Damaging loss for Djokovic

weelie · Aug 20, 2019

Pantera said:
While Medvedev played hit and hope tennis and will never do that sort of thing again (130mph 2nd serves is desperation)

Hitting 1st serves as your 2nd serves is a viable tactic. If you can hit 70% and win more than 70% of those points, you are winning around 50% (or more) of those points, which is winning a good stat for 2nd serve points. I remember some old article discussing that some players should serve two 1st serves. Anyway, if you do it all the time, you might lose the surprise element.

A loss here and there might only serve Djoker well. Medvedev on the other hand, has won too much already on this HC trek, will be taken out by some young hot gun on a good day. Nole is still very much the favorite for US Open. Nadal is the 2nd, but could well get injured etc. Federer has not played much, and has not won much, this year.

vex · Aug 20, 2019

Pantera said:
While Medvedev played hit and hope tennis and will never do that sort of thing again (130mph 2nd serves is desperation) for Djokovic being 2 behind Nadal at Masters 1000 level is going to grate with him, as is the fact Nadal bagelled Medvedev a week ago.

Psychology plays a huge part in sport and Nadal is 2-1 v Djokovic in new york and add to that recent events should the almost inevitable Nadal Djokovic final happen in 3 weeks time (only injury stops it as no player is remotely close to either on hard courts) then Nadal has the edge mentally, also albeit on clay not hard but the last meeting was a bagel and breadstick for Nadal.

Missed opportunitu for Djokovic as had he won cincinatti he would have been clear favourite for USO. Now he probably will be wary of Nadal and historically when Djokovic has doubts he tends to lose to nadal.

You think Djoker ISN’T the clear favorite at the USO? Lol

UnderratedSlam · Aug 20, 2019

Pantera said:
Dude...I have already defeated your argument lol. Fact you don't know the difference between North American Hard courts and Australasian hard courts suggests to me you have limited knowledge of tennis.

You cannot have it both ways...if you want to rely on hard court matches from Beijing 2013 on wards...then you have to include Nadal 2-1 Djokovic at USO..it is that simple. Quit being bitter you got owned. lmao.

Just a reminder:

YOU are the one who said that older results don't count, but beforehand you had made the argument that 2010-2013 USO was proof that Rafa has an edge.

So which is it? Old results or newer results? Make a decision and stick with it, otherwise every single forum veteran here will crush your bad logic, just as I am. And I'm not even a forum veteran.

You've contradicted yourself in a legendary fail way, and now you're trying what?

Regarding the difference between CONTINENTS in HC surface... You are desperately trying to create an illusion that experts of Asian HC struggle on American HC and vice versa. Absolute gobbledygook. Perhaps in Asia the ball bounce is ten meters higher than in America?

UnderratedSlam · Aug 20, 2019

jackdaw said:
The point is Nadal won't even need to worry about facing Nole, some pleb will do him a favour and then he will just beat them - or some other pleb that beats pleb #1 6-1 6-0 6-0 in 52 minutes in the USO final.

I had no idea that Rafa's lucky 2017 USO win left so many tennis fans in the heavy delusion that he is heavy favourite to win USO again.

That's his only non-FO slam win since 2013. And he didn't have to beat either Novak or RF. Very rarely do we have USOs in which a player can lift the trophy without beating one or the other. We had that in 2017, but it won't happen this year or any time soon after.

UnderratedSlam · Aug 20, 2019

vex said:
You think Djoker ISN’T the clear favorite at the USO? Lol

I've tried to explain it to that user too... There is no point arguing.

You are brave to try to explain it, though. Some people are immune to facts.

Pantera · Aug 20, 2019

UnderratedSlam said:
Just a reminder:

YOU are the one who said that older results don't count, but beforehand you had made the argument that 2010-2013 USO was proof that Rafa has an edge.

So which is it? Old results or newer results? Make a decision and stick with it, otherwise every single forum veteran here will crush your bad logic, just as I am. And I'm not even a forum veteran.

You've contradicted yourself in a legendary fail way, and now you're trying what?

Regarding the difference between CONTINENTS in HC surface... You are desperately trying to create an illusion that experts of Asian HC struggle on American HC and vice versa. Absolute gobbledygook. Perhaps in Asia the ball bounce is ten meters higher than in America?

Fella, I am pointing out your utter contradictions lol...and you walked right into it. lmao.

If you are that clueless to not know the difference between North American HC and Australasian all I can do is pity you.

Pantera · Aug 20, 2019

vex said:
You think Djoker ISN’T the clear favorite at the USO? Lol

Nope...he is clear 2nd favourite. Put bluntly he lost to a guy his nemesis Nadal thrashed 3 and 0.

Pantera · Aug 20, 2019

weelie said:
Hitting 1st serves as your 2nd serves is a viable tactic. If you can hit 70% and win more than 70% of those points, you are winning around 50% (or more) of those points, which is winning a good stat for 2nd serve points. I remember some old article discussing that some players should serve two 1st serves. Anyway, if you do it all the time, you might lose the surprise element.

A loss here and there might only serve Djoker well. Medvedev on the other hand, has won too much already on this HC trek, will be taken out by some young hot gun on a good day. Nole is still very much the favorite for US Open. Nadal is the 2nd, but could well get injured etc. Federer has not played much, and has not won much, this year.

Nadal a huge favourite on current form, as others have pointed out, Djokovic is not anywhere near the form he showed in Australia.

Pantera · Aug 20, 2019

N01E said:

I always win.

UnderratedSlam · Aug 20, 2019

Pantera said:
Fella, I am pointing out your utter contradictions lol...and you walked right into it. lmao.

If you are that clueless to not know the difference between North American HC and Australasian all I can do is pity you.

I realize that you have now trapped yourself into a dead-end corner and are forced to only post non-sequiturs.

Let that be a lesson to learn, OK? Take a stand and THEN make an argument. Don't post that old results count but then change your stance mid-way on a thread into "older results don't count".

That way you can avoid having to talk around the subject, rather than face my arguments head on.

N01E · Aug 20, 2019

Pantera said:
I always win.

Of course you do.

Pantera · Aug 20, 2019

UnderratedSlam said:
I realize that you have now trapped yourself into a dead-end corner and are forced to only post non-sequiturs.

Let that be a lesson to learn, OK? Take a stand and THEN make an argument. Don't post that old results count but then change your stance mid-way on a thread into "older results don't count".

That way you can avoid having to talk around the subject, rather than face my arguments head on.

Fella, stop crying lol. You were the one who decided to go back to Beijing 2013, stop making yourself look foolish.

As you have now changed your mind, I expect an explanation as to on what basis you think Djokovic is favourite given there has been no HC meeting in North America in over 2 years.

Pantera · Aug 20, 2019

N01E said:
Of course you do.

Facts trump opinions.

tennis_pro · Aug 20, 2019

Nadal_Django said:
Rafa should be a massive massive favourite for the USO right now. Then is between Federer, Medvedev, Djokovic and Thiem.

The only massive thing about Nadal is his ***

Pantera · Aug 20, 2019

tennis_pro said:
The only massive thing about Nadal is his ***

Did his missus tell you that? You sound envious to be fair.

UnderratedSlam · Aug 20, 2019

Pantera said:
Fella, stop crying lol. You were the one who decided to go back to Beijing 2013, stop making yourself look foolish.

As you have now changed your mind, I expect an explanation as to on what basis you think Djokovic is favourite given there has been no HC meeting in North America in over 2 years.

You always expect wrong, it's your trademark.

I will merely repeat - again - that you started off saying that older results are very important, then did a 180 and argued that older results don't count.

But at least we all had a nice laugh at your suggestion that Asian and American HC are so completely different that they're almost like different surfaces, like clay and grass.

NoleFam · Aug 20, 2019

It was disappointing but damaging is a stretch. It would have been great to have the double career Masters but he already has them all had like 33 of them. The Slams are most important for him now. Medvedev played really well and it was one of those days where the opponent is hot and everything is going in. You can't expect him to go for 120 second serves and make 90% of them again consistently. At least Novak has seen that play so if he tries it in the future, it won't catch him off guard.

N01E · Aug 20, 2019

Pantera said:
Facts trump opinions.

*facts™

Lew II · Aug 20, 2019

Djokovic2011 said:
It's possibly a damaging loss in terms of who ends up as the greatest Masters champion 'cos even if Nadal ultimately finishes ahead, most people would consider Djokovic's resume superior had he completed a Double Golden Masters(hence so many Nadal fans being delighted with last night' s result) but in terms of being damaging for the upcoming US Open? Hmm, not really.

Djokovic has 5 yec and won all masters. He's the greatest outside Slams easily.

Pantera · Aug 20, 2019

UnderratedSlam said:
You always expect wrong, it's your trademark.

I will merely repeat - again - that you started off saying that older results are very important, then did a 180 and argued that older results don't count.

But at least we all had a nice laugh at your suggestion that Asian and American HC are so completely different that they're almost like different surfaces, like clay and grass.

Hahahah you think AO and UO play the same? cannot stop laughing!!!

Do older results count or not? I am leaving it open for you to decide. So cmon, make a decision lol. Don't get all upset, stand up, and make your case. This is all too easy lol.

Pantera · Aug 20, 2019

Lew II said:
Djokovic has 5 yec and won all masters. He's the greatest outside Slams easily.

No, Nadal has more Masters 1000's and Olympic Gold, that sways it to Nadal.

Lew II · Aug 20, 2019

Pantera said:
No, Nadal has more Masters 1000's and Olympic Gold, that sways it to Nadal.

Make a poll.

UnderratedSlam · Aug 20, 2019

Pantera said:
Hahahah you think AO and UO play the same? cannot stop laughing!!!

Do older results count or not? I am leaving it open for you to decide. So cmon, make a decision lol. Don't get all upset, stand up, and make your case. This is all too easy lol.

You are internet-LOLing, not reality-LOLing.

We all know what the difference between those two is...

Deleted member 744633 · Aug 20, 2019

Pantera · Aug 21, 2019

UnderratedSlam said:
You are internet-LOLing, not reality-LOLing.

We all know what the difference between those two is...

I mean what does that even mean other than you changing topic as you got owned by me posting facts.

Pantera · Aug 21, 2019

Lew II said:
Make a poll.

On a Nadal bashing website? LMAO that would be an exercising in reversing the actual result.

LETitBE · Aug 21, 2019

weelie said:
Hitting 1st serves as your 2nd serves is a viable tactic. If you can hit 70% and win more than 70% of those points, you are winning around 50% (or more) of those points, which is winning a good stat for 2nd serve points. I remember some old article discussing that some players should serve two 1st serves. Anyway, if you do it all the time, you might lose the surprise element.

A loss here and there might only serve Djoker well. Medvedev on the other hand, has won too much already on this HC trek, will be taken out by some young hot gun on a good day. Nole is still very much the favorite for US Open. Nadal is the 2nd, but could well get injured etc. Federer has not played much, and has not won much, this year.

never understood why Muzzard didnt try this

KINGROGER · Aug 21, 2019

Pantera said:
No, Nadal has more Masters 1000's and Olympic Gold, that sways it to Nadal.

The 5 YEC outranks the Olympics gold. Masters titles are a wash, since Nole has the full set and Nadal is missing Miami and Paris.

Lew II · Aug 21, 2019

Pantera said:
On a Nadal bashing website? LMAO that would be an exercising in reversing the actual result.

Fed fans hate Djokovic as much as Nadal now.

UnderratedSlam · Aug 21, 2019

Pantera said:
I mean what does that even mean other than you changing topic as you got owned by me posting facts.

The only thing you own is that huge bag of non-facts that you picked up at a garage sale for 3 pennies each.

Whoever sold you that bag, owned you.

Pantera · Aug 21, 2019

Lew II said:
Fed fans hate Djokovic as much as Nadal now.

No they don't lol, not on here anyway, Federer of course hates Djokovic a lot more than Nadal so that's quite ironic.

Pantera · Aug 21, 2019

UnderratedSlam said:
The only thing you own is that huge bag of non-facts that you picked up at a garage sale for 3 pennies each.

Whoever sold you that bag, owned you.

You dispute 24-16, or 18 majors in Federer prime compared to 7 Majors in Nadal's prime? or 2 Major difference yet 5 year age gap....which of those is not a fact lmao. I do feel sorry for you now.

UnderratedSlam · Aug 21, 2019

Pantera said:
You dispute 24-16, or 18 majors in Federer prime compared to 7 Majors in Nadal's prime? or 2 Major difference yet 5 year age gap....which of those is not a fact lmao. I do feel sorry for you now.

I have no idea what you're talking about. I now realize you've got me confused with other smart people you're arguing with here...

I guess you probably need to go back, re-read, and try to sort things out. Especially user names.

I know, it's so complicated...

Pantera · Aug 21, 2019

UnderratedSlam said:
I have no idea what you're talking about. I now realize you've got me confused with other smart people you're arguing with here...

I guess you probably need to go back, re-read, and try to sort things out. Especially user names.

I know, it's so complicated...

LOl so you actually do not know what 24-16 refers to....thanks for proving you do not actually follow tennis, got you hook line sinker...

UnderratedSlam · Aug 21, 2019

Pantera said:
LOl so you actually do not know what 24-16 refers to....thanks for proving you do not actually follow tennis, got you hook line sinker...

True, I don't follow tennis, at least not the way you "follow" it.

A fact I am quite proud of.

Pantera · Aug 21, 2019

UnderratedSlam said:
True, I don't follow tennis, at least not the way you "follow" it.

A fact I am quite proud of.

If you follow me, as it seems you do, you will know I only post facts. So 24-16 is a fact as is Nadal 3 UO's in the last decade to Federer's 0.

UnderratedSlam · Aug 21, 2019

Pantera said:
If you follow me, as it seems you do, you will know I only post facts. So 24-16 is a fact as is Nadal 3 UO's in the last decade to Federer's 0.

You mean like that thread a week ago when every single poster disagreed with you...

Er, I meant several threads.

Pantera · Aug 21, 2019

UnderratedSlam said:
You mean like that thread a week ago when every single poster disagreed with you...

Er, I meant several threads.

Only Federer fans disagree...not seen Djokovic fans have an issue, or Nadal fans, or Murray fans. Just Federer's

And as I said to Hitman, I can understand why some people put Djokovic favourite, not a problem with that, but putting Federer in the mix is obvious trolling. Titles are not won by a surname, it is current form.

UnderratedSlam · Aug 21, 2019

Pantera said:
Only Federer fans disagree...not seen Djokovic fans have an issue, or Nadal fans, or Murray fans. Just Federer's

And as I said to Hitman, I can understand why some people put Djokovic favourite, not a problem with that, but putting Federer in the mix is obvious trolling. Titles are not won by a surname, it is current form.

Federer being a favourite for USO is trolling?

What you just posted can be construed as trolling. Heavy trolling.

vex · Aug 22, 2019

Pantera said:
Nope...he is clear 2nd favourite. Put bluntly he lost to a guy his nemesis Nadal thrashed 3 and 0.

Pretty sure Vegas gonna disagree with ya there

No one is favoring Nadal. Even if Nadal played on fire and Djoker looked pretty meh throughout Djoker would be favored against Rafa in a SF/F match. Rafa has to prove it first

Deleted member 77403 · Aug 22, 2019

clayqueen said:
The reason the Masters record is not talked about a lot is because Fedfan commentators have ignored it as Fedr does not hold the record. The GOAT debate is centered around Fedr's achievements.

The masters record wasn't even mentioned when Agassi had the record at 17, while Sampras had 11...long before the world knew about the Fedalovic war that was coming. It gave Agassi no leverage over Sampras then, GOAT debate was about slams, weeks at number one long before these guys came along. Historically masters were not part of GOAT debate, so they don't mention it as much. Nadal himself once didn't know the exact number he had, that should tell you how much it really matters in the GOAT debate.

Zara · Aug 22, 2019

Writing Novak off has always been a good omen for him.

Zara · Aug 22, 2019

Hitman said:
The masters record wasn't even mentioned when Agassi had the record at 17, while Sampras had 11...long before the world knew about the Fedalovic war that was coming. It gave Agassi no leverage over Sampras then, GOAT debate was about slams, weeks at number one long before these guys came along. Historically masters were not part of GOAT debate, so they don't mention it as much. Nadal himself once didn't know the exact number he had, that should tell you how much it really matters in the GOAT debate.

That's quite accurate. In the end, it was the slam count together with year-end No. 1. Even WTF wasn't part of the discussion but Sampras thrived on it because he loved playing on carpet.

Pantera · Aug 22, 2019

vex said:
Pretty sure Vegas gonna disagree with ya there

No one is favoring Nadal. Even if Nadal played on fire and Djoker looked pretty meh throughout Djoker would be favored against Rafa in a SF/F match. Rafa has to prove it first

Nadal 2-1 djokovic uso.

Damaging loss for Djokovic

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