Cristophe Rochus: Doping rampant, mentions Nadal and Soderling

[Flash O'Groove]

Originally Posted by ctjpm

1 major, 1 masters cup & five lesser tournaments compared to 3 majors, 1 masters cup, 3 masters & four lesser tournaments is as striking an improvement as Djokovic '10/'11 and far more than Rafa who missed part of April, May & June '04. '11 whooping titles' - eight of which came on clay, in '04 he didn't make the trip to South America, dnp MC, Barcelona, Rome, RG. His clay dominance had to start sometime...and did in 2005. Won his first hard court masters title - brilliant, then lost first match in Cinci & R3 @ USO, hardly a striking improvement.

In 2010, Djokovic won Dubai (ATP 500), and reached the USOpen final. He beated less than five top 10 players.
In 2011, Djokovic won 3 slams, 5 masters 1000, went 10'000 - 1 against top 10 players.

It is the biggest improvement in the history of tennis.

[Fiji]

Originally Posted by Flash O'Groove

In 2010, Djokovic won Dubai (ATP 500), and reached the USOpen final. He beated less than five top 10 players.
In 2011, Djokovic won 3 slams, 5 masters 1000, went 10'000 - 1 against top 10 players.

It is the biggest improvement in the history of tennis.

Djokovic's is the biggest improvement in the history of tennis because he went from a weakling who retired all the time from matches and couldn't play in the heat to the player with the best endurance/stamina on tour by far.

[Flash O'Groove]

Originally Posted by Fiji

Djokovic's is the biggest improvement in the history of tennis because he went from a weakling who retired all the time from matches and couldn't play in the heat to the player with the best endurance/stamina on tour by far.

I don't remember in which matches he retired in 2010, nor in which of them he especially suffered from heat? I don't remember him playing any marathon matches in 2011?

[Clarky21]

Originally Posted by Flash O'Groove

I don't remember in which matches he retired in 2010, nor in which of them he especially suffered from heat? I don't remember him playing any marathon matches in 2011?

He played a long semi against Andy in Rome and then went out the very next day fresh as a daisy and won the final. Cvac wasn't really known for his incredible stamina prior to this, so this made me raise an eyebrow.

He also went out and played a gruelling and long 3 set final in the heat and humidity of Miami, and was fresher than Nadal was after that match. Nadal was in sad shape and had to be given an IV for dehydration afterwards that match was so brutal. This is the match that solidified my suspicions about him that he was on something. No way on earth Cvac pre-Dr. Igor would have been able to do that.

And look at what he did at the AO last year. Again, no way Cvac pre-Dr. Igor would have been able to outlast both Andy and Nadal in such long and gruelling matches before his magic potion in 2011. Cvac is the most obvious doper on the entire tour, and it is sickening how he still has not been caught and never will be because the ATP and WADA are as corrupt as corrupt gets.

[Flash O'Groove]

Originally Posted by Clarky21

He played a long semi against Andy in Rome and then went out the very next day fresh as a daisy and won the final. Cvac wasn't really known for his incredible stamina prior to this, so this made me raise an eyebrow.

He also went out and played a gruelling and long 3 set final in the heat and humidity of Miami, and was fresher than Nadal was after that match. Nadal was in sad shape and had to be given an IV for dehydration afterwards that match was so brutal. This is the match that solidified my suspicions about him that he was on something. No way on earth Cvac pre-Dr. Igor would have been able to do that.

Wait, professional players shouldn't be able to play two long best of 3 matches in a row?

[Clarky21]

Originally Posted by Flash O'Groove

Wait, professional players shouldn't be able to play two long best of 3 matches in a row?

I was pointing out how he struggled with his stamina prior to 2011 and then suddenly he became a physical beast over night who never tires and can outlast anyone. His entire turn around physically was explained away by a gluten-free diet. I will never believe he is clean, and if WADA and the ATP were serious about catching doper's he would have been caught by now.

And the Cvac of old would have have a very tough time of it going out and playing 2 long matches in a row. His entire career up until then is proof enough of that.

[Onehandedbackhand]

Do I think Federer's taking something? Yup.

Do I think Ferrer's taking something? Yup.

Do I think Djoker's taking something? Yup.

Do I think Nadal's taking something? Yup.

On down the line.

Do I condemn them for it? Not in the least.

Different world, different time now. They all are, and they all will. The only time I'm going to condemn these substances is if they make one that allows you to work less to achieve the same results. These guys still have to work harder than any of us will ever really know.

And even with it being a different world now, "performance enhancers" have been around for years and years and years. Anytime a pro athlete took cocaine or popped a couple pills before a game, it was because he was absolutely exhausted and needed some pep in his step(besides the fact that he was hooked too). That's a performance enhancer.

They said Babe Ruth stayed out all night partying, then slept about three hours, then went to the ballpark and slammed three homers. I've slept three hours before, even one hour many times before, and I feel like I'm in another dimension even with coffee. You don't think he was taking something to give him a little pep?

I'm not an advocate for these things...I'm just being honest. The Rochuses look bitter as hell with their standing, and Olivier will continue to get slaughtered by even the top 100. He hustles just as much as Ferrer, and Ferrer toyed with him because he's just stronger than Ollie. It's honorable to stay clean, but he's just going to get pounded in every first round.

Because, I mean, have you SEEN Tim Smyczek?

[Onehandedbackhand]

Originally Posted by Clarky21

I was pointing out how he struggled with his stamina prior to 2011 and then suddenly he became a physical beast over night who never tires and can outlast anyone. His entire turn around physically was explained away by a gluten-free diet. I will never believe he is clean, and if WADA and the ATP were serious about catching doper's he would have been caught by now.

I believe he started taking them last year, not the year before.

His gluten free diet did wonders, but he absolutely taxed out by the US Open in 2011. Just looked awful.

[fedfan46]

Originally Posted by DropShotArtist

Look at Federer's huge muscles.

this. Federer has not undergone visible body changes that would highlight steriod use at anytime during his career. In fact, his play has dropped off! Fed isn't a doper...

[Clarky21]

Originally Posted by fedfan46

this. Federer has not undergone visible body changes that would highlight steriod use at anytime during his career. In fact, his play has dropped off! Fed isn't a doper...

You do not have to be muscle bound to be pumped full of peds. People need to get with the times badly on this subject.

[Flash O'Groove]

Originally Posted by Onehandedbackhand

Do I think Federer's taking something? Yup.

Do I think Ferrer's taking something? Yup.

Do I think Djoker's taking something? Yup.

Do I think Nadal's taking something? Yup.

On down the line.

Do I condemn them for it? Not in the least.

Different world, different time now. They all are, and they all will. The only time I'm going to condemn these substances is if they make one that allows you to work less to achieve the same results. These guys still have to work harder than any of us will ever really know.

And even with it being a different world now, "performance enhancers" have been around for years and years and years. Anytime a pro athlete took cocaine or popped a couple pills before a game, it was because he was absolutely exhausted and needed some pep in his step(besides the fact that he was hooked too). That's a performance enhancer.

They said Babe Ruth stayed out all night partying, then slept about three hours, then went to the ballpark and slammed three homers. I've slept three hours before, even one hour many times before, and I feel like I'm in another dimension even with coffee. You don't think he was taking something to give him a little pep?

I'm not an advocate for these things...I'm just being honest. The Rochuses look bitter as hell with their standing, and Olivier will continue to get slaughtered by even the top 100. He hustles just as much as Ferrer, and Ferrer toyed with him because he's just stronger than Ollie. It's honorable to stay clean, but he's just going to get pounded in every first round.

Because, I mean, have you SEEN Tim Smyczek?

You might be right in the "everybody do it", but wrong in the "it doesn't matter". Because every players don't benefit in the same way by taking enhancer. Federer or Raonic, because of their game's style, wouldn't benefit as much from stamina enhancers than Ferrer or Nadal (they would still benefit from it, though). Drugs enhance the physical dimension of tennis, and thus help more the players whom game rely heavily on the physical dimension.

[heninfan99]

In Fed's entire career there's never been a drastic change in his strength, endurance and recovery. He never suddenly became an iron man. He's clean and endorses more testing.

I believe Gasquet is also clean. Whatever you think of his reasoning he got caught for coke and paid the price. He wouldn't risk such a thing again. It was not a fun time for him.

Yes, some of the top guys have become iron men seemingly overnight but I give them the benefit of the doubt until someone steps up with proof.

Listen, they caught Korda. It took a while but they eventually banned him for 12 months and he retired. I don't think Rios ever complained. The didn't strip Korda of his AO title.

They were very tough on Coria who seemed to prove that his vitamins was contaminated. They still banned him.

Soon they will all master perfectly legal ways to get an edge. Like the CVAC egg, ozone therapy & legal supplements.

[President]

Originally Posted by Flash O'Groove

You might be right in the "everybody do it", but wrong in the "it doesn't matter". Because every players don't benefit in the same way by taking enhancer. Federer or Raonic, because of their game's style, wouldn't benefit as much from stamina enhancers than Ferrer or Nadal (they would still benefit from it, though). Drugs enhance the physical dimension of tennis, and thus help more the players whom game rely heavily on the physical dimension.

There are also drugs which enhance the mental side of tennis, like amphetamines which will give you much improved concentration and focus. How many times have you seen Djokovic bulgy eyed and ultra alert in pressure moments during a big match, looking he is on cocaine?

[heninfan99]

Good point but it makes me laugh. If you're buggy-eyed you're automatically a coke head?

Are the nonchalant players on heroin?

Originally Posted by President

There are also drugs which enhance the mental side of tennis, like amphetamines which will give you much improved concentration and focus. How many times have you seen Djokovic bulgy eyed and ultra alert in pressure moments during a big match, looking he is on cocaine?

[corners]

Deleted post

[Sid_Vicious]

Originally Posted by President

There are also drugs which enhance the mental side of tennis, like amphetamines which will give you much improved concentration and focus. How many times have you seen Djokovic bulgy eyed and ultra alert in pressure moments during a big match, looking he is on cocaine?

I really doubt it. Djokovic is a wealthy man. If he wanted to use something, he would probably hire professionals to help him do it and make sure his tracks are completely covered. Popping amphetamine pills would be extremely irresponsible and stupid. They conduct drug tests during grand slams and amphetamines show up in your urine for 2-4 days. Djokovic would be risking a lot for a cheap buzz during the match.

[onehandbh]

I think it's impossible to stop PEDs from being in sports.

In many ways it's no different than everyday life. We are all trying to
get an "edge" on our competition. For some people, that means the ends
justify the means. Some examples from mild to illegal:

- using a headhunter to help find a job.
- leveraging your alumni connections.
- asking a friend for a referral to a job.
- asking your friend for a job interview.
- asking your friend to hire you.
- lying on your resume to help land a job.
- stealing credit from a co-worker to get ahead at work.
- insider trading
- getting approved for a good loan from a friend in banking.
- stealing copyrighted material and reselling.
- copying a successful product and making and selling your version of it.
- a congressman helping pass or stop a bill or law from passing because a
lobbyist wants him to -- leading to a big payoff after leaving office by
the corporation /organization that hired the lobbyist.
- overthrowing a government because they don't do what you want them
to do. (e.g. history of Central America & US)
- starting a war or overthrowing a government to get access to the country's
natural resources.

When you start thinking about all this, it doesn't surprise me a pro
athlete or aspiring pro would take PEDs or a parent would give HGH
to his kid to make him grow taller because it is an advantage in the sport
they play. There was a 15 or 16 year old WTA player that got busted for
Steroids a few years ago. (I can't remember her name) Kids in my
high school were taking roids and most of them had nowhere near pro
potential in the sport they played. At a certain point some cross the
gray line between supplement and PED. Like plastic surgery, once you
start, it's probably hard to stop...

[ivan_the_terrible]

Originally Posted by Sid_Vicious

I really doubt it. Djokovic is a wealthy man. If he wanted to use something, he would probably hire professionals to help him do it and make sure his tracks are completely covered. Popping amphetamine pills would be extremely irresponsible and stupid. They conduct drug tests during grand slams and amphetamines show up in your urine for 2-4 days. Djokovic would be risking a lot for a cheap buzz during the match.

But he did hire that quack magnetotherapy dude who apparently diagnosed his gluten issue & you saw the results in 2011.

I'm always wary of tennis pros that travel around with a bunch of dubious fellas.

[bullfan]

Originally Posted by Mustard

But Lance Armstrong didn't fail a doping test. So where's innocent until proven guilty? The system is full of plea bargains, thereby corrupting the whole process. I don't see how any conviction can be safe in such an environment as that. I read in a newspaper yesterday that the USADA wanted to do a deal with Armstrong to allow him to keep his first 5 Tour de France titles. When Armstrong refused all their plea bargains, and then said that he would no longer defend himself, the USADA went for the maximum punishment, and then the USADA had the audacity to act like a drug free sport was their motivation for throwing the whole damn library at Armstrong. Their real reason was to punish Armstrong for resisting all their plea bargains.

Actually, that is incorrect. Lance did fail a test, and then they backdated a prescription. It's what Emma O'Reilly said, and Lance sued her. He did say he owed her an apology. He called her one of the ones he couldn't remember suing, but they sued everyone.

[Gonzo_style]

delete.....