How far can Gilbert take Murray?

[ChiefAce]

Originally Posted by serveitup911

I'll add to my previous point. Murray has no big weapons and is mopey. Phil, Hewitt had two weapons - mental toughness and speed. Murray seems to have neither of those.

I agree, Hewitt brings more to the table when you compare him to Murray. Is it too late to progress and develop weapons........no but we'll see what happens. He won't be top 10 unless he gets more firepower.

[monologuist]

I think Gilbert will take Murray into the top 10, possibly top5. Murray has a lot going for him; more than many give him credit for :
-He has an excellent and consistent 2-handed backhand, capable of quite a variety of pace, angle, and spin for a backhand that is so limited, inherently.
-He has an excellent backhand slice. This was the first shot I noticed watching him...his slice is better than 90% (or more) of the top tier ATP. He can keep it very deep and low with good pace, or cut it short and angled, Federer-style. Most importantly, he knows how to use it while contructing a point, again, Fed-like, not just as a bail-out defensive shot.
-His forehand has potential, although it seems to be a bit consistent at this point. It is certainly not a dominating shot, but I think he can easily improve it. He seems to trust a it a little less than his backhand presently, which may be part of the problem.
-His serve has potential as well, IMO. He can get into the high 120's and 130's on his first serve; not bad for such a beanpole-like physique. His motion looks nice and smooth...if he gains some strength, and his body fills out a little, I think his serve will only improve in power. Consistency seems to be lacking in his serve at this point...chalk that up as #1 on his list of things to work on.
-He seems to be an excellent returner....I was very impressed by his returns against Roddick at Wimbledon this year. He knows when to attack and when to return conservatively. For now, his return game somewhat offsets his inconsistent serve.
-I love his passing shots. He is not in the same league as Nadal or Monfils in court coverage, but he seems deceptively quick, and has a nose for the ball. His passing shots always seem very controlled and accurate on both wings. Along with his backhand (s), and his returns, I rank his passing shots as one of his greatest strengths.
-Defense : As I said before, I think he is deceptively quick. He doesn't have world-class speed, but he moves well and anticipates well. Some work on his fitness and strength will improve his retrieving abilities, I believe, and along with his ability to pass and lob, defense should be an area of strength for Murray.
-Transition and net game : This is an area where I think he is well beyond his young peers, with the exception of Gasquet. Murray clearly is comfortable using the whole court, and has excellent hands at the net, not surprising for a Brit. I'd like to see him attack a bit more in fact, as he seems content at times to counter punch.
-Tennis IQ : Here is where he is head and shoulders above all of the young guns, and most older guns for that matter. Murray posseses the rare gift of seeing how things will unfold a step or two ahead, knows how to contruct points using his extremely well-rounded array of shots, and has been called , repeatedly, a smart "match player". In other words, he is adept at improvising, and adapting to match situations as they unfold, changing tactics when need be, a sign of true tennis intelligence. This I believe, as many do, to be his greatest "weapon", one that is more rare and potentially more lethal than a huge forehand.
-Passion for winning, mental toughness : These are two aspects of Murray's game that have been lauded by tennis "experts". However, it seems that his confidence is easily shaken at this point, and when he is in bad form, the passion and the toughness slip away too easily. But at heart, I believe this guy has some fire; and in matches, he knows how to feed off of it to carry himself to victory. THis is, again, an all too rare trait in today's ATP. Unfortunately, I think at this point, he is not maximizing his mental toughness and tapping into the fire in his belly, mainly due to the fact that his awful level of conditioning leaves him helpless, late in critical matches.
-proficiency on different surfaces - Murray posses the type of game that translates well to all surfaces. Grass and hardcourts are a given for him; if he can improve his fitness, clay becomes a much better possibility.

...so it is clear that the absoulte greatest hole in Murray' game is his fitness. His endurance is paltry presently, and while he has a great frame for a male tennis pro, it is still in an awkward, gangly, adolescent phase. The boy needs to put some meat on his bones, put on his running shoes and head for the hills Agassi-style. If he has more confidence in his body, I believe he will be able to maximize his potential for mental toughness, and develop the killer instinct necessary to take it to the next level.

If Gilbert can encourage Andrew to do the necessary work off the court, I think he could take him far. I also think he will do a good job preparing him mentally and strategically, as those are the two areas that he is known to possess the most wisdom in. All in all, I think he's a great choice for Murray, and it shows that he wants to take things to the next level, and hiring a coach that has "championship experience" is indicative that he may be ready to get serious.

[tarheels2323]

Maybe if Gilbert can change Murray's mental game (and by change I mean totally re-arrange) the can propel him into the top ten for a while. However, I don't see Murray as a potential top 5 player and if he does get into the top 10 he probably (without radical adjustment) won't be able to stay there. Like someone else already said, he doesn't have any big weapons so he would need to develop in that area as well.

[AJK1]

All he will do for Murray is suck money out of his Bank Account!

[illkhiboy]

Originally Posted by Moose Malloy

Just read that this is pretty much a done deal(3 year contract)

I think this is the biggest challenge of Gilbert's career. With Agassi & Roddick, he joined them when they had already accomplished quite a bit(Agassi was already W champion & former top 3 player, Roddick was in the top 5 & had already been to a slam SF)

Murray is 19, currently ranked 36. He certainly isn't a sure thing like those players.

Gilbert reminds me of Phil Jackson, someone who steps into a perfect situation & ends up looking like a genius when his players do what they are supposed to do. Now we'll see just how good of a coach he really is.

Agassi was on a downward spiral when he hooked up with Gilbert. Ranked 32 and his results were very inconsistent. Gilbert stabilised his results. Same with Roddick. He was ranked 10 I think. Had just lost in the first round of the French and had a poor record on grass coming into that season. Amazingly he won at Queens beating Agassi for the first time and reached Wimby semi's losing to Federer. Thats a big improvement!
I agree though, that Roddick and Agassi had already had a few accomplishments. Murray's best result is probably his victory in San Jose. Interesting to see what magic BG can do with him. Perhaps none, but it should be interesting nonetheless.

[Aykhan Mammadov]

Gilbert can't take him far, he can take him backward only, as in the case with Roddick.

Gilbert will kill his talent and understanding of the game. This is the end for Murray.

[omniexist]

I'll concede that Murray is definitely a thinker out there. Against Roddick he outmaneuvered him by a mile. Very interesting to see him devise his gameplan and blunt Roddick's power.

[Woodstock_Tennis]

If BG could help any player I'd think it would be murray. They're both thinkers out there on the court, with bg scouting his opponents and coming up with game plans I think he could take murray very far.

[TXKiteboarder]

well, i heard on bbc that they will be offering him nearly 500K Euros, so I am sure that will buy alot for a year.



I personally would like to see him coach Baghdatis. I think they would an aowsome choice since Baghs just need that "extra" push to make it near the top, while Murray seemed to require alot more work

[scotus]

Originally Posted by Wondertoy

What did he do for Roddick? The way I see it, he confused the crap out of Andy by telling him to come into net more and serve and volley some because of his serve and size, he needed to attack more. So Andy's been slicing his way into net and coming in and now everyone is beating him! Now Andy is in a no confidence death spiral because Gilbert gave him the wrong advice. You cannot change his style of game and teach him to be a great volleyer at 20, you need to develop the attack game at 14-16! Brag was also the guy who told him to receive serve 10 feet behind the baseline. No one thinks more highly of himself than Gilbert. He is a mediocre coach and a good self promoter who just sold himself to the Brits who are desparate for a champion.

Boy, then how did Roddick win the U.S. Open and become the #1 player under Gilbert's guidance?

[Wondertoy]

Roddick was already playing that well before Gilbeert got on board. Why do you think he is not considered for the job again?

[malakas]

Originally Posted by TXKiteboarder

well, i heard on bbc that they will be offering him nearly 500K Euros, so I am sure that will buy alot for a year.



I personally would like to see him coach Baghdatis. I think they would an aowsome choice since Baghs just need that "extra" push to make it near the top, while Murray seemed to require alot more work

Very small chance this will happen.Marcos,is not so good financially.He still owes big to the Mouratoglou academy.I think that last year he couldn't even afford having his coach all-year round.

[arosen]

Murray's biggest problem is his mental stability. He seems to go quickly from blowing the other guy off the court to totally losing it. Maybe Gilbert can make him lighten up a bit, Murray could use a better 'tude.

[Moose Malloy]

Looks like I(& a few others) were wrong. Murray & Nadal are changing what I thought was necessary to get to the top in todays game. Defense seems to be more important than offense nowadays.

[TGV]

I was convinced of Murray's abilities after watching him beat Roddick at Wimbledon last year. It reminded me of Federer's 2003 demolition of Roddick (which was Fed's breakout performance). Right now, he looks like top 5 in ability. The ranking should catch up sooner or later.

Originally Posted by Moose Malloy

Murray & Nadal are changing what I thought was necessary to get to the top in todays game. Defense seems to be more important than offense nowadays.

This is a great observation, Moose. It is almost like in NBA where, gradually defense came to dominate as athletes got better and better (until they changed the rules a couple of years ago to help the offense).

[Nick Irons]

Gilbert is a fab coach; the man just knows tennis. Comparing him to Phil Jackson is a disservice; Jackson stepped into a sitchy with Michael Jordan and Shaq/Kobe (and the Refs in Game 6 against the Kings), 3 of the most dominant players in ths history of the game.

Why Gilbert get's such a bad rap from the armchair tennis community is a mystery. He is a tennis zen master; a guru of the sport. What does he have to do to get respect around here? Coach yet another player to win another Grand Slam ? Even Agassi has stated that Brad Gilbert taught him how to play the game.

Murray has beaten Roddick (2) and Roger Federer; this isn't a fluke.
The young man took Rafa 5 Sets at the Aussie and was obviously exhausted (Welcome to the ATP Tour kid)

He's been to 5 finals in 15 Months and has won 2 of them.

I believe Murray will not only go onto greatness, but will reach the final of a Major this year. In fact, the more I think about it, the more I like him.

[norcal]

Originally Posted by Phil

"Mopey" doesn't really matter. Sampras was "mopey" and it didn't seem to hurt him. From what I've seen, Murray has some mental toughness and he's smart-two things Hewitt has. He also has better groundstrokes. We'll see-I'm not expecting miracles, but if he gets in shape and gets motivated, he could possibly jump a lot of places this year and next. I can see Top 10.

Nostradomus Phil.

[yonex90]

Gilbert and Murray will end up in the top five by the end of the year easy.

Roddick would be a better player today if he could have stuck with Brad. Roddick's lack of success is his own fault and firing Brad came from the same part of his brain that say's "I dont need to learn how to do anything well but serve" and "I will leave quick movement on the court to players like Federer, Nadal, and Hewitt" and "I can't believe Murray has beat me so many times"

Murray will be the next new player to win a Major.

[fastdunn]

Originally Posted by The tennis guy

I think he can get to top 16 in 3 years. He has such different game, mix junk with touch and power, just plays so different. Top 10 would be tough because I am not sure if he can pass the likes of Baghdatis, Berdych, Djokovic, Monfils, Gasquet, Ancic. Not a lot of room left in top 10 in 3 years.

Who is "he" you're refering here ?

Murray is currently #13. And current top 10 is not exactly a group of folks
who strike me as solid top 10 talents excapt of course Fed, Nadal and maybe
Nabandian...

IMHO, Murray can be top 5 in a hurry... but he'd better hurry... while
top 10 is pretty weak, IMHO.

[TheNatural]

Gilbert might do alright with him as Murray is already good technically, so Gilbert doesnt have to worry muich about 'fixing ' his shots. He can just babble and tell him to be mentally strong. Murray will naturally improve anyway regardless of who coaches him.