When tennis becomes populaar in the black community

[goober]

Originally Posted by r2473

But are your daughters athletic phenoms that are going to be professional athletes? Are they choosing between pro careers in figure skating, tennis, or basketball? It's actually hard to make this discussion about females because they already have limited possibilities in the world of professional sport. It's easier to think in terms of males.

.

No they are obviously not, but if they were, I still wouldn't try to push them into a sport for the purposes of what will reap the largest possible financial gain.

[r2473]

Originally Posted by goober

No they are obviously not, but if they were, I still wouldn't try to push them into a sport for the purposes of what will reap the largest possible financial gain.

If you were a black mother with a gifted son you might.

By and large, tennis players come from "comfortable" families. There are exceptions.

I'm certainly not rich enough to even dream of supporting a son to a professional tennis career. Not unless he is "noticed" at a young age and given a free scholarship at a tennis academy, etc. Even then, if he were also good at baseball, I'd probably have him go that route (if he didn't have a preference that is).

Just looking at the economics of tennis and thinking about population wide numbers, I'm not expecting much to change in tennis anytime soon.

[goober]

Originally Posted by Sander001

What about jockey or race car driver?

true dat

Race car drivers are some of the richest people at the top of their sport.

Golf and pofessional pool are 2 other sports he could make it in (ok debatable whether they are sports but still...).

[goober]

Originally Posted by r2473

If you were a black mother with a gifted son you might.

I seriously doubt a black mother would have to do much pushing for an very gifted, athletic son. Most of his friends are probably already playing soccer, basketball, little league baseball or football so he will want to do what they are doing. If you are athletic and dominating on the junior levels you will have all kinds of praised heaped upon you. Coaches and all kinds of people will probably ask him to try out for the team. AAU people will try to steer you towards their team. If out of the blue, he says I want to do Olympic rowing or Curling, yeah you might nix that idea especially if you have no means to pay for the training.

[sureshs]

Originally Posted by Sander001

What about jockey or race car driver?

race car driver requires very good coordination, eye-sight, and lack of balance issues

[dman72]

Originally Posted by goober

If money was the only consideration, then yes you might be correct. There are many sports which have very little in return financially for how much you train- (i.e most Olympic sports that are only competed seriously every 4 years). I have 2 daughters that are in figure skating. The costs are high for coaching and ice time, but I am not really looking at it as a financial investment. Any college scholies they get are going to be academic. There is no pro potential or college scholies available for skating. So is it a waste? Not for them or for me.

I shouldn't have used the term "waste". A better "investment" would be more accurate.

I love tennis and if my son wants to play, I'll try to help him. But the dollars and cents reality is that the expense and time that goes into tennis reaps fewer rewards than most other sports.

The only thing that weighs in tennis favor here on LI is that it is SO expensive to play year round that you have far, far fewer athletes than in places like Florida an Socal who bother to learn, so it's very easy to get on a high school tennis team (basically if you have a racquet and a pulse you make it). Of course, that probably means that you have no chance of being recruited by a college playing tennis for a LI High School because the talent level is so low... unless you attend a tennis academy as well.

I mean, some guys in my club league are tennis coaches at local high schools and community colleges...they're 3.5's by national standards at best. I guess I don't have a very high opinion of myself, but I just can't see anyone who loses a set to a complete hack like me being qualified to coach. .

[r2473]

Originally Posted by goober

I seriously doubt a black mother would have to do much pushing for an very gifted, athletic son. Most of his friends are probably already playing soccer, basketball, little league baseball or football so he will want to do what they are doing. If you are athletic and dominating on the junior levels you will have all kinds of praised heaped upon you. Coaches and all kinds of people will probably ask him to try out for the team. AAU people will try to steer you towards their team. If out of the blue, he says I want to do Olympic rowing or Curling, yeah you might nix that idea especially if you have no means to pay for the training.

Recall the point of the thread.

The OP is wondering what will happen WHEN (and it is assumed) tennis becomes more popular in the black community. The implication is that very good black athletes will be drawn to tennis (instead of other sports) and will make an impact on the biggest stage, thus raising the bar, and changing the sport.

I have simply argued that this is unlikely to happen for many reasons.

It's easy to get sidetracked in these threads, but that is my only point.

[goober]

Originally Posted by S&V Specialist

And the troll wins again!

What did you win? The I look like a **** award? BTW intentional trolling can get you banned.

[8F93W5]

Originally Posted by r2473

Why would anyone with athletic talent "waste" it on a sport like tennis?

If you turn out to be in the upper .0000001% and are 100 in the world for example, your reward is a tough life of traveling and pretty much no cash.

If you are the 100th best soccer, football, basketball, or baseball player, you are a god and a multimillionaire.

In short, only rich white folks are dumb enough to pour their money into tennis when there is little if any return on investment (except for the intangibles).

I think that's true for men, but if you're a woman tennis is the best chance to make big money. How many women are making money at baseball or American football?

[Bowtiesarecool]

It'll never happen with any sport that costs money on a regular basis. Driving around to a decent court. Spending $1-200 on a racquet that can get stolen, plus the cost of restringing every month at least... Tiger Woods has been in the public eye since 1995 and golf is still not something "the black community" has latched onto for the same reasons. Footballs and basketballs are cheap, and those games can be played just about anywhere.

[r2473]

Originally Posted by 8F93W5

I think that's true for men, but if you're a woman tennis is the best chance to make big money. How many women are making money at baseball or American football?

That is an excellent point.

[goober]

Originally Posted by 8F93W5

I think that's true for men, but if you're a woman tennis is the best chance to make big money. How many women are making money at baseball or American football?

Well WNBA players can make quite a bit of money playing in the WNBA and then heading to Europe in the off season. Some of the top players earn 30,000 euros a month tax free.

Really the only ones making any money in tennis are the top WTA players and you still have to earn it whereas in team sports you get the contract and the money.

[ClairHarmony]

Originally Posted by r2473

But are your daughters athletic phenoms that are going to be professional athletes? Are they choosing between pro careers in figure skating, tennis, or basketball? It's actually hard to make this discussion about females because they already have limited possibilities in the world of professional sport. It's easier to think in terms of males.

I certainly wouldn't disagree that there are enormous benefits to playing sport. But the OP seemed to be asking about the impact black athletes will make in tennis on the biggest stage. The best athletes simply don't pursue tennis. This is certainly true in America, and pretty true in the rest of the world (soccer and others).

My cousins started figure skating late, but finished 2nd and 5th or won or something states almost immediately. Not a wealthy family, medical reasons galore, what have you. The one with the greater talent, moved specifically to train with ENFP IR (International Relations goody-2-shue, u know how smarty skirt Asians always aspire too even if they don't have too, it's just the Asian way for whatever reason). Anyway, Swan Kwan's coach.

The thing is, this I feel bad about the whole thing looking back. The conventionally "prettier" one who also had more of the "gift" or whatever, and being likely an ESFP sister...and it leads to resentment I think, knowing what I know of types, and how I know my sister couldn't keep up with no money and all (it's much more expensive to be a woman, the upkeep and all, if you're a guy and dress like a doll, it's almost more man-bro-koolio not too), anyway, I just know how it goes. I think 2 things, not enough ability to jump high or something to the next level, for whatever reason. I was the same, could sprint, and INFP's are supposed to jump too, but I couldn't. Always sucked at jumping. People would go, oh, look, he's sooo blazing fast down the runway, but then, go,oh, oh, he's gonna jump soooo far, but then, oh, gosh, that wasn't very far, don't know why. Wasn't my thing. I hate people who can jump now as a result. Oh, nougat me, why am I so sassy, ungrateful. What I think is this. If you don't come from a rich family, you have to be extra specially cognizant of how "types" go off generally in very predictable ways. The goody sunshine vibe is not enough, you need to always prepare yourself, forecast, the worst case scenario.

What I think? In a way lucky, though. The Olympic dreams never worked out, could have been not enough of the kangaroo hop gene necessary, but even if not the best student...you know, it's easier to recover, once the "dream" is over. You can find a way back to decency, normalcy. But if you think you have the potential to go down as one of the G.C.O.A.T.'s of all time still, well, then, in that case, u can never give up now, can you? That's just what it is. The thing is this, figure skating is "glorious" because when you're on top, there's envy. Why? Be careful to see how much people are really concerned about u, and the after bummer, should you fall short. Because, it's an event. People like to tag along, bandwagon along, come and go see, *be seen.* With, tagalong bandits, but the thing is this...in the afterglow, if nobody's there, and nobody cares anymore, bcs.u're not "special" anymore, then u know, it's like a price tag, an accessory, you can learn to live without that kind of glory.

ENTJ's are better than some, at being able to look past it. They're brains is naturally in the "pill zone," that boost that certain part, but with *self-control.* That's the difference. U can artificially inseminate whatever part of the brain you want, give it buzz-buzz, spark-spark, spizz-spazz, jumpstart daily if you want...but it's still not u. And if all does not work out perfectly according to plan, u're soul's gonna feel like crip, & then u become dependent on, and then ur body stop's producing what meager pittance it had, on its own.

If you wanna see a type who can pick up new forms, most naturally, most easily...provided they worked out their coordination before hand, on the raw hand, before that certain age which if not developed by, it closes, and you'll throw like a sissy Spacek baloons in her eyes gal for the rest of ur life? It's the INFP. A master mimick of form. Don't need to break it down so much as, see it, feel it, absorb it, recreate it, and then later try to spice it up a little something extra special unique of your own if able to. An INFP *without* being in the mental doldrums of life, with minimal training, and the right people in ears, would have a better chance than James, the ESFP. Why? Again, less "formal" training required in that sense. But the thing is this, few types are sooo affected by their mental mood. Play according to how you feel, that's the thing. An ENTJ is far less likely to mentally discombulate in the field of battle, they're better built that way, less emotion, feelings to get in the way. Everything's a give and take in life. Can't have it all. That's what you need to take risks, that boastful, can't fail, feeling self-confidence. See an opportunity, and just go with it. Get to it. From not a lot of dough, though, most INFP's gonna be affected. They carry it on with them more so than most types, even if makin' it back to civility again, they still don't lose that, can't forget from where they first...so subtle, but I know what it's taken out of me to derive at that subtlety. It was earned.

[ClairHarmony]

Perhaps no other type plays as much according to mood. It's just one of those things. One day, could be lsoing to anybody, with your head glued someberly to the ground, =can't barely even lift ur own racket anymore. The next in a good mood, the pressur'es finally off, a grand college with no worries of tuition, & "recruited" on the spot to come hit with, come train play with some of the nicer juniors in the nation. That's what i mean about knowing ur type, and knowing why you can't trust urself, unless you've got a backup. It's just one of those things. Know you're type. 95% ENTP or ESFP in the entertainment field for a reason. ESFP's like to party a lot and are full-body looser feeling if you will, ENTP's have that self-marketing sparkle in their eye when pursuing that sort of thing...and yet never ever not since that Muppet dude, and MJ...who would not have made it, no one would have gootten out of his way, and given him that trust, to just do his thang, the Grant Hill offense, if you will, what does that say? MJ's lucky he made it as a kid, bcs. otherwise they would have just walked all over him. 99.99% guaranteed. Honestly, I find it not shocking, but it's just u know, I really feel that there should be more than that in the arts, when amongst the most naturally gifted for that sort of thing. I don't even care about me. I just don't like to see people's *valuable* soul's be wasted like that. If you elminate the head from the equation though, those who can out of nowhere, whoop tail for one day at least when catching fire against a fringe former pro, with a 1-handed backhand that I picked up on my own from just fooling around occasionally...that's me. But everything comes with a cost. It wouldn't be fair, otherwise. ESTP's and INFP's can pick up easier, but fall apart elsewhere. You have to start young in tennis, my sister never picked up the fluidity though she could pound it like most ESFP's do in sports. Kick a ball far, everything of that sort, like a guy...that's how they can do. BUT, note how they're basically no male ESFP's who've really made it in tennis that I know of, maybe Den't one, don't know. But I don't think it's by accident. They're the MOST gross motor dominant. In the "raw" state, you see these traits even more, before the "teaching" can edit all that out for ya'.

It's those little nuances, they're digital, not analog, fine tuning to the ball. My feeling is that in general the men by tour level are usually big enough, that everyone has *enough* power, and hence, it's the little things, those finesse adjustments that then are able to take over. Maybe Gonzo, ESFP, not really sure, don't really care enough anymore to dig deep to care.

It took me 4 times out to "adjust" to the higher level of play, the thing is this. It's everyone below, you'll never find a higher possible swing in arc than this type, depending on when u catch them, and how thing's iz going on in their life.

I've *never* EVER learned ANYTHING from a schoo lecture in my life. Honestly it's like I wasn't even there, would never even know what Ch.'s was on, day before test...then, suddenly, just bang with a gun to my head, the brain goes into stealth turbo mode. Negotiating extremes. A limp to dead fish one second,then in those most extreme of moments suddenly one of the most naturally fear governed types, is the most fearless and thriving...the balance of it all, the way it all works out, the checks and blanaces, just astounds me, but also why I don't really think in terms of "talent" type notions. It just is what it is. If BJ Penn were born, late balding Agassi it wouldn't exactly be fair now would it? Yeah, exactly. So, it's NOT something to be looked at as something "better than," or to be glorified. I just look at people for what they is now. You know, I'd rather just know what my problem is now, and get on with it. People need to know the *worst-case* scenariors for their type, that's the only things that's really useful when you're life falls apart...man, if only, it's nothing personal, if only I knew that sooner. Better for all, y'a know? But u have to see it as a problem, u have to care *enough.* That really is the question.

Allz I can say is, INFP feeling particularly a "need" to be "inspired" (usually, for other people, for w/out a cause, they'd just capitiulate and roll over along time ago), with limited resources, would be able to make the most out of apparent "talent" wise. We're just geared that way, to absorb the soul, the "signature" of a stroke, take that snapshort, just like that. Remember, Cedric Pioline started tennis VERY late, and yet look at how poetic his strokes were. And that's the thing though, he wasn't all mentally in the doldrums though upstairs at that time, and so never developed the wolrd's worst focustration in the moment, so many times. And that's what I mean. An ENTJ in pro sports is usally going to be more there, day-in, day-out. Less "mercurial" if you will then an INFP or ESTP going through the dumps, you never know which one you're going to get. It's more in their head. We take what have for granted. It's just how we're geared, and it's fair. It's perfectly fair. Those who usually have more "natural" talent, often times squander it mroe,dilly dally moping iwht thier soul. Those with apparently "less" natural talent, whine and mope, about how why can't they be "special," whatever that means, why can't I be "specially" admired in that way too...while all the meanwhile, dilligiently, working their way up the ladder, taking notes, asking questions (you know, it's true. Teachers will tell you, you can't just give everyone an A...those who ask questions a lot, teachers know. Those are the ones who on the bubble, will always get the A-, and those like me...will always be singled out, as the ones easier to get away with, as won't raise a fuss...that type, those kind of daily swings go on all the time in life, be aware of them, what makes me sad though is knowing how much potential "brilliance" is lost in life, becs we're living by somebody's elses imposed rules and standars all the time, can honestly say, that had I, were I ever able to be a professor now looking back, no one else is likely to have given more, but that's just how life is, that's how it works itself out, who, whoo, wrote that...outside the classroom, then whatever, C+, B-, whatever in it, it's just the way it is, gotta conform, and I don't even know why looking back, I'm tired of having to always hold back, ahh, and whatever).

The thing is this, u wanna win the lottery, in sport, and have limited means, then an INFP or ESTP is you're best bet. I'm tired of hearing about race. My "raw" and unscripted on line about that, I feel like there's a lot of people who feel that way today. U know, Ichiro...he happened. And that's the bottom-line. Look at a person's*type* first, then work from there. We're
"close enough," that there's always going to be exceptions to the rule. And I'm tired of placing caps on people. I just want people to be the best that they can be, on behalf of other people. I remember thinking, little girl what do you know about racism? Not everyone has a group fighting for them over the past, don't pick sides while boasting that this is going to get you into law school on Facebomb. It's just uggh, I'm not racist at all...and perhaps, that's my problem. I'm sick of us, we, me, them, uggh, and that was in response to the sitinit's bible or something or other, overheard bending by the gas sation, late at night, & of course, I never gulped more palpably inside. One one hand, I guess that meant I had more potential than a C+, and "VErryyyy, verrrrry small mrket for" and whatever, & it meant something too. U know @ the end of the day, things can go wrong in ur life. I don't want that kind of thing to happen to anyone else, if the hear tis good, it deserves a chance to be heard, "You're talent deserves to be heard." I don't care about tlaent anymore, I just don't want to waste what I have, and lead nowhere in the end, bcs. I don't see a point to that anymore, & how Queen's anywhere the wind blows...no, really, whas't the point of that? In the end, I don't care if u have talent, but wahat's the point of that, what good does that do anyone, when they *really* need it? It's not enough.

You know, money was not enough for my cousin. U know, that's just how it wokrs out sometimes. Some of the families did, some of them didn't, or did, but then had nothing, that's just how it works out sometimes. But if you don't hae the mentality that that's all you're good for, then you shouldn't do it. But if you truly believe that, and feel that way, then might as well die trying. Though, I'm still very much intimidated by the notion, that gulp...why should I even try, when I've still never even been to those pointy-top buildings...though, I wish I could now. Style, in my pinky, it comes like nothing to me, always has & always will. If that's the case, then it's not worth it. If I say, I want your best, and you can't still gulp, and self-motivate yourself, as all perfectly sane and reasonable people do, then you never really had it in you. I still know that porn star has great potential. You just kjnow these things as you move along. I just re-discovered my will to get nougat-licensed to try again, gotta go.

It's hard to go all the way in solosit sports, feel bad for my cousin, because I can honestly say that...well, it still meant something to me that she tried. It don't matter to me that she felt short of the "goal." If she were Jet, she would get sympathy points for that, but one way or the other, I don't really care much about that.

[sureshs]

Originally Posted by 8F93W5

I think that's true for men, but if you're a woman tennis is the best chance to make big money. How many women are making money at baseball or American football?

That is why tennis is unique and should be kept that way. One would think men would appreciate seeing women's sports, but instead they prefer to watch big sweaty ill-behaved men. Give me women's sports any day. Much easier on the eyes.

[r2473]

Originally Posted by sureshs

That is why tennis is unique and should be kept that way. One would think men would appreciate seeing women's sports, but instead they prefer to watch big sweaty ill-behaved men. Give me women's sports any day. Much easier on the eyes.

Keep an eye out for my new video log coming soon to TW.

You might find a few outfits you like.

[filphil]

Originally Posted by sureshs

That is why tennis is unique and should be kept that way. One would think men would appreciate seeing women's sports, but instead they prefer to watch big sweaty ill-behaved men. Give me women's sports any day. Much easier on the eyes.

Spoken like a true bro.

I saw somewhere that motorsports were mentioned. I think that's even more difficult to make money in. A popular saying is, "How does one make a small fortune racing cars? You start with an even bigger fortune."

[Limpinhitter]

Originally Posted by S&V Specialist

Just imagine a guy like Lebron James playing tennis. 6'8", faster than Nadal, and stronger than any other tennis player. If US tennis brings someone like that to the sport, the rest of the world better watch out. Maybe he'll pull a Jordan but play tennis instead of baseball...

I don't think Lebron James is as fast as Nadal in a short sprint, and I don't think he can change directions anywhere near as fast as Nadal can either.

[Limpinhitter]

Originally Posted by Sander001

What about jockey or race car driver?

Ian Woosnam anyone?

[RollTrackTake]

One would think if more people of any & every race participated in a given sport it would increase the level of play/competition. Don't hold your breath hoping young black kids flock to tennis. There is seemingly little gold or glory in it to the casual American sports watcher. How many tennis hi lights do you see on sportscenter outside the majors? Interesting enough, where I live I see Asian and Indian kids flocking to tennis in droves. I can only figure it's because it's a non-contact sport and there parents don't want them to get hurt. Cuz other than nishikori I don't see Asian/Indian tennis pros they're trying to emulate. How come no one asking why or if those kids will save American tennis?