How Do You Call Lines?

[junbumkim]

I usually try to be accurate and give the point if I am not sure. Fortunately I never had to deal with anybody who was a obvious cheat.

I think if it was really bad enough to frustrate me, I would probably stop playing with the guy.

[LuckyR]

What do you do if you are tracking a ball and your opinion is it is going to land out, you see it bounce on the court but because you are behind the ball, your view of the outside portion of the line is obscured by the ball itself? Needless to say, you can't see court between the ball and line.

You "know" the ball is "out".

If I am playing a "generous" player I will call the ball "in".

[papa]

Originally Posted by LuckyR

What do you do if you are tracking a ball and your opinion is it is going to land out, you see it bounce on the court but because you are behind the ball, your view of the outside portion of the line is obscured by the ball itself? Needless to say, you can't see court between the ball and line.

You "know" the ball is "out".

If I am playing a "generous" player I will call the ball "in".

You have to "see" the ball "out" rather than guess it might be. So in the case you described, the ball would be "in" because you didn't see it "out".

[SystemicAnomaly]

Originally Posted by LuckyR

What do you do if you are tracking a ball and your opinion is it is going to land out, you see it bounce on the court but because you are behind the ball, your view of the outside portion of the line is obscured by the ball itself? Needless to say, you can't see court between the ball and line.

You "know" the ball is "out".

If I am playing a "generous" player I will call the ball "in".

Originally Posted by papa

You have to "see" the ball "out" rather than guess it might be. So in the case you described, the ball would be "in" because you didn't see it "out".

No, I disagree with this.

It's not really a "guess" that the ball is out in the situation described LuckyR. Experienced serve returners will often/usually be able to discern if the ball is long even if they cannot see that gap between the ball and the line from their perspective/location. The serve may be long by 2-3 inches or so and the returner might not be able to clearly see the gap but can still tell that the serve is long. Most/many servers should be able to see that same gap from their perspective and should expect that ball to be called long.

Sometimes, as a server, I can clearly see that the ball is long and do not prepare to respond to a return. However, the returner does not make the "long" call and rips the ball back for a winner. The "generous" returner idoes the server no favors by failing to call the ball long in this situation.
.

[Limpinhitter]

Originally Posted by SystemicAnomaly

No, I disagree with this.

It's not really a "guess" that the ball is out in the situation described LuckyR. Experienced serve returners will often/usually be able to discern if the ball is long even if they cannot see that gap between the ball and the line from their perspective/location. The serve may be long by 2-3 inches or so and the returner might not be able to clearly see the gap but can still tell that the serve is long. Most/many servers should be able to see that same gap from their perspective and should expect that ball to be called long.

Sometimes, as a server, I can clearly see that the ball is long and do not prepare to respond to a return. However, the returner does not make the "long" call and rips the ball back for a winner. The returner is not doing the server a favor by being generous in this situation.

That's exactly right! It does take some experience to accurately call incoming serves that are less than a few inches out, especially 100+mph serves. Your experience is also bolstered by your opponents concurrence with your calls.

Having said that, I get a kick out of inconsistent calls from different opponents of my serves and other shots that land close to the service lines and baselines. For example, last week I played a practice set against a very good player who played one of my shots that landed very close to the baseline without calling it out. After the point I asked him if he was sure it was good. He said yes. I explained that the reason I asked was because, although I couldn't really see if the ball touched the line from 70 feet away, I was accostomed to having a ball that looked like that called out by others. Needless to say, a few points later, he hit a brutally sharp-angled lefty slice serve (that hit the side fence), that I percieved as just wide by less than an inch, but, it was very close. I gave him the ace.

[jmverdugo]

First thing you should think is that maybe he is not hooking you, he just doesn't see the lines very good and he is also doing his best. Second there is also the possibility that he thinks you are hooking him and then he tries to do the same, let's face it we can also be the one making honest mistakes. Personally if I saw it out I call it out, I am not sure i just play it. Sometimes I have called it out and then 5 sec later I rethink about the play and tell to the other guy to take the point because actually the ball may have been in, usually they just ask to repeat the point.

I think the number one rule to avoid frustration for bad calls is to think he is doing an honest mistake and move on. If you start thinking they are hooking you then you will get mad and frustrated.

[LuckyR]

Originally Posted by Limpinhitter

That's exactly right! It does take some experience to accurately call incoming serves that are less than a few inches out, especially 100+mph serves. Your experience is also bolstered by your opponents concurrence with your calls.

Having said that, I get a kick out of inconsistent calls from different opponents of my serves and other shots that land close to the service lines and baselines. For example, last week I played a practice set against a very good player who played one of my shots that landed very close to the baseline without calling it out. After the point I asked him if he was sure it was good. He said yes. I explained that the reason I asked was because, although I couldn't really see if the ball touched the line from 70 feet away, I was accostomed to having a ball that looked like that called out by others. Needless to say, a few points later, he hit a brutally sharp-angled lefty slice serve (that hit the side fence), that I percieved as just wide by less than an inch, but, it was very close. I gave him the ace.

I agree with you (obviously), but predicted that the scenario (which is extremely common) would elicit different answers, which is why I posted the situation.

I predicted that the players more likely to be hitting many high pace serves/shots close to the line would agree that the ball is "out" (since it is out).

[jmjmkim]

it is frustrating to play against people who calls bad lines. Anything close should be played...... in recreational tennis

[papa]

Originally Posted by SystemicAnomaly

No, I disagree with this.

It's not really a "guess" that the ball is out in the situation described LuckyR. Experienced serve returners will often/usually be able to discern if the ball is long even if they cannot see that gap between the ball and the line from their perspective/location. The serve may be long by 2-3 inches or so and the returner might not be able to clearly see the gap but can still tell that the serve is long. Most/many servers should be able to see that same gap from their perspective and should expect that ball to be called long.

Sometimes, as a server, I can clearly see that the ball is long and do not prepare to respond to a return. However, the returner does not make the "long" call and rips the ball back for a winner. The "generous" returner idoes the server no favors by failing to call the ball long in this situation.
.

Well, you can "guess" about calls but you better be right. As far as I'm concerned, if you can't see it out, its a guess no-matter how educated that guess might be, Your correct we all know, or think we know, if the ball is "in" or "out" and play the ball accordingly but the mark has to verify the "guess" - no second chance if we're wrong.

I think my position would be that if your "guessing" on a line call (in other words its that close) you probably are better off playing the ball as good.

I also think we both would agree that a player can't have it both ways or have two bites of the apple. You can't play a ball, assuming its "in" and then after your ball goes astray, decide/declare its "out". If your "out" call is almost immediate after you strike the ball - maybe but I wouldn't encourage making a habit out of it.

[Bhagi Katbamna]

As others have said, play it as you see it and then forget it. That way you don't have to remember if you have to be generous with calls etc...

[treo]

The way the rules are now with "if you are not sure it is out, it is good" works fine for 3.5 level or below where the lower ball speeds allow you to more easily see a gap between the line and the bounce for the out call. But when you get to the 4.5 level and above it becomes impossible to see some very fast balls hit the court. You need to use what you can see to determine whether it was good which is what the pro line judges do to call 135mph serves. You watch the trajectory and angle and determine whether it can land in.

[papa]

Originally Posted by treo

The way the rules are now with "if you are not sure it is out, it is good" works fine for 3.5 level or below where the lower ball speeds allow you to more easily see a gap between the line and the bounce for the out call. But when you get to the 4.5 level and above it becomes impossible to see some very fast balls hit the court. You need to use what you can see to determine whether it was good which is what the pro line judges do to call 135mph serves. You watch the trajectory and angle and determine whether it can land in.

Yeah, good post. Actually, line judges will just watch the "line" so in that one aspect they are a little different than players. Although not fool-proof, watching just the line puts you in a "better" position to make close calls.

[TTMR]

When in doubt, call it out.

[Rickson]

I'd say give about an inch with the fair team and stop playing that hooker altogether.

[Limpinhitter]

Originally Posted by Rickson

I'd say give about an inch with the fair team and stop playing that hooker altogether.

Stop playing with hookers?

[guitarplayer]

Originally Posted by Bhagi Katbamna

As others have said, play it as you see it and then forget it. That way you don't have to remember if you have to be generous with calls etc...

This. If it's out I say out. If it's in , then it's in.

[Ronaldo]

Originally Posted by Limpinhitter

Stop playing with hookers?

They rub me the wrong way

[Mahboob Khan]

In other words the honest vs. cheaters even out (hehehe).

[Rickson]

Hookers need exercise too although I don't know why they'd choose tennis. All they do is hook and hook while you they take away your hard earned points. Don't play with hookers.

[Caesar]

Is this really a big issue?

If I'm not sure, it's in. If I call something out and they dispute it, I offer to replay the point.

It's rec tennis, you're not playing for sheep stations.