Very annoyed: Will Hamilton from FYB

Flatballs · May 8, 2015

So I listened to Will rant for a good 20 minutes about his new 55% Advantage program with Chris O'Shaughnessy, Who's work I really admire. $47 - I thought, hey that's not to bad I guess. After this 'amazing, special offer' price was spoken about over and over again...

Then I go down to pay and in fine, small print "Per month for two months"

What a joke. Sick of this deception! Not once did he say "total price $94" or "two payments"

No sign up for me

Flatballs · May 8, 2015

Annoyed: Will Hamilton of FYB

So I listened to Will rant for a good 20 minutes about his new 55% Advantage program with Chris O'Shaughnessy, Who's work I really admire. $47 - I thought, hey that's not too bad I guess. After this 'amazing, special offer' price was hammered over and over again...

Then I go down to pay and in fine, small print "Per month for two months"

What a joke. Sick of this deception! Not once did he say "total price $94" or "two payments"

No sign up for me

jeebeesus · May 8, 2015

FYB you can fall asleep waiting for the punchline

beltsman · May 9, 2015

I have nothing against Will and FYB...I watch all my videos for free.

But seriously if you pay for something, it is your fault for not reading the terms.

You are just projecting your own anger. You should read things before you pay.

Gazelle · May 9, 2015

Will's style of writing emails is annoying

"Hey have you seen my new offer

It's something you have never seen before

It's a once in a lifetime opportunity

A chance to lift your game to the next level

And leave your opponents behind in the dust

While being astounded at your new-found spectacular game

That would leave even the best players in awe

I garantee that you have never seen this before

When you buy this you'll think, why didn't I buy this earlier?

Your game will rise to new dimensions

Opponents will now truly fear you

You'll be able to hit with far more confidence and accuracy than ever before

You won't believe how good you have become

All because of this one small secret

That you didn't know till now

But makes such a big change to your game

You'll be surprised at how easy it is

And opponents will be surprised at how easy you smash them off the court

They will look dumbfounded

Wonder why they suddenly are losing against you

So this is why I offer this to you

So you can become the player you always wanted

And reach a level you couldn't even dream of in your wildest dreams

To finally be able to play the way you want it

And it is all in this one small secret

Never released, until now

For you, not because I want money

But because I want YOU to improve YOUR game"

(half an hour later)

"Normally this product is worth 500 dollars

But because it's for you, I sell it for ONLY 100 dollars

To become the player you deserve to be

But be quick, cause this offer is only on for a limited amount of time

A one-time action that offers this product at this very cheap price

Chat soon
Will"

PhrygianDominant · May 9, 2015

Flatballs said:
So I listened to Will rant for a good 20 minutes about his new 55% Advantage program with Chris O'Shaughnessy, Who's work I really admire. $47 - I thought, hey that's not to bad I guess. After this 'amazing, special offer' price was spoken about over and over again...

Then I go down to pay and in fine, small print "Per month for two months"

What a joke. Sick of this deception! Not once did he say "total price $94" or "two payments"

No sign up for me

beltsman said:
I have nothing against Will and FYB...I watch all my videos for free.

But seriously if you pay for something, it is your fault for not reading the terms.

You are just projecting your own anger. You should read things before you pay.

:twisted:

10 reading comprehensions

Bartelby · May 9, 2015

It is not that hard to communicate correctly so if Will does not do it then everyone needs to be informed of the matter.

The OP did read the fine print and did not sign up, so maybe you need to brush up on your reading skills.

beltsman said:
I have nothing against Will and FYB...I watch all my videos for free.

But seriously if you pay for something, it is your fault for not reading the terms.

You are just projecting your own anger. You should read things before you pay.

heninfan99 · May 9, 2015

I'm surprised this style of his isn't commercial suicide for FYB. I would think false pressure email blasts would engender disdain from my fellow weekend warrior tennis players.

Years ago he had some good free vids with what seemed a local pro on playing pushers and footwork, I think they were called "inside man" tactics and then he changed his style.

heninfan99 · May 9, 2015

how many places will you post this?

syc23 · May 9, 2015

I used to watch a lot of FYB videos when I was a beginner 4 years ago, however I quickly realised there were infinitely better videos elsewhere offered for free. Will is just a money grabber without offering anything unique.

racket king · May 9, 2015

Never been impressed by Will Hamilton from a tennis perspective.

That said, he does know how to monetize.

http://www.entrepreneurs-journey.com/2168/will-hamilton-tennis/

http://podbay.fm/show/303638149/e/1263551266

Steve0904 · May 9, 2015

Gazelle said:
Will's style of writing emails is annoying

"Hey have you seen my new offer

It's something you have never seen before

It's a once in a lifetime opportunity

A chance to lift your game to the next level

And leave your opponents behind in the dust

While being astounded at your new-found spectacular game

That would leave even the best players in awe

I garantee that you have never seen this before

When you buy this you'll think, why didn't I buy this earlier?

Your game will rise to new dimensions

Opponents will now truly fear you

You'll be able to hit with far more confidence and accuracy than ever before

You won't believe how good you have become

All because of this one small secret

That you didn't know till now

But makes such a big change to your game

You'll be surprised at how easy it is

And opponents will be surprised at how easy you smash them off the court

They will look dumbfounded

Wonder why they suddenly are losing against you

So this is why I offer this to you

So you can become the player you always wanted

And reach a level you couldn't even dream of in your wildest dreams

To finally be able to play the way you want it

And it is all in this one small secret

Never released, until now

For you, not because I want money

But because I want YOU to improve YOUR game"

(half an hour later)

"Normally this product is worth 500 dollars

But because it's for you, I sell it for ONLY 100 dollars

To become the player you deserve to be

But be quick, cause this offer is only on for a limited amount of time

A one-time action that offers this product at this very cheap price

Chat soon
Will"

Chat soon. Did not read.

Rozroz · May 9, 2015

syc23 said:
I used to watch a lot of FYB videos when I was a beginner 4 years ago, however I quickly realised there were infinitely better videos elsewhere offered for free. Will is just a money grabber without offering anything unique.

Exactly.
his focus on marketing is almost obnoxious.

Roddick85 · May 9, 2015

No offence to FYB, they have to make a living like we all do, but those video's aren't worth much. I think at some point, we all watched some tennis videos on YT, or FYB over the years, but if you really want to learn how to play tennis, your much better off spending that money on real lessons than on videos.

Algo · May 9, 2015

Salzenstein would be the only online instructor I'd give my money to.
But I'd rather to real life coaches anyway.

treo · May 9, 2015

Will makes six figures from his videos.
http://jeffwalker.com/product-launch-case-study/

Attila_the_gorilla · May 9, 2015

The way to make long term success in any business is to get repeat customers and word-of-mouth referrals. I can't see how FYB would get much of that sort of stuff, sooner or later rip-off merchants run out of fools to rip off.

snowpuppy · May 9, 2015

Sad to say I've purchased his videos before and at no time did I felt it offered much to my game. Yes, they all need to make a living but he is showing more and more unsavory business practices with each program. From over the top promises, to celebrity tutorials (think celebrity chefs), to now a mini bait and switch (and this is the not the first, his previous serve program was the same. A shell program at a low price followed by 'if you want more? sign up for with more $$$) Also it is disturbing to see many other coaches now following his footsteps and by now I'm sure most of your email boxes are flooded. He has in the past deliver good free content so I figured he might deserve some money for that. Jeff Salzenstein is alright. I've tried his program and it is not too enlightening but once in awhile he offer at least something insightful and original. To this day I think john yandell's content is probably your best bet. But even that is more like food for tennis geeks. But his business is fair and there is no cheese buy lines. I echo the same sentiment as the rest: get a real coach. There is no "oh use my program and you will jump 0.5 or even 1.0 in ntrp rating!" Nothing beats hard work and dedication.

mightyrick · May 9, 2015

Thread reported. This doesn't belong in this section. It belongs in either Tips/Instruction (at best) or Odds&Ends.

HRB · May 9, 2015

Roddick85 said:
No offence to FYB, they have to make a living like we all do, but those video's aren't worth much. I think at some point, we all watched some tennis videos on YT, or FYB over the years, but if you really want to learn how to play tennis, your much better off spending that money on real lessons than on videos.

Depends on the type of learner you are. Natural athlete who played other sports and worked my way up to 4.5 without paying for a lesson ever. Used a variety of You Tube Vid's, a little of Will's stuff, lot's of slow mo' vids of all types of Pro's, and most importantly sought out better players, lost to them big time, but always learned!

Now I regularly hang with those dudes who used to beat my arse, and can grab a set now and then off a few aging 5.0's. I always beat my poor buddy who has spent thousands over the years on lessons, usually adding insult to injury with a beat down right after he comes straight from his latest one!

Not discounting teaching Pro's, that is a successful way for MANY...just pointing out that there are different paths to success, that's all. I'm a very visual learner, and I can carry that over to making physical/mechanical changes, so no need for much verbal instruction, so vid's and observation work good for me.

Roddick85 · May 9, 2015

HRB said:
Depends on the type of learner you are. Natural athlete who played other sports and worked my way up to 4.5 without paying for a lesson ever. Used a variety of You Tube Vid's, a little of Will's stuff, lot's of slow mo' vids of all types of Pro's, and most importantly sought out better players, lost to them big time, but always learned!

Now I regularly hang with those dudes who used to beat my arse, and can grab a set now and then off a few aging 5.0's. I always beat my poor buddy who has spent thousands over the years on lessons, usually adding insult to injury with a beat down right after he comes straight from his latest one!

Not discounting teaching Pro's, that is a successful way for MANY...just pointing out that there are different paths to success, that's all. I'm a very visual learner, and I can carry that over to making physical/mechanical changes, so no need for much verbal instruction, so vid's and observation work good for me.

I agree with you, it can work for some at the beginning. Myself, I had never taken a lesson with a pro up until 2 years ago. As visual as some of us are, I think that at some point, you'll reach a plateau. Sometimes we think we are doing things right like what we see, yet when we see a video of us playing, it might not be as great as what we thought. That's why I think having a pro is of greater help, because he see's you hit and can correct your technique.

wihamilton · May 9, 2015

Flatballs said:
So I listened to Will rant for a good 20 minutes about his new 55% Advantage program with Chris O'Shaughnessy, Who's work I really admire. $47 - I thought, hey that's not to bad I guess. After this 'amazing, special offer' price was spoken about over and over again...

Then I go down to pay and in fine, small print "Per month for two months"

What a joke. Sick of this deception! Not once did he say "total price $94" or "two payments"

No sign up for me

Hey man,

Can you email me (will.fyb@fuzzyyellowballs.com) the page in question?

Everything should be clearly labeled "2x$47" on the page (in huge text), and in the video as well, but if that wasn't your experience please point me in the right direction so I can see what's up.

Thanks!

Will

wihamilton · May 9, 2015

Flatballs said:
So I listened to Will rant for a good 20 minutes about his new 55% Advantage program with Chris O'Shaughnessy, Who's work I really admire. $47 - I thought, hey that's not too bad I guess. After this 'amazing, special offer' price was hammered over and over again...

Then I go down to pay and in fine, small print "Per month for two months"

What a joke. Sick of this deception! Not once did he say "total price $94" or "two payments"

No sign up for me

Hey responded to your post here:

http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?p=9298800&posted=1#post9298800

Thanks for your help!

Will

Deleted member 120290 · May 9, 2015

Don't trash someone because you did not read.

Disclaimer: I have no relationships with FYB but will be expecting some royalties to be rolling in soon...

SFrazeur · May 9, 2015

Nothing against Will personally, but I have always found his material to be "lipstick on a pig" instruction. But good on him for figuring out how to make 6 figures a year on it.

HRB · May 9, 2015

Roddick85 said:
I agree with you, it can work for some at the beginning. Myself, I had never taken a lesson with a pro up until 2 years ago. As visual as some of us are, I think that at some point, you'll reach a plateau. Sometimes we think we are doing things right like what we see, yet when we see a video of us playing, it might not be as great as what we thought. That's why I think having a pro is of greater help, because he see's you hit and can correct your technique.

I had a friend video tape me, the mistakes were glaring, I then corrected them myself.

Again, coaches relax, you'll never go out of business...I'm just a "do it myself" kinda guy!

SFrazeur · May 9, 2015

snowpuppy said:
Sad to say I've purchased his videos before and at no time did I felt it offered much to my game. Yes, they all need to make a living but he is showing more and more unsavory business practices with each program. From over the top promises, to celebrity tutorials (think celebrity chefs), to now a mini bait and switch (and this is the not the first, his previous serve program was the same. A shell program at a low price followed by 'if you want more? sign up for with more $$$) Also it is disturbing to see many other coaches now following his footsteps and by now I'm sure most of your email boxes are flooded. He has in the past deliver good free content so I figured he might deserve some money for that. Jeff Salzenstein is alright. I've tried his program and it is not too enlightening but once in awhile he offer at least something insightful and original. To this day I think john yandell's content is probably your best bet. But even that is more like food for tennis geeks. But his business is fair and there is no cheese buy lines. I echo the same sentiment as the rest: get a real coach. There is no "oh use my program and you will jump 0.5 or even 1.0 in ntrp rating!" Nothing beats hard work and dedication.

Yandell's tennisplayer.net is the science journal for tennis geeks. FYB stuff is like popular mechanics for kids on an off issue.

fecaleagle · May 9, 2015

Feel a bit guilty replying in this thread, given that Will is here, but I have purchased/hung around during the trial-periods of both Will (FYB) and Ian's (Essential Tennis) paid courses, and from what I've seen, I prefer Ian's content. Never saw anything in the pricing of either that could be described as misleading, but it's been a minute, so who knows.

wihamilton · May 9, 2015

fecaleagle said:
Feel a bit guilty replying in this thread, given that Will is here, but I have purchased/hung around during the trial-periods of both Will (FYB) and Ian's (Essential Tennis) paid courses, and from what I've seen, I prefer Ian's content.

Hey no worries! Ian is a great coach, and if his style resonates more w/ you then obviously you should go w/ him.

mikeler · May 9, 2015

HRB said:
I had a friend video tape me, the mistakes were glaring, I then corrected them myself.

Again, coaches relax, you'll never go out of business...I'm just a "do it myself" kinda guy!

I need to try this at some point but I dread watching myself on film.

Rozroz · May 9, 2015

mikeler said:
I need to try this at some point but I dread watching myself on film.

it's very purifying and immensely helpful in correcting what's needed..
but you'll be depressed for a week or so

Lotto · May 9, 2015

SFrazeur said:
Yandell's tennisplayer.net is the science journal for tennis geeks. FYB stuff is like popular mechanics for kids on an off issue.

Have to admit - I am a huge fan of Yandell's work.

Being brutally honest though it is a site that teaches you more how to work with technically advanced players. I've learned more about specific error correction, how to refine technique but there's not much about actually playing the game and applying technical changes to then actually playing the game and the process of technical correction.

Very good resource though. Personally, I have used FYB in the past, but this was ages ago and I don't pay much attention to their work now but I remember conversing with Will in the past and he was a nice guy.

sureshs · May 9, 2015

Why is this thread in the Pro Player section?

Mods, please move it to the Tips section

sureshs · May 9, 2015

If you can't read the fine print, how will you keep your eyes on the ball? Look at Federer reading the fine print on the ball. Probably the ad was meant to develop your visual acuity.

Bertie B · May 9, 2015

Who's that guy?

Rozroz said:
it's very purifying and immensely helpful in correcting what's needed..
but you'll be depressed for a week or so

Depressed indeed. Bought the camera myself, bought the tripod. First video saddened/shamed me greatly. Scared me off taping for a bit, truthfully. After a while shot the second video...painful. I won't be doing that anymore.

Hey, didn't know Ian had a paid course. He's a bit wordy for my taste, get to the point Ian!, but good stuff once he cough it out. I'm most excited about his progressed return drill - Block it! Guide it! Attack it!

HRB · May 9, 2015

mikeler said:
I need to try this at some point but I dread watching myself on film.

It sucks...aint going to lie!:twisted:

GuyClinch · May 9, 2015

That promotional video seemed more useful then usual..I got to give him that much. I liked it.

SFrazeur · May 10, 2015

Anyone have a link to the video/page in question?

hup · May 10, 2015

HRB said:
Depends on the type of learner you are. Natural athlete who played other sports and worked my way up to 4.5 without paying for a lesson ever. Used a variety of You Tube Vid's, a little of Will's stuff, lot's of slow mo' vids of all types of Pro's, and most importantly sought out better players, lost to them big time, but always learned!

Now I regularly hang with those dudes who used to beat my arse, and can grab a set now and then off a few aging 5.0's. I always beat my poor buddy who has spent thousands over the years on lessons, usually adding insult to injury with a beat down right after he comes straight from his latest one!

Not discounting teaching Pro's, that is a successful way for MANY...just pointing out that there are different paths to success, that's all. I'm a very visual learner, and I can carry that over to making physical/mechanical changes, so no need for much verbal instruction, so vid's and observation work good for me.

ah of course. everyone and their mother here is a natural athlete who can make it to a very solid level of play based on their inborn talent that is just so much better than everyone elses.

Rozroz · May 10, 2015

Bertie B said:
Depressed indeed. Bought the camera myself, bought the tripod. First video saddened/shamed me greatly. Scared me off taping for a bit, truthfully. After a while shot the second video...painful. I won't be doing that anymore.

Hey, didn't know Ian had a paid course. He's a bit wordy for my taste, get to the point Ian!, but good stuff once he cough it out. I'm most excited about his progressed return drill - Block it! Guide it! Attack it!

no man, you gotta fix what's makes you look/play bad,
and after a while take another video (2-3 months).
IT'S THE ONLY WAY to change your game.
i would tape every match/practice if it was less of a hassle.

but now i got a new PLAYSIGHT system in my club, so it would get pretty easy to watch myself (and check my lame serve speeds, LOL)

HRB · May 10, 2015

hup said:
ah of course. everyone and their mother here is a natural athlete who can make it to a very solid level of play based on their inborn talent that is just so much better than everyone elses.

2 things Mr. Insecure....first I pointed out coaching is the way for "Many", secondly I was defending alternative ways of learning, which happens to work FOR ME.

As for your sarcastic threatened comment...trust me I'm well aware tennis is NOT filled with natural athletes....all you have to do is have your ball roll onto an opposite court and look at the throwing skills of some players returning it back to you...YIKES!

Said it before, and I'll say it again...Coaches are SAFE, the need is plenty.

Fedinkum · May 10, 2015

That FYB guy is such a wind pipe...

jg153040 · May 10, 2015

HRB said:
2 things Mr. Insecure....first I pointed out coaching is the way for "Many", secondly I was defending alternative ways of learning, which happens to work FOR ME.

As for your sarcastic threatened comment...trust me I'm well aware tennis is NOT filled with natural athletes....all you have to do is have your ball roll onto an opposite court and look at the throwing skills of some players returning it back to you...YIKES!

Said it before, and I'll say it again...Coaches are SAFE, the need is plenty.

Well, what you do, I consider this coaching too. The only difference is that you don't pay for it

. So, no biggy, it's semantics issue.

hup · May 10, 2015

HRB said:
2 things Mr. Insecure....first I pointed out coaching is the way for "Many", secondly I was defending alternative ways of learning, which happens to work FOR ME.

As for your sarcastic threatened comment...trust me I'm well aware tennis is NOT filled with natural athletes....all you have to do is have your ball roll onto an opposite court and look at the throwing skills of some players returning it back to you...YIKES!

Said it before, and I'll say it again...Coaches are SAFE, the need is plenty.

I just smh whenever someone tries to pass off some not so subtle brag as 'advice' or 'sharing their experience'

RajS · May 10, 2015

sureshs said:
If you can't read the fine print, how will you keep your eyes on the ball? Look at Federer reading the fine print on the ball. Probably the ad was meant to develop your visual acuity.

LOL!! Great post, Suresh! Keep them coming!

Raul_SJ · May 10, 2015

SFrazeur said:
Anyone have a link to the video/page in question?

I'm on the FYB mailing list.

After taking a quick "Match Killer Survey", I get a link to a video describing the "55% Advantage" program with Craig O'Shannessy. On the video, it says the price of the program is $47...

So maybe Will can clarify as I am confused: Is this $47 program different than the $47x2 program mentioned earlier?

Flatballs · May 10, 2015

Raul_SJ said:
I'm on the FYB mailing list.

After taking a quick "Match Killer Survey", I get a link to a video describing the "55% Advantage" program with Craig O'Shannessy. On the video, it says the price of the program is $47.

So maybe Will can clarify as I am confused: Is this a different program than the $47x2 option Will mentioned earlier?

Thats what I saw

Deleted member 120290 · May 11, 2015

Ok, then I take back my comment. That is somewhat misleading...

sureshs · May 11, 2015

It is to teach you about being prepared. Just because an opponent appears to be hitting a normal groundie does not mean he could not suddenly change it into a drop shot with a subtle change in grip and swing at the last moment. So you must be alert to see what is really going to happen.

JohnYandell · May 11, 2015

snow puppy, sf, lotto,

Thanks for the great words--or I take them that way. Been looking at every tree in the forest with a high speed camera for about 10 years. That definitely could be construed as tennis geekdom...

In my opinion that's what it took/takes to create understanding of the real. I actually agree that we need more focus on the practical, and/or on simplified presentations of the complex... That is one direction we are heading but this will evolve from our knowledge base.

It's easy to say something. Much harder to be sure of what you say.

Very annoyed: Will Hamilton from FYB

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