How is my NTRP affected by playing Self rated players???

S

SmoothOperator

Rookie
I don't think I've ever seen this covered so I thought I would throw it out there. In my local playoffs, 3 out of the 4 people I played ( 2 doubles matches) were self rated. So my question, how does playing self rated players affect your rating if they haven't yet played three matches?
 
OrangePower

OrangePower

Legend
It does not.

EDIT: I take it back. It does not impact your rating until such time as the self rate has a dynamic rating. But now I don't remember if they already have a dynamic rating after the first match or only after three matches.
 
B

Bedrock

Semi-Pro
There is seeding and ranking. The ranking is available only by the end of the year. I believe your question about seeding which gets updated at least once a month.

In order to become eligible for seeding enough to win one match and have completed at least three matches.

Since they did not have any records, their seeding is going to be calculated based on yours. Obviously they will get right before you :)
But as long as they do not satisfy conditions to get qualified for seeding, they will be listed in a list of ineligible players.
 
J

J_R_B

Hall of Fame
OrangePower said:
It does not.

EDIT: I take it back. It does not impact your rating until such time as the self rate has a dynamic rating. But now I don't remember if they already have a dynamic rating after the first match or only after three matches.
Click to expand...

I'm pretty sure you get a dynamic rating after just one match, but you need three to get a computer rating at the end of the year.
 
R

rainman007

Rookie
I think you get a dynamic rating after three matches.. I think the usta says your ntrp is 50 percent from your year end rating and 50 percent from your last three matches.. It is confusing though.. I think if your self rated and you only play adult or mixed if you play two matches you still get a year end rating..

The original question is a good one though.. At first I always though it didn't affect you at all if your opponent didn't have a dynamic rating the match was solely to establish what the self rates rating is.. Later I heard that self rates ratings works in reverse if you play them before they have a dynamic rating.. So, if you play a self rate locally say the 1st match and beat them and then that self rate later goes on to hammer people at sectionals then the rating is calculated in reverse and the 1st match you played moved your dynamic rating higher.. So, i'm not sure how self rates affect you either ive heard different things thats a good question..
I DO KNOW THE USTA NEEDS TO COUNT ALL MATCHES.. ITS A DOUBLE STANDARD TO ALLOW A SELF RATE TO BE DYNAMICALLY DQ'D DURING ADULT, BUT IF YOU SELF RATE DURING MIXED YOU CANNOT BE DQ'D yet YOU GET A YEAR END RATING IF YOU PLAY MIXED ONLY..
 
B

Bedrock

Semi-Pro
J_R_B said:
I'm pretty sure you get a dynamic rating after just one match, but you need three to get a computer rating at the end of the year.
Click to expand...

To get year-end ranking player must complete three tournaments (not matches) To complete a tournament player must at least start the last match played on that tournament. Three completed matches are required to become eligible for seeding :) All I'm saying related to sectional ranking and seeding lists. National ranking is a different animal.
It is all described on USTA web-site.
 
J

J_R_B

Hall of Fame
Bedrock said:
To get year-end ranking player must complete three tournaments (not matches) To complete a tournament player must at least start the last match played on that tournament. Three completed matches are required to become eligible for seeding :) All I'm saying related to sectional ranking and seeding lists. National ranking is a different animal.
It is all described on USTA web-site.
Click to expand...

The question is about your NTRP rating, not tournament rank.
 
J

J_R_B

Hall of Fame
rainman007 said:
I think you get a dynamic rating after three matches.. I think the usta says your ntrp is 50 percent from your year end rating and 50 percent from your last three matches.. It is confusing though.. I think if your self rated and you only play adult or mixed if you play two matches you still get a year end rating..

The original question is a good one though.. At first I always though it didn't affect you at all if your opponent didn't have a dynamic rating the match was solely to establish what the self rates rating is.. Later I heard that self rates ratings works in reverse if you play them before they have a dynamic rating.. So, if you play a self rate locally say the 1st match and beat them and then that self rate later goes on to hammer people at sectionals then the rating is calculated in reverse and the 1st match you played moved your dynamic rating higher.. So, i'm not sure how self rates affect you either ive heard different things thats a good question..
I DO KNOW THE USTA NEEDS TO COUNT ALL MATCHES.. ITS A DOUBLE STANDARD TO ALLOW A SELF RATE TO BE DYNAMICALLY DQ'D DURING ADULT, BUT IF YOU SELF RATE DURING MIXED YOU CANNOT BE DQ'D yet YOU GET A YEAR END RATING IF YOU PLAY MIXED ONLY..
Click to expand...

If you get an M-rating at the end of the year, you can still be DQ'd in adult the next year, though. Only B and C ratings are immune from DQ.
 
B

Bedrock

Semi-Pro
I did not say anything about tournament rank. Seeding for some reason it is called just a seeding and nothing else(not dynamic rating – check USTA web-site), is a monthly calculated "ranking".
"NTRP rating" -
1) ranking is calculated only once a year. 2) Seeding calculated every months.
Eligibility conditions I have described.

I hope I answered your question before:
“There is seeding and ranking. The ranking is available only by the end of the year. I believe your question about seeding which gets updated at least once a month.

In order to become eligible for seeding enough to win one match and have completed at least three matches.

Since they did not have any records, their seeding is going to be calculated based on yours. Obviously they will get right before you
But as long as they do not satisfy conditions to get qualified for seeding, they will be listed in a list of ineligible players.”
 
J

J_R_B

Hall of Fame
Bedrock said:
To get year-end ranking player must complete three tournaments (not matches) To complete a tournament player must at least start the last match played on that tournament. Three completed matches are required to become eligible for seeding :) All I'm saying related to sectional ranking and seeding lists. National ranking is a different animal.
It is all described on USTA web-site.
Click to expand...

Dude, whether you realize it or not, you're talking about something totally different than the OP. NTRP rating for league play has nothing to do with tournaments or sectional seeding or ranking lists.
 
J

J_R_B

Hall of Fame
Bedrock said:
Ok,
What is OP?
Click to expand...

OP is Original Poster or Original Premise, which in this case was a question about the effect of playing self-rated players on your NTRP rating for league play.

rainman007 said:
I think you get a dynamic rating after three matches.. I think the usta says your ntrp is 50 percent from your year end rating and 50 percent from your last three matches.. It is confusing though.. I think if your self rated and you only play adult or mixed if you play two matches you still get a year end rating..
Click to expand...

http://www.usta.com/Play-Tennis/USTA-League/Information/1482_Dynamic_NTRP/

According to this, you get a dynamic rating after your first match against a "player who has an NTRP computer rating". It's not 100% clear from that statement whether this means a computer-rated player (C rated or presumably B rated as well) or a player with a rating in the computer, which could also include T, M, A, and D rated players as well. I assume it means that latter, so the only match where no dynamic rating would be generated would be two self-rates both playing their first USTA match.
 
Topaz

Topaz

Legend
Bedrock said:
OP does not say anything about "league play", besides USTA-league itself.
Click to expand...

NTRP is a RATING, not a ranking. National Tennis RATING Program.

There are NTRP leagues and NTRP tournaments. Neither of which give a hoot about a ranking.

Two completely different things.
 
B

Bedrock

Semi-Pro
Topaz said:
NTRP is a RATING, not a ranking. National Tennis RATING Program.

There are NTRP leagues and NTRP tournaments. Neither of which give a hoot about a ranking.

Two completely different things.
Click to expand...

How about NTRP 5.0 year-end ranking :)
 
A

amarone

Semi-Pro
SmoothOperator said:
I don't think I've ever seen this covered so I thought I would throw it out there. In my local playoffs, 3 out of the 4 people I played ( 2 doubles matches) were self rated. So my question, how does playing self rated players affect your rating if they haven't yet played three matches?
Click to expand...
A self-rated player needs to have played at least two matches before your result against him/her affects your own rating.
 
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