After watching Nadal play at this RG, how can they NOT ban poly strings?

tennis_balla · Jun 14, 2012

Also you forgot to add the ATP needs to steal Rafa's half million Euro watch before each big match.

Wolfman Jack · Jun 14, 2012

tennis_balla said:
Also you forgot to add the ATP needs to steal Rafa's half million Euro watch before each big match.

Thank you, sir. Edited my poast to include your very well thought out suggestion.

BreakPoint · Jun 14, 2012

ViscaB said:
Yannik Noah smokes too much grass. He always talks out of his rear. He's up there with Breakpoint. This is exactly how rumors are started. Nadal is and always has been clean.

I'm sorry, but are you Nadal's personal physician? Or else how can you be sure enough to make a blanket statement like that?

BTW, Lance Armstrong has been saying the same thing about himself for many years as well.

BreakPoint · Jun 14, 2012

Blade0324 said:
Sorry but players being able to generate a lot of spin does not take away from the integrity of the sport IMO. I'd love to know exactly why you think this is the case. Spaghetti strings were a different pattern for stringing a racquet. Poly are simply a different material for strings in the same pattern as has always been the case. I'm sorry but I don't think this is comparable.

But the result is pretty much the same. Too much unnatural spin due to the strings. There's a reason why they banned spitballs in baseball.

KTENNIS · Jun 14, 2012

BreakPoint said:
It's ridiculous. Nadal can take huge cuts on almost every ball and put so much topspin on the ball that it almost never goes out. That is NOT tennis. There's a reason why a tennis court had boundaries - to prevent players from hitting the ball as hard as they can on every shot without the fear of hitting the ball outside of the boundaries. This is not baseball. Almost all of Nadal's balls landed in no matter how hard he hit the ball. He could hit ridiculous angles and the ball would still land inside the sidelines.

The effect on the ball using polyester strings is really NO DIFFERENT than the effect on the ball using spaghetti strings - and they BANNED spaghetti strings back in the late-70's. So why haven't they banned poly strings yet?

Eliminating poly strings would force players to use more variety, more strategy, differing pace and spins, attack the net more, and be more creative in keeping the ball in play rather than just taking huge swings and hitting the ball as hard as you can from the baseline on every single shot. It would also save a lot of recreational players who like to copy the pros from arm injuries and leaving the sport.

Let's face it, poly strings have made playing against Nadal on clay almost unplayable and made watching pro tennis almost unwatchable because it's like watching a game of Pong (the video game). There's basically no variety and no strategy other than bludgeoning every ball with no fear of hitting out.

If they came out with a technology which allowed Tiger Woods to hit a hole-in-one on every shot, don't you think they would immediately ban it as it would ruin the sport of golf? So why haven't they banned poly strings yet that is ruining the sport of tennis from what it used to be and supposed to be?

Why don't you try using poly and we'll see how far you get in Wimbledon.

tennis_balla · Jun 14, 2012

Lack of knowledge right there Breakpoint. Poly strings do not add unnatural spin. They can add more spin and more control, however gut strings are still more powerful.

The advantage with poly strings is the player can string at a lower tension without lacking control. This in turn will also increase the sweetspot. The strings can also increase spin but its not as much as you'd think. The reason the strings have more spin is because it allows the player to take bigger cuts at the ball while still maintaining control. Also, Nadal uses 1.35mm string (15L) so hardly looking for spin. One more thing, not all poly's are created equal. There's the Luxilon ALU/RPM Blast type poly which most are familiar with but string your racket with basic poly like Kirschbaum Super Smash 1.30 or Babolat Duralast 135 (which Nadal used to use) and then tell me how 'spinny' those strings are. When Rafa switched to RPM (marketed as a spin string, yea thats a laugh) he had maybe a slight increase, but not much).

Personally, I think you're just looking for attention with threads like this.

Gasolina · Jun 14, 2012

BreakPoint said:
I don't think that's true. The modern poly string was invented by Luxilon, mainly for use by professional players. The use of Luxilon strings allowed pros to switch to bigger, more powerful frames, such as Babolats and still maintain control, as well as a consistent, uniform stringbed as poly stays in place. The pros also found that this combination allowed them to hit harder with less fear of the ball sailing out because of the additional spin the poly strings could generate. The durability of poly strings was an extra plus as it was less likely they would break a string in the middle of an important point. They didn't originally think recreational players would like it as poly is low powered and most recreational players can't hit as hard nor with as much spin as pros can since they don't have those kind of strokes. But of course, recreational players love to copy the pros so as soon as it was made well known that pros were using poly strings, recreational players started switching to them in droves. Many have paid the price with arm injuries.

That was the old polyester strings. Newer co-polys can be used properly by rec players. The spin I get from them just cannot be duplicated by a similar priced multi. Plus I hate fixing my strings after every point.

In terms of skill, I don't think it takes away from the game. Most people are baseliners now because it's very easy especially with today's racquet and string technology. However, the better players I see in the club are the ones who really put in time to develop variety in their games and "brush off" these baseline bashers.

It just so happens that there hasn't been an all court player good or quick enough to attack nadal on clay.

Chopin · Jun 22, 2012

BreakPoint said:
But the result is pretty much the same. Too much unnatural spin due to the strings. There's a reason why they banned spitballs in baseball.

"Unnatural spin" ha!

"Captain, these strings defy the laws of physics!"

mawashi · Jun 22, 2012

This is one of e funniest thread I have read in a looonnnngggg time lol!

Bp is one of the last breeds of old farts that always HAS... NEEDS to have e last word however lost e cause was lol

Bp admit it you r a closet Armish lol!

One of the case of seeing a blade of grass n missing e forest lol!

Polys n graphite bad for e environment lol... Yup I'm sure there's no plastic or graphite anywhere else at his place. I'm sure BP was screaming bloody murder when Borg went from wood to aluminium n later graphite lol

Now listen ye all let's all only wear cotton n straw sandals whenever we bat our rat bladder balls lol!

I'm sure Bp will have... NEED to reply!

Rock Strongo · Jun 23, 2012

Right, came across this clip with Becker hitting a banana shot using a 92 square inch very heavy racquet and gut strings, and thought that if this thread was bumped I'd share it. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XpZWo2Gp-cE&feature=player_detailpage#t=77s
Check out the curve on that!

mellowyellow · Jun 23, 2012

TV angle makes that look better thanit was, he makes contact inside the area of the lines, and the ball is just inside the line where it lands, the hook you are seeing is the camera angle and the rise and fall of the ball. No different than in basketball.

marc45 · Jun 23, 2012

willshot said:
Forget about strings. Lets ban all players that hit spin. You must hit flat or underspin only. stupid. lol

all ken rosewall backhands

MarTennis · Jul 2, 2012

I...

Rock Strongo said:
Now I just feel like blaspheming completely and put poly in a wooden racquet.

love this post!

Ripster · Jul 2, 2012

I gotta agree with Breakpoint on this one. Banning poly strings would encourage more 90's style tennis while still keeping the modern day power game with current racquet tech for baseliners. We aren't going back to wood any day, so this is a good compromise.

TomT · Jul 2, 2012

BreakPoint said:
It's ridiculous. Nadal can take huge cuts on almost every ball and put so much topspin on the ball that it almost never goes out. That is NOT tennis. There's a reason why a tennis court had boundaries - to prevent players from hitting the ball as hard as they can on every shot without the fear of hitting the ball outside of the boundaries. This is not baseball. Almost all of Nadal's balls landed in no matter how hard he hit the ball. He could hit ridiculous angles and the ball would still land inside the sidelines.

The effect on the ball using polyester strings is really NO DIFFERENT than the effect on the ball using spaghetti strings - and they BANNED spaghetti strings back in the late-70's. So why haven't they banned poly strings yet?

Eliminating poly strings would force players to use more variety, more strategy, differing pace and spins, attack the net more, and be more creative in keeping the ball in play rather than just taking huge swings and hitting the ball as hard as you can from the baseline on every single shot. It would also save a lot of recreational players who like to copy the pros from arm injuries and leaving the sport.

Let's face it, poly strings have made playing against Nadal on clay almost unplayable and made watching pro tennis almost unwatchable because it's like watching a game of Pong (the video game). There's basically no variety and no strategy other than bludgeoning every ball with no fear of hitting out.

If they came out with a technology which allowed Tiger Woods to hit a hole-in-one on every shot, don't you think they would immediately ban it as it would ruin the sport of golf? So why haven't they banned poly strings yet that is ruining the sport of tennis from what it used to be and supposed to be?

It's Nadal's technique, plus the technology. Everybody has access to the technology, but nobody has equaled Nadal's technique. So, he beats most pros consistently. Nadal would, imo, be one of the greatest of all time no matter what the racket/string technology. Just my two cents.

But then, I grew up in the era of Gonzalez, Rosewall, Laver, Newcombe, Connors, Borg, Vilas, etc.

The thing is, imo, extreme topspin is difficult for even the very best players to consistently handle. The success of players like Borg, Vilas, Nadal, et al. seems to attest to this. Extreme topspin isn't unique to the Nadal era. I was using it, and winning because of it, back in the early/mid 70's against good amateur players.

TomT · Jul 2, 2012

Ripster said:
I gotta agree with Breakpoint on this one. Banning poly strings would be a GREAT compromise. It would encourage more 90's style tennis while still keeping the modern day power racquets for baseliners. We aren't going back to wood any day, so this is a good compromise.

Do the poly strings really make that much difference? Don't all players have access to this technology? Personally, I like the current style of tennis at least as much as 90's style tennis, maybe moreso.

Timbo's hopeless slice · Jul 2, 2012

movies99 said:
No it hasn't..chris gayle hits a six every 9/10 balls in 20-20 ..the amout of sixes in every tournament increases by numbe rof times when u compare even 5 yrs back.. teams were posting 180-200 n won world cups..now 300 cannt guarantee a win.. so should everyone go back to wodden bats?

Umm, everyone DOES play with wooden bats, actually..

anyway, this is a silly thread and I think BP just does this to wind people up, much like his celebrated and famously idiotic Sam Stosur thread of a while back...

Tennis is a relatively young sport that has seen a process of evolution over time. You think nobody ever hit with massive topspin before poly strings? Watch Tom Okker hit a FH just for starters..

BreakPoint · Jul 2, 2012

TomT said:
It's Nadal's technique, plus the technology. Everybody has access to the technology, but nobody has equaled Nadal's technique. So, he beats most pros consistently. Nadal would, imo, be one of the greatest of all time no matter what the racket/string technology. Just my two cents.

But then, I grew up in the era of Gonzalez, Rosewall, Laver, Newcombe, Connors, Borg, Vilas, etc.

The thing is, imo, extreme topspin is difficult for even the very best players to consistently handle. The success of players like Borg, Vilas, Nadal, et al. seems to attest to this. Extreme topspin isn't unique to the Nadal era. I was using it, and winning because of it, back in the early/mid 70's against good amateur players.

Even Nadal would be the first to admit that he wouldn't be able to generate the same amount of massive topspin without his poly strings. Yes, of course, he will still be able to hit topspin with other stings, but he won't be able to hit the massive poly induced topspin that dips into the court at the last second and also bounces over his opponent's shoulders nor will he be able to bend shots from outside the doubles alley into the court.

The fact that everyone has access to the technology is precisely the reason it needs to be banned. If no one had access to it then there would be no need to ban it.

BreakPoint · Jul 2, 2012

Timbo's hopeless slice said:
You think nobody ever hit with massive topspin before poly strings? Watch Tom Okker hit a FH just for starters..

So if Tom Okker could do it without poly strings, why can't Nadal? Nadal's not as good of an athlete? So taking poly strings away from Nadal should have absolutely no effect on his game, right? So then what's the big deal if they banned poly strings?

BreakPoint · Jul 2, 2012

TomT said:
Do the poly strings really make that much difference? Don't all players have access to this technology? Personally, I like the current style of tennis at least as much as 90's style tennis, maybe moreso.

Yes, they do. If they didn't, the great majority of pros wouldn't be using poly strings.

Doubles · Jul 2, 2012

BP's logic is escaping me...
There's no reason to ban poly strings. Just because Nadal can hit with topspin doesn't mean that the entire game needs to be changed to handicap him. Regardless of strings or racket technology, Rafa would be able to find a way to win with his superior fitness and mental strength. Bear in mind, this is coming from someone who doesn't root for any of the "big three".
I'm sure you'll refute this, as arguing over the internet seems to be your favorite past time, but before you do, remember that Nadal lost to Rosol, who also happened to be using poly strings. In that match, they didn't seem to give him much of an advantage did they?

Cross-court · Jul 3, 2012

BreakPoint said:
It's ridiculous.

You're ridiculous. Polyester is nothing new. And all the players have the same advantages and disadvantages so its a matter of skill. The fact that Nadal puts more spin on the ball shows he has more skill than the rest in generating that extra spin because they can all use the same.

And please, like if the "old tennis" was that great. The one right now is a million times better than the "follow through with the racket pointing at the net" days where people with not-so-great fitness could get away with it.

I find the long rallies between Djokovic and Nadal in the USO for example to be a million times better than 2-3 point rallies of old.

Deleted member 77403 · Jul 3, 2012

Mustard said:
This is the change and evolution of tennis. It is always happening. For example, players in the second half of the 1980s, such as Lendl and Becker, had equipment miles beyond that of Laver 20 years earlier, let alone somebody as far back Budge, Vines and Tilden.

And this is why you can't have an overall GOAT, or a GOAT of a particular surface. Purely because the game is always changing, and players are exposed to very contrasting conditions to those seen in the past.

fullpolyserve&volley · Oct 23, 2013

Doubles said:
BP's logic is escaping me...
There's no reason to ban poly strings. Just because Nadal can hit with topspin doesn't mean that the entire game needs to be changed to handicap him. Regardless of strings or racket technology, Rafa would be able to find a way to win with his superior fitness and mental strength. Bear in mind, this is coming from someone who doesn't root for any of the "big three".
I'm sure you'll refute this, as arguing over the internet seems to be your favorite past time, but before you do, remember that Nadal lost to Rosol, who also happened to be using poly strings. In that match, they didn't seem to give him much of an advantage did they?

They slowed down the game because of players like Roddick and Roanic hitting too many aces.....

BreakPoint · Oct 23, 2013

Cross-court said:
You're ridiculous. Polyester is nothing new. And all the players have the same advantages and disadvantages so its a matter of skill. The fact that Nadal puts more spin on the ball shows he has more skill than the rest in generating that extra spin because they can all use the same.

And please, like if the "old tennis" was that great. The one right now is a million times better than the "follow through with the racket pointing at the net" days where people with not-so-great fitness could get away with it.

I find the long rallies between Djokovic and Nadal in the USO for example to be a million times better than 2-3 point rallies of old.

A lot of people have exactly the opposite opinion as you. A lot of people prefer attacking tennis where a winner is hit within the first 3 or 4 shots.

And if poly strings give all the players the same advantages and disadvantages, why not give every pro golfer a club that allows them to hit a hole-in-one every time? Every golfer would have the same advantage, right? Wouldn't that ruin the game of golf?

Poly strings have taken skill and strategy out of the game and replaced it with grinding.

objectivity · Oct 23, 2013

BreakPoint said:
A lot of people have exactly the opposite opinion as you. A lot of people prefer attacking tennis where a winner is hit within the first 3 or 4 shots.

And if poly strings give all the players the same advantages and disadvantages, why not give every pro golfer a club that allows them to hit a hole-in-one every time? Every golfer would have the same advantage, right? Wouldn't that ruin the game of golf?

Poly strings have taken skill and strategy out of the game and replaced it with grinding.

if you can't see the amount of point construction that is at the heart of successful modern play, you clearly don't know tennis. it is no coincidence that American players are doing so poorly now. they are brought up with no notion of point construction or strategy. just learn to hammer hard serves and forehands.

i think poly strings and slower courts have combined to lend GREATER strategy NOT LESS strategy to the tennis game. power has become less important, while movement and strategy have become more important. that is the true modern game.

Omega_7000 · Oct 23, 2013

objectivity said:
if you can't see the amount of point construction that is at the heart of successful modern play, you clearly don't know tennis. it is no coincidence that American players are doing so poorly now. they are brought up with no notion of point construction or strategy. just learn to hammer hard serves and forehands.

i think poly strings and slower courts have combined to lend GREATER strategy NOT LESS strategy to the tennis game. power has become less important, while movement and strategy have become more important. that is the true modern game.

Going from an all court game to a purely baseline game has definitely led itself to greater strategy.

BreakPoint · Oct 23, 2013

objectivity said:
if you can't see the amount of point construction that is at the heart of successful modern play, you clearly don't know tennis. it is no coincidence that American players are doing so poorly now. they are brought up with no notion of point construction or strategy. just learn to hammer hard serves and forehands.

i think poly strings and slower courts have combined to lend GREATER strategy NOT LESS strategy to the tennis game. power has become less important, while movement and strategy have become more important. that is the true modern game.

"Point construction" in modern tennis? Are you serious??

Spinning the ball over the net over and over ad nausem hoping your opponent will hit the next ball out or into the net is "point construction"? LMAO!!!!

objectivity · Oct 23, 2013

BreakPoint said:
"Point construction" in modern tennis? Are you serious??

Spinning the ball over the net over and over ad nausem hoping your opponent will hit the next ball out or into the net is "point construction"? LMAO!!!!

well, if that's all you see, i guess we can agree to disagree. i on the other hand, see the top players like djokovic and nadal especially, outmaneuvering and moving their opponents all over the court. it is no surprise that the top players are also the very best movers in the game.

my contention is that modern technology has allowed players to strike their shots with greater consistency using enhanced spin, hence more shots land in making the contest less about power but about placement and movement.

MichaelNadal · Oct 24, 2013

BreakPoint said:
It's ridiculous. Nadal can take huge cuts on almost every ball and put so much topspin on the ball that it almost never goes out. That is NOT tennis. There's a reason why a tennis court had boundaries - to prevent players from hitting the ball as hard as they can on every shot without the fear of hitting the ball outside of the boundaries. This is not baseball. Almost all of Nadal's balls landed in no matter how hard he hit the ball. He could hit ridiculous angles and the ball would still land inside the sidelines.The effect on the ball using polyester strings is really NO DIFFERENT than the effect on the ball using spaghetti strings - and they BANNED spaghetti strings back in the late-70's. So why haven't they banned poly strings yet?

Eliminating poly strings would force players to use more variety, more strategy, differing pace and spins, attack the net more, and be more creative in keeping the ball in play rather than just taking huge swings and hitting the ball as hard as you can from the baseline on every single shot. It would also save a lot of recreational players who like to copy the pros from arm injuries and leaving the sport.

Let's face it, poly strings have made playing against Nadal on clay almost unplayable and made watching pro tennis almost unwatchable because it's like watching a game of Pong (the video game). There's basically no variety and no strategy other than bludgeoning every ball with no fear of hitting out.

If they came out with a technology which allowed Tiger Woods to hit a hole-in-one on every shot, don't you think they would immediately ban it as it would ruin the sport of golf? So why haven't they banned poly strings yet that is ruining the sport of tennis from what it used to be and supposed to be?

That's right.... you better keep unintentionally praising #TeamRafa and the #GOAThand :lol:

After watching Nadal play at this RG, how can they NOT ban poly strings?

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