Lambsscroll
Hall of Fame
Your not thinking about your strings because you ruled out polys. So at one point you were forced to think about your strings due to the poly string.
Mikeler's Multis
- Thread starter mikeler
- Start date
Your not thinking about your strings because you ruled out polys. So at one point you were forced to think about your strings due to the poly string.
JT_2eighty
Hall of Fame
Yea, for the majority of my tennis playing life, just used gamma syn gut: cheap, playable, better than tourney nylon.
Then when I decided to try gut, I was hooked. Since then, been rollercoaster riding every string out there; last year settled on gut/rip, and played it for almost a year. Yesterday replaced rip with bhb poly, and I think I'm good again, heh. Great feel, control, spin... no arm pain. That's all I need.
I can live vicariously through playtest reviews for the remainder, so don't stop testing mikeler! :mrgreen:
Then when I decided to try gut, I was hooked. Since then, been rollercoaster riding every string out there; last year settled on gut/rip, and played it for almost a year. Yesterday replaced rip with bhb poly, and I think I'm good again, heh. Great feel, control, spin... no arm pain. That's all I need.
I can live vicariously through playtest reviews for the remainder, so don't stop testing mikeler! :mrgreen:
Jeepers
Professional
Have any of you guys tried Bow Brand strings? i have heard of their gut before, but wasnt really aware of their other strings, but i found they have quite a few strings, most noteably superspin,
Control and spin
Composition
Monofilament polyamide co-polymer core wrapped with strong monofilaments. Coated
and its only £3
Control and spin
Composition
Monofilament polyamide co-polymer core wrapped with strong monofilaments. Coated
and its only £3
mikeler
Moderator
As I posted in your thread, it is all subjective. Different balls, court surfaces, temperature, racket weight, racket flex, string pattern, style of play, opponents style of play, string tension, stringing machine type etc. are all variables that no two players could possibly replicate exactly.
Not sure of your level, but I'm a 4.5 who can hit every shot in the book. When I used the TW Solinco Playtest multi I stunk up the court. I lost 3 sets in a row 6-1 to guys that I'm competitive with. When I play with the strings listed in the middle of my list, I did not have the same confidence to go for my shots like I do with say the top 7 strings on my list. So for me, I've found that there are 3 tiers of multis. About half of them I'll play well with. Then maybe a quarter I'll play below average and then a few where I just can't play my game at all.
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mikeler
Moderator
Yea, for the majority of my tennis playing life, just used gamma syn gut: cheap, playable, better than tourney nylon.
Then when I decided to try gut, I was hooked. Since then, been rollercoaster riding every string out there; last year settled on gut/rip, and played it for almost a year. Yesterday replaced rip with bhb poly, and I think I'm good again, heh. Great feel, control, spin... no arm pain. That's all I need.
I may take a break after these last few strings unless I decide to try some soft polys.
JT_2eighty
Hall of Fame
a break?!?! Noooooooo
Ok, it's cool.
And in reference to the TW test multi... same here, lost to a guy in my league that I typically own every time we play, also 4.5. Sure, he was playing well, but man that was a bad day to use that dull string, meh.
rodrigoamaral
Hall of Fame
have you ever considered hybriding some of the soft polys with a multi?
mikeler
Moderator
That is where I may be heading next. I've been following your string reviews on polys.
rodrigoamaral
Hall of Fame
You should definately consider it to maybe get the best of 2 worlds..
mikeler
Moderator
rodrigoamaral
Hall of Fame
Without a doubt, Poly Star Energy, Polyfibre TCS are very soft polys.. When I played with the TCS, I thought it was a syn gut as it was just so soft.. these are definately 2 of the softest polys out there..
JT_2eighty
Hall of Fame
Nice, which holds tension better? Durability?
rodrigoamaral
Hall of Fame
rodrigoamaral
Hall of Fame
I think hexablade is TCS but hexagonal
nope.. it plays nothing like tcs..
Jeepers
Professional
Oh really? soz lol i cant really comment as i havent played TCS XD
although i have read a few reviews that say it does
JackB1
G.O.A.T.
Just get NXT Control. It feels like a multi and controls like a poly. It's an "internal" hybrid.
Other than that, a copoly/multi hybrid would be OK. I currently have PL2 w/ Mantis CS and it feels pretty soft. MCS is a great cross to use for a hybrid.
TCS is VERY soft but it also has the worst tension maintenance. WC Silverstring or Scorpion are good soft choices, as is SPPP.
I used Bow brand gut for a few years until they stopped making it. I just saw they are making it available again. I thought it was a nice playing gut string. I used the Professional model one they had. I also tried the Classic as well. Their gut was about $10 cheaper than the rest of the guts at one time. Actually TW carried Bow brand gut strings some years back before they stopped making tennis strings. I figured since they make professional music strings their gut for tennis should be pretty good. I was right, it was great strings. I never had an issue with their gut. It was quality through and through. If it is available to you try it. You won't be disappointed.
Jeepers
Professional
Ah interesting thanks
unfortunately im in the UK so dont really have the climate to make gut worth the cost lol but looking at the prices of their other strings i might give them a go
mikeler
Moderator
OK, I think you have convinced me to try this string next. I like Tecnifibre DuraMix so hopefully it plays like that string.
Had a 30min hit with PLII 1.20 and MCS 1.30 at 50/53lbs.
Wasn't quite what I was hoping for. The stringbed feels ever so slightly boardy. Doesn't quite feel as if the poly is quite 'biting' the ball enough or that there's much 'give' in the stringbed.
Does MCS have some sort of break in period? Maybe the strings are locked in too tightly (95 18x20), and need to bed in a bit? I've had this before with certain string combinations. Doesn't feel as a nice as when Xcel 1.25 is being used as cross.
Will have another hit tomorrow to try and get the stringbed to loosen up a bit.
Wasn't quite what I was hoping for. The stringbed feels ever so slightly boardy. Doesn't quite feel as if the poly is quite 'biting' the ball enough or that there's much 'give' in the stringbed.
Does MCS have some sort of break in period? Maybe the strings are locked in too tightly (95 18x20), and need to bed in a bit? I've had this before with certain string combinations. Doesn't feel as a nice as when Xcel 1.25 is being used as cross.
Will have another hit tomorrow to try and get the stringbed to loosen up a bit.
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JackB1
G.O.A.T.
I am testing the same hybrid, but mine was strung a couple lbs higher. I am also
undecided about this combo. Feels soft enough, but it does feel a little "boardy" to me as well. Pretty low powered as well...maybe too much so, but I never judge a new setup until the 2nd hit at least. You need to hit with again after the intitial tension drop. Torres...how was the power level of your setup and what is your racquet? You should have more pop than mine with the lower tension.
Even levels are subjective. I play USTA 4.0, but I've played with 4.5s that I was better than, and I've played with 3.5s that were mighty tough.
Without trying to sound like a jerk, I would go so far as to say if changing one's strings causes playing level to change (like, to the point where that person is losing to someone he'd normally beat) then he's nowhere near the level he thinks he is.
I'm not talking about you specifically though, mikeler. You may very well be a top-notch player. No doubt probably better than me.
But I stand firm. Someone who can kick my butt is going to do it with any racquet, any strings. They just don't make anywhere near the difference that most people think they do.
It's about 2% racquet and strings, and the other 98% is the person controlling them.
That's what I believe, even though it's not a popular opinion.
Lambsscroll
Hall of Fame
All Mikeler is doing is sharing characteristics of each multi so the reader can make a better choice as to which multi may suit their needs. No where is Mike sharing information on the mental side of tennis. I think you misunderstand what this thread is all about.
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JackB1
G.O.A.T.
^^^^ I agree.
Mikeler is just testing for testing purposes and reviews. He's not advocating changing strings all the time as a good idea. But everyone has a unique style and each will have a string that works best for their racquet, style, power, skill level, climate, etc. Why not optimize that choice? You can slap any round tires on your car and it will get you there. But why not pick the best for that car, weather, road conditions and your budget? Same thing.
Hey, I got no problem with his thread at all, and in another point in the thread you will see where I said "I value and appreciate this input."
Forums are all about sharing opinions and information, and I think you guys are actually misunderstanding me. I'm not out to make enemies or irritate anyone. Mikeler created a valuable thread to share his personal opinions and I enjoy reading it and offering my own opinions.
I realize not everyone's going to have the same experience as me, and I don't see any issue with that. You're more than welcome to disagree with my findings and I'm not the least bit insulted or put off by that.
The information presented in this thread is subjective and I don't think anyone is arguing that point. And as it is subjective, on occasion, where I feel it is relevant, I offer my own subjective view.
That's all really. There's no hard feels here at all. At least not on my end.
mikeler
Moderator
Some players are not sensitive to their gear. I'm not much of a racket guy. I feel like I can play well with almost any player's racket. I don't find the same to be true with strings.
As for NTRP, I've played enough leagues and tournaments to know where I rank.
I played with Babolat Xcel today and it was Xcellent. I will post a full review later. Just strung up Prince Premiere LT. More on that later too.
As for NTRP, I've played enough leagues and tournaments to know where I rank.
I played with Babolat Xcel today and it was Xcellent. I will post a full review later. Just strung up Prince Premiere LT. More on that later too.
And see, I'm looking forward to hearing this review. So to the folks that may have thought I was trying to be disagreeable or something, please know that I'm not. I enjoy this thread. I enjoy the reviews. If I didn't think Mikeler had good information to offer, I wouldn't be here commenting (even if my comments don't always agree w/ the masses).
mikeler
Moderator
Get your Quasi Gut (or is it Maxim Touch?) loving self out of here! I am kidding of course.
Just curious, are you more of a flat hitter?
Get your Quasi Gut (or is it Maxim Touch?) loving self out of here! I am kidding of course.
Just curious, are you more of a flat hitter?
Yes, I would say I do tend to hit a bit flatter than maybe the typical 30-something club player. Interestingly, in high school, I used to play with just whatever synthetic gut, usually strung at the max or near the max of my racquet. I just did what the coaches/instructors told me to do, which was to string tight(ish) and go for about 2 to 3 feet net clearance.
I wasn't until I found the TT forums (and switched to the Fischer Pro One) that I found people stringing on the low side. Ever since then (and with the Fischer in particular), I've been stringing in the low 50s, and sometimes even down in the high 40s (with multis or zyex strings) and haven't ever really looked back.
Also interesting is that my shift to the Fischer/flexy racquet and low tensions has shifted my game a bit to hit a little flatter. Much less net clearance now. And perhaps consistency does suffer a bit. But I'm just a recreational player and what is fun to me is to hit flatter and to get that ball pocketing feeling.
It's a little hard to explain b/c I'm not 100% certain I mean the same as others when I talk about ball pocketing. If you've ever been just practicing with a hitting partner and a flat or semi-flat ball made its into one of your rallies, and you happened to just crush that flat ball right on the sweet spot of your string bed.... I LOVE that feeling. But of course, I want that feeling with a lively ball, not a flat one. Still, it's that sensation of the ball, sort of deforming or lingering while I'm hitting it that I really like. And for a reason that I cannot really articulate either.
Other friends who've hit with my racquet/setup often hate it immediately and describe it as "so muted."
Shrug... I dunno, it's just what I like.
I'm about to try Alpha Gut 18, strung at 53/50. After that I will give Mantis Comfort a go.
mikeler
Moderator
That's cool. My problem is when the text gets too long, sometimes it won't let me scroll down to the bottom of the post.
It does indeed, and actually it also helps explain in general why my preferences don't really follow what most people are after these days -- the modern game seems pretty significantly geared towards heavy topspin.
But it's all good. I love the TT forums b/c I can learn about and read about all these variations. And even though my comments might make me sound like I'm stubborn, I do consider everything I read and often do try new things from time to time.
mikeler
Moderator
Xcel is Xcellent!
OK, here is my review in the TW format of the Babolat Xcel Premium 16.
Strung up the Babolat Xcel a few nights ago. I love the packaging because it does not have any ties to cut off and it uncoiled perfectly. It looks like a CD case. Anyways, the string was noticeably soft and was right up there with Mantis Comfort for ease of stringing. I did get 1 minor kink with it but it was nothing. The string seemed to have a coating of something that only helped with weaving the crosses. I did the old ball bounce test and it feels soft yet crisp. I think I'm going to really enjoy hitting with it but only time will tell.
Tension it is strung: 60 pounds on a lockout machine full bed
Your regular string set up: Mantis Comfort Synthetic 60 pounds full bed
String pattern of your racquet: 16 x 20
Power (or lack there of): Low/Medium powered multi
Feel: Good feel not great
Tension maintenance: Seemed to hold all 12 hours
Price: $17.95/set
Overall comments and feedback: See below
General: I could tell on the first few hits that I was going to like this. The string is smooth but still provides pretty good spin for a multi. I loved this string for everything but came up short on several drop shots which is the only minor negative.
Serve/Return of Serve: First serve is at 90% due to a shoulder injury. Still I had 2 or 3 aces due to accuracy. When I went for my returns this string was great. Chip returns were pretty good too.
Strokes: Lots of spin on both wings. Depth control was good. This string felt like MultiFeel for spin which is just below RIP/Hexy Fiber for spin potential. When I wanted to blast forehands, I felt like I could without having to worry about the trampoline effect. In fact, my first outing with this string my forehand was a beast. When I can pull opponents off the court with short cross court forehands, they are usually in trouble that day. I did this often. My inside out forehand was great too. My slice backhand is lethal with this string. The topspin 1 hander was pretty good with it too.
Volleys: It's very good for volleys just like RIP. Volleys felt very solid when I tried to punch them. I did not get the opportunity yet to attempt a drop volley.
Touch shots: I started out with a few good drop shots and then I could not find the mark after that. I hit about 5 in a row that hit the net and did not go over. Maybe I just need a little more time to adjust to this string.
Softness: The string feels about as soft as the Mantis Comfort. Yet another string that does not correlate with the RSI stiffness rating. I think it feels softer than Maxim Touch 17.
Tension: Perfect for my game.
Durability: Because the strings don't move that much, I think notching in the same place could be a problem. It would not surprise me if I only get another 3 hours out of the string. Lo and behold, I cut this string out after about 12 hours when the crosses were hanging on by a thread.
Movement: String movement was very little. KCraig would approve.
Conclusion: This is an excellent string that deserves a premium title. I think I like it slightly better than the Mantis but not quite as much as MultiFeel. I will rated it higher than MultiFeel just because of the bad durability of MF. Too bad it is so expensive because I'm sure more people would buy it if the price were right.
OK, here is my review in the TW format of the Babolat Xcel Premium 16.
Strung up the Babolat Xcel a few nights ago. I love the packaging because it does not have any ties to cut off and it uncoiled perfectly. It looks like a CD case. Anyways, the string was noticeably soft and was right up there with Mantis Comfort for ease of stringing. I did get 1 minor kink with it but it was nothing. The string seemed to have a coating of something that only helped with weaving the crosses. I did the old ball bounce test and it feels soft yet crisp. I think I'm going to really enjoy hitting with it but only time will tell.
Tension it is strung: 60 pounds on a lockout machine full bed
Your regular string set up: Mantis Comfort Synthetic 60 pounds full bed
String pattern of your racquet: 16 x 20
Power (or lack there of): Low/Medium powered multi
Feel: Good feel not great
Tension maintenance: Seemed to hold all 12 hours
Price: $17.95/set
Overall comments and feedback: See below
General: I could tell on the first few hits that I was going to like this. The string is smooth but still provides pretty good spin for a multi. I loved this string for everything but came up short on several drop shots which is the only minor negative.
Serve/Return of Serve: First serve is at 90% due to a shoulder injury. Still I had 2 or 3 aces due to accuracy. When I went for my returns this string was great. Chip returns were pretty good too.
Strokes: Lots of spin on both wings. Depth control was good. This string felt like MultiFeel for spin which is just below RIP/Hexy Fiber for spin potential. When I wanted to blast forehands, I felt like I could without having to worry about the trampoline effect. In fact, my first outing with this string my forehand was a beast. When I can pull opponents off the court with short cross court forehands, they are usually in trouble that day. I did this often. My inside out forehand was great too. My slice backhand is lethal with this string. The topspin 1 hander was pretty good with it too.
Volleys: It's very good for volleys just like RIP. Volleys felt very solid when I tried to punch them. I did not get the opportunity yet to attempt a drop volley.
Touch shots: I started out with a few good drop shots and then I could not find the mark after that. I hit about 5 in a row that hit the net and did not go over. Maybe I just need a little more time to adjust to this string.
Softness: The string feels about as soft as the Mantis Comfort. Yet another string that does not correlate with the RSI stiffness rating. I think it feels softer than Maxim Touch 17.
Tension: Perfect for my game.
Durability: Because the strings don't move that much, I think notching in the same place could be a problem. It would not surprise me if I only get another 3 hours out of the string. Lo and behold, I cut this string out after about 12 hours when the crosses were hanging on by a thread.
Movement: String movement was very little. KCraig would approve.
Conclusion: This is an excellent string that deserves a premium title. I think I like it slightly better than the Mantis but not quite as much as MultiFeel. I will rated it higher than MultiFeel just because of the bad durability of MF. Too bad it is so expensive because I'm sure more people would buy it if the price were right.
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mikeler
Moderator
Strung up the Prince Premiere LT 16 today. It felt softer than the RSI stiffness ratings would indicate. It was very easy to string except for a few times when I got minor friction burn on the crosses. I gave it Ye Olde Ball Bounce test and it felt a lot like NRG2. I'll give it a go tomorrow and report back. Goodnight everyone and thanks for following along.
Great review and information as always. The pricepoint of $18 is a bit steep for a multi seeing that you and most will only get about 8-12hrs max out of any multi--just a little pricey. Hell for that price you can get a 1/2 set of Pacific Tough Gut and just cross with a cheaper syn gut for right at $20 or even cheaper!! I think $14-15 is about my "tipping" point for a multi or any "nongut" combo string.
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I agree with Kcraig. There has to be a tipping point for a good string combination/ playing time for it to be worthwhile. $18 for 8 hours of play isn't a very good return for the money. IMO. That doesn't include if you have to pay for someone to string it for you either.
parasailing
Legend
Multis in general don't last very long. I think about 8 to 12 hours is pretty much what you will get for most people who hit with spin. Although adding string savers will extend the life for at least 25% more, they add 1 to 2 lbs of tension to the stringbed.
mikeler
Moderator
I agree. Had these strings not been a birthday present I probably would never have used them due to the high cost.
mikeler
Moderator
OK, here is my review in the TW format of the Prince Premiere LT 16.
Strung up the Prince Premiere LT 16 yesterday. It felt softer than the RSI stiffness ratings would indicate. It was very easy to string except for a few times when I got minor friction burn on the crosses. I gave it the ball bounce test and it felt a lot like NRG2. It uncoiled very easily out of the package.
Tension it is strung: 60 pounds on a lockout machine full bed
Your regular string set up: Mantis Comfort Synthetic 60 pounds full bed
String pattern of your racquet: 16 x 20
Power (or lack there of): Low/Medium powered multi
Feel: Good feel not great
Tension maintenance: Seemed to hold the first 2 hours
Price: $16.00/set
Overall comments and feedback: See below
General: I could tell on the first few hits that this string had some very nice spin potential. The string has a slight roughness to it which probably helps with spin generation. I loved this string for most shots just wish it felt a little softer.
Serve/Return of Serve: First serve is at 90% due to a shoulder injury. I felt like I could put the serve pretty close to where I aimed. Returns were OK with this string. My opponent had a good serving day so that may have had something to do with it. I missed more than usual just several inches past the baseline. Perhaps further play with this setup will straighten that out.
Strokes: Lots of spin on both wings. Depth control was good. This string felt like RIP/Hexy Fiber for spin potential. My forehand was very good with this string. When I can pull opponents off the court with short cross court forehands, they are usually in trouble that day. I did this often. My inside out forehand was great too. I really liked this string on low forehands. Felt like I could pop a winner at any time. My slice backhand and topspin backhand were solid, but nothing special.
Volleys: It's very good for volleys but I thought Xcel was a little better in that department. Volleys felt very solid when I tried to punch them. Low volleys were somewhat tough with this string, not sure why.
Touch shots: I hit a few bad drop shots at first but then started finding my mark later on and was quite happy with the touch.
Softness: The string feels like a medium softness multi. It felt better after playing for an hour than it did initially so it has a little bit of a break-in period.
Tension: Perfect for my game.
Durability: The strings look pretty good after 2 sets of play. Hopefully they'll give me some decent life. I ended up cutting this out after about 8 hours of play.
Movement: String movement was average for a multi meaning it moves a lot.
Conclusion: This is an excellent string that deserves a premium title. I think I like it slightly better than the Mantis but not quite as much as MultiFeel or Xcel. Too bad it is so expensive because I'm sure more people would buy it if the price were right. I would also prefer it to be just a tad softer. I cut this string out, it performed better fresh than after a few hours.
Strung up the Prince Premiere LT 16 yesterday. It felt softer than the RSI stiffness ratings would indicate. It was very easy to string except for a few times when I got minor friction burn on the crosses. I gave it the ball bounce test and it felt a lot like NRG2. It uncoiled very easily out of the package.
Tension it is strung: 60 pounds on a lockout machine full bed
Your regular string set up: Mantis Comfort Synthetic 60 pounds full bed
String pattern of your racquet: 16 x 20
Power (or lack there of): Low/Medium powered multi
Feel: Good feel not great
Tension maintenance: Seemed to hold the first 2 hours
Price: $16.00/set
Overall comments and feedback: See below
General: I could tell on the first few hits that this string had some very nice spin potential. The string has a slight roughness to it which probably helps with spin generation. I loved this string for most shots just wish it felt a little softer.
Serve/Return of Serve: First serve is at 90% due to a shoulder injury. I felt like I could put the serve pretty close to where I aimed. Returns were OK with this string. My opponent had a good serving day so that may have had something to do with it. I missed more than usual just several inches past the baseline. Perhaps further play with this setup will straighten that out.
Strokes: Lots of spin on both wings. Depth control was good. This string felt like RIP/Hexy Fiber for spin potential. My forehand was very good with this string. When I can pull opponents off the court with short cross court forehands, they are usually in trouble that day. I did this often. My inside out forehand was great too. I really liked this string on low forehands. Felt like I could pop a winner at any time. My slice backhand and topspin backhand were solid, but nothing special.
Volleys: It's very good for volleys but I thought Xcel was a little better in that department. Volleys felt very solid when I tried to punch them. Low volleys were somewhat tough with this string, not sure why.
Touch shots: I hit a few bad drop shots at first but then started finding my mark later on and was quite happy with the touch.
Softness: The string feels like a medium softness multi. It felt better after playing for an hour than it did initially so it has a little bit of a break-in period.
Tension: Perfect for my game.
Durability: The strings look pretty good after 2 sets of play. Hopefully they'll give me some decent life. I ended up cutting this out after about 8 hours of play.
Movement: String movement was average for a multi meaning it moves a lot.
Conclusion: This is an excellent string that deserves a premium title. I think I like it slightly better than the Mantis but not quite as much as MultiFeel or Xcel. Too bad it is so expensive because I'm sure more people would buy it if the price were right. I would also prefer it to be just a tad softer. I cut this string out, it performed better fresh than after a few hours.
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Good to see such positive reviews of Babolat Xcel and Prince Premier LT - they're both excellent multi-filaments.
I don't know if you're planning to use these strings in the long term, but if you are, you may want to consider:-
- experiment with pre-stretching. I find that this results in more gentle and predictable tension loss, as well as reducing some of the power / liveliness. Depends on what suits your game.
- thinner gauges. I prefer Xcel 1.25mm and LT 1.25mm (the latter also comes in an incredibly thin, probably incredibly delicate, 1.20mm gauge) as I play 18x20 95.
Maybe something for the future, but I would be interesting in hearing how your comments change when testing the higher rated strings on your list over a longer period of time ie 10,15,20 hours plus. Presumably you tested them over a couple of hours or so, which is fine, but I for one, am not going to be cutting out an $18 string after two hours - I'm going to be squeezing every dollar out of it!
I don't know if you're planning to use these strings in the long term, but if you are, you may want to consider:-
- experiment with pre-stretching. I find that this results in more gentle and predictable tension loss, as well as reducing some of the power / liveliness. Depends on what suits your game.
- thinner gauges. I prefer Xcel 1.25mm and LT 1.25mm (the latter also comes in an incredibly thin, probably incredibly delicate, 1.20mm gauge) as I play 18x20 95.
Maybe something for the future, but I would be interesting in hearing how your comments change when testing the higher rated strings on your list over a longer period of time ie 10,15,20 hours plus. Presumably you tested them over a couple of hours or so, which is fine, but I for one, am not going to be cutting out an $18 string after two hours - I'm going to be squeezing every dollar out of it!
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mikeler
Moderator
^^^ I will not be cutting out any strings of my current three. I don't plan on using any of the premium strings again. They were a great birthday gift and I'm glad I got to use them once. My current plan is to try Black Widow after I test out my next 4 multis. Depending how that goes, I may test 1 more round of 6 to 8 more multis.
