I'm getting really sick of Wilson's poor QC! And TW too!

TennisManiac · Dec 9, 2017

Well... it happened to me again. I bought another Wilson frame from TW and it wasn't even close to the advertised specs. As usual, the static weight and balance was way off. What in the hell is the problem with Wilson's quality control? And why doesn't TW care about what they're selling us? If you're going to advertise a racquet weighing a certain weight and being a certain balance when strung, make sure you're selling us what you're advertising. I'm getting really tired of this crap. Now I have another racquet that I can't get to my preferred specs without it being to damn heavy. And because I removed the plastic from the handle I can't return it. I'm so mad right now I'm seriously considering never purchasing anything from TW ever again. I'd like to hear what TW has to say about this nonsense. Why do you advertise something that you know damn well you can't give us? I wish there was something legally I could do to get my money back for the past couple of frames I purchased from TW. Feel free to chime in and explain why you continue to disappoint so many of us with the bogus specs you advertise.

Wait to hear

EdMcMush · Dec 9, 2017

ya should put this in the "tw question" forum as well

TennisManiac · Dec 9, 2017

EdMcMush said:
ya should put this in the "tw question" forum as well

I did

ollinger · Dec 9, 2017

What sort of person keeps buying WIlson racquets if he's convinced their quality control is so dreadful?? Are there not other brands to choose from?? This is laughable. If you bought several Fiats and they constantly broke down on the road would you keep buying them??

TennisManiac · Dec 9, 2017

ollinger said:
What sort of person keeps buying WIlson racquets if he's convinced their quality control is so dreadful?? Are there not other brands to choose from??

I like the way the Wilson Pro Staff's feel and play. Just because there are other brands out there to chose from doesn't make it ok for TW to sell us crap that isn't even close to advertised specs. It's false advertisement.

movdqa · Dec 9, 2017

They have racquet matching service if you need more than one frame or a service to look for frames with particular specs. It's a pain if you find this out after buying though. Best approach is to get the lightest they have and then have them customized to your specs.

datsveryinterestin · Dec 9, 2017

TW cares more than most companies from my experience. Too late now, but it sounds like you knew Wilson Quality Control is suspect. TW can easily, with a phone call, pick a racquet that weighs closest to spec. Or, if you pay a small fee, they can select 2 racquets closest to weight, balance, and flex!!! And for another fee they can custom match the racquets to your specifications.
Seems reasonable to me!!

(Edit.. movdqa beat me to it!)

TennisManiac · Dec 9, 2017

I know about the racquet matching and all that stuff. I just want to be able to order a racquet that's true to specs without having to pay an extra $20 to get it. Why should we have to pay an extra 20 bucks to get what they're advertising it to be in the first place? It's nonsense.

Crocodile · Dec 9, 2017

Yonex, Pacific, Volkl and Tecnifibre better with quality control so I would look there.

ollinger · Dec 9, 2017

TennisManiac said:
I like the way the Wilson Pro Staff's feel and play. Just because there are other brands out there to chose from doesn't make it ok for TW to sell us crap that isn't even close to advertised specs. It's false advertisement

no, not false advertisement; the "terms of use" text for this website indicates specs are approximate and subject to change, and you can return the unused product if you're not satisfied with it.

TennisManiac · Dec 9, 2017

ollinger said:
no, not false advertisement; the "terms of use" text for this website indicates specs are approximate and subject to change, and you can return the unused product if you're not satisfied with it.

They only give us the "strung" specs. Not the "unstrung" specs. So I had to string it before I could tell what the weight and balance was. I wish I would have known what the unstrung specs were supposed to be. I have a balance board and scale. But like I said... I had to string it first.

Rampart · Dec 9, 2017

TennisManiac said:
I know about the racquet matching and all that stuff. I just want to be able to order a racquet that's true to specs without having to pay an extra $20 to get it. Why should we have to pay an extra 20 bucks to get what they're advertising it to be in the first place? It's nonsense.

It's on Wilsons end though. TW just get the rackets in stock and you can't expect them to throw out rackets that are off spec, that'd lead to a lot of money down the toilet. At least TW will customise it for you so you can get exactly what you want, a lot of other vendors wont, and you can't expect them to do that for free either.

For better quality control go for a yonex or tecnifibre or something along those lines. If you want a racket to your exact spec without any extras just get a custom Angell, if you message him he'll make basically anything for you.

moon shot · Dec 9, 2017

TennisManiac said:
They only give us the "strung" specs. Not the "unstrung" specs. So I had to string it before I could tell what the weight and balance was. I wish I would have known what the unstrung specs were supposed to be. I have a balance board and scale. But like I said... I had to string it first.

If you want unstrung look at TWE, they list both. Not that it solves everything, my 6.1 Anni frames are all like 20 higher than their listed swingweight but all the other specs were pretty good.

PBODY99 · Dec 9, 2017

@TennisManiac

Ask for what you want; no more than X grams.
When it arrives, weight it unstrung check the balance, return if it is not what you ordered.

kimguroo · Dec 9, 2017

PBODY99 said:
@TennisManiac

Ask for what you want; no more than X grams.
When it arrives, weight it unstrung check the balance, return if it is not what you ordered.

Agree. Also TW is internet store and nothing to do with Wilson quality control.
if you are really concern about spec, you should ask TW for specific request or even paying for matching service from TW.
OR get Yonex racket hahaha

TW does not have power to control Wilson's quality control issue. TW just receives bulk Wilson rackets and they can't check every single racket. it will be too much work for them. Also they can't return all unqualified rackets to Wilson. In my experience, If I ask for specific requests, most of stores tried to match my request as much as they can.
Adverting spec is guide line. even TW pull out several rackets then post average specs.

Wilson is known for " bad quality control" and they seem to more interested in "customized Paint job rackets (actually not true customization since the concept is similar to nikeID)" instead of their quality controls.
I strongly think that it's good for short term sale strategy but longer term, it won't benefit them at all especially after Fed era. Wilson should start to invest themselves especially quality control now.
it will cost more money and effort but it will be only way to become a solid reputable company like Yonex.

Bartelby · Dec 9, 2017

I wonder whether investing in quality control is a simple matter of Wilson rejecting more racquets that come out of production which are off spec?

All companies have tolerances and the tighter the tolerance, the more waste and greater cost. One can see why companies have poor quality control.

kimguroo · Dec 9, 2017

Bartelby said:
I wonder whether investing in quality control is a simple matter of Wilson rejecting more racquets that come out of production which are off spec?

All companies have tolerances and the tighter the tolerance, the more waste and greater cost. One can see why companies have poor quality control.

It should not be just “rejecting rackets”. They should find/invest better way to manufacture rackets.
Or spying from Yonex hahahaha.

DJTaurus · Dec 9, 2017

I ve asked TW about Wilson QC and they told me that they have complained many times on Wilson based on people’s feedback/emails etc but Wilson simply doesn’t care. Maybe we should stop caring about Wilson too. My last Ultra tour was 309/10gr unstrung.

Also i don’t like the fact that TW raised their matchmaking charge from 10 to 20$.....

http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/inde...-control-is-a-joke-shame-on-them-ps97.591367/

Bartelby · Dec 9, 2017

From the one or two videos I've seen racquet manufacture is not that high tech.

If it were you could imagine leaps in quality control. That just does not seem to happen.

kimguroo said:
It should not be just “rejecting rackets”. They should find/invest better way to manufacture rackets.
Or spying from Yonex hahahaha.

tata · Dec 9, 2017

One of the reasons why I am not getting a pro staff 97. Specs suit me but just as good as buying blind in a big ball park.

Imago · Dec 9, 2017

Bartelby said:
I wonder whether investing in quality control is a simple matter of Wilson rejecting more racquets that come out of production which are off spec?

All companies have tolerances and the tighter the tolerance, the more waste and greater cost. One can see why companies have poor quality control.

They have invested in the cultural and technical diversity specs, so there is a match for everyone.

Old Skool Graphite · Dec 9, 2017

What a trivial thing to get angry over.

Imago · Dec 10, 2017

DJTaurus said:
I ve asked TW about Wilson QC and they told me that they have complained many times on Wilson based on people’s feedback/emails etc but Wilson simply doesn’t care. Maybe we should stop caring about Wilson too. My last Ultra tour was 309/10gr unstrung.

Also i don’t like the fact that TW raised their matchmaking charge from 10 to 20$.....

http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/inde...-control-is-a-joke-shame-on-them-ps97.591367/

I wonder if TW can return stock to Wilson if there is no demand for it because of the specs control issues - weight and balance are part of the Quantity rather than Quality Control, this is what Hegel and Marx would say. OP doesn't seem to know much about dialectical materialism.

@Bartelby

Bartelby · Dec 10, 2017

The OP is a strict Kantian: the categories of the understanding are precisely laid down and there can no alteration.

Imago said:
I wonder if TW can return stock to Wilson if there is no demand for it because of the specs control issues - weight and balance are part of the Quantity rather than Quality Control, this is what Hegel and Marx would say. OP doesn't seem to know much about dialectical materialism. @Bartelby

Imago · Dec 10, 2017

Bartelby said:
The OP is a strict Kantian: the categories of the understanding are precisely laid down and there can no alteration.

He should have relied on the Vernunft antinomies, though.

4-string · Dec 10, 2017

TennisManiac said:
They only give us the "strung" specs. Not the "unstrung" specs. So I had to string it before I could tell what the weight and balance was. I wish I would have known what the unstrung specs were supposed to be. I have a balance board and scale. But like I said... I had to string it first.

Strung specs, that is useless. All strings are not equal, makes no sense at all. The difference in weight between a set of syn gut and nat gut for example is huge, as is the difference in weight between gauges.

IMO/IME this «Wilson has poor qc» is exaggerated, and for each time someone posts stuff like this, more people believe it.

I have purchased 8 Wilson rackets over the last few years, all of them have been on spec (unstrung that is!) or very close. I have also bought a couple of Babolats, and one Yonex. All three were as close (or far if you prefer) from spec as the Wilsons. Anectdotal evidence I know, but that seems to the norm anyway. [emoji6]

To be fair - I have a balance board, and a digital scale. I am talking static weight and balance only. Flex and swing weight might be way off for all I know, but I suspect the same goes for most of those who complain as well.

Booger · Dec 10, 2017

QC doesn't matter to literally 99% of customers. Obviously Wilson doesn't care about the 1% who want it gram perfect, so either get TW to match the spec you want or buy a different brand with tighter tolerances. No sense in getting mad. You aren't going to convince Wilson to scrap millions worth of inventory because it's off 5-10 grams.

penguin · Dec 10, 2017

TennisManiac said:
I know about the racquet matching and all that stuff. I just want to be able to order a racquet that's true to specs without having to pay an extra $20 to get it. Why should we have to pay an extra 20 bucks to get what they're advertising it to be in the first place? It's nonsense.

F you want that then Wilson ain't for you.
Simple people who use the racquet matching are probably glad they can get a wider variation of specs

penguin · Dec 10, 2017

Sw

4-string said:
Strung specs, that is useless. All strings are not equal, makes no sense at all. The difference in weight between a set of syn gut and nat gut for example is huge, as is the difference in weight between gauges.

IMO/IME this «Wilson has poor qc» is exaggerated, and for each time someone posts stuff like this, more people believe it.

I have purchased 8 Wilson rackets over the last few years, all of them have been on spec (unstrung that is!) or very close. I have also bought a couple of Babolats, and one Yonex. All three were as close (or far if you prefer) from spec as the Wilsons. Anectdotal evidence I know, but that seems to the norm anyway. [emoji6]

To be fair - I have a balance board, and a digital scale. I am talking static weight and balance only. Flex and swing weight might be way off for all I know, but I suspect the same goes for most of those who complain as well.

Ibgweight is easy to measure with the app

penguin said:
F you want that then Wilson ain't for you.
Simple people who use the racquet matching are probably glad they can get a wider variation of specs

4-string said:
Strung specs, that is useless. All strings are not equal, makes no sense at all. The difference in weight between a set of syn gut and nat gut for example is huge, as is the difference in weight between gauges.

IMO/IME this «Wilson has poor qc» is exaggerated, and for each time someone posts stuff like this, more people believe it.

I have purchased 8 Wilson rackets over the last few years, all of them have been on spec (unstrung that is!) or very close. I have also bought a couple of Babolats, and one Yonex. All three were as close (or far if you prefer) from spec as the Wilsons. Anectdotal evidence I know, but that seems to the norm anyway. [emoji6]

To be fair - I have a balance board, and a digital scale. I am talking static weight and balance only. Flex and swing weight might be way off for all I know, but I suspect the same goes for most of those who complain as well.

Swing weight is easy to measure with an app these days

Alex78 · Dec 10, 2017

The problem is, manufacturers simply offer too many choices these days, even within one single racket line. Already back in the 80ies/early 90ies, there was great variability in specs for one and the same model, but look around for racquets of that era and you either won't find published (target) specs at all or information about a rather large spec range (e.g., Wilson's Pro Staff).
It really makes one wonder if it is actually a smart idea to have so many options which are only slightly different when the standard production process (taking into account costs) is not reliable at all.

A_Instead · Dec 10, 2017

String type can influence static and swing weight...
Its a variable that needs to be considered..

BretH · Dec 10, 2017

I want internet prices but customized service and I don't want to pay extra for it.

America, 2017 in a nutshell.

AMGF · Dec 10, 2017

All my Angells come spot on and the price is not higher than commercial brands.

Yonex are great too.

If it’s important to you, choose a brand whose quality control is important to them.

nvr2old · Dec 10, 2017

datsveryinterestin said:
TW cares more than most companies from my experience. Too late now, but it sounds like you knew Wilson Quality Control is suspect. TW can easily, with a phone call, pick a racquet that weighs closest to spec. Or, if you pay a small fee, they can select 2 racquets closest to weight, balance, and flex!!! And for another fee they can custom match the racquets to your specifications.
Seems reasonable to me!!

(Edit.. movdqa beat me to it!)

I’ve had nothing but positive experiences with TW. They have gone out of their way to make things right whenever I have had a problem. I cannot speak to Wilson’s QC but surely would find it hard to blame TW.

TennisManiac · Dec 10, 2017

PBODY99 said:
@TennisManiac

Ask for what you want; no more than X grams.
When it arrives, weight it unstrung check the balance, return if it is not what you ordered.

This is exactly what I'm going to do for now on. I just think it's pathetic to have to pay an additional $20 to get a racquet near advertised specs. It should be done for us for free. I bet it only takes someone about 2 minutes to weigh and check the balance of a handful of frames. Is that really worth the $20 we have to spend. That's what pisses me off so much. Not everyone has money to blow. I know I sure don't.

topspn · Dec 10, 2017

I’m not sure what you want TW to do? They publish based on average and have explained that and everyone knows it. Everyone also knows Wilson has QC issues so up to you to buy or not. Or do you want TW to stop selling Wilson for poor QC?

TennisManiac · Dec 10, 2017

topspn said:
I’m not sure what you want TW to do? They publish based on average and have explained that and everyone knows it. Everyone also knows Wilson has QC issues so up to you to buy or not. Or do you want TW to stop selling Wilson for poor QC?

I'm just sick and tired of getting frames that are way out of spec range. And I'm venting right now. It's all I can do.

Maybe if more people vent, things will eventually change.

Hansen · Dec 10, 2017

TennisManiac said:
Maybe if more people vent, things will eventually change.

nope, only if less people buy

SpinToWin · Dec 10, 2017

Just got 2 Flexpoint Prestige XLs... 8g apart, seemingly almost all of it in the head

Have had the same with Dunlop, Volkl, other Head frames, Babolat, etc.

It seems select Yonex and Pacific frames are a rare exception. Also, even Angell doesn't bring frames spot on every time, they have some variance in there, it's the sate of the business overall.

movdqa · Dec 10, 2017

SpinToWin said:
Just got 2 Flexpoint Prestige XLs... 8g apart, seemingly almost all of it in the head

Have had the same with Dunlop, Volkl, other Head frames, Babolat, etc.

It seems select Yonex and Pacific frames are a rare exception. Also, even Angell doesn't bring frames spot on every time, they have some variance in there, it's the sate of the business overall.

Just find a customizer (there are a few on these boards), get light frames and pick your specs. It costs a bit more but you have peace of mind.

SpinToWin · Dec 10, 2017

movdqa said:
Just find a customizer (there are a few on these boards), get light frames and pick your specs. It costs a bit more but you have peace of mind.

Oh I'm not complaining, I customise myself. Just pointing out that it's the industry standard

mad dog1 · Dec 10, 2017

BretH said:
I want internet prices but customized service and I don't want to pay extra for it.

America, 2017 in a nutshell.

I want free!!!

TennisHound · Dec 10, 2017

Yes Wilson has poor QC, but I wonder if Wilson made the racquets the way they wanted, regardless of printed specs. There is no doubt that the all the CV Blades are heavier, some are close to .5oz. over the listed specs. I think Wilson knows they’re heavier but wanted to fit in the 10-6oz range so they advertised them and printed the specs this way. Wilson could care less how the specs turn out or what anyone thinks about it. (Tin foil hat, right)

loosegroove · Dec 10, 2017

Hansen said:
nope, only if less people buy

So you're saying money speaks louder than words? Say it ain't so Joe.

On a side note, I absolutely can't stand how inconsistent the fit of my DudeDenim jeans are. I buy the same exact ones as the pair I'm wearing, but some run too tight or too short, or whatever. Think I'll go buy another few pairs tomorrow, cut off all the tags, wash'em, wear'em, and then when the fit isn't right, find Macy's online Discuss Denim forum and go on a crazy rant!

CopolyX · Dec 10, 2017

Sounds like you would rather fight that switch...
Which is totally your choice.

My 2 cents:T
To me it is more that just quality, I add customer service and customer connection/focus/communication.
That is the soul company.
I made the switch years back.
Angell frames has been the fit for us .
Yonex has come a close second, they even sent me a free AI 98 a few years back for one of my sons. Because of error that they owned up to and promptly responded beyond my expectations.
These are the companies/brands/people that support me, so I have no issues supporting them ($$ -also with feedback-yep a connection!).
Sad that most today have a very hard time barely just meeting expectations, exceeding most will never. The focus is on the Benjamins! Not the customer...
Your money, your discussion...

Shroud · Dec 10, 2017

A_Instead said:
String type can influence static and swing weight...
Its a variable that needs to be considered..

And balance too. Of tw uses 16g and op uses 15g or a heavier 16g string then all bets are off.

And not to mention if you use overgrips and dampeners...

TennisCJC · Dec 11, 2017

Crocodile said:
Yonex, Pacific, Volkl and Tecnifibre better with quality control so I would look there.

yes, but even these brands have a variance. based on nothing more than my experience, I think manufacturer's have a 2-3% variance up or down above spec. For example, if the target static weight is 300 grams, a 2% variance would be 6 grams. And, the variance goes up and down, so a racket weighing between 294 grams and 306 grams would be on spec and ready to sell. If they use 3%, the racket could be 291 to 309 grams. that's a range of 12 to 18 grams which is pretty big.

I don't think TW is worse than any other retailer and the manufacturer's deliver the rackets.

If you want more precision, 1. don't unwrap the rackets before you check weight and balance. SW could also be checked. 2. pay the $10 per racket matching fee, or 3. see if you can find a local pro shop that will throw the frame on an RDC machine to measure/match frames before you buy.

I have had decent luck with Volkl, Tecnifibre and Yonex as stated above but even here you'll see some variance but more likely 1% or 2% rather than more.

zaskar1 · Dec 11, 2017

TennisManiac said:
I know about the racquet matching and all that stuff. I just want to be able to order a racquet that's true to specs without having to pay an extra $20 to get it. Why should we have to pay an extra 20 bucks to get what they're advertising it to be in the first place? It's nonsense.

TM

pretty much all of the commercial, non-custom racquets are made in China, and all manufacturers pretty much use subs.
these subs are the cheapest bidders, so their QC is always suspect. that being said, the manufacturing process has tolerances, so probably its within the tolerances that Wilson or whoever you get specifies.
if not, i am sure you can return the racquet for a refund, as TW is usually is pretty good about that.

z

Traffic · Dec 11, 2017

I bought 3 Wilson PS97LS at different times. Two of them were very close to spec. One was just a little off in balance. Made up for it with different spec vib damp.

I bought 2 Volkl V1Pro at different times. I think these two sticks were more off in balance than the Wilsons to the point I had to add some weight to the handle and they are still a hair off.

I just bought 2 Babolat Pure Strike 98 at different times. These two are pretty close in weight and balance. Just adjusting with vib damp spec.

KaiserW · Dec 11, 2017

This is not TW's fault. All manufacturing has tolerance ranges some tighter than others.

If it was that critical you probably should have paid for the matching service at $10 it is reasonable.

I'm getting really sick of Wilson's poor QC! And TW too!

Hall of Fame

Professional

Hall of Fame

G.O.A.T.

Hall of Fame

Talk Tennis Guru

Professional

Hall of Fame

G.O.A.T.

G.O.A.T.

Hall of Fame

New User

Hall of Fame

Legend

Legend

Bionic Poster

Legend

Hall of Fame

Bionic Poster

Hall of Fame

Hall of Fame

Semi-Pro

Hall of Fame

Bionic Poster

Hall of Fame

Professional

Hall of Fame

Professional

Professional

Hall of Fame

Legend

Semi-Pro

Hall of Fame

Hall of Fame

Hall of Fame

Legend

Hall of Fame

Professional

Talk Tennis Guru

Talk Tennis Guru

Talk Tennis Guru

G.O.A.T.

Legend

Hall of Fame

Hall of Fame

G.O.A.T.

Legend

Professional

Hall of Fame

Hall of Fame

Similar threads