Yes out in front for sure, but making sure that before and after contact, the elbow does not flex. Elbow flexion only well after contact?
Feels a bit jarring to keep the arm structure constant through contact.
No.Don't bend the elbow through contact? I mean for FH.
Are you really squeezing all your arm muscles to maintain your constant structure through contact? That could be why.
Why are you arming the ball in the first place?yeah maybe. I realize you're supposed to keep a loose arm. It just seems that arming the ball while keeping the arm structure constant is much less forgiving than arming the ball with elbow flexion during contact to generate topspin.
Ok I see what you mean now. Flexing the elbow into contact is a bad thing, I agree. That means you’re using the biceps muscle to swing the racket aka arming.Sorry I think you misunderstood what I wrote. I wasn't asking about bent arm FH vs. straight arm FH. Regardless of whether you have a bent arm or straight arm FH, the point is to keep it constant through contact. And after contact has occurred, elbow flexion occurs for both bent arm and straight arm FH. For bent arm it is taking an already flexed elbow and flexing it further. The point being the additional flexion occurs well after contact for a general baseline FH shot.
My question was why does it feel jarring on the arm to keep it constant through contact, regardless of bent arm or straight arm FH. Am I doing something wrong?
Not purposely doing it, but when a ball is in front of me, it kinda happens through habit. Trying to break the habit. But sometimes hitting with constant arm through contact hurts a bit.Why are you arming the ball in the first place?
Ok I see what you mean now. Flexing the elbow into contact is a bad thing, I agree. That means you’re using the biceps muscle to swing the racket aka arming.
Jarring felt where, the elbow?Exactly, but that way usually worked not too badly. Decent consistency and power. But now when I try not to flex the elbow into contact, it's jarring to my arm. Wondering what I'm doing wrong.
Would need to see you hitting to know what is wrong with your stroke.Not purposely doing it, but when a ball is in front of me, it kinda happens through habit. Trying to break the habit. But sometimes hitting with constant arm through contact hurts a bit.
Jarring felt where, the elbow?
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My question was why does it feel jarring on the arm to keep it constant through contact, regardless of bent arm or straight arm FH. Am I doing something wrong?
Kinda in the elbow but more in the shoulder joint, like the racquet at contact is pushing the arm into the shoulder socket. Must be doing something wrong.
Among my tennis acquaintances "extension" out to and through contact means "extend the shoulder out to the hit." This adds to power, makes deceleration before contact less probable, recruits some muscles, and aids keeping the racquet head on line outward to the ball. It also helps several ways in performing ISR into the hit. How? It maximizes the lat flex and the internal shoulder rotator action. Maybe it will help with the pain bit. The feeling of extension is largely one of releasing the shoulder, because the consequent muscle action is so automatic as the shoulder goes forward.
The shoulders are kept quite square to the torso in initiating FH UB rotation, until the torso is facing, or almost, the net (adjusted for incoming ball direction), so extension comes late in the hit, just before/with ISR. Or so it seems to me...
And I always thought it means what’s happening in the first photo ie hitting out in front.Always thought this is what’s referred to as extension, second pic:
Kinda in the elbow but more in the shoulder joint, like the racquet at contact is pushing the arm into the shoulder socket. Must be doing something wrong.
Always thought this is what’s referred to as extension, second pic:
Some very complicated answers in this thread to a very simple question. Jarring in your arm can only come from being late at contact. If someone told you that you need to work on extending out to the ball to solve it, they were inferring that you need to work on your timing which for some people means making sure your arm is "extended" all the way out in front of your chest, square to the ball, at contact.
Some very complicated answers in this thread to a very simple question. Jarring in your arm can only come from being late at contact. If someone told you that you need to work on extending out to the ball to solve it, they were inferring that you need to work on your timing which for some people means making sure your arm is "extended" all the way out in front of your chest, square to the ball, at contact.
I just heard this argument, this past summer in Romania from a head coach, but it's easier said then done at the amateur level...He was using this extended arm for maaking contact in front of you as an argument how using a lighter racquet would not jarr your arm ( the arm acting like a lever against your body).
It worked from him (who thought the RF97A was too heavy), but not for me (who found again my older RF97s too light, due to jarring). My regular coach (still Romanian but living in Canada) agrees with me (at least for my choice of racquets).
The Federer skeleton video shows his forehand. The turn of his uppermost body (line between the two shoulders) can be seen followed by the "horizontal adduction (flexion)" of the shoulder joint. Use single frame "." & "," keys. These are defined joint motions and so we can look up the defined terms. (This is all very clear because the video is viewed from above so the most important sub-motions for the ground strokes are most clearly shown.)
Using the term 'extension' for the forehand certainly does not fit into the academic usage where everybody can look up the meaning of terms. This system originated over 2000 years ago and the defined terms are not ambiguous.
'Extension' is being used in a loose conversational way that is undefined and not able to describe tennis strokes.
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If someone meant that the elbow was 'extended', the elbow seems extended throughout much of Federer's forehand. That is not the case for Djokovic and probably the majority of current forehands.
The Federer skeleton video shows his forehand. The turn of his uppermost body (line between the two shoulders) can be seen followed by the "horizontal adduction (flexion)" of the shoulder joint. Use single frame "." & "," keys. These are defined joint motions and so we can look up those terms. (This is all very clear because the video is recorded from above so that the most important sub-motions for the ground strokes are most clearly shown.)
Using the term 'extension' for the forehand certainly does not fit into the academic usage where everybody can look up the meaning of terms. This system originated over 2000 years ago and the defined terms are not ambiguous.
Instead in this thread, 'Extension' is being used in a loose conversational way unrelated to useful definitions on the internet for tennis strokes.
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If someone meant that the elbow was 'extended', the elbow seems extended throughout much of Federer's forehand just the horizontal adduction (flexion) of the shoulder changed. That is not the case for Djokovic and probably the majority of current forehands.
Always thought this is what’s referred to as extension, second pic:
You should always use the racquet that produces your best ball. Your summer coach was conflating two things that don't have to do with one another, you should always be looking to extend but the weight of the racquet is not going to affect jarring, that's strictly an issue of timing. Your regular coach is correct, use what works best.
This instructor shows what he means by "full extension".
That's what I had also thought that extension was.
Happy 2020!