Head still makes the best racquets

beltsman

G.O.A.T.
Despite the complaints about gimmicks, or confusing lines, or poor marketing, Head still makes the most playable racquets. Volkl is second for me in that category.

Babolat has no feel, too stiff, etc. Wilson is all over the place. Yonex doesn't quite hit the sweet spot for me. Prince Textreme isn't a great feel.

I might just stick with Head exclusively. All of their lines play well and do what they are intended to do.

Carry on.
 

TennisHound

Legend
Despite the complaints about gimmicks, or confusing lines, or poor marketing, Head still makes the most playable racquets. Volkl is second for me in that category.

Babolat has no feel, too stiff, etc. Wilson is all over the place. Yonex doesn't quite hit the sweet spot for me. Prince Textreme isn't a great feel.

I might just stick with Head exclusively. All of their lines play well and do what they are intended to do.

Carry on.
are you using the 360 Speed MP?
 

beltsman

G.O.A.T.
are you using the 360 Speed MP?

I have currently switched to the 360 Extreme MP. It gives better power with little noticeable loss in control. But the Speed is definitely still in my bag! I find that the 360 line is pretty interchangeable.
 
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gazz1

Semi-Pro
Despite the complaints about gimmicks, or confusing lines, or poor marketing, Head still makes the most playable racquets. Volkl is second for me in that category.

Babolat has no feel, too stiff, etc. Wilson is all over the place. Yonex doesn't quite hit the sweet spot for me. Prince Textreme isn't a great feel.

I might just stick with Head exclusively. All of their lines play well and do what they are intended to do.

Carry on.
Why do you say that?

I’ve never used a head racket and the TW reviews never seem to rave about them. I’m curious because it’s the only major brand that I haven’t tried.

I tend to like like the rackets that are reasonably powerful with a bit of control such as the Babolat P17 but it’s an arm wrecker so I’m currently using a Prince TT315 which is similar but more comfortable.

Is there anything in the Head lineup that you would recommend?
 

leojramirez

Rookie
Been playing with the Radical Touch MP and just bought my second frame as its now on discount and will be tougher to find soon. Its working great for me, really stable and muted, just what my hand and wrist needs with a bit of extra weight in the buttcap. And I can finally hit winners on clay as I was struggling in this aspect with my Wilson Ultra Tours. I'll still keep the UTs though.
I was a long time Yonex user and it fell out with me since the Dual G, shame because I really like their head shape.
 

Crocodile

G.O.A.T.
I think they used to make the best racquets back in the twin tube days and hope that the Gravity will be a step back in the right direction. At present the only Head racquet I like is the Head Prestige MP. The Speed MP is pretty OK.
Volkl with their V Feel range at present is a disappointment to me especially the current 10 series.
While everyone has different needs at present I like what Prince and Pro Kennex are doing and I like the Yonex V Core 95 but the V pro 97 330g I feel is less substantial than the old orange frames.
 

Issya

New User
Can't say it's current but I recently picked up a Youtek IG Prestige MP. The only racquets I've ever known were modern tweeners and this one feels completely different. Although it's 20 grams heavier than what I am used to, I jived with it right away and it feels like a natural extension of my arm. Hopefully the Gravity will be similar because older racquets are hard to get in good condition.

Edit: Forgot to add that I am also loving 18x20. I was staying away from it because of less spin but I am still able to get a lot of spin when I want it but also much more control.
 

Dominic

Semi-Pro
Im a big fan..
Back using the Graphene XT Speed Pro.
Had a short hit with the Speed 360 Pro...very decent
Looking forward to the Gravity
 

Dartagnan64

G.O.A.T.
I don't think you've stated any facts to back up your claim of "Head makes the best racquets". The best you can claim is that they make racquets that suit you personally. An n=1 claim can never be used to make such a big generalization. If you told us you spoke to 100 pros and they all stated Head made the best frames. Or 1000 rec players surveyed, then you might have a little weight behind the claim.

Epidemiology aside, Head makes some good frames and some bad frames as do most manufacturers. The Head Ti S6 is the most common Head frame I see at the club and it's over 20 years old. That is a worrisome sign if you ask me.

From personal experience I've only tried the Head Ti S6 and Head Extreme 360 MP and didn't really like either. So my n=1 experience is less than flattering. Of course I might be bitter about Head stealing Agassi from Prince back in the day.
 

bleno567

Professional
All the Head bashing that goes on on this forum is because of them largely ignoring their old prestige/radical enthusiasts. If they would just release a Head "Classic" line of their all time greats, that would all dissipate and people would stop ragging on their new racquets. This is essentially what prince did with their POG re-boots, and Wilson when they re-released the PS 6.0. Original. Even Nike realized the demand for their old breathe free 2s and brought those back for a while. Head was basically already doing this up to the late 2000s by keeping the Prestige Classic 600 in their line-up.

They wouldn't even have to mention any pros actually using those frames. They could stick to their current "pros endorse this racquet" strategy, which is what they did with Safin endorsing the latest prestige Mid when everyone knew it was really a PC 600.

It's not a long list of racquets they'd need to do this for either:

1) PT57 (if they really want to be crowd pleasers, both a 16x19 & 18/20 version)
2) Classic Mid
3) A LM Radical (or whatever is most similar to the frame Nole really uses)
 

am1899

Legend
All the Head bashing that goes on on this forum is because of them largely ignoring their old prestige/radical enthusiasts.

That’s some of it.

But we ought not lose sight of Head’s overall change of direction toward making stiffer frames (arguably to chase away some of Babolat’s increasing market share). (Which, in my view, was a colossally catastrophic mistake). I’m sure some will trip over each other to yell from the rafters that the newest Head sticks have shifted back toward being more flexible. While the RA specs support that, I don’t think it’s necessarily true. For one, many of Head’s newer frames have an extraordinary thin throat bridge. IMHO, there’s no other reason for Head to do this other than to make frames flex more in that area. Sure, some people like the resulting feel. But it also has the added benefit of skewing the RA lower, while the hoop remains as stiff, if not more so than outgoing models. At the club I work at, it wasn’t an uncommon observation made by those who tested the newest Speeds in particular, that although the RA is lower, the racquet still feels jarring and stiff - especially on off center hits.

All of that said, there’s more than enough blame to go around - Head isn’t the only brand making gold for the pros and selling cheap junk to the masses. Most brands are doing the same thing.
 

rafa_prestige89

Professional
All the Head bashing that goes on on this forum is because of them largely ignoring their old prestige/radical enthusiasts. If they would just release a Head "Classic" line of their all time greats, that would all dissipate and people would stop ragging on their new racquets. This is essentially what prince did with their POG re-boots, and Wilson when they re-released the PS 6.0. Original. Even Nike realized the demand for their old breathe free 2s and brought those back for a while. Head was basically already doing this up to the late 2000s by keeping the Prestige Classic 600 in their line-up.

They wouldn't even have to mention any pros actually using those frames. They could stick to their current "pros endorse this racquet" strategy, which is what they did with Safin endorsing the latest prestige Mid when everyone knew it was really a PC 600.

It's not a long list of racquets they'd need to do this for either:

1) PT57 (if they really want to be crowd pleasers, both a 16x19 & 18/20 version)
2) Classic Mid
3) A LM Radical (or whatever is most similar to the frame Nole really uses)

*Safin really did use the latest Prestige Mid (Microgel) he endorsed...
 

bleno567

Professional
That’s some of it.

But we ought not lose sight of Head’s overall change of direction toward making stiffer frames (arguably to chase away some of Babolat’s increasing market share). (Which, in my view, was a colossally catastrophic mistake). I’m sure some will trip over each other to yell from the rafters that the newest Head sticks have shifted back toward being more flexible. While the RA specs support that, I don’t think it’s necessarily true. For one, many of Head’s newer frames have an extraordinary thin throat bridge. IMHO, there’s no other reason for Head to do this other than to make frames flex more in that area. Sure, some people like the resulting feel. But it also has the added benefit of skewing the RA lower, while the hoop remains as stiff, if not more so than outgoing models. At the club I work at, it wasn’t an uncommon observation made by those who tested the newest Speeds in particular, that although the RA is lower, the racquet still feels jarring and stiff - especially on off center hits.

All of that said, there’s more than enough blame to go around - Head isn’t the only brand making gold for the pros and selling cheap junk to the masses. Most brands are doing the same thing.

Very interesting analysis. I haven't hit with that many of the new frames, because their specs are way off for me, so I didn't realize that about the bridges. I also didn't really hone in on Head's shift to stiffer frames, because it didn't happen in a vacuum. Every other company also did it at the same time.
 

bleno567

Professional
*Safin really did use the latest Prestige Mid (Microgel) he endorsed...

Huh. That must have been the tail end of his career then. The Microgel came out in late 2007 and he retired in 2009. I know for sure he used the PC 600 for the majority of his career.
 

tribesmen

Professional
I think that Head is no worse or better than other manufacturers, but Head currently makes racquets that has definitely the most metallic, empty, hollow feeling when contacting the ball. Really not my cup of tea. I hope Gravity line will change this.
 
D

Deleted member 756272

Guest
Played with the Wilson Pro Staff mid size frames as a junior. In the past year and half, I've been looking for a replacement and have been rotating between various Yonex, Wilson, ProKennex and Head frames. Every racquet had been customized to be of similar static weight, balance and swing weight.

Surprisingly, I find myself consistently returning to a pair of Head Microgel Radical 18x20s from the Tennis Warehouse sale last year. Also got a PT630 to see what the hype was all about. Never thought I'd be using Head, but I gotta say, really really loving these two frames.

(Haven't tried the recent Heads, so no comment on the tin-ny, hollow feel, but a leaded and capped MG Radical feels solid)

I'm going to give the Babolat Pure Strike 18x20 and the Wilson 6.1 95 18x20 a go before accepting the fact that the cheapest frames are my favorite.
 

CiscoPC600

Hall of Fame
I might give Head another shot, but my Yonex VCORE 95 is sweet. I flirted with the Babolot Pure Drive and Wilson Blade 98 countervail but the former was too stiff and jarring and the latter had awful quality control. One of the Blades nearest spec was okay but too head heavy and noticeably less spin. I'm surprised it's popular among juniors and college players. Although, I wouldn't double D1 college players are using pro stocks.

Yonex has great quality control and the lines are different enough.
 

am1899

Legend
Very interesting analysis. I haven't hit with that many of the new frames, because their specs are way off for me, so I didn't realize that about the bridges. I also didn't really hone in on Head's shift to stiffer frames, because it didn't happen in a vacuum. Every other company also did it at the same time.

Yeah, the Graphene XT series is where I first noticed this. I think initially it was just a couple frames that had it. I’m guessing but I think the instinct rev had it, and possibly the Speed rev as well. Those actually made sense - Head was trying to cut weight everywhere possible with the rev frames. But now the Speed and Radical mp’s have the thin bridge. Interestingly, the S’s in the Speed and radical lines don’t have it. But I think the Radical pro does. Can’t remember whether the Speed pro does or does not.

I do see your point - it was a little hard to pick Head out of crowd of brands doing the same thing (moving toward stiff). One caveat I would make is Head was so well known for their (generally) softer, more plush feeling frames - even outside of the Prestige line. So when Head shifted gears and went stiff, they might have alienated a lot more folks than the just the Prestige fans.

Right now, I have to give the nod to Yonex. Comfortable, spinny, and powerful...the triad of success!

Of the bigger brands, I would be inclined to agree. Also, Yonex’s quality control is better than Wilson, Head, or Babolat - by a long shot.

I would also give an honorable mention to Prince for their more recent offerings - the Phantom and Tour lines especially. Full disclosure that I’m using a 93p, so my opinion may be biased.
 

A_Instead

Legend
Each manufacture has a exceptional one in their line up..
Some just have more than one..
Just like they all have duds..some more than others..
 

beltsman

G.O.A.T.
That’s some of it.

But we ought not lose sight of Head’s overall change of direction toward making stiffer frames (arguably to chase away some of Babolat’s increasing market share). (Which, in my view, was a colossally catastrophic mistake). I’m sure some will trip over each other to yell from the rafters that the newest Head sticks have shifted back toward being more flexible. While the RA specs support that, I don’t think it’s necessarily true. For one, many of Head’s newer frames have an extraordinary thin throat bridge. IMHO, there’s no other reason for Head to do this other than to make frames flex more in that area. Sure, some people like the resulting feel. But it also has the added benefit of skewing the RA lower, while the hoop remains as stiff, if not more so than outgoing models. At the club I work at, it wasn’t an uncommon observation made by those who tested the newest Speeds in particular, that although the RA is lower, the racquet still feels jarring and stiff - especially on off center hits.

All of that said, there’s more than enough blame to go around - Head isn’t the only brand making gold for the pros and selling cheap junk to the masses. Most brands are doing the same thing.

Stiff hoop and flexy beam is the way to go my man.
 

AggieJason

Semi-Pro
I have currently switched to the 360 Extreme MP. It gives better power with little noticeable loss in control. But the Speed is definitely still in my bag! I find that the 360 line is pretty interchangeable.

What string and tension are you using in your Extreme MP?? I just purchased one from TW. Had it strung with Volkl Cyclone @57 lbs. I also have a Graphene Touch Speed Pro.
 

[d]ragon

Hall of Fame
In my opinion, Head is one of the worst manufacturers right now. This is based on their overall products for the general market (not us neurotics TTWers) in my area over the last few years. They come up with good racquets once in awhile, but as a whole, they have been trending down.
1a. Too many lines with too many racquets racquets with too overlapping specs. There is not enough differentiation between the MPs from the Speed, Radical, Instinct, Extreme, now Gravity (as if they needed another racquet line).
1b. Inconsistent product lines i.e. the Pro model is too different from the MP which is too different from the S. Other companies typically maintain the same frame (pattern, headsize, beam), only varying weight, but Head likes to change a lot within the same line. This makes it harder to keep a player within same line as they grow older.
2. Polarizing paint colors and designs i.e. most people either like 'em or don't
3. The double shared hole grommets at the top used for a good amount of time. They caused strings to stick out beyond the bumperguard, leading to a lot of premature breakage if not carefully installed. Luckily they seem to be phasing these out now
4. Alienating their heritage player base. Radicals and Prestiges have moved very far from what they used to be. It's fine to trend towards stiffer, but why do it to two lines that have been very successful lines in the past? Let's not forget the great Radical Graphene bastardization...
5. Cheaper and flimsier grommets/bumperguards. To be fair, many manufacturers have been doing this, but taken within context to all the other trends, its becomes a weak point
6. Failure to sign exciting pros or market efficiently. Djokovic and Murray were at the top of their games for 2008-present, but the Speed and Radical lines never flew off the shelf like Aero/PD/Pure Strike/Blade/Prostaff (at least in my area). Lost Thiem to Babolat. Zverev doesn't sell and now is getting his own line? Sharapova doesn't sell anymore (hope they're not still paying her the big bucks). Cilic and Gasquet endorsing dying lines
7. 2 different grip shapes. This just adds to the lack of consistency across racquets
 
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[d]ragon

Hall of Fame
8. Their racquets have failed to consistently impress in the TW Playtests. Of course, the playtest is a subjective process and is by no means a true barometer, but its a consistent metric, and HEAD racquets have failed to score above the low 80s year after year. When taken as a trend, it's pretty worrisome, especially because TW is has incentive to bump numbers (at least slightly).
 
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beltsman

G.O.A.T.
What string and tension are you using in your Extreme MP?? I just purchased one from TW. Had it strung with Volkl Cyclone @57 lbs. I also have a Graphene Touch Speed Pro.

Hyper-G 17 @ around 50 lbs. I actually don't love Hyper-G 17 - I only play with Hyper-G 16, normally. But this racquet came with 17. I can never find enough control with anything above a 16. So I will restring when the time comes (although I'll try out Black Knight/Ghost Wire). I have Hyper-G 16 on hand as a backup.
 

beltsman

G.O.A.T.
In my opinion, Head is one of the worst manufacturers right now. This is based on their overall products for the general market (not us neurotics TTWers) in my area over the last few years. They come up with good racquets once in awhile, but as a whole, they have been trending down.
1a. Too many lines with too many racquets racquets with too overlapping specs. There is not enough differentiation between the MPs from the Speed, Radical, Instinct, Extreme, now Gravity (as if they needed another racquet line).
1b. Inconsistent product lines i.e. the Pro model is too different from the MP which is too different from the S. Other companies typically maintain the same frame (pattern, headsize, beam), only varying weight, but Head likes to change a lot within the same line. This makes it harder to keep a player within same line as they grow older.
2. Polarizing paint colors and designs i.e. most people either like 'em or don't
3. The double shared hole grommets at the top used for a good amount of time. They caused strings to stick out beyond the bumperguard, leading to a lot of premature breakage if not carefully installed. Luckily they seem to be phasing these out now
4. Alienating their heritage player base. Radicals and Prestiges have moved very far from what they used to be. It's fine to trend towards stiffer, but why do it to two lines that have been very successful lines in the past? Let's not forget the great Radical Graphene bastardization...
5. Cheaper and flimsier grommets/bumperguards. To be fair, many manufacturers have been doing this, but taken within context to all the other trends, its becomes a weak point
6. Failure to sign exciting pros or market efficiently. Djokovic and Murray were at the top of their games for 2008-present, but the Speed and Radical lines never flew off the shelf like Aero/PD/Pure Strike/Blade/Prostaff (at least in my area). Lost Thiem to Babolat. Zverev doesn't sell and now is getting his own line? Sharapova doesn't sell anymore (hope they're not still paying her the big bucks). Cilic and Gasquet endorsing dying lines
7. 2 different grip shapes. This just adds to the lack of consistency across racquets

1) Simps use other lines like Babolat lol good luck with your hollow trampoline and elbow issues
1a) have you seen the Baboat lineup? lol
 

[d]ragon

Hall of Fame
1) Simps use other lines like Babolat lol good luck with your hollow trampoline and elbow issues
1a) have you seen the Baboat lineup? lol

1) Babolat outsells Head by a far margin. If you don't like Babolat or the stiffness, that's your prerogative, but most people who use Babolat don't have arm issues. If this were true, they would not put out best seller after best seller for the last decade and half. Plus, the Extreme, Instinct, and now Radical lines have generally had RAs in the the upper 60's so it's not like HEAD is championing arm friendliness. Either way, I did not mention of the subjective feels of any racquets as a pro/con of any manufacturer
1a) Babolat offers 3 performance lines lines with clear differentiation: power, spin, control (relative to their other lines). These are simplifications, but the general consumer only needs simple, but clear marketing on what makes each line different.

Obviously, you like Head racquets a lot, and there's nothing wrong with that. I actually like the 360 Speed MP myself. But I'm talking about HEAD from a macro-perspective (trends across entire line-ups) and why I think they have declined. If you want to debate these points, I'm open to it, but you're gonna have to come up with better than "simps" and "lol"
 
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Frans Bleker

Professional
1) Simps use other lines like Babolat lol good luck with your hollow trampoline and elbow issues
1a) have you seen the Baboat lineup? lol

Lolling about just Babolat?

I think for a while they thought about adding Graphene as a synonym for Elbow issues in the dictionary.
 

nvr2old

Hall of Fame
Played with the Wilson Pro Staff mid size frames as a junior. In the past year and half, I've been looking for a replacement and have been rotating between various Yonex, Wilson, ProKennex and Head frames. Every racquet had been customized to be of similar static weight, balance and swing weight.

Surprisingly, I find myself consistently returning to a pair of Head Microgel Radical 18x20s from the Tennis Warehouse sale last year. Also got a PT630 to see what the hype was all about. Never thought I'd be using Head, but I gotta say, really really loving these two frames.

(Haven't tried the recent Heads, so no comment on the tin-ny, hollow feel, but a leaded and capped MG Radical feels solid)

I'm going to give the Babolat Pure Strike 18x20 and the Wilson 6.1 95 18x20 a go before accepting the fact that the cheapest frames are my favorite.

What grommets do you use to cap the MG Radical? Prestige MP?
 

Power Player

Bionic Poster
What string and tension are you using in your Extreme MP?? I just purchased one from TW. Had it strung with Volkl Cyclone @57 lbs. I also have a Graphene Touch Speed Pro.

How do you like Cyclone? I have a reel of it and I haven’t used it in ages. Currently have Max Power rough 17 in mine, which is what I use. That or RS Lyon. I think I will try the RS Lyon in it next, but I also have some head Hawk touch,. All 17 gauge though, and I feel like this frame may work better with 16.
 

beltsman

G.O.A.T.
1) Babolat outsells Head by a far margin. If you don't like Babolat or the stiffness, that's your prerogative, but most people who use Babolat don't have arm issues. If this were true, they would not put out best seller after best seller for the last decade and half. Plus, the Extreme, Instinct, and now Radical lines have generally had RAs in the the upper 60's so it's not like HEAD is championing arm friendliness. Either way, I did not mention of the subjective feels of any racquets as a pro/con of any manufacturer
1a) Babolat offers 3 performance lines lines with clear differentiation: power, spin, control (relative to their other lines). These are simplifications, but the general consumer only needs simple, but clear marketing on what makes each line different.

Obviously, you like Head racquets a lot, and there's nothing wrong with that. I actually like the 360 Speed MP myself. But I'm talking about HEAD from a macro-perspective (trends across entire line-ups) and why I think they have declined. If you want to debate these points, I'm open to it, but you're gonna have to come up with better than "simps" and "lol"

Eh I'm just having some fun, Babolats work for a lot of people, just not for me.

I do think the Babolat lines are better defined but not remarkably so.
 

AggieJason

Semi-Pro
How do you like Cyclone? I have a reel of it and I haven’t used it in ages. Currently have Max Power rough 17 in mine, which is what I use. That or RS Lyon. I think I will try the RS Lyon in it next, but I also have some head Hawk touch,. All 17 gauge though, and I feel like this frame may work better with 16.
Meh. Not crazy about the Cyclone so far. Maybe strung it a bit too tight. Definitely gonna try something different. Maybe RPM Blast Rough or BiPhase.
 

Power Player

Bionic Poster
Meh. Not crazy about the Cyclone so far. Maybe strung it a bit too tight. Definitely gonna try something different. Maybe RPM Blast Rough or BiPhase.

Yeah Cyclone is springy. I like a more honest and controlled response which is why I like max power or RS Lyon. I think they called it max power just so people know it's an ALU power clone. It's a very low powered string. Ill try the head hawk touch next since I have a pack sitting here.
 

TheIntrovert

Hall of Fame
Yonex is the best of the new bunch of rackets that I’ve tried as a whole. But nothing beats a box beam Wilson for me
 
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