Did Paterno Die of a Broken Heart?

[TennisMaverick]

Originally Posted by jtrain_36

You're telling me that Paterno had no way of making sure Sandusky never set foot on campus again? Haha good one. The reason this whole situation got out of hand was because people viewed Paterno as more than just a coach, he was a legend in the community who could do know wrong. The board of directors wanted to fire him or have him step down in the early 2000's but he basically said, nope I'm staying around. He definitely had the power to make sure that Sandusky would never molest children on the campus again and failed to do that. Morally that puts him at fault for every child that Sandusky abused since 2002 when McQueary told him about the incident he saw in the showers. You could even argue that he could have done more in 1998 when he was first made aware of what a monster Jerry Sandusky was.

It wasn't his responsibility. That's the point. Plain and simple.

The people who are the most responsible, besides the perp, are the parents of the children. If your BS radar isn't up to protect your own, then you have no one to blame but yourself. It's analogous to the idea that if your husband beats you or cheats on you, that's partially your bad; you choose him and should have known better.

[r2473]

This is a conversation between Paterno and the father of one of the victims when Paterno told him what Sandusky did to his child:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uA1CBHebCeo

[jtrain_36]

Originally Posted by TennisMaverick

It wasn't his responsibility. That's the point. Plain and simple.

The people who are the most responsible, besides the perp, are the parents of the children. If your BS radar isn't up to protect your own, then you have no one to blame but yourself. It's analogous to the idea that if your husband beats you or cheats on you, that's partially your bad; you choose him and should have known better.

Ah so it wasn't his responsibility? How so? He had knowledge that children were being abused, not just on the campus where he coached and was arguably the top of the chain of command for the university, but in his football buildings where he is undoubtedly the head of operations. He even let Sandusky keep his office there! Paterno was responsible for the children that he allowed into the football buildings especially knowing that a child rapist was in the building at the time.

[maleyoyo]

Originally Posted by TennisMaverick

How was it his responsibility for what goes on on-campus? That is the AD's purview in/on the athletic facilities, and the president's purview on all campus grounds. They had the moral obligation because they controlled the facilities. The head football coach oversees only the football team. Paterno was scapegoated in an overreaction.

You can point fingers wherever you like, the fact remains that the system failed those kids and Paterno was a very integral part of that system. Nobody cared enough about those kids to make a difference. The end result was many kids got hurt.
At the time, 12 years ago, Paterno was already a legend in his seventies having accomplished so much. It wasn’t like he was risking his own career blowing the whistle.
It all comes down to what you value more in life, protecting children from a child molester or protecting the football program, the trophies, and your own behind. Paterno made his choice obviously.
Ironically, in the end, do we care how many football games or trophies he’d won?

[TennisMaverick]

Originally Posted by jtrain_36

Ah so it wasn't his responsibility? How so? He had knowledge that children were being abused, not just on the campus where he coached and was arguably the top of the chain of command for the university, but in his football buildings where he is undoubtedly the head of operations. He even let Sandusky keep his office there! Paterno was responsible for the children that he allowed into the football buildings especially knowing that a child rapist was in the building at the time.

Nope....head of the building is the Facility's Manager. His boss, is the AD. What goes on inside the buliding, is the AD's job. That is why the AG is going after the AD and the president, and exonerated Paterno. Once Paterno reported to his boss, he was done with his responsibility. Once the AD went to a VP or the President, his responsibility was also done. Everything you have to say is conjecture; not legally binding nor institutionally/organizationally correct. PERIOD. Apparently, you've never been on staff in an athletic department nor a college campus. LOL!

[TennisMaverick]

Originally Posted by maleyoyo

You can point fingers wherever you like, the fact remains that the system failed those kids and Paterno was a very integral part of that system. Nobody cared enough about those kids to make a difference. The end result was many kids got hurt.
At the time, 12 years ago, Paterno was already a legend in his seventies having accomplished so much. It wasn’t like he was risking his own career blowing the whistle.
It all comes down to what you value more in life, protecting children from a child molester or protecting the football program, the trophies, and your own behind. Paterno made his choice obviously.
Ironically, in the end, do we care how many football games or trophies he’d won?

I could careless who was responsible. My kid would have never been in that situation, plain and simple. His parents and Sandusky are responsible. It was never Paterno's responsibility, he wasn't there to see it, he had no paid institutional relationship to Sandusky, as Sandusky was off Paterno's staff for two years, and the only person who counts in the whole manner, is the AG, and there is no grand jury hunting Paterno. That says all that needs to be said. PERIOD.

[jtrain_36]

Originally Posted by TennisMaverick

Nope....head of the building is the Facility's Manager. His boss, is the AD. What goes on inside the buliding, is the AD's job. That is why the AG is going after the AD and the president, and exonerated Paterno. Once Paterno reported to his boss, he was done with his responsibility. Once the AD went to a VP or the President, his responsibility was also done. Everything you have to say is conjecture; not legally binding nor institutionally/organizationally correct. PERIOD. Apparently, you've never been on staff in an athletic department nor a college campus. LOL!

Yes you are correct, I have never been on the staff of a college campus nor is anything he did legally wrong. I never said that. What I did say is when he reports it to his boss and then notices his boss does not report it to the police he is morally obligated to go to the police himself. He has knowledge of a rapist on his campus, which lets face it, was his campus. Paterno was the most powerful man at Penn St by far, the board tried to fire him before but he said that he was staying. After seeing the proper course of action not being taken by the people above him, Paterno was obligated to go to the police himself. His son said today that he died with a clean conscience, and that's ********. If he did, well then he was just as sick as Sandusky knowing he endangered children and not feeling remorse about it.

[TennisMaverick]

Originally Posted by jtrain_36

"....he is morally obligated to go to the police himself."

Nope....that's called hearsay, and of no legal use. If he did do that, without actually witnessing it, Paterno opens himself up for a lawsuit.

The only person morally obligated, if in fact, he actually shares your morals--which he does not have to share with you, as this is America and he is free to believe in whatever he wants, regardless of who you are--is the GA who witnessed what happened. It's obvious that the GA didn't because he would have most likely have lost his scholarship in the power struggle. That is why I mentioned in an earlier post, if my 28 year old son was the GA, I would have advised an anonymous phone call to the police and fulfilled our personal moral responsibility.

[jtrain_36]

Originally Posted by TennisMaverick

Nope....that's called hearsay, and of no legal use. If he did do that, without actually witnessing it, Paterno opens himself up for a lawsuit.

The only person morally obligated, if in fact, he actually shares your morals--which he does not have to share with you, as this is America and he is free to believe in whatever he wants, regardless of who you are--is the GA who witnessed what happened. It's obvious that the GA didn't because he would have most likely have lost his scholarship in the power struggle. That is why I mentioned in an earlier post, if my 28 year old son was the GA, I would have advised an anonymous phone call to the police and fulfilled our personal moral responsibility.

I agree, McQueary was also at fault and should have done more. Also at the very least Paterno needs to make sure Sandusky never sets foot on the campus again, which despite what you're saying he for sure had the power to do.

[TennisMaverick]

Originally Posted by jtrain_36

... he for sure had the power to do.

Maybe, but you don't know that. Secondly, it's SIMPLY not his responsibility.

[jtrain_36]

Originally Posted by TennisMaverick

Maybe, but you don't know that. Secondly, it's SIMPLY not his responsibility.

Yes I do, they wanted to fire him about 10 years ago. JoePa simply said no to that and kept on coaching. He was the man in Happy Valley and anything he said was the truth. That's why there's so many idiots in Pennsylvania still defending him after this situation. They're putting football before the safety of children. Plus, it may not be his irresponsibility per se, but wouldn't you want someone in his situation to do more if it was your child that got abused?

[Cindysphinx]

Paterno may have been depressed because of an investigation about why he didn't do enough to prevent children from being raped, causing his cancer to accelerate?

I don't need any fancy medical theories to explain that one.

I'm going with "Karma."

[TennisMaverick]

Originally Posted by jtrain_36

Yes I do, they wanted to fire him about 10 years ago. JoePa simply said no to that and kept on coaching. He was the man in Happy Valley and anything he said was the truth. That's why there's so many idiots in Pennsylvania still defending him after this situation. They're putting football before the safety of children. Plus, it may not be his irresponsibility per se, but wouldn't you want someone in his situation to do more if it was your child that got abused?

First of all, my kids traveled the subway everyday to the UES to go to school by themselves at 10 years old when NYC was no where near as safe as is today. Thus, there is no way that either of my kids BS meters would have been anywhere near that bad to get caught-up in that situation. They would have run way before, just from the wrong look, because they knew better. I didn't need anyone to help protect my children; they could protect themselves. PERIOD. You want to blame someone besides the perp, Sandusky? Blame the child's mother and father for not properly training their child to recognize evil. The child is a victim, no doubt about it; but the parents are culpable.

Secondly, Paterno did not witness the act. Anything he does or says is hearsay. If I'm his attorney, I advise him to report what his subordinate told him to his own superior, and then, get on to coaching football.

[jtrain_36]

Originally Posted by TennisMaverick

...If I'm his attorney, I advise him to report what his subordinate told him to his own superior, and then, get on to coaching football.

Yes, let's all look the other way while a monster rapes kids because we need to win at football. Great attitude!

[TennisMaverick]

Originally Posted by jtrain_36

Yes, let's all look the other way while a monster rapes kids because we need to win at football. Great attitude!

Has nothing to do with football. It has to do with the law and what you get paid to do. Do I need to write it in a different way for you to understand, or will you keep misinterpreting what my POV is? Did you even understand what I wrote? How is Paterno responsible for Sandusky's behavior? How is Paterno or anyone else responsible for the kid's negligent parents? How is whatever a non-witnesses testimony any thing other than hearsay?

[jtrain_36]

Originally Posted by TennisMaverick

Has nothing to do with football. It has to do with the law and what you get paid to do. Do I need to write it in a different way for you to understand, or will you keep misinterpreting what my POV is? Did you even understand what I wrote? How is Paterno responsible for Sandusky's behavior? How is Paterno or anyone else responsible for the kid's negligent parents? How is whatever a non-witnesses testimony any thing other than hearsay?

He's definitely responsible for allowing Sandusky to continue his crimes against children on the Penn St. campus. Also, most of these kids didn't have parents which is why they were being "helped" by the Second Mile, which is Sandusky's charity. He used his authority with the charity and his buddy JoePa to lure kids into Penn St. building on so called visits to the campus where he then took advantage of said kids. How do you not get the Paterno is responsible for what goes on in his football facilities?

[TennisMaverick]

Originally Posted by jtrain_36

How do you not get the Paterno is responsible for what goes on in his football facilities?

I get what happens on a college/university campus because I've been on staff at five different ones. I am not Paterno, but I always brought in the greatest amount of revenue to the department, so I had an inordinate amount of clout for a tennis coach. When in the position of head tennis coach, I look after the facility, but I am only responsible for it when my players are on it.

Paterno had nothing to do with the charity. In fact, he dumped Sandusky because of the distraction of being involved with the charity.

[Steady Eddy]

Originally Posted by jtrain_36

Yes, let's all look the other way while a monster rapes kids because we need to win at football. Great attitude!

You nailed it!

So many could have been saved if Paterno had a minimal conscience. Instead he liked to appear to have integrity, and wasn't going to upset things. Musta figured, "We got away with it this long, maybe we'll never get caught." Well, you thought wrong, Joe, and now you'll forever be infamous.

P.S. Penn State students have messed up priorities too. Pedophiles aren't "OK", if they help you win games. Got that?

[jimanuel12]

Originally Posted by TennisMaverick

He died from being unceremoniously stabbed in the back with a broadsword, late at night, while his wife and he were about to go to bed, from a dishonorable trustee from an institution that Paterno had a huge part in building. So much for honor and loyalty.

i agree, i really don't think he was aware of the ******* that was on his staff. joe was back stabbed, dishonored by the media (they love to bring people down - except their bleeding heart liberal friends of course).
i said the same thing that he would not live long after they fired him.
he was a good man - just caught up in a scandal that he had no part in - he did not know what was going on. do you really think that he would have let that kind of thing go on right under his nose? i don't think so.
everyone else trying to save their own *****.

[Steady Eddy]

^^One struggles so much to understand how people react to reports. I'm aware that the catholic church would simple move such priests to new locations.

Paterno chose to not let Sandusky bring kids to the locker room anymore. ? So does that mean that Paterno thought he was a rapist, or he wasn't a rapist...I don't get it. Why not try to find out what's going on? Everyone went "ho hum". And as a result, so many more kids got raped, due to all these Penn State people's negligence. No wonder so many people don't want to say, "Oh, that's ok."