I love how whenever a new up and coming player beats Federer other than Nadal...

Tennis_Maestro

Tennis_Maestro

Banned
....fans refer to how "bad" Federer played instead of how "well" that other player played.

Its as if they need to find an excuse as to why the great man lost. Why can't people ever give credit where credit is due?

Just reading the past 2-4 pages on this forum tells you everything.

"Federer sucked"

"Federer's lost the passion"

"Federer averages a poor 5 set grandslam record"

"Federer may as well have played with his laced tied"

....and if Federer loses to a player outside of a grandslam its always; ahh its a Masters Series, Federer doesn't care for those, he's pacing himself like a long distance runner.
 
U

UsualSuspect

Banned
I agree. But what is equally damn annoying is people acting like Federer played great tennis and still lost. 13 aces, 11 Double Faults, terrible serving and not to mention the fact that he was running away with the match until he started playing like a tool and let del potro back into the match :roll:. The match serves as a huge reminder that you should never take your foot of the gas even with a sizable lead.
 
U

UsualSuspect

Banned
Tennis_Maestro said:
Sorry, how was he playing like a tool?
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^^ TM, During the match when Federer was a break in the second set, Federer played some of the sloppiest tennis I have ever seen. He sliced the ball into the middle of the service box and ran up to the net only to get passed several times. He unnecessarily went for being a shotmaker rather than showing consistency and Del Potro made him eat it.
 
Court Valkyrie

Court Valkyrie

Banned
My beef is the "Is Del Potro the Greatest of All Time?" threads.
Come on folks he won one freaking grand slam event and beat in 5 sets a 7/10 Federer. If Federer would have served better and wouldn't have hit to the Delpo Forehand, we would be talking about Federer's 16th GS title.
 
Tennis_Maestro

Tennis_Maestro

Banned
UsualSuspect said:
^^ TM, During the match when Federer was a break in the second set, Federer played some of the sloppiest tennis I have ever seen. He sliced the ball into the middle of the service box and ran up to the net only to get passed several times. He unnecessarily went for being a shotmaker rather than showing consistency and Del Potro made him eat it.
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I see....

So your basically in other words suggesting Federer was attempting to showboat and impress @ a time and against an opponent he was only just out playing; rather he should've just quite simply gotten the job done in a professional manner.
 
U

UsualSuspect

Banned
Tennis_Maestro said:
I see....

So your basically in other words suggesting Federer was attempting to showboat and impress @ a time and against an opponent he was only just out playing; rather he should've just quite simply gotten the job done in a professional manner.
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Even with that, I am not saying Federer would have won. My belief is that Federer let Del Potro into the match and once Del Potro found his form, he became unstoppable. Del Potro, by the end of the 4th set, had so much confidence that he was virtually indestructible.
 
Tennis_Maestro

Tennis_Maestro

Banned
UsualSuspect said:
Even with that, I am not saying Federer would have won. My belief is that Federer let Del Potro into the match and once Del Potro found his form, he became unstoppable. Del Potro, by the end of the 4th set, had so much confidence that he was virtually indestructible.
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I see what your saying.
 
U

UsualSuspect

Banned
ArrowSmith said:
If only Fed was 24 years old, he would have thumped Del Potro!
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USO 2004 was a performance like no other. Federer's forehand was so much more lethal in those days. Federer was a faster, stronger, and more stable player back then. Not that this is relevant to the discussion.
 
Ripster

Ripster

Hall of Fame
It's mostly just *******s who are writing those responses. It's like Federer can't be beat when he's playing well but when he loses it's because he had an off-day. It's unfathomable to these people that Fed might actually have gotten outplayed.
 
Court Valkyrie

Court Valkyrie

Banned
Ripster said:
It's mostly just *******s who are writing those responses. It's like Federer can't be beat when he's playing well but when he loses it's because he had an off-day. It's unfathomable to these people that Fed might actually have gotten outplayed.
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Yes...49% First serves and 11 double faults is a great day for Fed. He was outplayed because Federer couldn't serve, and played to the Delpo forehand wayyy too much.
 
grafselesfan

grafselesfan

Banned
I am no Federer fan but I see why people would think he played poorly. His serve sucked majorly for his standards, and that was right from the start even when he was dominating the match so it wasnt due to Del Potro. He lacked focus and blew alot of the break points and other chances and got lazy mentally at key points in the 2nd and 4th sets. His timing was off, and his strategy was increasingly poor. I hate Federer and am thrilled Del Potro won and do feel Del Potro played amazingly well to beat him, especialy after the 1st set and a half. However I also can see why people would think Federer didnt play well. I dont care, I am just happy someone other than Federer won and I sort of like Del Potro too (though he isnt one of my top few favorites), but I am not going to criticize anyone who feel Federer didnt play that well this match either.

If it seems as you said that is probably not just coincidence. The reality is Federer is probably so good and the current field lacking enough in truly great players (not just very good players) that it turns out Nadal is actually the only one who can beat him when he is playing really well most of the time.
 
Ripster

Ripster

Hall of Fame
Court Valkyrie said:
Yes...49% First serves and 11 double faults is a great day for Fed. He was outplayed because Federer couldn't serve, and played to the Delpo forehand wayyy too much.
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I'm not just talking about the Del Potro match, I'm talking about pretty much every loss he's had this year.
 
DarthFed

DarthFed

Hall of Fame
Ripster said:
I'm not just talking about the Del Potro match, I'm talking about pretty much every loss he's had this year.
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Ughh i don't want to come off as a **** but a lot of his losses this year HAVE been due to horrible play....examples

Montreal Tsonga - Up 5-1 served for it like twice and couldn't get a first serve to save his life

Miami-self explanatory, even before Nole he lost a set to roddick because he got broken after being up 40-0 and should have lost to roddick anyway.

Indian Wells - Had the momentum in the 3rd...Murray trips and for some reason Federers level just dipped.

His opponents deserve credit..but if you really think Fed was at his best in some of these matches (miami in particular) then you're blind.

I fully give Del Po credit but Rog played like crap for good amount of the match but thats not DP or any other players fault is it?
 
Tennis_Maestro

Tennis_Maestro

Banned
BreakPoint said:
How long have you been playing, watching, and analyzing tennis?
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To be fair, i was on holiday and only watched the semi brief highlights.

Been playing since i was 8, reached a relatively reasonable high standard and have followed the pro circuit intensively since about 14. I am 22 now.
 
Ripster

Ripster

Hall of Fame
DarthFed said:
Ughh i don't want to come off as a **** but a lot of his losses this year HAVE been due to horrible play....examples

Montreal Tsonga - Up 5-1 served for it like twice and couldn't get a first serve to save his life

Miami-self explanatory, even before Nole he lost a set to roddick because he got broken after being up 40-0 and should have lost to roddick anyway.

Indian Wells - Had the momentum in the 3rd...Murray trips and for some reason Federers level just dipped.

His opponents deserve credit..but if you really think Fed was at his best in some of these matches (miami in particular) then you're blind.

I fully give Del Po credit but Rog played like crap for good amount of the match but thats not DP or any other players fault is it?
Click to expand...

**** ALERT!

No I'm just kidding :)

It's true he didn't play his best in those matches but I do think more credit has to be handed to his opponents. All those players you mentioned are solid top ten players so there's a reason he lost to them and not some journeymen players. Just wondering if people can come up with a match where Federer lost while playing his best (or high-level) tennis.... 2005 AO loss to Safin?
 
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West Coast Ace

West Coast Ace

G.O.A.T.
Claudius said:
Federer played relatively poorly. Del Potro played very well....end of story.
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That pretty much sums it up.

Sounds like the OP is a bitter fan of some other player... or doesn't know tennis - if you watched Fed's SF and F matches and didn't see a difference (after the 1st 5 or 6 sets) then I think I know the answer...

JMDP played well (his FH was incredible) in the last 3-4 sets and took advantage of the opportunity that was presented - and deserves credit for that. But that opportunity was created by Fed's drop in play. As others have said, look at the #'s - I'm sure Roddick wished Fed had served like that back at Wimby...
 
DarthFed

DarthFed

Hall of Fame
Fedace? ughh...why have you never been banned? i suppose you can't be banned for being annoying..
Just wondering if people can come up with a match were Federer lost while playing his best (or high-level) tennis.... 2005 AO loss to Safin?
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AO 05 definitely, and some of the FO losses...since Nadals better is better than Feds better on clay :), I'm pretty sure Nalbandian has kicked his ass regardless of level lol.

To be honest my post only refers to this year though..in which poor play, if i had to put a number, was 40% responcible for the loss.
 
BreakPoint

BreakPoint

Bionic Poster
Ripster said:
It's mostly just *******s who are writing those responses. It's like Federer can't be beat when he's playing well but when he loses it's because he had an off-day. It's unfathomable to these people that Fed might actually have gotten outplayed.
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Yes, Federer got outplayed because he was playing terrible. It's not too hard to outplay someone who can't get a 1st serve into the box and keeps hitting to your biggest weapon on purpose.
 
BreakPoint

BreakPoint

Bionic Poster
Tennis_Maestro said:
To be fair, i was on holiday and only watched the semi brief highlights.
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OK, so now the truth comes out. Why did you start this thread if you didn't even see the entire match? I've seen the entire match like over 4 times already because they keep repeating it on Tennis Channel and ESPN2.

Please refrain from analyzing what happened in the match and how it unfolded without seeing the entire match first - from the first point to the last point.
 
Tennis_Maestro

Tennis_Maestro

Banned
West Coast Ace said:
That pretty much sums it up.

Sounds like the OP is a bitter fan of some other player... or doesn't know tennis - if you watched Fed's SF and F matches and didn't see a difference (after the 1st 5 or 6 sets) then I think I know the answer...

JMDP played well (his FH was incredible) in the last 3-4 sets and took advantage of the opportunity that was presented - and deserves credit for that. But that opportunity was created by Fed's drop in play. As others have said, look at the #'s - I'm sure Roddick wished Fed had served like that back at Wimby...
Click to expand...

Sounds like your an ignorant fool that has the shallow minded cheek to make judgemental remarks about other posters simply because they aern't in agreement with yourself.

Its every posters stupidity to guess about someone being bitter or twisted about another player; sometimes there isn't a motive, you see? I'm simply pissed off with the barage of ****ty troll threads on this board made by narrow minded idiots who believe Federer is so good he can only beat himself.

Part of being a great player, is playing your best or close to your best consistently; if Federer isn't playing his best on a particular day, that means he was beaten by the better player on the day and occasion. It doesn't mean Del Potro won the tournament through forms of default.

Del Potro served huge the entire match and even Aggasi would've struggled to return those serves back.
 
DarthFed

DarthFed

Hall of Fame
Del Potro served huge the entire match and even Aggasi would've struggled to return those serves back.
Click to expand...

If you believe this then you couldn't have possibly seen the entire match.

No one is saying Del Potro won by default..have not seen the legion of fed fans praising him? including myself...god damn i ****ing hate this forum sometimes...

Fact-Del Potro outplayed Federer, in the latter stages he was outgunning him.
Fact-Federer was NOT AT HIS BEST, this is indisputable he served VERY poorly..11 double faults? from Federer? is that normal to you? And he wasted a ton of chances..had he served out the second set i think we would have had a different USO champion
 
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Tennis_Maestro

Tennis_Maestro

Banned
BreakPoint said:
OK, so now the truth comes out. Why did you start this thread if you didn't even see the entire match? I've seen the entire match like over 4 times already because they keep repeating it on Tennis Channel and ESPN2.

Please refrain from analyzing what happened in the match and how it unfolded without seeing the entire match first - from the first point to the last point.
Click to expand...

...well the highlights gave me a pretty accurate enough insight as it pretty much backed up what most people had been saying about how the "ENTIRE" match had been strung.

Also note, i never "analyzed" what happened; analyzing would've involved me going in to more detail, i simply made summaries and i think its fairly obvious to anyone with half a brain that the moment Federer loses to ANYONE, thats anyone regardless of who or how and in what circumstances there are always excuses involved.
 
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Tennis_Maestro

Tennis_Maestro

Banned
DarthFed said:
If you believe this then you couldn't have possibly seen the entire match.
Click to expand...

Watched highlights of each set and what i came to witness was a big serving, i dunno what sort of standards you expect when talking about "huge" but it was on the mark as far as i am concerned.
 
West Coast Ace

West Coast Ace

G.O.A.T.
Tennis_Maestro said:
Sounds like your an ignorant fool...I'm simply pissed off with the barage of ****ty troll threads on this board made by narrow minded idiots...
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Resorting to name calling exposes your lack of tennis knowledge.

Fed broke JMDP multiple times in the 1st set and in the 1st game of the 2nd. So your 'he served HUGE all match' is an Epic Fail.

And you didn't even debate my point about Fed's serve in the JMDP match relative to the Wimby final. Again, you obviously know when the facts don't relate with your view and choose to ignore them.

I gave JMDP some credit so I'm not quite sure why you're lashing out at me - unless your just a child... then it makes perfect sense.

PS - so by your silly logic it was all Tsonga's doing when Fed was up 5-1 in the 3rd in Montreal and lost. Too funny.
 
BreakPoint

BreakPoint

Bionic Poster
Tennis_Maestro said:
...well the highlights gave me a pretty accurate enough insight as it pretty much backed up what most people had been saying about how the "ENTIRE" match had been strung.

Also note, i never "analyzed" what happened; analyzing would've involved me going in to more detail, i simply made summaries and i think its fairly obvious to anyone with half a brain that the moment Federer loses to ANYONE, thats anyone regardless of who the situation, there is always excuses involved.
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Sorry, but highlights never tell the whole story. Just like a movie trailer does not tell the whole story of the movie and everything that happens in a movie.

If you saw the entire match from beginning to end, you would be amazed that Federer didn't win the match in straight sets and you would have seen how poorly he played and how bad his strategy was, especially on important points. I mean he was 5 for 22 on break points! He knows how to beat Del Potro. He's done it 6 times in a row. He beat him 6-3, 6-0, 6-0 just a few months ago on a hardcourt. For some reason, he decided to change his winning strategy completely and go to a losing strategy. He decided to try and slug it out with Del Potro from the baseline and hit almost everything to Del Potro's biggest weapon, his forehand. Well, you can ask Nadal how well that strategy works.
 
West Coast Ace

West Coast Ace

G.O.A.T.
BreakPoint said:
If you saw the entire match from beginning to end, you would be amazed that Federer didn't win the match in straight sets and you would have seen how poorly he played and how bad his strategy was, especially on important points. I mean he was 5 for 22 on break points! He knows how to beat Del Potro. He's done it 6 times in a row. He beat him 6-3, 6-0, 6-0 just a few months ago on a hardcourt. For some reason, he decided to change his winning strategy completely and go to a losing strategy. He decided to try and slug it out with Del Potro from the baseline and hit almost everything to Del Potro's biggest weapon, his forehand. Well, you can ask Nadal how well that strategy works.
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Great analysis. I'd add "Fed let off the gas in the 1st set - should have won it 6-1 - ended up a more respectable 6-3" - which gave Del Potro, who was already starting to get that 'I'm happy to be here and get the 2nd place check and fly back to Buenos Aires' look. And 100% right - Fed has a VERY bad habit of reverting to strictly baseline play when things get tough - and when he does venture to the net it's usually a poorly mapped out Kamakazi Run that ends up with a short approach and getting passed.

But I think we've both fed this little troll enough - I'm out of this thread.
 
Tennis_Maestro

Tennis_Maestro

Banned
West Coast Ace said:
Resorting to name calling exposes your lack of tennis knowledge.

Fed broke JMDP multiple times in the 1st set and in the 1st game of the 2nd. So your 'he served HUGE all match' is an Epic Fail.

And you didn't even debate my point about Fed's serve in the JMDP match relative to the Wimby final. Again, you obviously know when the facts don't relate with your view and choose to ignore them.

I gave JMDP some credit so I'm not quite sure why you're lashing out at me - unless your just a child... then it makes perfect sense.

PS - so by your silly logic it was all Tsonga's doing when Fed was up 5-1 in the 3rd in Montreal and lost. Too funny.
Click to expand...

Refering to someone as ignorant is name calling? Okay.

Breaking him multiple times in one set wouldn't automatically suggest he didn't serve well. Did Del Potro have to not lose serve for it to be worth credit?

The facts relate with my view very well indeed. Here's the fact, Federer didn't perform to his outstandingly best and was beaten by an in form and inspired Del Potro. My view is people are detracting from Del Potro's performance and focusing most of their attentions on what Federer did wrong.

If Federer played near his best; he'd almost never lose, thats unquestionable.

A child? Coming from a poster that resorts with using the overused, forum kiddy catch phrase saying that is "Epic Fail"? You've got to be kidding me? lol
 
Tennis_Maestro

Tennis_Maestro

Banned
West Coast Ace said:
Great analysis. I'd add "Fed let off the gas in the 1st set - should have won it 6-1 - ended up a more respectable 6-3" - which gave Del Potro, who was already starting to get that 'I'm happy to be here and get the 2nd place check and fly back to Buenos Aires' look. And 100% right - Fed has a VERY bad habit of reverting to strictly baseline play when things get tough - and when he does venture to the net it's usually a poorly mapped out Kamakazi Run that ends up with a short approach and getting passed.

But I think we've both fed this little troll enough - I'm out of this thread
Click to expand...

What a self righteous fool.
 
Tennis_Maestro

Tennis_Maestro

Banned
West Coast Ace; you missed the point of this thread completely, Federer admittedly didn't perform to how he could and should mainly as a result of a stupid transformation in tactics during the match and Del Potro took full advantage. To me thats being outplayed. Now what others are suggesting is far different from what you and BreakPoint are, some seem to believe Federer's lost his passion and desire to win @ all costs.
 
DarthFed

DarthFed

Hall of Fame
Tennis_Maestro said:
Watched highlights of each set and what i came to witness was a big serving, i dunno what sort of standards you expect when talking about "huge" but it was on the mark as far as i am concerned.
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Thats the problem...for most of the 3rd DP was spinning First serves in after the DF cost him the 3rd set...you can't use highlights for match analysis >_>
 
federerfanatic

federerfanatic

Banned
Ripster said:
I'm not just talking about the Del Potro match, I'm talking about pretty much every loss he's had this year.
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The very best players typically almost never lose a match where they play particularly well, let alone their very best. That is why they are the best players. Look at Serena Williams for another example. She is less dominant and won less than Federer, yet she probably loses even less often when she plays well. In fact Serena has probably never lost a match her whole career where she played her best, and she hasnt lost a match where she played fairly well since last years Wimbledon final with Venus. As for Federer the only matches he lost this year playing fairly well were the Australian Open final with Nadal and the loss to Wawrinka in Monte Carlo. I honestly cant think of any others at the moment.
 
Tennis_Maestro

Tennis_Maestro

Banned
federerfanatic said:
The very best players typically almost never lose a match where they play particularly well, let alone their very best. That is why they are the best players. Look at Serena Williams for another example. She is less dominant and won less than Federer, yet she probably loses even less often when she plays well. In fact Serena has probably never lost a match her whole career where she played her best, and she hasnt lost a match where she played fairly well since last years Wimbledon final with Venus. As for Federer the only matches he lost this year playing fairly well were the Australian Open final with Nadal and the loss to Wawrinka in Monte Carlo. I honestly cant think of any others at the moment.
Click to expand...

Something most people won't ever learn.
 
BreakPoint

BreakPoint

Bionic Poster
Tennis_Maestro said:
Breaking him multiple times in one set wouldn't automatically suggest he didn't serve well. Did Del Potro have to not lose serve for it to be worth credit?
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On Del Potro's first 10 serves, he only got 1 first serve in.

Federer had more than 10 break points in that 1st set alone. It could have easily been a 6-1 or 6-0 set for Federer.

As poorly as Del Potro was playing, Federer found a way to play even worse to lose the match.

Del Potro played significantly better in the semis against Nadal.
 
tlm

tlm

G.O.A.T.
It is not like delpo played some unbelievable tennis the whole match.I love how all we hear about is feds mistakes, but not much about delpos.

The first set he played like crap, the 3rd he double faults twice in a row to give the set up. Then the rest of the match he took it easy on the serve+ was mostly spinning them in. Delpo did not play anywhere near as good as he can either.

In the 5th set he played solid but nothing spectacular by any means. This is where fed played crappy, but we have seen him fall apart a lot lately in the final set of a match.
 
A

ArrowSmith

Banned
Wow... a 28 year old got beat by a 20 year old with super-fresh legs and 600 less matches under his belt. That's such a shocker in tennis!
 
Nadalfan89

Nadalfan89

Hall of Fame
*******s doing what they do best. Take solace in the fact that most of them have early bed times. The forum get's better after 10 pm.
 
U

UsualSuspect

Banned
Nadalfan89 said:
*******s doing what they do best. Take solace in the fact that most of them have early bed times. The forum get's better after 10 pm.
Click to expand...
I am sorry that watching Nadal get wrecked in straights has given you severe insomnia. Please do forgive us for having normal circadian rhythms.
 
フェデラー

フェデラー

Hall of Fame
this was far from a clean match by either player. but its hard to argue that federer didnt close it out in three sets which he easily could have. The match was moving in slo mo because of how ****ty del po played.
 
A

ArrowSmith

Banned
フェデラー said:
this was far from a clean match by either player. but its hard to argue that federer didnt close it out in three sets which he easily could have. The match was moving in slo mo because of how ****ty del po played.
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It sure wasn't in slo-mo when D-Pot was hitting 109mph forehands.
 
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