Chinese Swimmer on Drugs?

[Shangri La]

Originally Posted by syke

Lol... dude... Manchus ain't Chinese... Lineage wise Manchus are closer to the Japanese or Koreans....

ohh, please...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manchu_people

[krz]

Originally Posted by syke

Lol... dude... Manchus ain't Chinese... Lineage wise Manchus are closer to the Japanese or Koreans....

lol maybe? Either way it's beside the point.

He's depicted as an evil Chinese criminal similar to how China is viewed today.

[NickC]

Originally Posted by sureshs

Because it hasn't happened before? That is what the Olympics are about - breaking records.

Records in olympic swimming usually are broken by tenths or hundredths of a second. Not by 5 seconds.

You have no proof

If it walks like a duck, looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, has ducklings as offspring, and has the same DNA as a duck, chances are it's a duck. 'nuff said.

and it has already been contradicted by top swimmers so your opinions don't really count.

Yours don't count either, dude.

And would you like me to get a quote from someone who medaled in the 08 olympics regarding this whole ordeal? Because that someone's opinions are much more valid and truthful than some know-it-all talking about doping and PEDs in Olympic Swimming on an online tennis shop's message board.

[syke]

Originally Posted by Shangri La

ohh, please...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manchu_people

You know very well, I wasn't referring Chinese as a nationality.

[krz]

Originally Posted by NickC

Records in olympic swimming usually are broken by tenths or hundredths of a second. Not by 5 seconds.

Broke the record by 5 seconds... do you even look up the "facts" you spew?

[Shangri La]

Originally Posted by NickC

Records in olympic swimming usually are broken by tenths or hundredths of a second. Not by 5 seconds.

She beat her personal best by 5 seocnds, which she swam at 14, not world record.

Learn, to, read.

And please refrain from posting further. Your fiction-based 'opinion' is not needed.

[NickC]

Originally Posted by Shangri La

Learn, to, read.

And please refrain from posting further. Your fiction-based 'opinion' is not needed.

I'd suggest that you yourself should refrain from posting and insulting others until you can type in English correctly. Your grammatical skills are worse than my 3-year-old cousin, who, ironically enough, can tell me to "learn to read" without needing to use two commas and a period when a simple period is all that's needed. The commas are completely unnecessary and represent a awful command of the English language, something you should have become competent in before going off and insulting others. Because while you tried to make your opinion sound worthwhile, you managed to destroy all of your credibility (not that you had any to begin with) by proving to the boards here that a poster with worse grammatical skills than Fedace exists.


Oh, and you took my previous post out of context. You should learn to read as well.

[Shangri La]

Originally Posted by NickC

I'd suggest that you yourself should refrain from posting and insulting others until you can type in English correctly. Your grammatical skills are worse than my 3-year-old cousin, who, ironically enough, can tell me to "learn to read" without needing to use two commas and a period when a simple period is all that's needed. The commas are completely unnecessary and represent a awful command of the English language, something you should have become competent in before going off and insulting others. Because while you tried to make your opinion sound worthwhile, you managed to destroy all of your credibility (not that you had any to begin with) by proving to the boards here that a poster with worse grammatical skills than Fedace exists.

It's awesome punctuation skills that you have. But what really established your credibility is your reading comprehension skills. Now let's get back on topic - she beat her personal best by 5 seconds, not world record.

Originally Posted by NickC

Oh, and you took my previous post out of context. You should learn to read as well.

You know what you meant. And so does everybody else. You can't dodge it.

[Dedans Penthouse]

Originally Posted by ninman

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-19058712

Read that news article today, according to the article the 16 year old swimmer Ye Shiwen swam the last 50m of the 400m individual medley faster than the men's winner, Ryan Lochte, at the same event.

People are asking questions, but of course the Chinese deny it, and she has tested negative for banned substances. But still, these tests are far from perfect, so what do you think?

In my opinion, she's probably on something. I live in China, and I know enough about Chinese culture, including some of their history regarding underage athletes in gymnastics at past events, to make an educated guess that they've probably given her something.

Obviously there is absolutely no evidence for what I just said, that is purely my own opinion. However there is an awful lot of pressure on Chinese athletes to win gold medals, to the point where anything less than gold is deemed a failure, and winning a gold comes with substantial monetary, political, as well as other, benefits.

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That record is all the more amazing considering the high levels of lead in their swim suits.

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[Bobby Jr]

Originally Posted by sureshs

The Chinese will say that US companies appear to be more ethical only because the sneakiness is done for them at the political and military level by others to lay the foundation for US companies to penetrate markets. Like if US companies get contracts to "rebuild" Iraq, it was made possible by the destruction caused by the war.

Mind you, the Chinese and Russians will, and are, doing much the same.

This is true. I was speaking from experience at a much lower level than *rebuild Iraq* sort of levels - I meant daily, consumer goods industry stuff.

[Bobby Jr]

Originally Posted by r2473

I'm very surprised that most people seem to have faith in the testing systems in place and most people seem to believe that it is only a very few people that take PED's.

Politics is one thing (innocent until PROVEN guilty), but it's OK to believe things based on other evidence.

The widespread use of PED's in (high level) sport isn't exactly a well kept secret.

This ^... If you look at bodybuilding for example they have tested for decades... and many former world champions have later admitted taking stuff... despite never being caught at the time.

In some sports it's is considered by experts to be almost impossible to compete at the top level without taking something. Swimming and cycling are two of those sports.

[Bobby Jr]

Originally Posted by syke

This talk about the Chinese swimmer is passé.

The real fiasco is on the Badminton courts... Totally ridiculous.

4 doubles team disqualified for deliberatly throwing away their matches in hope of meeting a weaker team in the next phase.

I can see why people would think the Badminton thing is not on but, really, they're trying to pave their best path to the finals... It's no different to Phelps swimming just fast enough in a heat race to qualify for the next round, or a team not fielding the best players in a meaningless match (in situations where they've already qualified for the next round for example).

Rowing, cycling, swimming, football etc teams all do it.. I think the key difference with Badminton is that for people watching it's obvious when someone trying to lose to the spectacle is ruined. From that point of view I do think they ought to have a code of competitive ethics in place (like tennis does).

I can also see their points though - in the Olympic competition format the medal rounds are the aim.

[LeeD]

I apolgize for coming on late and missing some of the pertinent facts.
She swam the last 50 faster than the men's winner.
OK, but what was her time on the last 50? Was it lower than world record?
We've seen some American men fade in the final lap.
We've seen some French swimmer eat up two whole lengths in 50 yards.
Only her time for the final 50 tells us anything important.

[volleygirl]

Originally Posted by Dedans Penthouse

-

That record is all the more amazing considering the high levels of lead in their swim suits.

-

HAHA That is a great point Dedan. Cant believe no one on NBC has even mentioned that.

[ninman]

Originally Posted by LeeD

I apolgize for coming on late and missing some of the pertinent facts.
She swam the last 50 faster than the men's winner.
OK, but what was her time on the last 50? Was it lower than world record?
We've seen some American men fade in the final lap.
We've seen some French swimmer eat up two whole lengths in 50 yards.
Only her time for the final 50 tells us anything important.

This whole "she swam faster than Lochte" thing is totally missing the point.

If you compare the 100m freestyle (women), with the final 100m from the 400 IM (women), you would expect the times to be about 18% slower.

Ye Shiwen's time was about 10% slower, meaning it was well outside the normal statistical range. Not only that, she didn't even swim herself to point of exhaustion. So she could have swam even faster, making her final 100m totally abnormal, statistically.

I think comparing her final 50 with Lochte's final 50 is a total red herring. The best comparison is with her peers.

The other thing you have to remember is that she was just keeping up with them for the other 300m, so suddenly being able to go that much faster for the last 100m is really, really unusual.

Finally, unfortunately for her, she comes from a country which has a horrible record when it comes to things like cheating. The history of Chinese athletes at olympic games works against her. People have seen it all before, and the system in China hasn't changed one jot.

Not only that, but you're asking the Chinese to conduct her out of competition testing, so there's always the possibility that she was hopped up on all sorts of drugs right up to the olympics. Then, just before the olympics started, stopped taking them to clean out her system so she would pass the drugs tests (which are now, not controlled the Chinese government).

Remember, everything in China, including (especially) sports, is controlled by the government. I wouldn't trust them as far as I can spit. Also remember that one of her compatriots was caught just a few weeks ago. So there is plenty of reason to be suspicious.

[corners]

Originally Posted by ninman

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-19058712

Read that news article today, according to the article the 16 year old swimmer Ye Shiwen swam the last 50m of the 400m individual medley faster than the men's winner, Ryan Lochte, at the same event.

People are asking questions, but of course the Chinese deny it, and she has tested negative for banned substances. But still, these tests are far from perfect, so what do you think?

In my opinion, she's probably on something. I live in China, and I know enough about Chinese culture, including some of their history regarding underage athletes in gymnastics at past events, to make an educated guess that they've probably given her something.

Obviously there is absolutely no evidence for what I just said, that is purely my own opinion. However there is an awful lot of pressure on Chinese athletes to win gold medals, to the point where anything less than gold is deemed a failure, and winning a gold comes with substantial monetary, political, as well as other, benefits.

Let me put it this way, if she was later found to have been on something it would not shock me, even slightly. What do you guys think?

I think that it's highly likely that she is on something. And even more likely that she does not know that she's on something.

[ninman]

Originally Posted by corners

I think that it's highly likely that she is on something. And even more likely that she does not know that she's on something.

But she passed all her drugs tests, she's clean right?

[Larrysümmers]

she was taking bong hits with phelps.

[JoelDali]

I declare GSOAT

[Bartelby]

The competition used to be all knock-out like tennis and they were warned this might happen when they changed it to round robin then knock-out.

Originally Posted by Bobby Jr

I can see why people would think the Badminton thing is not on but, really, they're trying to pave their best path to the finals... It's no different to Phelps swimming just fast enough in a heat race to qualify for the next round, or a team not fielding the best players in a meaningless match (in situations where they've already qualified for the next round for example).

Rowing, cycling, swimming, football etc teams all do it.. I think the key difference with Badminton is that for people watching it's obvious when someone trying to lose to the spectacle is ruined. From that point of view I do think they ought to have a code of competitive ethics in place (like tennis does).

I can also see their points though - in the Olympic competition format the medal rounds are the aim.