06-07 Nadal vs. 23-24 Alcaraz at Wimbledon?

More impressive at Wimbledon age 20-21?

  • Rafael Nadal

    Votes: 35 55.6%

  • Carlos Alcaraz

    Votes: 23 36.5%

  • I'm pleading a Push here.

    Votes: 5 7.9%
  • Total voters
    63
BGod

BGod

G.O.A.T.
Even with next-gen cheerleading this one should be juicy no?

Nadal beat Nieminen-Baghdatis then lost to Federer in 4 in 06
Beat Berdych and Novak (r in 3rd) then lost to Federer in 5 in 07

Alcaraz we know Rune-Medvedev-36 year old Novak then this year Paul-Medvedev-37 year old Novak.


I mean it's really tough because the easiest analysis is Federer by miles superior to Novak as a finals opponent, but things get dicey after that.
 
By the time Raz is done with Wimbledon he would have left Rafa far far behind in his rear view mirror. Barring injury and Sinner somehow stepping up, he can this many times even before he turns 30. Roger’s record 8 may get get blown out. We will then have to use hypotheticals and era strengths to justify Roger as the grass goat which he is right now.
 
Nadal from 06 is seriously underrated on here, he was an absolute monster from the baseline who could serve surprisingly big too (held serve 80 times in a row before the final). I think 23 Raz had advantage on serve + return overall though so would be close in the actual matchup.

Nadal from 07 would beat the Alcaraz we saw today hands down. Would punish the lack of rally tolerance and Raz wasn’t serving high %s today so would be punished. I’d have backed Nadal in the clutch too.
 
Last edited:
Feels like a bit more of a toss-up after today. Yes, I know 37 year old bum knee Djoker isn't even 10% the opponent peakiest of peak Fed was. But Carlos was still incredibly impressive today, outside of just 1 game.
 
RS said:
Come on 07 late rounds Nadal especially the F against Fed I will allow you the rest as a comp
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Nah. Alcaraz's tempo is suffocating at top gear. Would be interesting to see Nadal try to resist that. Just generally more impressed with Alcaraz's complete game with serious weapons in every possible facet. — Though I still prefer how a young Nadal managed the flow of matches, I just don't think his game was as mature/developed when addressing all the shots. Of course on clay I'm picking Nadal and with far more confidence than I'd pick Alcaraz on grass, but what Alcaraz has done so far at this stage is historic, as so it was with Nadal, so it's hardly unreasonable to back him in general at Wimbledon. And I suspect he'll end his career with a fat bag of Wimbledon titles... because he'll just generally prove to be a better grasscourt player than Nadal.

(Also, frankly, I think if you just plop Alcaraz back into 2006-07 he'd fare quite a bit better than dropping the 06-07 Nadal into 2023-24. I think the general state of the game and the tech was similar enough to imagine such a scenario. I just see an obvious big step up in overall completeness of game in Alcaraz on a historical level. Less time to breathe in rallies these days.)
 
pirhaksar said:
By the time Raz is done with Wimbledon he would have left Rafa far far behind in his rear view mirror. Barring injury and Sinner somehow stepping up, he can this many times even before he turns 30. Roger’s record 8 may get get blown out. We will then have to use hypotheticals and era strengths to justify Roger as the grass goat which he is right now.
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Saved for best sarcasm post of 2024 thank you.
 
-NN- said:
Nah. Alcaraz's tempo is suffocating at top gear. Would be interesting to see Nadal try to resist that. Just generally more impressed with Alcaraz's complete game with serious weapons in every possible facet. — Though I still prefer how a young Nadal managed the flow of matches, I just don't think his game was as mature/developed when addressing all the shots. Of course on clay I'm picking Nadal and with far more confidence than I'd pick Alcaraz on grass, but what Alcaraz has done so far at this stage is historic, as so it was with Nadal, so it's hardly unreasonable to back him in general at Wimbledon. And I suspect he'll end his career with a fat bag of Wimbledon titles... because he'll just generally prove to be a better grasscourt player than Nadal.

(Also, frankly, I think if you just plop Alcaraz back into 2006-07 he'd fare quite a bit better than dropping the 06-07 Nadal into 2023-24. I think the general state of the game and the tech was similar enough to imagine such a scenario. I just see an obvious big step up in overall completeness of game in Alcaraz on a historical level. Less time to breathe in rallies these days.)
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For me Nadal at least in the 07 final is just too convincing to pick Alcaraz RN. For 2006 I get why somebody would argue about the lack of grass dynamics and experience.

No doubt when it comes to HC Alcaraz matured quicker on a separate note he hits flatter than Nadal at same age.
 
RS said:
For me Nadal at least in the 07 final is just too convincing to pick Alcaraz RN. For 2006 I get why somebody would argue about the lack of grass dynamics and experience.

No doubt when it comes to HC Alcaraz matured quicker on a separate note he hits flatter than Nadal at same age.
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yeah no chance 05 or 06 Nadal could beat Sinner Tiafoe and Ruud on a HC. That's a bridge too far.
 
jl809 said:
Nadal from 06 is seriously underrated on here, he was an absolute monster from the baseline who could serve surprisingly big too (held serve 80 times in a row before the final). I think 23 Raz had advantage on serve + return overall though so would be close in the actual matchup.

Nadal from 07 would beat the Alcaraz we saw today hands down. Would punish the lack of rally tolerance and Raz wasn’t serving high %s today so would be punished. I’d have backed Nadal in the clutch too.
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except 2008 final 5th set, when was nadal ever clutch at wimbledon?
 
Alcaraz destroys both versions of Nadal
Nadal can't just moonball to BH and Raz would smash winners off Nadal's loopy shots.
He would also eat Nadal's weak serves for breakfast
 
TheFifthSet said:
‘07 Nadal won something like 101 of 166 baseline points against Fed.

He’s the best of the four.
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I don't know where this number is coming from but I guarantee you there weren't 166 neutral baseline points in that match. There were 134 points longer than 3 strokes and probably only half at most were neutral (tons of <10 ball rallies on Ned's serve won't be neutral for instance since he won't finish all the points as quickly or decisively as Fed).
 
jl809 said:
Nadal from 06 is seriously underrated on here, he was an absolute monster from the baseline who could serve surprisingly big too (held serve 80 times in a row before the final). I think 23 Raz had advantage on serve + return overall though so would be close in the actual matchup.

Nadal from 07 would beat the Alcaraz we saw today hands down. Would punish the lack of rally tolerance and Raz wasn’t serving high %s today so would be punished. I’d have backed Nadal in the clutch too.
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Wowee :D
 
guilhermefdc said:
I'd mix and match:
2007 Nadal > 2024 Alcaraz > 2023 Alcaraz > 2006 Nadal
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2023 Alcaraz got breadsticked by 23 Novak....

06 Fed would have bagelled him just like he did Nadal in the opening set...

Problem for Carlos is, Fed06 wouldn't allow him back into the match like 23Djok did.

In that 2006 final, Nadal's nerves settled after the first set and he started playing much better which caught Fed off guard a bit. I don't think Carlos' game would've given him the same trouble.

Plus in that 2006 final, Nadal's 3rd set was miles above anything 23 Carlos produced. Both had a flat 4th set.
 
Backspin1183 said:
People have lost sight of just how good Nadal was in 2006 for his age. That match could have been a five-set thriller (Nadal was very close to winning the second set TB). And this was against Federer at his peak, the best (modern) grass player in history.
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He served for the 2nd set too iirc
 
Backspin1183 said:
People have lost sight of just how good Nadal was in 2006 for his age. That match could have been a five-set thriller (Nadal was very close to winning the second set TB). And this was against Federer at his peak, the best (modern) grass player in history.
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agree on the first part.
Nadal was serving for the 2nd set, but not close to winning the 2nd set TB.
I don't think it would have gone 5 though even if nadal had won the 2nd set. Federer would have raised his level just like he did in the 4th set after losing the 3rd set.
nadal in 2006 Wim final wasn't handling the slice as well on grass as he would in the upcoming years.
 
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