How much chatter about consecutive weeks in top 10 record being GOAT metric if Fed/Djoker had it instead of Rafa?

clayqueen

clayqueen

Talk Tennis Guru
octogon said:
Just curious. It's definitely a nice record passing Connors for most consecutive weeks in the top 10, and only All-Time Greats or GOAT contenders are in the top 5.

I feel like Rafa fans will celebrate it for a second then quickly move on, but my perception is that Fed and Djoker fans really like to milk these kind of records as "evidence" that their guy is GOAT.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1321141900909400064
Click to expand...
Exactly.

Like I said, is it worth killing yourself to have the most weeks at #1 when it's only going to be a statistic to be aired every now and again? I haven't seen one Rafa fan spend time arguing that Rafa is now the GOAT since he equalled Fedr's slam count.
 
O

octogon

Hall of Fame
clayqueen said:
Exactly.

Like I said, is it worth killing yourself to have the most weeks at #1 when it's only going to be a statistic to be aired every now and again? I haven't seen one Rafa fan spend time arguing that Rafa is now the GOAT since he equalled Fedr's slam count.
Click to expand...


Well slam count is the single most important GOAT metric and will sway most people's minds, but I agree most of the other stuff is just statistics.
 
NoleFam

NoleFam

Bionic Poster
All those other 4 guys have a lot more weeks at #1 though. Djokovic may have close to 100 more weeks at #1 in January himself and he isn't even in the top 5 of that list.
 
O

octogon

Hall of Fame
TheAssassin said:
Yeah, being in the top 10 and being world number 1 are achievements of the same weight...
Click to expand...

Like I said, everyone who is in the top 5 is a GOAT contender or ATG. So it definitely suggests something. You could have a long stretch at no.1 in a weak era (or even get to no.1 without winning a slam like Marcelos Rios), but never leaving the top 10 for 15 years suggests you are definitely one of the greatest players who ever lived.

There are a lot of former no.1 players who are not ATG's or anything close to it. Yet at a minimum to be in the top 5 of the consecutive weeks in top 10 list, you need to be an ATG or GOAT contender.
 
Last edited:
TheAssassin

TheAssassin

Legend
octogon said:
Like I said, everyone who is in the top 5 is a GOAT contender or ATG. So it definitely suggests something. You could have a long stretch at no.1 in a weak era, but never leaving in the top 10 for 15 years suggests you are definitely one of the greatest players who ever lived

There are a lot of former no.1 players who are not ATG's or anything close to it. Yet at a minimum to be in the top 5 of the consecutive weeks in top 10 list, you need to be an ATG or GOAT contender.
Click to expand...
So what are you saying? Being top 10 for 15 years straight is more telling than being actual number 1 for 6 years or so? :D Nadal being one of the greatest has been unquestionable long before he broke this record, which is obviously very impressive as it highlights his longevity and consistency as well.

What kind of comparison is that, the best five in one category versus all players in the other? There have been 26 guys who became number 1 at some point, obviously not everyone is an ATG. But if you look at the list of five players with most weeks at number 1 you will also see that only GOAT contenders and ATGs are there. It's actually the same five players as in the OP except Djokovic is there instead of Nadal. Extend the list of players with most consecutive weeks in top 10 to over twenty guys and you will easily find some players there who are not ATGs too.
 
Last edited:
6august

6august

Hall of Fame
Outside top 3 is not worth mentioning.

David Ferrer is my favorite, not his tennis but his character. He's nice, very nice. He's humble. He reads a lot and he smokes (like me ^^) and he stayed in top 10 for for so long but all he'd achieved during that period is 1 MS1000 and 1 Slam final.

If losing in a Slam doesn't mean much then being in top 10 means nothing. Sorry.
 
O

octogon

Hall of Fame
6august said:
Outside top 3 is not worth mentioning.

David Ferrer is my favorite, not his tennis but his character. He's nice, very nice. He's humble. He reads a lot and he smokes (like me ^^) and he stayed in top 10 for for so long but all he'd achieved during that period is 1 MS1000 and 1 Slam final.

If losing in a Slam doesn't mean much then being in top 10 means nothing. Sorry.
Click to expand...

Marcelos Rios got to no.1 without ever winning a slam. Does that devalue the no.1 ranking?

We can all find examples that makes certain achievements look worthless or not a big deal.

The simple fact that every person in the top 5 of that consecutive weeks in top 10 list is a nailed on ATG or GOAT contender has to mean something.
 
6august

6august

Hall of Fame
octogon said:
Marcelos Rios got to no.1 without ever winning a slam. Does that devalue the no.1 ranking?

We can all find examples that makes certain achievements look worthless or not a big deal.

The simple fact that every person in the top 5 of that consecutive weeks in top 10 list is a nailed on ATG or GOAT contender has to mean something.
Click to expand...

Devalue? No. He earned it by playing consistently through all the year and completely deserved it.
 
O

octogon

Hall of Fame
6august said:
Devalue? No. He earned it by playing consistently through all the year and completely deserved it.
Click to expand...

If you say so. For a lot of people, Rios being able to get the no.1 spot without winning a slam devalued the no.1 ranking. And if it happened more regularly, it would be a big PR issue for the ranking. Thankfully, it doesn't repeat itself.
 
6august

6august

Hall of Fame
octogon said:
If you say so. For a lot of people, Rios being able to get the no.1 spot without winning a slam devalued the no.1 ranking. And if it happened more regularly, it would be a big PR issue for the ranking. Thankfully, it doesn't repeat itself.
Click to expand...

"A lot of people" you mentioned must be those who have recently followed tennis and are heavily manipulated by the media. Tennis is not all about the Slams.

If Slam performance is everything then Djokovic should be the No. 1 of 2016. In fact, I see most of his fans and tennis fans frankly congratulated Andy.

I'm a Sampras fan and I'm definitely not upset about Rios being No. 1 that year.
 
O

octogon

Hall of Fame
6august said:
"A lot of people" you mentioned must be those who have recently followed tennis and are heavily manipulated by the media. Tennis is not all about the Slams.

If Slam performance is everything then Djokovic should be the No. 1 of 2016. In fact, I see most of his fans and tennis fans frankly congratulated Andy.

I'm a Sampras fan and I'm definitely not upset about Rios being No. 1 that year.
Click to expand...

A lot of people includes me, and I have been following tennis for a very long time and am not easily manipulated by anyone. I thought Rios getting no.1 was a bad look for the sport. If you didn't, congrats I guess.

So yeah, a lot of people.

Andy at least won a grand slam in becoming no.1. Not the same thing at all. If he didn't, of course many more people would think him undeserving.
 
Last edited:
TennisProExpert

TennisProExpert

Semi-Pro
Well Federer got injured so fell out of the top 10 after 6 months out.
Rafa had a French open to carry him in the rankings when he was injured.
 
6august

6august

Hall of Fame
octogon said:
A lot of people includes me, and I have been following tennis for a very long time and am not easily manipulated by anyone. I thought Rios getting no.1 was a bad look for the sport. If you didn't, congrats I guess.

So yeah, a lot of people.

Andy at least won a grand slam in becoming no.1. Not the same thing at all. If he didn't, of course many more people would think him undeserving.
Click to expand...

Okay. I guess we have different view on this matter.
 
clayqueen

clayqueen

Talk Tennis Guru
NoleFam said:
You mean consistently been in the top 10. Being at the top is being #1 and his longest consecutive weeks in that position is more than double than that of Nadal's.
Click to expand...
Djokovic has made the most of Rafa being sidelined with injury over and over and over again since 2012.
 
duaneeo

duaneeo

Legend
octogon said:
I feel like Rafa fans will celebrate it for a second then quickly move on, but my perception is that Fed and Djoker fans really like to milk these kind of records as "evidence" that their guy is GOAT.
Click to expand...

You wonderful Rafa fans. The tennis world would be an all-peaceful, celebratory community if we were all like you.
 
GabeT

GabeT

G.O.A.T.
OP has a point that fan bases tend to highlight all kinds of ”records” when it suits their fav player.

but weeks at top 10 is an indirect indicator at best. It tells us about longevity but it’s hardly a GOAT indicator.

weeks at top 10 would not mean anything if the player doesn’t also have significant weeks at 1. If Nadal were to earn another 200 weeks at top 10 but nothing more at top 1 it would do nothing to help him catch up to Novak or Fed in time at number 1 records.

it reminds me a little of the “consecutive SFs” record (23 IIRC) sometimes mentioned by Fed fans. It only makes sense to look at that if the player also won most of those slams. If not then it’s actually more of a liability than a record to be proud of. There was a time when Novak was reaching a lot of slam finals (great for consistency) but losing most of them (terrible as a GOAT argument)
 
Last edited:
Lleytonstation

Lleytonstation

Talk Tennis Guru
octogon said:
Just curious. It's definitely a nice record passing Connors for most consecutive weeks in the top 10, and only All-Time Greats or GOAT contenders are in the top 5.

I feel like Rafa fans will celebrate it for a second then quickly move on, but my perception is that Fed and Djoker fans really like to milk these kind of records as "evidence" that their guy is GOAT.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1321141900909400064
Click to expand...
It is a great achievement for many reasons and on many levels. However, Fed fans dont think his consecutive weeks at #1 (which is bigger than this) is some massive TIGER metric. Likely not even a talking point in the debate.
 
RaulRamirez

RaulRamirez

Legend
One of the most futile exercises is trying to get into the mindset of fans who purport to be - and act as - partisan single-player fans, or single-player-detractors, etc.

I don't know where this achievement ranks in mythical GOAT yammerings, but the achievement is quite impressive.
Even during his fairly long absences and (relative) slumps, Rafa's level of play and motivation never dropped off too far.

Comparing to others in individual sports (I follow golf a little), I wonder if any golfer -- Nicklaus, Woods, Mickelson, etc --was in the Top 10 for so long consecutively.
 
GoldenMasters

GoldenMasters

Semi-Pro
Even if people tried to be fans of Nadal, the VB pretty much ruins it all. These are the worst fans of a tennis player in this forum. No logic anywhere, just subjective fanboying. Exceptions exist everywhere and this post isn't directed at nice Nadal fans with common sense.
 
Xemi666

Xemi666

Professional
GoldenMasters said:
Even if people tried to be fans of Nadal, the VB pretty much ruins it all. These are the worst fans of a tennis player in this forum. No logic anywhere, just subjective fanboying. Exceptions exist everywhere and this post isn't directed at nice Nadal fans with common sense.
Click to expand...

Say the Nole fans who were 100% sure that Nole was gonna destroy Nadal at RG, 100% no excuses, nuff said.
 
RaulRamirez

RaulRamirez

Legend
InsideOut900 said:
I am baffled why this metric has been given more attention recently than the fact he just won his 20th Slam :unsure:
Click to expand...
I think that his 20th (and 13th RG title) has - and will - garner much more attention, and it is, to most, the much bigger number.
Still, it's mind-boggling that only did Rafa hit the Top 10 at age 18, but despite all the injuries, wear and tear and twists and turns, that he has been in the Top 10 continually for all this time - and with a great majority of it in the Top 2.

Somewhat ironically, Connors (another "grinder" if you will) had held the previous Top 10 (consecutive weeks) record.
 
beast of mallorca

beast of mallorca

G.O.A.T.
octogon said:
Just curious. It's definitely a nice record passing Connors for most consecutive weeks in the top 10, and only All-Time Greats or GOAT contenders are in the top 5.

I feel like Rafa fans will celebrate it for a second then quickly move on, but my perception is that Fed and Djoker fans really like to milk these kind of records as "evidence" that their guy is GOAT.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1321141900909400064
Click to expand...

The Federinas will endlessly talk about it.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

NonP
Open Era ATGs' Win %s Against Fellow Slam Champions and Career H2Hs vs. the Top 10
Replies
14
Views
703
Gizo
G
Top