Tennis shoe can prevent an ankle roll ? I call BS.

[Rozroz]

wow, this debate is so stupid!!!
maybe the OP just have different feet and muscle structure and it doesn't bother him wearing sneakers so his opinion is definite..

SO WHAT???

[maxpotapov]

Originally Posted by BreakPoint

Because tennis shoes are designed specifically for tennis to specifically prevent rolling over on its side. The entire shoe is stiffer and wider to make them more stable.

True, let one try to roll the ankle in Courtballistecs 2.3, for instance. Those outside "bumpers" and overall glove-like (or ski boots) fit make it really complicated if not impossible.

[TimeToPlaySets]

Originally Posted by maxpotapov

True, let one try to roll the ankle in Courtballistecs 2.3, for instance. Those outside "bumpers" and overall glove-like (or ski boots) fit make it really complicated if not impossible.

Like any other sneaker, the ankle joint is exposed (unlike hightops)...I find it impossible yo believe you can not physically roll your ankle in Courtballistecs 2.3. I can say that one can easily roll your ankle in Barricade 6.0s

[KineticChain]

Tennis shoes with high midsole heels increase your chances of rolling an ankle. That increase in height applies a greater moment about the ankle joint during a roll. Notice that it is very difficult to roll your ankle if barefoot or wearing a low/flat heeled shoe.

[Povl Carstensen]

Originally Posted by KineticChain

Tennis shoes with high midsole heels increase your chances of rolling an ankle. That increase in height applies a greater moment about the ankle joint during a roll. Notice that it is very difficult to roll your ankle if barefoot or wearing a low/flat heeled shoe.

Totally agreed, and confirmed by experience. Plus no one is arguing that running shoes are more stable than tennis shoes.

[Bobby Jr]

Originally Posted by TimeToPlaySets

Like any other sneaker, the ankle joint is exposed (unlike hightops)...I find it impossible yo believe you can not physically roll your ankle in Courtballistecs 2.3.

I think you're looking at the ankle support aspect of the situation and omitting the roll-over resistance aspect of the shoe itself.

Ankles don't roll for the most part because the ankle is unsupported, they roll because the base of the foot is unstable and rolls over - leaving the ankle joint to 'fight' the rollover. In movements of sharp side-to-side motion no ankle joint can defeat the impetus of the foot to roll. It is at a huge mechanical disadvantage compounded by the increased apparent weight above it which adds a significant force to the last joint before the foot.

Making the foot more stable is the most practical way to prevent rollover and a good tennis shoe does just that.

Of course you can roll your ankle in a CB2.3 or a barricade, but they will resist the root cause of the a rolled ankle much longer than having no shoes or ones which aren't designed with lateral movement in mind.

If you are in a situation where the ground is very uneven then you are right - a shoe which offers no specific ankle support wont really offer any more protection. That's why shoes like tramping boots - designed for really uneven surfaces - look how they do.

[spacediver]

great question, and thanks to those in the thread who actually try to answer it rather than being morons.

[spacediver]

I've been trying to grasp this concept of "foot stability". Am I on the right track here?

Rolling the ankle happens when the ankle joint undergoes extreme inversion.

(see image here: http://www.dartmouth.edu/~humananato...s/IMAGE001.JPG )

Now the interesting thing is that your foot is not a perfectly rigid body. It can flex and deform. In particular, the structure can flex such that the dorsal surface of your foot can become more curved and compressed. Think about squeezing someone's hand during a hand shake - you're compressing their hand such that the back of it (opposite side of the palm) becomes compressed and curves. The exact same thing can happen to your foot, where the opposite side of your sole (the dorsal side) can become more curved and compressed.

When this happens, it should be intuitively obvious that the foot is more liable to roll over. This is because the foot starts to more closely approximate the shape of a cylinder (which is simply an extruded wheel). When you move a plank of wood sideways along a surface, it is less likely to roll compared to moving a log sideways.

I think the idea with foot stability is that shoes that hug the contours of the foot tightly, and have a degree of stiffness, will simulate making the foot itself a stiffer structure, and thus less liable to such compression.

[Povl Carstensen]

I just from experience find it extremely hard to roll over with no shoes or minimal shoes (that are only a few millimeters above the ground). Have never done that, but have done it in tennis shoes.

[usta2050]

Originally Posted by TimeToPlaySets

Wait a second, how can a tennis shoe even help to prevent an ankle roll in the first place?
I can only see this if you're wearing high tops that serve as a brace both above and below the ankle joint.
Almost like a splint, this would truly prevent ankle roll.

However, in a tennis sneaker, the ankle is exposed, like in any other sneaker.
It shouldn't matter how stiff the sneaker is.
In theory, if you wore steel sneakers with the ankles exposed, how would that help prevent rolling the ankle?
If you stop short laterally, the entire steel shoe can just roll right over at the exposed ankle hinge.

Now that I've given it more than 30 seconds of thought, I think I was suckered into yet another marketing scam.
"Tennis sneakers prevent ankle roll". I say BS because it makes no sense.

My old Prince sneakers were beat up, so it's not a total loss, but I'm just saying.
At least the new Barricade 6.0's will have fresh padding.
But, I can't see how they can help prevent ankle rolls.

I agree shoes can't "prevent" ankle rolls but some shoes fit me better and so I roll my ankles less. For example, I would never wear the Costco 20 dollar Kirkland tennis shoes for tennis because I rolled my ankle in them when I tried them on. But some people love them and they fit them great!

[volleygirl]

Originally Posted by waginen

Maybe at you level you do not need tennis shoes. But I really can not use regular shoes during clay tournament. If you tell me regular shoes can not cause injury you have never played tennis at competitive level.

Youre exactly right Waginen. If hes going out and just goofing around on the tennis court, he doesnt need good tennis shoes but if he was actually any good, he wouldnt have asked the question to begin with.

[jonnythan]

Originally Posted by TimeToPlaySets

Wait a second, how can a tennis shoe even help to prevent an ankle roll in the first place?
I can only see this if you're wearing high tops that serve as a brace both above and below the ankle joint.
Almost like a splint, this would truly prevent ankle roll.

However, in a tennis sneaker, the ankle is exposed, like in any other sneaker.
It shouldn't matter how stiff the sneaker is.
In theory, if you wore steel sneakers with the ankles exposed, how would that help prevent rolling the ankle?
If you stop short laterally, the entire steel shoe can just roll right over at the exposed ankle hinge.

Now that I've given it more than 30 seconds of thought, I think I was suckered into yet another marketing scam.
"Tennis sneakers prevent ankle roll". I say BS because it makes no sense.

My old Prince sneakers were beat up, so it's not a total loss, but I'm just saying.
At least the new Barricade 6.0's will have fresh padding.
But, I can't see how they can help prevent ankle rolls.

Tennis shoes have a wider, flatter sole on the forefoot than running shoes. It takes a lot more moment and larger radius of roll to roll over.

They also provide a stiffer upper on the forefoot to prevent lateral movement of the forefoot. Keeping the forefoot centered in the shoe also prevents rolling.

[Povl Carstensen]

Originally Posted by waginen

Maybe at you level you do not need tennis shoes. But I really can not use regular shoes during clay tournament. If you tell me regular shoes can not cause injury you have never played tennis at competitive level.

Well at least I am not talking about "regular" shoes (or running shoes), but specificly low to the ground (minimal) shoes without a lot of material between you and the surface. They allow the foots natural stability to function, whereas for every couple of millimeters you elevate the foot from the ground, you jeopardise this stability more and more, creating the need for "tech" in the shoe, and still people are rolling their ankles on court.
Vivo Barefoot, a leading minimal shoe brand, was developed by a tennisplayer as a solution to repeatedly rolling his ankle on court.
But this has been thorougly debated in other threads.
Edit: Check out the Merrell Barefoot Run Road Glove thread.

[USERNAME]

Someone mentioned the slight flared edge on the 2.3 and that is the perfect example of a shoe built to combat rolls, bigshots and barricades are other great examples of the wide firm base built to help a tennis player. Someone also mentioned the level of player and how that correlates to the shoes they use, I agree. Those of the club level may not need all the protection because they don't play with as much intensity but those who play and win section/national level matches will need all the protection they can get. I've messed around in running and minimalist type shoes on court and I can say from personal experience I have NO confidence in my movement because I have NO support.

[Darkhors]

Originally Posted by TimeToPlaySets

Like any other sneaker, the ankle joint is exposed (unlike hightops)...I find it impossible yo believe you can not physically roll your ankle in Courtballistecs 2.3. I can say that one can easily roll your ankle in Barricade 6.0s

This is exactly why I went away from my Barricades. The heel is way too high off the ground and that in itself can lead to ankle rolls. As stated in a post above, the higher your heel is off the ground, the higher % of rolling the ankle. I now use the Prince Rebel 2's. They are extremely comfortable and very low to the ground, not to mention light, and I feel like there's no way I could roll my ankle.

The other thing to look for too is how much traction the shoes have around the toe box. I had an extreme high level sprain (as bad as you can sprain it without breaking it) because my New balance shoes (1185's) caught the court when I was split stepping and pulled my foot under my body as I came down. Needless to say that was the last day I wore those. I'm now a prince user for good.

DH