The Tsonga we knew in 2008

jamesblakefan#1

jamesblakefan#1

G.O.A.T.
It was the best match of his career. It's hard to expect any player to play that high of a level on a consistent basis... If he played like THAT every match, he would be #1 in the world, lol.

hoping he does get back to top 10 level though.
 
Tsonga#1fan

Tsonga#1fan

Semi-Pro
I think Tsonga needs to stay healthy for a more extended period of time or he'll just be another James Blake.....flashes of brilliance but bad losses thrown into the mix.
 
cc0509

cc0509

Talk Tennis Guru
Uhhh, no! He does not have it in him to be that consistent. If he did he would have displayed it by now.
 
kishnabe

kishnabe

Talk Tennis Guru
That day...people though Tsonga had made his mark in tennis and will continue....but that mark died after paris 2008.
 
tacou

tacou

G.O.A.T.
tsonga's 08 was very injury ridden and he still finished top 10. he hasn't had too many consecutive months of play since then . admittedly he hasnt come very close to that level, and I don't expect him to get there again,I can definitely see him reaching top 5 if he can play 2 seasons straight
 
zak425

zak425

Semi-Pro
After watching that video it harkens my memory back to when I though of him as a contender. But to be honest (BTW I am a Fed Guy) it looked like Rafa was having a bad night, a lot of his shots seemed to be falling short allowing Tsonga to dictate play.
 
R

Ray Mercer

Hall of Fame
Nadal was beaten down big time on that night. The only other guy I've seen thrash Nadal at his best like that was Del Potro.
 
namelessone

namelessone

Legend
zak425 said:
After watching that video it harkens my memory back to when I though of him as a contender. But to be honest (BTW I am a Fed Guy) it looked like Rafa was having a bad night, a lot of his shots seemed to be falling short allowing Tsonga to dictate play.
Click to expand...

The downside of topspin. If you have a good night it can be hell for your opponent as he will be digging up deep shots that rise up quick but if you hit short you are offering up sitters, especially on HC.

People really hyped up Jo's level here. Nadal was in his first HC GS semifinal(so lol at people saying Nadal was at his best :oops: ) and did not have a great day. Don't get me wrong, this is still the best tourney jo has ever played but he has been owned by Nadal(and many other players) ever since, even on HC.

Another thing I felt people have always hyped up is the quality of jo's volleys in this match. Nadal is literally 2-3 metres behind the baseline most of the time and jo is doing a lot of drop volleys with little pressure on his shoulders as his opponent is very far from the net.

I still feel that Tsonga has a shot to be in the top 10, maybe even further, but I don't get a "serious" vibe from him. He seems to be another french talent gone to waste.
 
D

Deleted member 21996

Guest
Xemi666 said:
Yes, it was almost as bad as Nadal trashing Federer at his best 6-1 6-3 6-0
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great stuff there. :rolleyes:

now why did you bring Federer in a thread about Tsonga? insecure much? acute Arsenadalitis?
 
V

vllaznia

Semi-Pro
namelessone said:
People really hyped up Jo's level here. Nadal was in his first HC GS semifinal(so lol at people saying Nadal was at his best :oops: ) and did not have a great day.

QUOTE]

Also for Tsonga was the first HC GS semifinal and Rafa did not lose a set until the semifinal, we all know how good was Rafa's 2008 if he was not at his best he was near it.
Click to expand...
 
jamesblakefan#1

jamesblakefan#1

G.O.A.T.
vllaznia said:
Also for Tsonga was the first HC GS semifinal and Rafa did not lose a set until the semifinal, we all know how good was Rafa's 2008 if he was not at his best he was near it.
Click to expand...

Yeah, Nadal was favored by all commentators to get through to the finals and face Djokovic, Tsonga just played out of his mind. Nadal didn't play terribly by any means, Tsonga just was unbeatable that night.
 
eidolonshinobi

eidolonshinobi

Professional
jamesblakefan#1 said:
Yeah, Nadal was favored by all commentators to get through to the finals and face Djokovic, Tsonga just played out of his mind. Nadal didn't play terribly by any means, Tsonga just was unbeatable that night.
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He really looked like Ali out there, just floated on the court and stung like a bee
 
namelessone

namelessone

Legend
vllaznia said:
namelessone said:
People really hyped up Jo's level here. Nadal was in his first HC GS semifinal(so lol at people saying Nadal was at his best :oops: ) and did not have a great day.

QUOTE]

Also for Tsonga was the first HC GS semifinal and Rafa did not lose a set until the semifinal, we all know how good was Rafa's 2008 if he was not at his best he was near it.
Click to expand...

You're missing the point. That was Tsonga's HC peak(never played anywhere as good since then) while Nadal wasn't exactly kicking it on HC in the beginning of 2008. To me Nadal's HC peak came at AO 2009 with USO 2010 coming in a close second.
Click to expand...
 
RCizzle65

RCizzle65

Hall of Fame
I don't think he has the fitness or the desire to be that consistent, at least he hasn't shown it for the past couple years that he wants it.
 
RCizzle65

RCizzle65

Hall of Fame
namelessone said:
Nadal was in his first HC GS semifinal(so lol at people saying Nadal was at his best :oops: ) and did not have a great day. Don't get me wrong, this is still the best tourney jo has ever played but he has been owned by Nadal(and many other players) ever since, even on HC.
Click to expand...

He didn't lose a set until he faced Tsonga. Yeah he's obviously much better and aggressive on the hard courts now, but he wasn't exactly a slouch either.
 
V

vllaznia

Semi-Pro
namelessone said:
You're missing the point. That was Tsonga's HC peak(never played anywhere as good since then) while Nadal wasn't exactly kicking it on HC in the beginning of 2008. To me Nadal's HC peak came at AO 2009 with USO 2010 coming in a close second.
Click to expand...

So according to you Nadal never loses when he is at his best or near it.
 
namelessone

namelessone

Legend
vllaznia said:
So according to you Nadal never loses when he is at his best or near it.
Click to expand...

No, I am talking about playing level or form. Nadal of 2008 on HC doesn't come close to 2009 or 2010 Nadal.

Tsonga was at his very peak(and sadly probably only peak) and Nadal was just starting to make headway into HC slams. He made his first USO semi that year. Now losing before semis in any slam is a failure for Rafa. Back then a HC GS semi was a nice bonus.
 
Ripster

Ripster

Hall of Fame
namelessone said:
The downside of topspin. If you have a good night it can be hell for your opponent as he will be digging up deep shots that rise up quick but if you hit short you are offering up sitters, especially on HC.

People really hyped up Jo's level here. Nadal was in his first HC GS semifinal(so lol at people saying Nadal was at his best :oops: ) and did not have a great day. Don't get me wrong, this is still the best tourney jo has ever played but he has been owned by Nadal(and many other players) ever since, even on HC.

Another thing I felt people have always hyped up is the quality of jo's volleys in this match. Nadal is literally 2-3 metres behind the baseline most of the time and jo is doing a lot of drop volleys with little pressure on his shoulders as his opponent is very far from the net.

I still feel that Tsonga has a shot to be in the top 10, maybe even further, but I don't get a "serious" vibe from him. He seems to be another french talent gone to waste.
Click to expand...

So many of these sadly. Speaking of which, where the heck is Paul-Henri Mathieu?
 
F

fps

Legend
Tsonga missed a lot of his key formative tennis years due to injury. He found an amazing hot streak in that tournament, but honestly I think he'll be hit and miss the rest of his career and AO2008 will be remembered as the only tourny where he was all hit.
 
V

vllaznia

Semi-Pro
namelessone said:
No, I am talking about playing level or form. Nadal of 2008 on HC doesn't come close to 2009 or 2010 Nadal.

Tsonga was at his very peak(and sadly probably only peak) and Nadal was just starting to make headway into HC slams. He made his first USO semi that year. Now losing before semis in any slam is a failure for Rafa. Back then a HC GS semi was a nice bonus.
Click to expand...

In 2008 Nadal won Indian Wells which is 2 months later of Australian open after that he won the olimpics which was played on HC so do not tell me that his level was not good probably not his best but he was near his best and what is the most important thing he was not injured.
 
namelessone

namelessone

Legend
vllaznia said:
In 2008 Nadal won Indian Wells which is 2 months later of Australian open after that he won the olimpics which was played on HC so do not tell me that his level was not good probably not his best but he was near his best and what is the most important thing he was not injured.
Click to expand...

Nadal improved his HC game over that year and had some breakthroughs like first AO SF, first USO SF but we are talking strictly beginning of 2008 and Nadal was not that great on HC back then. He went out in USO 2007 to Ferrer, went on to have some solid results but lost against Nalby twice, beat a young Djoker in TMC but lost to Fed and he started his 2008 with a loss to Youzhny 6-0,6-1 while almost losing to a old Moya in that Chennai SF.

After AO 2008, Nadal lost to... Seppi in Rotterdam second round.

So in the beginning of 2008, he almost lost to veteran Moya, lost to Youzhny, lost to Tsonga and then to Seppi. Not the greatest HC form.
 
zak425

zak425

Semi-Pro
I can certainly agree that there are so many excuses for a Nadal loss, and far be it for me to say what was really going on in this match. But I think its pretty clear that Nadal's shots were landing quite short allowing Tsonga to stand on or well inside of the baseline and dictate play. That could be attributed to an "off-day" by Nadal, a tactical mistake, or Tsonga setting the tone early in match. Regardless it's pretty clear in the highlights when Nadal was hitting with depth he was winning the point, when the ball landed short Tsonga won the point. Which is why to me (once again not necessarily a Nadal fan, but its not like I hate the guy) to me the match was one where Nadal lost rather than Tsonga winning. But I understand that I'd really have to watch the full match to get a better read on it.

Everybody has off days, and most top players still win even on the off days so credit to Tsonga for sticking with the offense and taking what was there. Not too mention hitting some ridiculous droppers that I dont think he's hit since.
 
H

Heracles

Banned
Nadal was not "at his best".

He was average. He did not have a physical injury but he was just not playing very well. I remember the tournament before, doing a marathon against Moya on hardcourt and then being destroyed by Youzhny.

Nadal won IW in 2007 and 2009 but not in 2008. He lost to Djokovic 6-3 6-2. He went to the final of Miami and got beaten by Davydenko around the same score.

How Tsonga beat Nadal that day is similar to how Gonzalez beat Nadal the previous year.

Nadal was a good hardcourt player but lacked consistency (and still lacks that) and he was not a great player. It changed in 2008 at mid season.

He played unreal at RG , Queens, Wimbledon then won Canada and the Olympics, he was playing very very well. Then OA was the confirmation we all waited and last year USO was at least as good.

For Tsonga, I don't think he will reach that level again. Gonzalez did not reach the level of OA 2007 again. But Tsonga can definitely go back in the top 10 if he can do a full season.

Problem is that he has to take a lot of breaks in the season. But he has the potential to come and go around the top 10 like around 10 players outside the top 5.

But this tournament was probably a one shot.
 
mellowyellow

mellowyellow

Legend
Just like when he plays Cilic, DelPotro, Murray, Ferrer, Davydenko, Nalby, Blake, Yhouzny on hardcourts, he doesn't play good. Hmm the only thing that I can see is that they all have good backhands and move well. That pretty much negates Nadals advantage in a nutshell. Tsonga didn't play over his head, he was in shape and was not injured/coming off an injury. Nadal was not playing bad, he just played someone that if in shape and match tough not coming off injury will likely have his number on a hardcourt.
 
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