graycrait
Legend
I hit with a number of players from Miss State and Alabama
You are indeed blessed to get to hit with such players on a regular basis and to have the skills and fitness to do so. Good for you. Have a nice life.
I hit with a number of players from Miss State and Alabama
You do realize that in a kevlar/zx setup its the tension of the zx that determines the stringbed feel and not the tension of the kevlar? Even I, a person that likes low-powered really stiff stringbeds, was usually using a softer feeling kevlar/zx stringbed than what you tried because my zx cross was usually around 40 lbs (yours was 8 lbs tighter).If I had only I had strung the Kevlar 8-10lbs tighter it would be less stiff..no thanks.
@graycrait: This is a really fun thread thanks to positive-energy posters like you. And ironically, the extended debate spurred on by a certain negative poster has undoubtedly encouraged many more folks to give this very unique and addictive string hybrid a try.You are indeed blessed to get to hit with such players on a regular basis and to have the skills and fitness to do so. Good for you. Have a nice life.
You do realize that in a kevlar/zx setup its the tension of the zx that determines the stringbed feel and not the tension of the kevlar? Even I, a person that likes low-powered really stiff stringbeds, was usually using a softer feeling kevlar/zx stringbed than what you tried because my zx cross was usually around 40 lbs (yours was 8 lbs tighter).
What's your opinion on monogut zyex as a substitute for natural gut?
Of course gut/zx at 50/48 will be much softer than kevlar/zx at 50/48 (aside from the fact that prestretching adds about 10 lbs to the effective tension). But kevlar/zx at 60/40 will feel similarly soft to gut/zx at 50/48.Have a question for you. I string Gut/poly at 59/56 with Max Power 1.25 crosses. If the cross tension determines the stiffness of the stringbed then why is this set up not stiff while the Kev/Zx at 50/48 is unbearably stiff? I can tell you. Kevlar mains as opposed to Natural Gut mains. Go string Gut/Zx at 50/48 and you will have a much softer set up than Kevlar/Zx.
You guys have convinced yourself’s that Kevlar mains do not provide stiffness even if you string them at high tension. Not the case.
I've used both ZX and NG in a full bed and I didn't find them really much the same at all. Stringing both at a tension I could get some control, the ZX felt more "crisp" and had better pocketing, more spin, a smaller sweet spot.
Of course gut/zx at 50/48 will be much softer than kevlar/zx at 50/48 (aside from the fact that prestretching adds about 10 lbs to the effective tension). But kevlar/zx at 60/40 will feel similarly soft to gut/zx at 50/48.
There is a good reason why many people enjoy playing with kevlar/zx. When the mains are much tighter than the crosses with this combo, there is much less resistance to main string movement within the stringbed plane. This creates a unique cushioned feel with an exaggerated snappy snapback effect usually only found with fresh poly, but without the very short playability duration of poly.And the reason the Gut/Zx is softer than Kev/Zx is the stiffness of Kevlar not the 48lb tension of the crosses. There are a number of strings that can be used as mains that produce tremendous play without the mess that is created with Kevlar.
I have not tried
There is a good reason why many people enjoy playing with kevlar/zx. When the mains are much tighter than the crosses with this combo, there is much less resistance to main string movement within the stringbed plane. This creates a unique cushioned feel with an exaggerated snappy snapback effect usually only found with fresh poly, but without the very short playability duration of poly.
Almost everyone posting in this thread has experienced that cushioned snappy feel. You have not.
Every time you string gut/poly at 55/53 lbs without prestretching the poly, 10 hours of hitting later the frame will have squashed more than a frame will squash from kevlar/zx at 60/45.High differentials and squashing frames is not something I would ever be interested in doing. I’m not exactly in the minority among tennis players when it comes to this. The Kev/Zx requiring this type of stringing and adding tremendous weight to compensate makes it an unsavory set up along with the fact that Kevlar mains is sub par with respect to playabitly, feel, and the least powerful string made.
Every time you string gut/poly at 55/53 lbs without prestretching the poly, 10 hours of hitting later the frame will have squashed more than a frame will squash from kevlar/zx at 60/45.
FYI -- demo'd a Wilson Clash Tour a couple weeks ago with Sensation 16g multi (55 lbs) and loved the feel but had trouble managing the power when swinging out. Ended up purchasing one and strung it up with Volkl Cyclone 17g 50 lbs thinking it would help tame the power. It did, but funny enough it still felt a bit too powerful and didn't generate as much spin as I thought it might. So, strung with Kev 17g/ZXP 17g at 75/45 lbs last week. I've since played 6-7 hours with it and it feels absolutely great. Not only can I now swing out and control things, I also am getting more spin than I do with the same string setup in my Volkl VS-8 rackets. It is noticeable by me and my opponents. And, things are as comfortable as ever.
That all said, I am still not 100% sure I will keep this racket but it is just one more example of Kev/ZXP being a winning combination for me.
There is a good reason why many people enjoy playing with kevlar/zx. When the mains are much tighter than the crosses with this combo, there is much less resistance to main string movement within the stringbed plane. This creates a unique cushioned feel with an exaggerated snappy snapback effect usually only found with fresh poly, but without the very short playability duration of poly.
Almost everyone posting in this thread has experienced that cushioned snappy feel. You have not.
Will have to continue to suffer along with VS Touch/4g and there is no way will ever need any more spin and snapback out of a set up. Maximum spin and snapback is not always the most important factor in producing the best tennis. Hitting through the court with pace and controlling the ball are far more important. With high differentials one has to sacrifice some control for spin. Serve, return, attacking the mid court ball, and volleys all suffer as well as drop shots. To each his own.
if you didnt do it right then you can't draw any conclusions. Said another way, yeah how you did it is terrible.Sad for who and what? Learned to trust my better judgement. Knew it was a horrible idea to put this string in my racquet. My friend that is a 5.0 player and trained with me that day saw the racquet strung with Kevlar and said “I wouldn’t do that”. He is also a doctor.
Gave it a go at low tension and other than control and durability this set up is sub par to full poly, gut/poly, poly/gut, poly/syn gut, and poly/multi in all categories of playability, comfort, feel and power. For these reasons, we will never see Kevlar/Zx used at higher levels of tennis whether that be juniors, collegiate players or professional. Anyone using this at the recreational level is rolling the dice with your health.
if you didnt do it right then you can't draw any conclusions. Said another way, yeah how you did it is terrible.
Who is doing the selling here? You didn't follow the recipe!! So yeah news flash, you won't have the same experience.You have a string that in your estimation can only be strung at high tension with a high differential after major pre-stretching on both strings. Squashing the frame is needed to pull all of this off. If people have problems then the problem is they didn’t pre stretch correctly or they didn’t string it tight enough or with a high enough differential. Oh yeah, if it hurts their arm they didn’t add enough weight to the frane. Regardless of whether they play with a 12.0+ frame or not. Total ridiculousness. You guys are great salesmen to convince people this is what they need to do to have a good string set up. Kinda like the old snake oil salesmen.
Who is doing the selling here? You didn't follow the recipe!! So yeah news flash, you won't have the same experience.
And you are a coach? You can't see how one needs to do things the specific way to get the results??
And I use it strung at 35 lbs Kev/ 35 lbs ZX. And it WORKS beautifully for me. Spin, control, decent power.
But it's not for everybody and that's fine. It doesn't hurt my sensitive arm, shoulder, wrist. I do hit pretty hard and serve in the high 80's - mid 90's
So USPTARF97 tried it and didn't like it and that's all good
I got a pair of these (Prince Michael Chang Ti Longbody 95") from @dak95_00 today. These rackets are 95", 28" long, 14x18 but with 8 string throats, not the "typical" 6 string Prince throats I am used to with the Prince 90 series 14x18.
Before I got an answer on the status of the strings I restrung both, one with Wilson Revolve 16 at 50/53 and the the other Ashaway Kevlar 16g x Ashaway ZX Pro 17g at 65/55, both with a NEOS 1000 lockout. Did I have fun tonight. Got to hit against UTR 10+ gal and 12+ guy. Both rackets played great. Serves were really nice. Both weigh 11.4oz. Serve power is seductive but I was able to execute good drop volleys as well as standard ground strokes and a couple of shots I have not hit as hard with such confidence before. Their coach calls me a sandbagging 4.5 but having never played USTA who knows and at my age who cares.
If you have had one hanging in the basement or garage for 20+ yrs take it out for a spin with some decent strings. I thought I could do about the same things with either racket regardless of strings. But for me the poly is just a week long string, while the Ash Kev x ZX will be a month or better.
I've lurked these forums enough (way more than I should haha) to know that guys like Shroud and travlerajm can get a good amount of grief at times for sharing their "crazy" racquet setups and ideas, but from what I've seen, they also meet and play with a lot of other forum users who try these supposed racquet monstrosities in person and I've yet to see any reports of arms falling off or the like, and it seems the other way around, they meet in person, try these crazy racquets and find that it actually plays well, even if it's not something they would do themselves or promote.
I tried Kevlar/zx with relatively high differential a few times and thought it was great, but for me I just can't get a consistent string job each time I put it on, and I know it has to do with the inconsistency in prestretching both strings and I get enough longetivity from gut/poly on my 18x20 frame. If I played with a more open pattern racquet like the 14x18 Prince 93P I would definitely want to revisit this combo and maybe I'll finally put in the effort to figure out an efficient way to get that thorough prestretch.
Gut/poly and full poly I am able to produce the same set up over and over. It’s also ready to go right off of the stringer. Would be hard to compete with a string that plays well 3hrs in. Have players that string during a match needing a higher or lower tension. Presents a logistical problem there. The only strong opposition you see to this is people getting hurt. Overly heavy frames cause shoulder and back problems if one is training daily and Kevlar setups can hurt some one in any number of ways. To each his own but there can be tennis ending consequences to using Kevlar and also stringing poly at a high tension. It’s not by mistake that we don’t see Kevlar on the college circuit where it once was very popular. Experience.
Agree that this is a highly niche setup, another very important factor is that, to my knowledge, the Kevlar/zx setup can be complemented by a heavily weighted racquet with high swingweight (which is another controversial topic altogether) which acts to offset the impact on the arms.
It's certainly reasonable that those who find the setup uncomfortable should absolutely stop playing with it at the first sign of discomfort, and hopefully from there, they can decide if they like the playing characteristics enough that they are willing to experiment some more to see if there are ways to offset the stiffness, or decide it's not for them and stop altogether.
Edit: Looks like the weight thing has already been discussed. Apologies to the rest of the posters for adding to the circular conversation. Going to withdraw myself now!
Have you tried the MC LB 110? Probably my second favorite Prince frame behind the POG OS! [emoji109]
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full bed?I tried kevlar on a lighter racquet. Felt harsh. Ew.
Hybrid.full bed?
At what tensions?Hybrid.
Kevlar/poly
70/57At what tensions?
Kevlar/poly at 45/44 was sweet in my diablo mid.70/57
You don't do a differential with Kevlar/poly?Kevlar/poly at 45/44 was sweet in my diablo mid.
I'm well aware of your stance on kevlar and this is why I'll say this:Players are looking to produce their best tennis right off the stringer in a 2-3 set match. Full poly 48-52, seeing everywhere with an occasional 54 or 55. No hybrid, no differential, and no Kevlar.
Luxilon is still the string choice of the majority of high level players.
Just some info on what we see with the juniors, collegiate and 4.5+ players.
Ok but your using 85-93 frames 19 mm beam if I remember correctly.me. 35 lbs Kev/ZX. So far my fave string combo. Lots of spin, zero arm or elbow pain, good power with the ZX
Ok but your using 85-93 frames 19 mm beam if I remember correctly.