There no doubt Nole is the best ever in Australia now

[RF20Lennon]

Originally Posted by The_Order

Federer has only ever won ONE AO title by getting through a top 4 opponent. Oh and relax guys, it wasn't Novak or Rafa that he beat, it was only JC Ferrero.

I find it funny that people piss on Andre for his weak 2001 and 2003 draws but never mention Fed's easy runs, esp 2006.

LOL he did beat novak in the 2007 Aussie. But he played some tricky opponents. Please like novak could get through Safin the way fed did.

[TheFifthSet]

Originally Posted by MTF07

And yes, while Djokovic may have the more dominant run (of course and insane level Safin that would have beaten any version of Djokovic prevented Federer from 4 peating in Australia),

I don't mean to nitpick but I just don't get this. How did he prevent him from 4-peating? He was gunning for his second straight title. Plus he still had to win in the final, if he won that match. And even though he won in 2006 and 2007, if he had won in 2005 it would have changed the structure of things, like a butterfly effect if you will. His mentality going into the 2006 Australian Open would have been different if he won the year before than if he lost. Maybe he would have been more complacent, with less of a chip on his shoulder. Or maybe he would have played even better. But you can never know.

Also, I disagree with your premise that 2005 Safin would simply mop the floor with Djokovic, but I don't want to open that can of worms.

[The_Order]

Originally Posted by TheFifthSet

It's a tad deceptive though because the draws are much tougher than the ranking of the players woud indicate. 2004 was a very daunting draw. Prime Ferrero, prime Hewitt (albeit recovering from a bit of a low), Nalbandian, and then Safin, who made 3 finals down under, winning one.

Hewitt was coming off his worst season in years. Slipped from #1 to #17 IIRC.

Ferrero was never really that good, on clay yes you could make a case for him but he was coming off getting belted by Guccionne in Sydney.

And let's be fair to Safin here, he played that tournament, it was his first major since when? The previous AO? He was absent for 03 RG, WIM, USO and even the YEC. Then he had tough 5 set battles all the way through against Martin, a 4 setter with Blake (that featured 2 TBs), a 5 setter against then #1 Roddick and then ANOTHER 5 setter against Agassi. To even think that Safin was anywhere near up to beating a guy like Roger in the final is crazy talk. He was stuffed.

Originally Posted by TheFifthSet

2006 was pretty soft, but 2007 featured a resurgent Roddick who got shellacked by Fed, and an on-fire Gonzo.

Fed's 06 was quite soft. 2007 he destroyed Roddick in the semi no doubt played unbelievable, but on-fire Gonzo wasn't as on fire as his previous matches, most likely due to being nervous in his first major final.

Originally Posted by TheFifthSet

In 2010 he beat Davydenko, who was playing the best tennis of his life by far, and was seen as a legitimate contender, Tsonga who is a perennial top 8 player, and Murray, who was ranked 5 but lets be honest, he was a top 4 player at the time and would surpass Soderling shortly thereafter.

So, Soderling's efforts to get to top 4 are disregarded here. That isn't very fair, he produced better results therefore deserved his seeding above Murray. Had Murray been seeded 4 the draw would've been different and who knows what could've happened.

As for Davydenko, yeah he was playing probably his best level, but still I don't think his best level is enough against a Roger, Rafa or Novak in a major. Nadal has a bad HC h2h against him, but let's be honest, majors are a completely different story, just look at Roger and Murray's h2h.

Tsonga was also stuffed after back to back 5 setters against Almagro and Novak.

[The_Order]

Originally Posted by RF20Lennon

LOL he did beat novak in the 2007 Aussie. But he played some tricky opponents. Please like novak could get through Safin the way fed did.

Ah you crazy? Novak wasn't anywhere near top 4 in 2007 AO. LOL.

[doobiedoodoo]

Nah, weak field. Federer is old. HC is hardly Nadal's best surface. Murray is not in the same category.

[Mustard]

Here are all their Australian Open match results:

Andre Agassi
1995 Australian Open
R128: Andre Agassi def. Grant Stafford (6-2, 6-4, 6-2)
R64: Andre Agassi def. Jerome Golmard (6-2, 6-3, 6-1)
R32: Andre Agassi def. Greg Rusedski (6-2, 6-4, 6-2)
R16: Andre Agassi def. Patrick Rafter (6-3, 6-4, 6-0)
QF: Andre Agassi def. Yevgeny Kafelnikov (6-2, 7-5, 6-0)
SF: Andre Agassi def. Aaron Krickstein (6-4, 6-4, 3-0 ret.)
FR: Andre Agassi def. Pete Sampras (4-6, 6-1, 7-6, 6-4)

1996 Australian Open
R128: Andre Agassi def. Gaston Etlis (3-6, 7-6, 4-6, 7-6, 6-3)
R64: Andre Agassi def. Vincent Spadea (6-4, 6-2, 6-3)
R32: Andre Agassi def. Steve Bryan (4-6, 6-0, 6-2, 6-1)
R16: Andre Agassi def. Jonas Bjorkman (4-6, 6-2, 4-6, 6-1, 6-2)
QF: Andre Agassi def. Jim Courier (6-7, 2-6, 6-3, 6-4, 6-2)
SF: Michael Chang def. Andre Agassi (6-1, 6-4, 7-6)

1998 Australian Open
R128: Andre Agassi def. Marzio Martelli (3-6, 7-6, 6-2, 6-2)
R64: Andre Agassi def. Albert Costa (6-4, 6-4, 2-6, 7-5)
R32: Andre Agassi def. Andrea Gaudenzi (6-2, 6-2, 6-0)
R16: Alberto Berasategui def. Andre Agassi (3-6, 3-6, 6-2, 6-3, 6-3)

1999 Australian Open
R128: Andre Agassi def. Hernan Gumy (6-0, 6-3, 6-0)
R64: Andre Agassi def. Slava Dosedel (7-6, 6-2, 6-0)
R32: Andre Agassi def. Jiri Novak (6-3, 6-2, 6-1)
R16: Vincent Spadea def. Andre Agassi (6-1, 7-5, 6-7, 6-3)

2000 Australian Open
R128: Andre Agassi def. Mariano Puerta (6-2, 6-2, 6-3)
R64: Andre Agassi def. Sjeng Schalken (7-5, 6-0, 6-3)
R32: Andre Agassi def. Mariano Zabaleta (6-4, 6-4, 6-2)
R16: Andre Agassi def. Mark Philippoussis (6-4, 7-6, 5-7, 6-3)
QF: Andre Agassi def. Hicham Arazi (6-4, 6-4, 6-2)
SF: Andre Agassi def. Pete Sampras (6-4, 3-6, 6-7, 7-6, 6-1)
FR: Andre Agassi def. Yevgeny Kafelnikov (3-6, 6-3, 6-2, 6-4)

2001 Australian Open
R128: Andre Agassi def. Jiri Vanek (6-0, 7-5, 6-3)
R64: Andre Agassi def. Paul Goldstein (6-1, 6-3, 6-1)
R32: Andre Agassi def. David Prinosil (7-6, 5-0 ret.)
R16: Andre Agassi def. Andrew Ilie (6-7, 6-3, 6-0, 6-3)
QF: Andre Agassi def. Todd Martin (7-5, 6-3, 6-4)
SF: Andre Agassi def. Patrick Rafter (7-5, 2-6, 6-7, 6-2, 6-3)
FR: Andre Agassi def. Arnaud Clement (6-4, 6-2, 6-2)

2003 Australian Open
R128: Andre Agassi def. Brian Vahaly (7-5, 6-3, 6-3)
R64: Andre Agassi def. Hyung-Taik Lee (6-1, 6-0, 6-0)
R32: Andre Agassi def. Nicolas Escude (6-2, 3-6, 6-3, 6-4)
R16: Andre Agassi def. Guillermo Coria (6-1, 3-1 ret.)
QF: Andre Agassi def. Sebastien Grosjean (6-3, 6-2, 6-2)
SF: Andre Agassi def. Wayne Ferreira (6-2, 6-2, 6-3)
FR: Andre Agassi def. Rainer Schuettler (6-2, 6-2, 6-1)

2004 Australian Open
R128: Andre Agassi def. Todd Larkham (6-1, 6-3, 6-4)
R64: Andre Agassi def. Tomas Berdych (6-0, 6-2, 6-4)
R32: Andre Agassi def. Thomas Enqvist (6-0, 6-3, 6-3)
R16: Andre Agassi def. Paradorn Srichaphan (7-6, 6-3, 6-4)
QF: Andre Agassi def. Sebastien Grosjean (6-2, 2-0 ret.)
SF: Marat Safin def. Andre Agassi (7-6, 7-6, 5-7, 1-6, 6-3)

2005 Australian Open
R128: Andre Agassi def. Dieter Kindlmann (6-4, 6-3, 6-0)
R64: Andre Agassi def. Rainer Schuettler (6-3, 6-1, 6-0)
R32: Andre Agassi def. Taylor Dent (7-5, 7-6, 6-1)
R16: Andre Agassi def. Joachim Johansson (6-7, 7-6, 7-6, 6-4)
QF: Roger Federer def. Andre Agassi (6-3, 6-4, 6-4)



Roger Federer
2000 Australian Open
R128: Roger Federer def. Michael Chang (6-4, 6-4, 7-6)
R64: Roger Federer def. Jan Kroslak (7-6, 6-2, 6-3)
R32: Arnaud Clement def. Roger Federer (6-1, 6-4, 6-3)

2001 Australian Open
R128: Roger Federer def. Arnaud Di Pasquale (6-4, 4-6, 6-1, 7-5)
R64: Roger Federer def. Nicolas Escude (6-1, 6-4, 6-4)
R32: Arnaud Clement def. Roger Federer (7-6, 6-4, 6-4)

2002 Australian Open
R128: Roger Federer def. Michael Chang (6-4, 6-4, 6-3)
R64: Roger Federer def. Attila Savolt (6-2, 7-5, 6-4)
R32: Roger Federer def. Rainer Schuettler (7-6, 7-6, 6-4)
R16: Tommy Haas def. Roger Federer (7-6, 4-6, 3-6, 6-4, 8-6)

2003 Australian Open
R128: Roger Federer def. Flavio Saretta (7-6, 7-5, 6-3)
R64: Roger Federer def. Lars Burgsmuller (6-3, 6-0, 6-3)
R32: Roger Federer def. Andreas Vinciguerra (6-3, 6-4, 6-2)
R16: David Nalbandian def. Roger Federer (6-4, 3-6, 6-1, 1-6, 6-3)

2004 Australian Open
R128: Roger Federer def. Alex Bogomolov Jr. (6-3, 6-4, 6-0)
R64: Roger Federer def. Jeff Morrison (6-2, 6-3, 6-4)
R32: Roger Federer def. Todd Reid (6-3, 6-0, 6-1)
R16: Roger Federer def. Lleyton Hewitt (4-6, 6-3, 6-0, 6-4)
QF: Roger Federer def. David Nalbandian (7-5, 6-4, 5-7, 6-3)
SF: Roger Federer def. Juan Carlos Ferrero (6-4, 6-1, 6-4)
FR: Roger Federer def. Marat Safin (7-6, 6-4, 6-2)

2005 Australian Open
R128: Roger Federer def. Fabrice Santoro (6-1, 6-1, 6-2)
R64: Roger Federer def. Takao Suzuki (6-3, 6-4, 6-4)
R32: Roger Federer def. Jarkko Nieminen (6-3, 5-2 ret.)
R16: Roger Federer def. Marcos Baghdatis (6-2, 6-2, 7-6)
QF: Roger Federer def. Andre Agassi (6-3, 6-4, 6-4)
SF: Marat Safin def. Roger Federer (5-7, 6-4, 5-7, 7-6, 9-7)

2006 Australian Open
R128: Roger Federer def. Denis Istomin (6-2, 6-3, 6-2)
R64: Roger Federer def. Florian Mayer (6-1, 6-4, 6-0)
R32: Roger Federer def. Max Mirnyi (6-3, 6-4, 6-3)
R16: Roger Federer def. Tommy Haas (6-4, 6-0, 3-6, 4-6, 6-2)
QF: Roger Federer def. Nikolay Davydenko (6-4, 3-6, 7-6, 7-6)
SF: Roger Federer def. Nicolas Kiefer (6-3, 5-7, 6-0, 6-2)
FR: Roger Federer def. Marcos Baghdatis (5-7, 7-5, 6-0, 6-2)

2007 Australian Open
R128: Roger Federer def. Bjorn Phau (7-5, 6-0, 6-4)
R64: Roger Federer def. Jonas Bjorkman (6-2, 6-3, 6-2)
R32: Roger Federer def. Mikhail Youzhny (6-3, 6-3, 7-6)
R16: Roger Federer def. Novak Djokovic (6-2, 7-5, 6-3)
QF: Roger Federer def. Tommy Robredo (6-3, 7-6, 7-5)
SF: Roger Federer def. Andy Roddick (6-4, 6-0, 6-2)
FR: Roger Federer def. Fernando Gonzalez (7-6, 6-4, 6-4)

2008 Australian Open
R128: Roger Federer def. Diego Hartfield (6-0, 6-3, 6-0)
R64: Roger Federer def. Fabrice Santoro (6-1, 6-2, 6-0)
R32: Roger Federer def. Janko Tipsarevic (6-7, 7-6, 5-7, 6-1, 10-8 )
R16: Roger Federer def. Tomas Berdych (6-4, 7-6, 6-3)
QF: Roger Federer def. James Blake (7-5, 7-6, 6-4)
SF: Novak Djokovic def. Roger Federer (7-5, 6-3, 7-6)

2009 Australian Open
R128: Roger Federer def. Andreas Seppi (6-1, 7-6, 7-5)
R64: Roger Federer def. Evgeny Korolev (6-2, 6-3, 6-1)
R32: Roger Federer def. Marat Safin (6-3, 6-2, 7-6)
R16: Roger Federer def. Tomas Berdych (4-6, 6-7, 6-4, 6-4, 6-2)
QF: Roger Federer def. Juan Martin del Potro (6-3, 6-0, 6-0)
SF: Roger Federer def. Andy Roddick (6-2, 7-5, 7-5)
FR: Rafael Nadal def. Roger Federer (7-5, 3-6, 7-6, 3-6, 6-2)

2010 Australian Open
R128: Roger Federer def. Igor Andreev (4-6, 6-2, 7-6, 6-0)
R64: Roger Federer def. Victor Hanescu (6-2, 6-3, 6-2)
R32: Roger Federer def. Albert Montanes (6-3, 6-4, 6-4)
R16: Roger Federer def. Lleyton Hewitt (6-2, 6-3, 6-4)
QF: Roger Federer def. Nikolay Davydenko (2-6, 6-3, 6-0, 7-5)
SF: Roger Federer def. Jo-Wilfried Tsonga (6-2, 6-3, 6-2)
FR: Roger Federer def. Andy Murray (6-3, 6-4, 7-6)

2011 Australian Open
R128: Roger Federer def. Lukas Lacko (6-1, 6-1, 6-3)
R64: Roger Federer def. Gilles Simon (6-2, 6-3, 4-6, 4-6, 6-3)
R32: Roger Federer def. Xavier Malisse (6-3, 6-3, 6-1)
R16: Roger Federer def. Tommy Robredo (6-3, 3-6, 6-3, 6-2)
QF: Roger Federer def. Stanislas Wawrinka (6-1, 6-3, 6-3)
SF: Novak Djokovic def. Roger Federer (7-6, 7-5, 6-4)

2012 Australian Open
R128: Roger Federer def. Alexander Kudryavtsev (7-5, 6-2, 6-2)
R64: Roger Federer def. Andreas Beck (Walkover)
R32: Roger Federer def. Ivo Karlovic (7-6, 7-5, 6-3)
R16: Roger Federer def. Bernard Tomic (6-4, 6-2, 6-2)
QF: Roger Federer def. Juan Martin del Potro (6-4, 6-3, 6-2)
SF: Rafael Nadal def. Roger Federer (6-7, 6-2, 7-6, 6-4)

2013 Australian Open
R128: Roger Federer def. Benoit Paire (6-2, 6-4, 6-1)
R64: Roger Federer def. Nikolay Davydenko (6-3, 6-4, 6-4)
R32: Roger Federer def. Bernard Tomic (6-4, 7-6, 6-1)
R16: Roger Federer def. Milos Raonic (6-4, 7-6, 6-2)
QF: Roger Federer def. Jo-Wilfried Tsonga (7-6, 4-6, 7-6, 3-6, 6-3)
SF: Andy Murray def. Roger Federer (6-4, 6-7, 6-3, 6-7, 6-2)

[Mustard]

Novak Djokovic
2005 Australian Open
R128: Marat Safin def. Novak Djokovic (6-0, 6-2, 6-1)

2006 Australian Open
R128: Paul Goldstein def. Novak Djokovic (6-2, 1-6, 6-3, 6-2)

2007 Australian Open
R128: Novak Djokovic def. Nicolas Massu (6-1, 6-1, 6-0)
R64: Novak Djokovic def. Feliciano Lopez (6-2, 7-5, 6-1)
R32: Novak Djokovic def. Danai Udomchoke (6-3, 6-4, 5-7, 6-1)
R16: Roger Federer def. Novak Djokovic (6-2, 7-5, 6-3)

2008 Australian Open
R128: Novak Djokovic def. Benjamin Becker (6-0, 6-2, 7-6)
R64: Novak Djokovic def. Simone Bolelli (6-1, 6-2, 6-2)
R32: Novak Djokovic def. Sam Querrey (6-3, 6-1, 6-3)
R16: Novak Djokovic def. Lleyton Hewitt (7-5, 6-3, 6-3)
QF: Novak Djokovic def. David Ferrer (6-0, 6-3, 7-5)
SF: Novak Djokovic def. Roger Federer (7-5, 6-3, 7-6)
FR: Novak Djokovic def. Jo-Wilfried Tsonga (4-6, 6-4, 6-3, 7-6)

2009 Australian Open
R128: Novak Djokovic def. Andrea Stoppini (6-2, 6-3, 7-5)
R64: Novak Djokovic def. Jeremy Chardy (7-5, 6-1, 6-3)
R32: Novak Djokovic def. Amer Delic (6-2, 4-6, 6-3, 7-6)
R16: Novak Djokovic def. Marcos Baghdatis (6-1, 7-6, 6-7, 6-2)
QF: Andy Roddick def. Novak Djokovic (6-7, 6-4, 6-2, 2-1 ret.)

2010 Australian Open
R128: Novak Djokovic def. Daniel Gimeno-Traver (7-5, 6-3, 6-2)
R64: Novak Djokovic def. Marco Chiudinelli (3-6, 6-1, 6-1, 6-3)
R32: Novak Djokovic def. Denis Istomin (6-1, 6-1, 6-2)
R16: Novak Djokovic def. Lukasz Kubot (6-1, 6-2, 7-5)
QF: Jo-Wilfried Tsonga def. Novak Djokovic (7-6, 6-7, 1-6, 6-3, 6-1)

2011 Australian Open
R128: Novak Djokovic def. Marcel Granollers (6-1, 6-3, 6-1)
R64: Novak Djokovic def. Ivan Dodig (7-5, 6-7, 6-0, 6-2)
R32: Novak Djokovic def. Viktor Troicki (6-2 ret.)
R16: Novak Djokovic def. Nicolas Almagro (6-3, 6-4, 6-0)
QF: Novak Djokovic def. Tomas Berdych (6-1, 7-6, 6-1)
SF: Novak Djokovic def. Roger Federer (7-6, 7-5, 6-4)
FR: Novak Djokovic def. Andy Murray (6-4, 6-2, 6-3)

2012 Australian Open
R128: Novak Djokovic def. Paolo Lorenzi (6-2, 6-0, 6-0)
R64: Novak Djokovic def. Santiago Giraldo (6-3, 6-2, 6-1)
R32: Novak Djokovic def. Nicolas Mahut (6-0, 6-1, 6-1)
R16: Novak Djokovic def. Lleyton Hewitt (6-1, 6-3, 4-6, 6-3)
QF: Novak Djokovic def. David Ferrer (6-4, 7-6, 6-1)
SF: Novak Djokovic def. Andy Murray (6-3, 3-6, 6-7, 6-1, 7-5)
FR: Novak Djokovic def. Rafael Nadal (5-7, 6-4, 6-2, 6-7, 7-5)

2013 Australian Open
R128: Novak Djokovic def. Paul-Henri Mathieu (6-2, 6-4, 7-5)
R64: Novak Djokovic def. Ryan Harrison (6-1, 6-2, 6-3)
R32: Novak Djokovic def. Radek Stepanek (6-4, 6-3, 7-5)
R16: Novak Djokovic def. Stanislas Wawrinka (1-6, 7-5, 6-4, 6-7, 12-10)
QF: Novak Djokovic def. Tomas Berdych (6-1, 4-6, 6-1, 6-4)
SF: Novak Djokovic def. David Ferrer (6-2, 6-2, 6-1)
FR: Novak Djokovic def. Andy Murray (6-7, 7-6, 6-3, 6-2)

[TheFifthSet]

Hewitt was coming off his worst season in years. Slipped from #1 to #17 IIRC.

True, but he finished the year in the top 5 and was healthy during the event. A healthy, motivated, young Hewitt is danger for anybody in the R16 of a slam, and especially in Australia.

Ferrero was never really that good, on clay yes you could make a case for him but he was coming off getting belted by Guccionne in Sydney.

Well he was coming off a US Open final and a win in Madrid on an indoor hardcourt, so if we go a little further, I'd say his form wasn't too shabby.

And let's be fair to Safin here, he played that tournament, it was his first major since when? The previous AO? He was absent for 03 RG, WIM, USO and even the YEC. Then he had tough 5 set battles all the way through against Martin, a 4 setter with Blake (that featured 2 TBs), a 5 setter against then #1 Roddick and then ANOTHER 5 setter against Agassi. To even think that Safin was anywhere near up to beating a guy like Roger in the final is crazy talk. He was stuffed.

You make some salient points, I will admit, and I agree that it was a tough ask for Safin. I remember thinking before that final thinking he needed to close it out in 3/4 if he wanted to have a chance. I gave him a punchers chance.

Regardless though, I'd say a draw consisting of Hewitt, Ferrero and Nalby (the latter being a bad matchup for Fed) all in fairly good form isn't anything to scoff at. I would include Safin in there due to the redlining element, but I do concede that Fed was an overwhelming favourite.

Fed's 06 was quite soft. 2007 he destroyed Roddick in the semi no doubt played unbelievable, but on-fire Gonzo wasn't as on fire as his previous matches, most likely due to being nervous in his first major final.

To each their own I guess. I thought Gonzo played some pretty awesome tennis but was subdued by a peak Fed. My memory could be foggy, but I remember Gonzo holding a 5-4 40-15 lead on serve in the first set, and on the first set point he had a look on a pass and scorched a forehand at Fed that Fed just cooly handled with a stab volley. Then after that Rog clawed back and played near flawless tennis, with Gonzo staying the course.

So, Soderling's efforts to get to top 4 are disregarded here. That isn't very fair, he produced better results therefore deserved his seeding above Murray. Had Murray been seeded 4 the draw would've been different and who knows what could've happened.

I'm not disregarding him, he was ranked no. 4 and thus deserved it at the time, but I'm just saying, to say Fed only beat one top 4 player is just a tad deceiving in my judgment, because while on paper Soderling was in the top 4 at the time, Murray was seen as the subjective number 4, and played like it in the tournament (dispatching Rafa and playing extremely solid tennis). So in the grand scheme of things, while Federer didnt technically beat a top 4 player that year, he DID beat a guy who was playing like one, and who would supplant him as numner 4 shortly after that. The point is, is it really worth noting? It's a technicality at best. I mean it was one seed separating them, and given Murrays Aussie Open pedigree, I'm sure pretty much any top player would rather face Sod than Andy.

As for Davydenko, yeah he was playing probably his best level, but still I don't think his best level is enough against a Roger, Rafa or Novak in a major. Nadal has a bad HC h2h against him, but let's be honest, majors are a completely different story, just look at Roger and Murray's h2h.

Fair enough. I personally think that while Davys peak level wouldn't grant him 'favourite' status over any of those guys at a slam, I do maintain that drawing him at that tournament, given the form he was in, is a dangerous proposition. To this day I've never seen someone make Fed look so helpless at a major the way Davy did in that first set and a half (6-2, 3-1 and a BP for a double break), other than Rafa at 2008 RG. He just had immense difficulty making inroads with Davy from the baseline until his form raised and Davys dropped. While I don't think peak Kolja would win very often against Fed at a slam, he would definitely offer a stiff challenge.

Also, the way he was playing I could have seen Davy taking out Rafa if they played at the 2010 Aussie. Or maybe the 2006/2007 US Open.

Tsonga was also stuffed after back to back 5 setters against Almagro and Novak.

He wasn't in full flight but he was still a tough match on paper. This is a guy who's beaten Murray, Djokovic AND Rafa at this particular major, at some point. And he just took Fed to 5 a week ago. Tsonga is historically a giant killer at the Australian Open.

All in all, Davy Tsonga and Murray is tough no matter how one puts it (just in my opinion, of course).

[The_Order]

To TheFifthSet,

I'm not saying Fed's draws were piss easy (except 2006), but when I compare to who Novak had to beat to earn his titles:

2008 - Fed #1 and Tsonga
2011 - Fed #2 and Murray #5
2012 - Murray #4 and Nadal #2
2013 - Ferrer #4 and Murray #3

Apart from Murray in 2011, Tsonga's the only one not seeded top 4 and in that final he kept his level up from the previous 08 matches.

Then I look at Fed's:

2004 - Hewitt #15, Nalby #8, Ferrero #3 and Safin
2006 - Davydenko #5, Kiefer and Baghdatis
2007 - Roddick #6 and Gonzalez #10
2010 - Tsonga #10 and Murray #5

I think it's pretty clear Novak has had the tougher run and still has 4 titles, which imo ranks him as the AO GOAT in the open era.

[NadalAgassi]

A good question is who is the 2nd best Australian Open player of the Open Era- Agassi or Federer?

[President]

Originally Posted by NadalAgassi

A good question is who is the 2nd best Australian Open player of the Open Era- Agassi or Federer?

Look at Agassi's draws to win his latter 2 AO's....

[THE FIGHTER]

Originally Posted by NadalAgassi

A good question is who is the 2nd best Australian Open player of the Open Era- Agassi or Federer?

the answer is federer, but he isnt second to djokovic, but Rafa instead. Nads gets gets the nudge for his two 3+ stellar, classic worthy matches in the later rounds in various AOs. i'd rate the proper order as nadal, federer, agassi, and djokovic. as the name suggests, djokovic is a joke.

[Mustard]

Originally Posted by President

Look at Agassi's draws to win his latter 2 AO's....

In 2001, Todd Martin, Patrick Rafter and Arnaud Clement (Clement had beaten Agassi at the 2000 US Open). In 2003, Rainer Schuettler had beaten both David Nalbandian and Andy Roddick.

[THE FIGHTER]

Originally Posted by Mustard

In 2001, Todd Martin, Patrick Rafter and Arnaud Clement (Clement had beaten Agassi at the 2000 US Open). In 2003, Rainer Schuettler had beaten both David Nalbandian and Andy Roddick.

where's rafa? was he injured then?

[NadalAgassi]

Originally Posted by President

Look at Agassi's draws to win his latter 2 AO's....

Very true, but Federer's in 2006 and to a lesser degree 2007 was quite the joke as well. Agassi also while not winning 3 straight Australians Djokovic, did win 3 straight he played from 2000-2003 (and would have been the heavy favorite in the year he had to miss due to injury in 2002), something Federer has also not done. Agassi also wasted alot of opportunities by not playing the event until 1995, but that is his fault. It is unfortunate he did as he would probably be the Australian Open GOAT still today, and not Djokovic yet, if he had.

[THE FIGHTER]

Originally Posted by NadalAgassi

Very true, but Federer's in 2006 and to a lesser degree 2007 was quite the joke as well. Agassi also while not winning 3 straight Australians Djokovic, did win 3 straight he played from 2000-2003 (and would have been the heavy favorite in the year he had to miss due to injury in 2002), something Federer has also not done. Agassi also wasted alot of opportunities by not playing the event until 1995, but that is his fault. It is unfortunate he did as he would probably be the Australian Open GOAT still today, and not Djokovic yet, if he had.

i agree, djokovic and the like should be thanking their lucky stars that agassi back in the day didnt play the AO as much as he could. same can be said about rafa now since he isn't playing either. djokovic is reaping from draws that dont have neither agassi nor nads.

[Mustard]

Originally Posted by THE FIGHTER

where's rafa? was he injured then?

In early 2001, Rafa was playing in the satellites in Spain. In 2003, Nadal was playing on the challenger circuit, his ranking still a bit too low for the main tour. This changed in April 2003.

[THE FIGHTER]

Originally Posted by Mustard

In early 2001, Rafa was playing in the satellites in Spain. In 2003, Nadal was playing on the challenger circuit, his ranking still a bit too low for the main tour. This changed in April 2003.

any date after April 2003, either tennis related or non-tennis related, should be changed to the year "X" A.R. with "X" being the amount of years after 2003 the event takes place. A.R. obviously stands for Anno Rafa, signifying the year of his arrival.

it will greatly help distinguish what years and respective results count and which do not.

[Blocker]

Originally Posted by kishnabe

Andre beat Pete at his peak in 95 Aussie.....that alone makes him better than Nole who had to face slow fake tennis.

Pete was not at his peak at the 95 AO...he had a whole lot of things going on in his head at the time.

[Blocker]

Originally Posted by kragster

Just curious, why do you value consecutive slams so much? If the total number of slams won is the same, you could make the case that winning slams over a longer stretch is also impressive as it shows longevity and an ability to compete against likely different competition. In theory, shouldn't it be just as impressive to win a slam across your preprime prime and post prime as it is to win it consecutively during your prime?

Personally I value the sum total of achievements more than I value whether it was done all in one bunch or spread across .

Winning 5 straight to me is better than winning 5 scattered over a 10-12 year period.

Winning 5 straight means for 5 years in a row, you are the defending champion, so for 5 years in a row, you are the player everyone wants to knock off. So for me, Fed's 5 in a row at the USO is more impressive than Sampras' 5 because Sampras won one when he got under everyone's guard, flew under the radar so to speak, then he won his 5th as his swansong where he was a sentimental favourite with the crowd. Still an amazing feat to win 5 in that time, but to me it's not as impressive as facing up to the challengers every year for 5 years and keeping them at bay from your trophy.