Best French open player of the open era

Best French open player of the open era

  • Borg

    Votes: 31 33.7%

  • Nadal

    Votes: 56 60.9%

  • Kuerten

    Votes: 2 2.2%

  • Wilander

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Lendl

    Votes: 3 3.3%
  • Total voters
    92
kragster

kragster

Hall of Fame
Not that many choices but just wanted to gauge the forum sentiment.


Edit: I already know where this poll is heading.
 
Last edited:
Towser83

Towser83

G.O.A.T.
Erm, surely this is a 2 choice poll - Borg or nadal. The others don't come close - though Wilander like Nadal won at his first attempt and was even younger at only 17, but overall he doesn't come close to Nadal.
 
Mustard

Mustard

Bionic Poster
It's got to be Nadal, in my opinion.

Nadal is 45-1 (6 titles), Borg 49-2 (6 titles), Wilander 47-9 (3 titles), Lendl 53-12 (3 titles) and Kuerten 36-8 (3 titles).
 
kishnabe

kishnabe

Talk Tennis Guru
Borg for best French Open player. Best clay court player would be Nadal.

Nadal just needs 1 more RG and he is better than Borg at the French.
 
Mustard

Mustard

Bionic Poster
Rafael Nadal
2005: CHAMPION
2006: CHAMPION
2007: CHAMPION
2008: CHAMPION
2009: Round of 16 Loser
2010: CHAMPION
2011: CHAMPION

Bjorn Borg
1973: Round of 16 Loser
1974: CHAMPION
1975: CHAMPION
1976: Quarter Final Loser
1977: DID NOT PLAY
1978: CHAMPION
1979: CHAMPION
1980: CHAMPION
1981: CHAMPION

Mats Wilander
1982: CHAMPION
1983: Runner-up
1984: Semi Final Loser
1985: CHAMPION
1986: Round of 32 Loser
1987: Runner-up
1988: CHAMPION
1989: Quarter Final Loser
1990: DID NOT PLAY
1991: Round of 64 Loser
1992: DID NOT PLAY
1993: DID NOT PLAY
1994: Round of 128 Loser
1995: Round of 64 Loser
1996: Round of 64 Loser

Ivan Lendl
1978: Round of 128 Loser
1979: Round of 16 Loser
1980: Round of 32 Loser
1981: Runner-up
1982: Round of 16 Loser
1983: Quarter Final Loser
1984: CHAMPION
1985: Runner-up
1986: CHAMPION
1987: CHAMPION
1988: Quarter Final Loser
1989: Round of 16 Loser
1990: DID NOT PLAY
1991: DID NOT PLAY
1992: Round of 64 Loser
1993: Round of 128 Loser
1994: Round of 128 Loser

Gustavo Kuerten
1996: Round of 128 Loser
1997: CHAMPION
1998: Round of 64 Loser
1999: Quarter Final Loser
2000: CHAMPION
2001: CHAMPION
2002: Round of 16 Loser
2003: Round of 16 Loser
2004: Quarter Final Loser
2005: Round of 128 Loser
2006: DID NOT PLAY
2007: DID NOT PLAY
2008: Round of 128 Loser
 
DjokovicForTheWin

DjokovicForTheWin

Banned
^^^ There we go. Ever since Borg and Nadal won their first FO, they won in a 4/2 distribution. But in Borg's loss it was a QF, while Nadal was 4th round. Therefore Borg > Nadal.
 
kragster

kragster

Hall of Fame
kishnabe said:
Borg for best French Open player. Best clay court player would be Nadal.

Nadal just needs 1 more RG and he is better than Borg at the French.
Click to expand...

Why does Nadal need 1 more RG to be better than Borg at the FO but Fed is leading Sampras 3:1 in the USO poll when both have the same number of slams?

Nadal has a higher winning % than Borg at the FO and has never been stretched to 5 sets in his 6 FO finals.
 
DjokovicForTheWin

DjokovicForTheWin

Banned
kragster said:
Why does Nadal need 1 more RG to be better than Borg at the FO but Fed is leading Sampras 3:1 in the USO poll when both have the same number of slams?

Nadal has a higher winning % than Borg at the FO and has never been stretched to 5 sets in his 6 FO finals.
Click to expand...

Not being stretched to 5 sets is meaningless if you've already lost in 4.
 
M

magnut

Hall of Fame
Yannick Noah.....because he was French. All other years and champions it was just another tournamnet.

The last 7 years or so its been pretty much the Spanish Open.
 
Mustard

Mustard

Bionic Poster
DjokovicForTheWin said:
Not being stretched to 5 sets is meaningless if you've already lost in 4.
Click to expand...

Adriano Panatta twice beat Borg in 4 sets at the French Open, the only times Borg lost there. Borg also had to go 5 sets in 2 French Open finals (1974 against Orantes and 1981 against Lendl).
 
DjokovicForTheWin

DjokovicForTheWin

Banned
Mustard said:
Adriano Panatta twice beat Borg in 4 sets at the French Open, the only times Borg lost there. Borg also had to go 5 sets in 2 French Open finals (1974 against Orantes and 1981 against Lendl).
Click to expand...

Thanks for making my case. Borg lost to a FO champion. Nadal lost to a slamless wonder. Case closed. Borg > Nadal. Additionally Nadal's stats are inflated because he started playing at a much later age than Borg.
 
Mustard

Mustard

Bionic Poster
lgbalfa said:
my vote goes to thomas muster.
Click to expand...

I really wish I could agree with you. Thomas was amazing when winning there in 1995, and looked very good in 1990 until he blew his semi final, but there's no question that Muster underachieved at the French Open considerably, and running into Courier a couple of times and serve and volleyers like Rafter and Stich didn't help.
 
DjokovicForTheWin

DjokovicForTheWin

Banned
Mustard said:
It's not clear at all. Nadal's winning percentages at the French Open and on clay in general are superior to Borg's. Nadal has also beaten Federer 5 times at the French Open.
Click to expand...

It's actually quite clear. Nadal's stats are simply inflated due to playing clay nobodies other than Federer. Borg played a much harder field and lost only to a FO champion. Nadal lost to Soderling. Pathetic. Borg > Nadal.
 
B

Biscuitmcgriddleson

Professional
Mustard said:
I really wish I could agree with you. Thomas was amazing when winning there in 1995, and looked very good in 1990 until he blew his semi final, but there's no question that Muster underachieved at the French Open considerably, and running into Courier a couple of times and serve and volleyers like Rafter and Stich didn't help.
Click to expand...

I would have really enjoyed seeing Muster in the final against Agassi. I think it would have been one spectacular final, albeit only if Agassi could have his hair in place :)
 
B

Biscuitmcgriddleson

Professional
DjokovicForTheWin said:
It's actually quite clear. Nadal's stats are simply inflated due to playing clay nobodies other than Federer. Borg played a much harder field and lost only to a FO champion. Nadal lost to Soderling. Pathetic. Borg > Nadal.
Click to expand...

While the argument does hold water, you can't really base that argument for determining the best FO player ever. Nadal has the tools to succeed on clay and it appears that he is at home on clay just as fish are in water.

It is interesting though to hear Nadal fans(Not calling Muster a Nadal fan) say that Federer is only a product of a weak era when a majority of Nadal's achievements are against Federer. Can't exactly say that Nadal is an amazing FO player and likely the best that ever set foot at RG and then chastise Federer for not being able to beat the best clay court player of all time.
 
DjokovicForTheWin

DjokovicForTheWin

Banned
Biscuitmcgriddleson said:
While the argument does hold water, you can't really base that argument for determining the best FO player ever. Nadal has the tools to succeed on clay and it appears that he is at home on clay just as fish are in water.

It is interesting though to hear Nadal fans(Not calling Muster a Nadal fan) say that Federer is only a product of a weak era when a majority of Nadal's achievements are against Federer. Can't exactly say that Nadal is an amazing FO player and likely the best that ever set foot at RG and then chastise Federer for not being able to beat the best clay court player of all time.
Click to expand...

Well this thread was initiated by a *********, so you kind of have to speak in language they will comprehend.
 
kragster

kragster

Hall of Fame
Mustard said:
I can't help it :)
Click to expand...

Lol, but you should know that the one thing a troll wants most is attention. Taking that away is the best way to annoy a troll. Someone else in another thread spent 6 pages arguing with bullzilla! Nothing positive ever comes from arguing with a troll.
 
Hood_Man

Hood_Man

G.O.A.T.
There are a lot of stats that would probably prove it, but this one knocks me out of my shoes: Borg conceded 8 sets en route to winning his first French Open in 1974, but Nadal conceded just 7 sets in 4 years between 2005 and 2008.

Borg was perhaps spared losing a few more in fact due to the first two rounds of '74 being best of 3 sets, having lost his opening set in the first round 6-4 to Jean-François Caujolle.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1974_French_Open_-_Men's_Singles#Section_6

In fact, in his 6 winning years Borg conceded 14 sets in total, while Nadal conceded 10 from his.

If I was to include their losses things would be even more in Nadals favour since it would become 20 sets to 13.

[EDIT]

Oh yeah, forgot to add, my pick is Nadal. In case I wasn't obvious enough :lol:
 
DjokovicForTheWin

DjokovicForTheWin

Banned
Hood_Man said:
There are a lot of stats that would probably prove it, but this one knocks me out of my shoes: Borg conceded 8 sets en route to winning his first French Open in 1974, but Nadal conceded just 7 sets in 4 years between 2005 and 2008.

Borg was perhaps spared losing a few more in fact due to the first two rounds of '74 being best of 3 sets, having lost his opening set in the first round 6-4 to Jean-François Caujolle.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1974_French_Open_-_Men's_Singles#Section_6

In fact, in his 6 winning years Borg conceded 14 sets in total, while Nadal conceded 10 from his.

If I was to include their losses things would be even more in Nadals favour since it would become 20 sets to 13.

[EDIT]

Oh yeah, forgot to add, my pick is Nadal. In case I wasn't obvious enough :lol:
Click to expand...

Wait a second wait a second. If you say Borg lost 8 sets in winning one FO, and 14 sets for all 6 FO, then doesn't that mean Borg only lost 6 sets for the remaining 5 FO??????!!!! That's better than Nadal's 7 sets lost for 4 FO's.
 
C

celoft

Guest
Borg.

He only lost to a FO champ(Panatta twice). Soderling never won the FO.

Is Soderling still active?
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Mustard

Mustard

Bionic Poster
Rafael Nadal
2005 French Open - Rafael Nadal
R128: Rafael Nadal def. Lars Burgsmuller (6-1, 7-6, 6-1)
R64: Rafael Nadal def. Xavier Malisse (6-2, 6-2, 6-4)
R32: Rafael Nadal def. Richard Gasquet (6-4, 6-3, 6-2)
R16: Rafael Nadal def. Sebastien Grosjean (6-4, 3-6, 6-0, 6-3)
QF: Rafael Nadal def. David Ferrer (7-5, 6-2, 6-0)
SF: Rafael Nadal def. Roger Federer (6-3, 4-6, 6-4, 6-3)
F: Rafael Nadal def. Mariano Puerta (6-7, 6-3, 6-1, 7-5)

2006 French Open - Rafael Nadal
R128: Rafael Nadal def. Robin Soderling (6-2, 7-5, 6-1)
R64: Rafael Nadal def. Kevin Kim (6-2, 6-1, 6-4)
R32: Rafael Nadal def. Paul-Henri Mathieu (5-7, 6-4, 6-4, 6-4)
R16: Rafael Nadal def. Lleyton Hewitt (6-2, 5-7, 6-4, 6-2)
QF: Rafael Nadal def. Novak Djokovic (6-4, 6-4 ret.)
SF: Rafael Nadal def. Ivan Ljubicic (6-4, 6-2, 7-6)
F: Rafael Nadal def. Roger Federer (1-6, 6-1, 6-4, 7-6)

2007 French Open - Rafael Nadal
R128: Rafael Nadal def. Juan Martin del Potro (7-5, 6-3, 6-2)
R64: Rafael Nadal def. Flavio Cipolla (6-2, 6-1, 6-4)
R32: Rafael Nadal def. Albert Montanes (6-1, 6-3, 6-2)
R16: Rafael Nadal def. Lleyton Hewitt (6-3, 6-1, 7-6)
QF: Rafael Nadal def. Carlos Moya (6-4, 6-3, 6-0)
SF: Rafael Nadal def. Novak Djokovic (7-5, 6-4, 6-2)
F: Rafael Nadal def. Roger Federer (6-3, 4-6, 6-3, 6-4)

2008 French Open - Rafael Nadal
R128: Rafael Nadal def. Thomaz Bellucci (7-5, 6-3, 6-1)
R64: Rafael Nadal def. Nicolas Devilder (6-4, 6-0, 6-1)
R32: Rafael Nadal def. Jarkko Nieminen (6-1, 6-3, 6-1)
R16: Rafael Nadal def. Fernando Verdasco (6-1, 6-0, 6-2)
QF: Rafael Nadal def. Nicolas Almagro (6-1, 6-1, 6-1)
SF: Rafael Nadal def. Novak Djokovic (6-4, 6-2, 7-6)
F: Rafael Nadal def. Roger Federer (6-1, 6-3, 6-0)

2009 French Open - Rafael Nadal
R128: Rafael Nadal def. Marcos Daniel (7-5, 6-4, 6-3)
R64: Rafael Nadal def. Teymuraz Gabashvili (6-1, 6-4, 6-2)
R32: Rafael Nadal def. Lleyton Hewitt (6-1, 6-3, 6-1)
R16: Robin Soderling def. Rafael Nadal (6-2, 6-7, 6-4, 7-6)

2010 French Open - Rafael Nadal
R128: Rafael Nadal def. Gianni Mina (6-2, 6-2, 6-2)
R64: Rafael Nadal def. Horacio Zeballos (6-2, 6-2, 6-3)
R32: Rafael Nadal def. Lleyton Hewitt (6-3, 6-4, 6-3)
R16: Rafael Nadal def. Thomaz Bellucci (6-2, 7-5, 6-4)
QF: Rafael Nadal def. Nicolas Almagro (7-6, 7-6, 6-4)
SF: Rafael Nadal def. Jurgen Melzer (6-2, 6-3, 7-6)
F: Rafael Nadal def. Robin Soderling (6-4, 6-2, 6-4)

2011 French Open - Rafael Nadal
R128: Rafael Nadal def. John Isner (6-4, 6-7, 6-7, 6-2, 6-4)
R64: Rafael Nadal def. Pablo Andujar (7-5, 6-3, 7-6)
R32: Rafael Nadal def. Antonio Veic (6-1, 6-3, 6-0)
R16: Rafael Nadal def. Ivan Ljubicic (7-5, 6-3, 6-3)
QF: Rafael Nadal def. Robin Soderling (6-4, 6-1, 7-6)
SF: Rafael Nadal def. Andy Murray (6-4, 7-5, 6-4)
F: Rafael Nadal def. Roger Federer (7-5, 7-6, 5-7, 6-1)


Bjorn Borg
1973 French Open - Bjorn Borg
R128: Bjorn Borg def. Cliff Richey (6-2, 6-3)
R64: Bjorn Borg def. Pierre Barthes (3-6, 6-1, 8-6)
R32: Bjorn Borg def. Dick Stockton (6-7, 7-5, 6-2, 7-6)
R16: Adriano Panatta def. Bjorn Borg (7-6, 2-6, 7-5, 7-6)

1974 French Open - Bjorn Borg
R128: Bjorn Borg def. Jean-Francois Caujolle (4-6, 6-0, 6-4)
R64: Bjorn Borg def. Toma Ovici (6-1, 6-1)
R32: Bjorn Borg def. Jean-Loup Rouyer (6-4, 6-2, 6-0)
R16: Bjorn Borg def. Erik Van Dillen (0-6, 6-3, 6-3, 5-7, 6-3)
QF: Bjorn Borg def. Raul Ramirez (6-2, 5-7, 4-6, 6-2, 6-3)
SF: Bjorn Borg def. Harold Solomon (6-4, 2-6, 6-2, 6-1)
F: Bjorn Borg def. Manuel Orantes (2-6, 6-7, 6-0, 6-1, 6-1)

1975 French Open - Bjorn Borg
R128: Bjorn Borg def. Norman Holmes (6-2, 6-3)
R64: Bjorn Borg def. Peter Szoke (6-1, 6-1)
R32: Bjorn Borg def. Jiri Hrebec (6-1, 6-1, 6-1)
R16: Bjorn Borg def. Stan Smith (6-2, 6-3, 6-0)
QF: Bjorn Borg def. Harold Solomon (6-1, 7-5, 6-4)
SF: Bjorn Borg def. Adriano Panatta (6-4, 1-6, 7-5, 6-4)
F: Bjorn Borg def. Guillermo Vilas (6-2, 6-3, 6-4)

1976 French Open - Bjorn Borg
R128: Bjorn Borg def. Dominique Bedel (0-6, 6-0, 6-4, 7-5)
R64: Bjorn Borg def. Hans Kary (6-1, 6-1, 6-2)
R32: Bjorn Borg def. Antonio Zugarelli (6-3, 6-4, 6-4)
R16: Bjorn Borg def. Francois Jauffret (6-4, 6-2, 3-6, 4-6, 10-8 )
QF: Adriano Panatta def. Bjorn Borg (6-3, 6-3, 2-6, 7-6)

1978 French Open - Bjorn Borg
R128: Bjorn Borg def. Eric Deblicker (6-1, 6-1, 6-1)
R64: Bjorn Borg def. Rick F a g e l (6-0, 6-1, 6-0)
R32: Bjorn Borg def. Paolo Bertolucci (6-0, 6-2, 6-2)
R16: Bjorn Borg def. Roscoe Tanner (6-2, 6-4, 7-6)
QF: Bjorn Borg def. Raul Ramirez (6-3, 6-3, 6-0)
SF: Bjorn Borg def. Corrado Barazzutti (6-0, 6-1, 6-0)
F: Bjorn Borg def. Guillermo Vilas (6-1, 6-1, 6-3)

1979 French Open - Bjorn Borg
R128: Bjorn Borg def. Tomas Smid (6-1, 5-7, 6-4, 6-4)
R64: Bjorn Borg def. Tom Gullikson (6-3, 7-6, 5-7, 6-4)
R32: Bjorn Borg def. Raymond Moore (6-3, 6-1, 6-0)
R16: Bjorn Borg def. Gilles Moretton (7-5, 6-4, 6-2)
QF: Bjorn Borg def. Hans Gildemeister (6-4, 6-1, 7-5)
SF: Bjorn Borg def. Vitas Gerulaitis (6-2, 6-1, 6-0)
F: Bjorn Borg def. Victor Pecci (6-3, 6-1, 6-7, 6-4)

1980 French Open - Bjorn Borg
R128: Bjorn Borg def. Alvaro Fillol (6-3, 6-1, 6-4)
R64: Bjorn Borg def. Andres Gomez (6-2, 6-2, 6-1)
R32: Bjorn Borg def. Pascal Portes (6-3, 6-0, 6-1)
R16: Bjorn Borg def. Balazs Taroczy (6-2, 6-2, 6-0)
QF: Bjorn Borg def. Corrado Barazzutti (6-0, 6-3, 6-3)
SF: Bjorn Borg def. Harold Solomon (6-2, 6-2, 6-0)
F: Bjorn Borg def. Vitas Gerulaitis (6-4, 6-1, 6-2)

1981 French Open - Bjorn Borg
R128: Bjorn Borg def. Jose Lopez-Maeso (6-2, 6-2, 6-2)
R64: Bjorn Borg def. Cassio Motta (6-1, 7-5, 6-0)
R32: Bjorn Borg def. Paul Torre (6-2, 6-1, 6-2)
R16: Bjorn Borg def. Terry Moor (6-0, 6-0, 6-1)
QF: Bjorn Borg def. Balazs Taroczy (6-3, 6-3, 6-2)
SF: Bjorn Borg def. Victor Pecci (6-4, 6-4, 7-5)
F: Bjorn Borg def. Ivan Lendl (6-1, 4-6, 6-2, 3-6, 6-1)
 
DjokovicForTheWin

DjokovicForTheWin

Banned
Mustard said:
You know damn well that Federer's mono was nowhere near as bad a strain as Soderling's or Ancic's.
Click to expand...

Maybe, maybe not. You don't have any of their doctor's reports. All I know is Courier said Fed's mono cost him tons of practice time. Given how Fed's game is built on precision that loss of practice would have cost him dearly against someone as good as Nadal.
 
Mustard

Mustard

Bionic Poster
Biscuitmcgriddleson said:
True, but as DFTW pointed out it did cost him practice time. If Nadal fans want to discredit Federer's FO then you sure need to put asterisks next to WIM 08 and AO 09.
Click to expand...

From me, there has been no discrediting of Federer's 2009 French Open win nor are there any asteriks against Nadal's majors.
 
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