[1] Nadal vs. [24] del Potro

Who will win?


  • Total voters
    119
  • Poll closed .

cc0509

Talk Tennis Guru
h2h is so irrelevant who cares. The momentum thing, that's probably a better argument.

I wouldn't want to see Nadal be 1-0 over Federer at the USO after all these years of waiting for that match to occur. I agree with you that h2h is not important but who would want to listen to all of the BS that would be spewed if that happened? Not me. This way, Federer bypasses that and keeps his hc momentum moving forward.
 

Federer and Del Potro

Bionic Poster
No lifers living through success and failures of others. Sad.

It really is my friend, I'm all for rabid fandom and logical debate, I get that. But I think we can at least be civilized enough to not attack people. Attacking players is a little less egregious, they'll never read this forum, but attacking users of the forum..uncalled for. I've even seen people use stuff others have said in confidence against them (ie a user saying they have a certain illness and being attacked for it later on). I love TTW but there are some disgusting sides to the forum as well. But, thus is life. I can only control me, not anyone else.

I've made a really strong and concerted effort not to attack people personally. At the end of the day there is a human behind that screen + username, a human whose story I do not know. I will try to make their story a little better by not attacking them personally.
 
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zagor

Bionic Poster
I understand what you're saying but I don't have the energy to argue about draws because for me it's pointless. If Nadal wins #16, he cements himself as the second greatest in the Open Era behind Federer. That's how the history books will interpret it, commentators, analysts, etc.

I don't think you can succesfuly compare eras but yeah, whatever the draw when you win a slam, you win a slam. You still gotta put yourself out there and stay healthy. Nadal has been playing some great HC tennis this year and this time it looks like it will be rewarded with a slam title, one one can take that away from him.
 

Rafa24

Hall of Fame
True or not, you can't cherry pick periods that suit your argument. Fed turned pro in 1999, evaluating his career from 2008 is utterly biased. That's shaving off nearly a decade of his tennis career.
I didn't make the post. Just stating facts. They were better from 2008-2017. Of course they should be because fed is 5-6 years older than nadal/djoker. on the flipside he got to play a lot of people not named nadal/djoko in his prime. And I firmly believe those three are the 3 best to ever play.
 

GOATzilla

Banned
jane-dance.gif
 

cc0509

Talk Tennis Guru
So you think he tanked? I thought fed would pulled a Robredo. It was weird seeing that match especially that 3rd set tiebreaker. It was fishy.

He certainly played brain-dead tactics vs Del Potro, don't you think? I simply think he didn't want to progress because he knew he wasn't in good enough form and couldn't win it. He said so himself.
 
Z

Zara

Guest
I just wish he had played fed tonight. I'm certain this Nadal would have settled the score from AO17.

He would have (and at RG too but Fed made a wise decision there by opting out). Federer was struggling from the get go there. He was fresh at the start of this year but as the year progressed, he started to show signs of struggle so this is not too surprising.
 

cc0509

Talk Tennis Guru
you're right. My point is: Rafa was in no place to win this slam a week and a half ago. If not for the slowed down court and not facing a top-20 player all tournament, I very much doubt he would be in the tournament right now.

But it is what it is

Maybe but we'll never know.
 

The_Order

G.O.A.T.
I don't think you can succesfuly compare eras but yeah, whatever the draw when you win a slam, you win a slam. You still gotta put yourself out there and stay healthy. Nadal has been playing some great HC tennis this year and this time it looks like it will be rewarded with a slam title, one one can take that away from him.

He's lost something like 7 HC finals in a row since Dubai 2014! Surely the drought has to break this time.
 

icedevil0289

G.O.A.T.
Just real unfortunate. The decorum between Fedal fans was a lot better when they weren't on top of the sport anymore. Now, instead of enjoying the last time it will ever happen, instead of celebrating it together they're focused on pointless arguments like GOAT / easy draws / court speed / blah blah blah. I like the intelligent debate/discourse but usually it's just someone attacking someone because they don't like the same tennis player they do. o_O

i feel like it will always be there tbh, they have a lot of history, a lot of painful losses between (more so on fed's side imo) and it definitely dissipated when novak was dominating, but idt it ever truly left. i'll admit not fond of nadal in general will never be and fedal, rafa fans, etc brings out the petty in me, can't help it perhaps more so than novak fans and i know fed/novak fanbase as had their fare share of fighting. it would probably help to step away from the forum and re group and remember the great year the respective favorite player had. i think i'll probably be doing that post USO.
 

zagor

Bionic Poster
He's lost something like 7 HC finals in a row since Dubai 2014! Surely the drought has to break this time.

Well he's the overwhelming favourite but that's why they play the matches. As you say the drought has to end sometime (I thought it was gonna be Miami this year but that tourney seems jinxed for Nadal).

I just hope people don't crap on Anderson regardless, the guy played some inspiring tennis and deserved his breakthrough. Won't be easy facing a 15 slam winner in the final, that's for sure.
 

Federer and Del Potro

Bionic Poster
i feel like it will always be there tbh, they have a lot of history, a lot of painful losses between (more so on fed's side imo) and it definitely dissipated when novak was dominating, but idt it ever truly left. i'll admit not fond of nadal in general will never be and fedal, rafa fans, etc brings out the petty in me, can't help it perhaps more so than novak fans and i know fed/novak fanbase as had their fare share of fighting. it would probably help to step away from the forum and re group and remember the great year the respective favorite player had. i think i'll probably be doing that post USO.

I love the rivalry and banter between fans. As long as it doesn't attack the person/poster personally, I'm really not going to be upset. Like I said, I'm even fine with attacking the players, to a degree. The trolls I'm talking about are the ones trying to be bullies, not the ones trolling in a comical sense, which is fine and a posting style I really enjoy (that's what keeps me on this forum).

IE: @Sentinel , @stringertom , @Poisoned Slice , etc. - can troll, but in a non attacking, non denigrating way.

Trolling in jest = hilarious (this is cool)
Trolling to attack = bullying (this is not cool)
 

icedevil0289

G.O.A.T.
Well he's the overwhelming favourite but that's why they play the matches. As you say the drought has to end sometime (I thought it was gonna be Miami this year but that tourney seems jinxed for Nadal).

I just hope people don't crap on Anderson regardless, the guy played some inspiring tennis and deserved his breakthrough. Won't be easy facing a 15 slam winner in the final, that's for sure.

yeah i mean i dont expect much from anderson, as long as he plays better than rublev
 
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The_Order

G.O.A.T.
Well he's the overwhelming favourite but that's why they play the matches. As you say the drought has to end sometime (I thought it was gonna be Miami this year but that tourney seems jinxed for Nadal).

I just hope people don't crap on Anderson regardless, the guy played some inspiring tennis and deserved his breakthrough. Won't be easy facing a 15 slam winner in the final, that's for sure.

If anyone craps on KA, it'll be the bitter Fed and Novak fans.

I thought it would for sure end against Querry earlier this year...

I don't expect KA to win, maybe he'll take a set but then again I don't want to get too confident with Rafa because of what happened at the AO14 final.
 

icedevil0289

G.O.A.T.
I love the rivalry and banter between fans. As long as it doesn't attack the person/poster personally, I'm really not going to be upset. Like I said, I'm even fine with attacking the players, to a degree. The trolls I'm talking about are the ones trying to be bullies, not the ones trolling in a comical sense, which is fine and a posting style I enjoy.

i understand it goes up and down in general, iirc it was bad after AO 2009 considering what happened during the presentation ceremony, probably why i personally am always on edge with certain fanbase. with that being said, unfortunately, it will only get worse on sunday.

looks like novak is needed in more ways than one.
 

Kozzy

Hall of Fame
you're right. My point is: Rafa was in no place to win this slam a week and a half ago. If not for the slowed down court and not facing a top-20 player all tournament, I very much doubt he would be in the tournament right now.

But it is what it is
If not for the sped up courts (or balls) at the AO, Rafa probably would've beat Fed in the final (and Fed probably wouldn't have even got there). That kind of debate/point is basically meaningless. They have to play the courts they're on, and the opponents they face, and the best players on the day win. Honestly, the fact that both Murray and Djokovic have been awol this season is probably a bigger factor than anything else in the resurgent dominance of Roger and Rafa. Similarly, the disappearance of Rafa/Fed in 15/16 helped Djokovic dominate. I say, who cares? It doesn't diminish the accomplishments of any of them. They are all time greats.
 

icedevil0289

G.O.A.T.
I don't think you can succesfuly compare eras but yeah, whatever the draw when you win a slam, you win a slam. You still gotta put yourself out there and stay healthy. Nadal has been playing some great HC tennis this year and this time it looks like it will be rewarded with a slam title, one one can take that away from him.

i agree with that, but it really kills me you got rafa trolls (rofl bringing up kiefer) who were constantly going up and down the halls regarding fed's draws weak era. i guess the argument you can only play who is in front of you only works for rafa or his journey to his 10th rg somehow was so much better or more worthy than fed's to his 8th wimbledon.
 

Federer and Del Potro

Bionic Poster
If not for the sped up courts (or balls) at the AO, Rafa probably would've beat Fed in the final (and Fed probably wouldn't have even got there). That kind of debate/point is basically meaningless. They have to play the courts they're on, and the opponents they face, and the best players on the day win. Honestly, the fact that both Murray and Djokovic have been awol this season is probably a bigger factor than anything else in the resurgent dominance of Roger and Rafa. Similarly, the disappearance of Rafa/Fed in 15/16 helped Djokovic dominate. I say, who cares? It doesn't diminish the accomplishments of any of them. They are all time greats.

Great post. I think you'd have to be pretty crazy to not concede Djokovic/Murray being out is a BIG reason why Nadal/Federer have mopped things up this year. But given their hard work and perseverance time and time again, it's nice to see them being rewarded for never giving up and always putting the work in, even when the results were sub-optimal or not slam win garnering results.
 

KristaK

New User
Fed did not tank to avoid Rafa. We're talking about a guy who has won 19 slams and couldn't easily retired a few years ago when things were lousy. Someone with that competitive drive and love of the game does not tank. We're not talking about Tomic and Kyrgious here.
 

icedevil0289

G.O.A.T.
If not for the sped up courts (or balls) at the AO, Rafa probably would've beat Fed in the final (and Fed probably wouldn't have even got there). That kind of debate/point is basically meaningless. They have to play the courts they're on, and the opponents they face, and the best players on the day win. Honestly, the fact that both Murray and Djokovic have been awol this season is probably a bigger factor than anything else in the resurgent dominance of Roger and Rafa. Similarly, the disappearance of Rafa/Fed in 15/16 helped Djokovic dominate. I say, who cares? It doesn't diminish the accomplishments of any of them. They are all time greats.

overall agree though idk if i necessarily agree court was only reason fed beat nadal that day, not saying it didn't help ofc but multiple factors like fed mentally letting go finally
 

zagor

Bionic Poster
Great post. I think you'd have to be pretty crazy to not concede Djokovic/Murray being out is a BIG reason why Nadal/Federer have mopped things up this year. But given their hard work and perseverance time and time again, it's nice to see them being rewarded for never giving up and always putting the work in, even when the results were sub-optimal or not slam win garnering results.

Nothing against Murray (I quite like him, both his game and personality) but he seems to be consistently grouped with Novak here when the reality is that he was never as big of an obstacle for Fedal as Novak has been ever since 2011.

Fedal resurgence has mostly to due with the absence of Novak and his scary 2015-2016 (first half atleast) form in addition to obviously both of them putting the hard work, staying in shape, adapting their game etc.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying Murray can't beat them in big matches but Novak is the only one I've ever seen break the Fedal duopoly singlehandedly.
 

Ledigs

Legend
That's the thing though, sure Novak had some scary years but so did Nadal and fed and the key is keeping it up over many years which Nadal and fed do


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Chanwan

G.O.A.T.
No point since you're comparing Fed's 2006 draw with Nadal's this year.

Do it properly:

In 2010, Nadal faced #8 Verdasco and #12 Youhzny before #3 Djokovic. Avg 7.6 ranking.

Fed faced #5 Blake, #7 Davydenko and #9 Roddick. Avg 7. So 0.6 avg ranking difference in final 3 rounds which is insignificant.

if you don't want to use avg ranking (I don't like doing it that way but some people do), I'll make the argument that Novak at #3 was playing better and by that virtue, tougher than anyone Fed faced in 2006.
@abmk - the floor is yours. I believe you 2 have been through this before
 

icedevil0289

G.O.A.T.
Nothing against Murray (I quite like him, both his game and personality) but he seems to be consistently grouped with Novak here when the reality is that he was never as big of an obstacle for Fedal as Novak has been ever since 2011.

Fedal resurgence has mostly to due with the absence of Novak and his scary 2015-2016 (first half atleast) form in addition to obviously both of them putting the hard work, staying in shape, adapting their game etc.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying Murray can't beat them in big matches but Novak is the only one I've ever seen break the Fedal duopoly singlehandedly.

that and next gen flopping where it counts. i like murray, but every time people say they are tired of the big 4 winning all the time, i'm like but one of those imo could use a few more slams. one would think if healthy murray could win maybe another hc slam.
 

zagor

Bionic Poster
That's the thing though, sure Novak had some scary years but so did Nadal and fed and the key is keeping it up over many years which Nadal and fed do


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Of course, my point being is that in-form Novak is by some distance a scarier proposition for Fedal than in-form Murray. They respect the latter but are downright scared of the former when he's zoning.
 

Federer and Del Potro

Bionic Poster
Nothing against Murray (I quite like him, both his game and personality) but he seems to be consistently grouped with Novak here when the reality is that he was never as big of an obstacle for Fedal as Novak has been ever since 2011.

Fedal resurgence has mostly to due with the absence of Novak and his scary 2015-2016 (first half atleast) form in addition to obviously both of them putting the hard work, staying in shape, adapting their game etc.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying Murray can't beat them in big matches but Novak is the only one I've ever seen break the Fedal duopoly singlehandedly.

I 100 percent agree, I just think Murray is an added wrinkle and a much more likely threat to "spoil" a draw and beat someone. Add Wawrinka in there and you got a slam that's a lot harder to win, on paper at the very least.
 

Ledigs

Legend
I thought that when he kept going to bh, Rafa you can construct points better than that use your tactics like you would do against someone with a forehand and backhand


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Chanwan

G.O.A.T.
that's interesting, i figured given that a lot their matches have gone distance and some slam wins over him that in 2016 stan would be given a chance against novak.
I both figured and bet on Stan winning in 4. That was no ordinary upset, if upset even applies
 

zagor

Bionic Poster
that and next gen flopping where it counts. i like murray, but every time people say they are tired of the big 4 winning all the time, i'm like but one of those imo could use a few more slams. one would think if healthy murray could win maybe another hc slam.

Yeah, Murray definitely deserves an AO atleast, I mean 5 finals without a title is a bit cruel.

Who knows about the next gen, perhaps 2018 is the year LOL! Maybe they'll finally make Meles proud. Shapovalov most of all hopefully because he's by far the most entertaining to watch IMO.
 

The_Order

G.O.A.T.
@abmk - the floor is yours. I believe you 2 have been through this before

So, you have no counter argument now. My point is, if you're going to crap on Nadal's 2010 US Open draw, then you can crap on Fed's 2006 US Open draw.

BTW he won't save you, I've completely and utterly OWNED him over the years. Now he's tucked his tail between his legs and given up because he knows he won't be able to convince any sane human being that follows this sport with his biased, ridiculous, fantasy land arguments.
 

icedevil0289

G.O.A.T.
Yeah, Murray definitely deserves an AO atleast, I mean 5 finals without a title is a bit cruel.

Who knows about the next gen, perhaps 2018 is the year LOL! Maybe they'll finally make Meles proud. Shapovalov most of all hopefully because he's by far the most entertaining to watch IMO.

i absolutely love how shapovalov is bringing all the fanbases together. that's remarkable talent all on its own. how long it will last idk. i truly hope he doesn't become another hyped next gen.
 

mightyrick

Legend
During the press conference, Del Potro said he was tired, but he also emphasized that he needs to try to get his old backhand back.
 

icedevil0289

G.O.A.T.
I both figured and bet on Stan winning in 4. That was no ordinary upset, if upset even applies

yeah i can't remember who i thought would win, probably by default i gave the edge to novak as defending champion. but i wasn't necessarily surprised either when stan won and figured it would be tough as a lot of their matches are, atleast post 2013 slams
 

Chanwan

G.O.A.T.
So, you have no counter argument now. My point is, if you're going to crap on Nadal's 2010 US Open draw, then you can crap on Fed's 2006 US Open draw.

BTW he won't save you, I've completely and utterly OWNED him over the years. Now he's tucked his tail between his legs and given up because he knows he won't be able to convince any sane human being that follows this sport with his biased, ridiculous, fantasy land arguments.
I've read enough of your posts over the years to know this doesn't end in one post. And the time is 5.16 am here, I'm gonna sleep.

Congrats on your guy winning his 16th. He's had tough draws over the years too, just not at the US
 
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