Bjorn Borg is the GOAT

[kiki]

Originally Posted by monfed

Umm, shouldn't this be in the former pro players section?

Stay and you will learn much more in a couple of our posts than in 500 threads ran by young kids...

[TMF]

Originally Posted by kiki

Stay and you will learn much more in a couple of our posts than in 500 threads ran by young kids...

You mean like:

-Martina never won a CYGS
-Schiavone is FAT
-Mecir won a slam
-Federer won his last slam in 09


NO THANKS !

[borg number one]

Originally Posted by kiki

Now, a nice contrats was Borg and Nastase...but they were really good friends, and Nastase took Borg a bit under his wing.Borg was a very likeable punky, nobody - not even Connors- had tough feelings against him.

True Kiki. On the question you had about Kriek and McEnroe, I agree as well. Torrid personalities, for sure. Nastase-Borg in the '76 W Final, there was one point that I recall watching where Borg shot this stare right at Nastase after a point that sort of told him, look I may be young and nice, but today you can call me the Angelic Assassin, know what I mean.

After the last shot was hit, Nastase's reaction to Borg winning that first title is just classic. Borg would later say something like: "hey..it's like, I just won Wimbledon...my dream.you know ever since you are a child, practicing, you have this dream and that dream came through for me.. I just won Wimbledon...I was so happy..yeah it took me about a week."

Nastase on Borg in that '76 W final (when Borg had just turned 20): "you know it's like hitting against a wall, the ball keeps coming back, but the ball keeps coming back better and better..I think Bjorn played too good that day and the proof was that he won 4 more after that."

[merlinpinpin]

Originally Posted by monfed

Umm, shouldn't this be in the former pro players section?

Not necessarily, if Borg is staging a comeback...

[kiki]

Originally Posted by borg number one

True Kiki. On the question you had about Kriek and McEnroe, I agree as well. Torrid personalities, for sure. Nastase-Borg in the '76 W Final, there was one point that I recall watching where Borg shot this stare right at Nastase after a point that sort of told him, look I may be young and nice, but today you can call me the Angelic Assassin, know what I mean.

After the last shot was hit, Nastase's reaction to Borg winning that first title is just classic. Borg would later say something like: "hey..it's like, I just won Wimbledon...my dream.you know ever since you are a child, practicing, you have this dream and that dream came through for me.. I just won Wimbledon...I was so happy..yeah it took me about a week."

Nastase on Borg in that '76 W final (when Borg had just turned 20): "you know it's like hitting against a wall, the ball keeps coming back, but the ball keeps coming back better and better..I think Bjorn played too good that day and the proof was that he won 4 more after that."

Nasty was nasty on court but a well spirited and loved by all peers off court.He was the king of the party.I remember, after he lost his last chance to win the title that mean the most to him, how he shook Borg´s head in a very calid motion.This is the first and only time I remember of somebody doing that after losing the last chance to win the title that you desperately want to win.Speaks volume of the big heart of Nastase...and the sympathy Borg arose around him.Even a guy like JMac, adored him...

[kiki]

Borg Nº1, one of the nice things that resume that era ( 1970´s and early 80´s) was the buddy relationship those terrific fighters had outside the courts.I remember Laver and Emmo or Newc and Rochey killing themselves on the court, then congratulating the winner and both getting drunk together.Even guys like Ashe,Gimeno,Riessen,Okker followed them.

Then, Nastase,Vitas,Mac and Borg were great night lovers, going out together.Panatta was another funny guy, he was very close to Nasty and Vilas.Vilas, being a bull on court was really funny outside.I have met them in discos after bleeding exos and that was the real atmosphere.

Gerulaitis was beaten by close friend Borg 18 times in a row...any bad feelings? not at all.Vitas,Panatta and Nasty were even close to Connors, who was a pretty funny guy outside the court.The swedes like Wilander,Edberg,Nystrom,Jarryd were close, they were not as extrovert as the former, still did a lot of partying together.JMac was pretty close with all of them, and joined them often.The only guy that stood apart was, for a while, Connors and, of course, Lendl.I know of some stories and, believe me, that was part of the concept " golden era"

[kiki]

Originally Posted by TMF

You mean like:

-Martina never won a CYGS
-Schiavone is FAT
-Mecir won a slam
-Federer won his last slam in 09


NO THANKS !

We talk about the GOLDEN ERA.Something you can learn about in internet or following closely Nadalagassi, Borg Nº1,PC1,Hoojdem,LH,Urban,Timinz,Krossero, BTurner (for ladies), Susan DK, or myself...of course, you won´t be interested in the msot interesting era ever, without which Federer would probably now would work in a swiss bank, Nadal would be a pro fisherman in his island and Djokovic would be in the serbian army

[natalia]

Originally Posted by accidental

Honestly, that's what I call a cool story bro. Such a riveting tale, I honestly copy and pasted it to word, saved on my hard drive, backed it up on a usb drive, drove to the bank, put the usb drive in the safe deposit box, and will leave it there until my kids turn about 12 (when they can actually state their age, and ask what it is I'm showing them), when I will pick it up, put it in an old USB drive reader and relay this cool story to them and tell them, "kids, this is what a cool story should look and sound like...not like the stories your generation tells."

LOL

I will use this gem in my signature, it's perfect!

[borg number one]

Originally Posted by kiki

Borg Nº1, one of the nice things that resume that era ( 1970´s and early 80´s) was the buddy relationship those terrific fighters had outside the courts.I remember Laver and Emmo or Newc and Rochey killing themselves on the court, then congratulating the winner and both getting drunk together.Even guys like Ashe,Gimeno,Riessen,Okker followed them.

Then, Nastase,Vitas,Mac and Borg were great night lovers, going out together.Panatta was another funny guy, he was very close to Nasty and Vilas.Vilas, being a bull on court was really funny outside.I have met them in discos after bleeding exos and that was the real atmosphere.

Gerulaitis was beaten by close friend Borg 18 times in a row...any bad feelings? not at all.Vitas,Panatta and Nasty were even close to Connors, who was a pretty funny guy outside the court.The swedes like Wilander,Edberg,Nystrom,Jarryd were close, they were not as extrovert as the former, still did a lot of partying together.JMac was pretty close with all of them, and joined them often.The only guy that stood apart was, for a while, Connors and, of course, Lendl.I know of some stories and, believe me, that was part of the concept " golden era"

Absolutely, 100% correct Kiki. Those guys worked hard together and partyed hard together too, living life to the fullest in many respects. I don't think any of them would change any of that.


(Bjorn Borg and John McEnroe in New York, supporting a Vitas Gerulaitis youth tennis cause)

[kiki]

Originally Posted by borg number one

Absolutely, 100% correct Kiki. Those guys worked hard together and partyed hard together too, living life to the fullest in many respects. I don't think any of them would change any of that.


(Bjorn Borg and John McEnroe in New York, supporting a Vitas Gerulaitis youth tennis cause)

True.Other times.Other spirit.Other music.Other values.That´s it.I wouldn´t change that, it just sticks inside.

[jackson vile]

Cool photo, anymore?

Originally Posted by borg number one

Absolutely, 100% correct Kiki. Those guys worked hard together and partyed hard together too, living life to the fullest in many respects. I don't think any of them would change any of that.


(Bjorn Borg and John McEnroe in New York, supporting a Vitas Gerulaitis youth tennis cause)

[borg number one]

Jackson Vile,

[jackson vile]

With Ali!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Originally Posted by borg number one

[borg number one]

[borg number one]

[big ted]

as much as i like borg i concur with the sentiment that a player who cant win the us open even once cant be considered THE greatest of all time.

[borg number one]

Big Ted, you're certainly entitled that opinion, I just don't happen to share it. You know I just hit today with a former Swedish pro (took a lesson) and we were discussing Borg. He inspired my tennis pro and many other Swedes that did quite well soon after him. That says a lot about his impact on the Game. He told me in essence that Borg does not even want the guy to put up a big picture of him at the club I take lessons at. He just doesn't care about how he is "ranked" or regarded among other all time greats. Anyway, see my earlier large post if you haven't. If Federer had not won the '09 FO, would many (not all) STILL consider him the "greatest"? Have a good one.

[Devilito]

do any of you even actually play tennis?

[Apun94]

Several things to consider:
1. Though Borg did not play AO many times, its not roger's fault. Plus Even if you take out Roger's 4 AO titles, he still had more than Borg's.
2. Borg's titles came only at RG and Wimb. Even if he didnt play in AO, he shudve atleast won 1 US title to even consider him as GOAT contender.
3. Borg's failure to win even one US title is the biggest reason that he is not GOAT. He lost in all four finals. Fed just does not lose that much(though he does struggle against the clay GOAT). Borg played the US open many times and shudve won it atleast once.
4. Borg lost to Connors and McEnroe at the US. Fed usually finds a way to beat opponents and does not lose to anyone consistently, especially in Slams. The only reason why Fed loses to Rafa at RG is becuz of surface. That wasnt an issue in Borg's failure at the US open. The surface was grass, the same at Wimb. So, he never lost becuz he didnt like the US open surface.
5. Yes, Borg started winning earlier than Fed, but remember that every player peaks at different times. Fed just peaked late.
6. It was Borg's fault that he retired at such an early age. Fed never faced a problem of Burnout, which shows his true love for the game.
So all in all, Fed is GOAT.
Although we have to give it to Borg for starting a new type of tennis which relied very much on one's physical shape. That type of tennis is played today. Kudos to Borg.
PS. My praise for Fed is not biased. I a not a Fed fan. I am a HUGE Nadal fan. I used to hate Fed, but now, as a player I respect him emmensely. (I still love it when Fed loses, LOL)

[borg number one]

Several things to consider:

1. Who were the prime rivals of Federer, and how did he do against them?
2. How many majors has he played and won versus Borg?
3. Look at Borg's winning percentage even through 25-26, versus Federer and Nadal then and now (and even including his later playing years after he left the Tour). He has the best overall winning %. He also has the best percentage at the majors. There was no "slow" hard court major then, plus Wimbledon was faster in a time when the dynamics, arguably actually favored serve and volleyers. It's much more difficult to pull off given today's conditions. What would Borg have hit like with Luxilon in a Donnay graphite frame, that's about 85-90 sq. inches, with modern shoes?
4. Does one understand what was happening on the Tour and how Borg was asked to qualify for Wimbledon? Asking Borg to qualify in 1982, are you kidding me Tour officials?
5. Look at Borg's ability to win the Masters YEC (4th biggest tourney of 1980-1981, not the AO, which was not even a top 10 tourney). Great indoor player (unlike even Nadal). He went 5-0 to win both of those tournaments against Lendl, Connors, McEnroe. He did face burnout, as do all players, even Federer. He wanted to take a break and then focus on majors, too much of him to ask after his match totals (see match totals, which do not include a very heavy "unofficial schedule, with big money matches, with Connors and company)
6. Borg is not only one of the greatest clay courters ever, but he dominated Wimbledon and holds the record of a 41 match win streak.
7. His only losses in the finals of majors, were to McEnroe and Connors.
8. Borg completely changed the Game. Watch the video clips in my earlier post for examples.
9.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZL__OcegrbY (thanks Krosero)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DTMx--E0OhY

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yyuiEzBb7hk (thanks Borgforever)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dKQVdZNsyuQ (watch him go offscreen here on this get)

He's the greatest mover ever. He is considered the best conditioned player ever.

10. See him in 1982 at the AKAI event, where he took out Lendl and McEnroe. He was at this time, training and considering staying on the Tour.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kger-33YtiY (Borg vs. McEnroe)

11. He played in 4 hard court majors total.

12. How has Federer done against his main rival? Borg only played McEnroe on hard courts, grass courts, and indoors..never clay (7-7, his worst H2H). McEnroe went to #2 in 1982 behind Connors). Borg has the record at 32 games lost at a major ('78 FO). He won Wimbledon without lost a set and won his first final in straight sets. See Borg at 20 in his first W final.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4bPsEi3UxWo (serving and volleying with a Donnay, no poly on very fast courts)
......