted to start by trying a budget gut, figuring that if it was arm-friendly enough and at least comparable to Intellitour 17 (my personal reference string that I used for 7/8 years) then I'd be getting something that was good enough for my purposes and it didn't matter that the budget gut didn't perform nearly as well as VS.

I couldn't get a set of budget gut quickly so I found Pacific Classic Gut 16g and pulled the trigger. Had it strung at 51 x 48.


Initial Impressions

My stringer notched it ever so slightly in a few places but nothing that appeared to go through the coating or seemed problematic. Just tapping the stringbed against the palm of my hand was a revelation: no vibrations going through to my racket arm, just proper contact feel.

Felt great.

I hit the court for an hour today doing moderate paced hitting with a friend who's a 3.5. The first 3-4 minutes were weird as it felt slippery and gloopy and biological, like hitting with a jellyfish. The ball pocketing and trampolining were like nothing I'd encountered before since I've used predominantly stiff(ish) feeling strings, and although I didn't notice any special spin being put on like with MSV Focus Hex, I sure noticed that more balls were dropping in and bouncing higher than expected. After 10-15 minutes I'd adjusted enough to it that I began to feel comfortable plowing through my groundies, especially my backhands. A few forays up to the net revealed very comfortable feel and placement, combined with almost effortless power.

On my forehands especially, I noticed that I wasn't feeling any vibrations coming through to my arm anymore so I bit the bullet and tried a couple of serves --- slowly. Even without doing my full second serve motion, I immediately noticed the balls kicking up a good six feet high, about a foot higher than expected. My shoulder still wasn't ready to go full tilt, but this was clearly very promising.

And the strings may still be a few hours away from settling in and hitting their stride.


Specific Impressions

String movement: none
Spin potential: very good to excellent
Power: good to very good
Feel: very good to excellent
Arm-friendliness: outstanding

(Reference string: Intellitour 17g)

I'll be playing at least a couple more times before next weekend with stronger partners who'll really put me through my paces, and I'll update then.

And if anyone has any questions or items they'd like me to include in this review, please by all means ask.

What kind of strokes do you have? Extreme topspin or more flat? I just want to know what kind of game this setup is conducive to.

Thanks

[Smasher08]

Moderate spin, but my strokes are probably flatter than I think, hence my fondness of spinny strings. I use a semi western grip on my forehand and an eastern on my 1hbh, playing an aggressive all-court style.

Focus hex was fun because I could really pile on the topspin and play like a clay court specialist.

[a0f6459]

Originally Posted by Smasher08

Moderate spin, but my strokes are probably flatter than I think, hence my fondness of spinny strings. I use a semi western grip on my forehand and an eastern on my 1hbh, playing an aggressive all-court style.

Focus hex was fun because I could really pile on the topspin and play like a clay court specialist.

Thanks for the reply.

Have you ever played with a fullbed of the Pacific you use in this hybrid? What tension?

If so, what is the dropoff in power when combined with the poly?

[Smasher08]

Nope. Tried a full bed of gut (brand unknown) a stringer surprised me with a couple of years ago and I hated how un-spinny it was. Arm-friendly and powerful, but not spinny.

Don't think there was much of a dropoff (if any) with the co-focus, until I put in the string savers. Felt a pound or two tighter then.

[TennisCJC]

Pac Classic is good and you may want to try Bab Tonic+ Ballfeel (16g) as it is good too. I get about 20 hours of good play with Bab Tonic+ BF gut mains/poly cross. I am currently playing poly mains with either multi cross but am thinking of switching back for more power and comfort. Arm and wrist a bit sore.

[Smasher08]

Update - 16 hours

Still only very slight fraying, like little fuzz. And I do think that there's a tiny, tiny bit more spin than before. This hybrid sure looks like it's gonna last.

At this rate, I'm wondering if I should go down to 1.25 mains x 1.20 crosses next time.....

[a0f6459]

Originally Posted by Smasher08

Update - 16 hours

Still only very slight fraying, like little fuzz. And I do think that there's a tiny, tiny bit more spin than before. This hybrid sure looks like it's gonna last.

At this rate, I'm wondering if I should go down to 1.25 mains x 1.20 crosses next time.....

Keep us updated!

I'm following along to see how it plays the life of the strings.

[Smasher08]

Lol aw thanks buddy.

What's really surprised me is the longevity of this setup: I would've expected way more fraying by now, and also there's no discernable drop in tension or playability in the crosses.

If it had more bite and spin, it would be perfect. So depending on how long it lasts -- and I'm just guessing here but 30+ hours sure looks like a real possibility right now -- I'll go for either 16L or 17g next time.

[Smasher08]

Update - 22 hours

It really is getting spinnier and spinnier, and the slight fraying doesn't seem to have changed since my last update.

If the setup was this spinny from the get-go, it really would be perfect.

[TimothyO]

Originally Posted by Smasher08

Update - 22 hours

It really is getting spinnier and spinnier, and the slight fraying doesn't seem to have changed since my last update.

If the setup was this spinny from the get-go, it really would be perfect.

Smasher,

My wife and I are having the same experience with our Pure Storms. As the string bed "ages" with time and play the spin potential increases as does the comfort. Control is as solid as ever.

For my Speed MP 18x20 I switched from Team to Touch to tame the power a bit and after about a 10 days the string bed is showing the same result. I have a sore ankle and can't play but on Sunday I hit some serves and the spin potential increased dramatically. I had despaired that the MP would never match the PSLGT in spin but not now.

IIRC the TW Prof mentioned that gut mains and poly crosses may increase in spin potential due to the structure or chemical make up of the gut. It may be "self lubricating".

I don't know why but rather than being eager to "try another string setup" for the first time I'm dreading the need to restring at some future date.



EDIT: do try the 18g Co-Focus for the crosses...I switched to that from 17g and spin potential definitely increased. I have some Focus Hex 18L inbound which I'm going to try with VS Black in my new MG Radical OS. I had bad luck with profiled/textured crosses previously but I'm wondering if the super thin cross section will mitigate those issues.

[Smasher08]

Originally Posted by TimothyO

I don't know why but rather than being eager to "try another string setup" for the first time I'm dreading the need to restring at some future date.



EDIT: do try the 18g Co-Focus for the crosses...I switched to that from 17g and spin potential definitely increased. I have some Focus Hex 18L inbound which I'm going to try with VS Black in my new MG Radical OS. I had bad luck with profiled/textured crosses previously but I'm wondering if the super thin cross section will mitigate those issues.

Thanks Timothy, and I probably owe you a huge thank you for all your posts about Co-Focus, since they turned me towards trying it in the first place!

I'm curious about a couple of things: how many hours do you think you and your wife have logged on your current string jobs, and are you encountering any difficulties with the 1.18mm crosses (ie, the alleged "sawing" that supposedly can occur when you have a difference in thickness of more than 0.05mm between your mains and crosses)?