12 old kid vs older man

boramiNYC

Hall of Fame
I'd rate the old guy 6.0 and kid 5.5. I feel the old guy should beat the kid rather easily. It mustn't have been one of his better performances. The kid's serves should have been abused. The kid's serve needs a lot of improvement. A currently ranked pro 1000 and up would double bagel the kid due to his serve. And there's no guarantee his serve will improve as he gets older. It's just my opinion that flat serve is more fundamental than spin serves. It's a preferable progression to go from flat serve to spin serves. Builds better technique.
 
I'd rate the old guy 6.0 and kid 5.5. I feel the old guy should beat the kid rather easily. It mustn't have been one of his better performances. The kid's serves should have been abused. The kid's serve needs a lot of improvement. A currently ranked pro 1000 and up would double bagel the kid due to his serve. And there's no guarantee his serve will improve as he gets older. It's just my opinion that flat serve is more fundamental than spin serves. It's a preferable progression to go from flat serve to spin serves. Builds better technique.
It's the complete opposite. You want to start with spin and then learn to flatten the serve out. Preferably a slice or topslice serve and then learn a kick, but flat should wait until you have confidence in the spin.
 

boramiNYC

Hall of Fame
It's the complete opposite. You want to start with spin and then learn to flatten the serve out. Preferably a slice or topslice serve and then learn a kick, but flat should wait until you have confidence in the spin.
Well yeah that's conventional wisdom and I understand why but many kids focusing on spinny serve never get to develop good flat serve with high enough percentage to be a weapon. They just keep relying on their second serve to start a point but high first serve percentage and win percentage of those are quite critical psychologically imo.
 

shindemac

Hall of Fame
I'd rate the old guy 6.0 and kid 5.5. I feel the old guy should beat the kid rather easily. It mustn't have been one of his better performances. The kid's serves should have been abused. The kid's serve needs a lot of improvement. A currently ranked pro 1000 and up would double bagel the kid due to his serve. And there's no guarantee his serve will improve as he gets older. It's just my opinion that flat serve is more fundamental than spin serves. It's a preferable progression to go from flat serve to spin serves. Builds better technique.
Didn't someone say he is a currently ranked pro?

Guy looks and plays like a pro. Kid was really good, but guy just steamrolled him. I don't rate open players. What's the point?
 
The kid is 14. My bad. I didn't bother to search his profile. I just heard a couple spectators saying he is 12. Anyhow the age difference is still huge whether he is 12 or 14. He got a little bit intimidated, but on most of the part he handled himself quite well. A coach told me last night he practice pretty much every day of the week. It is extremely difficult to have kids doing that in places like Hong Kong.

Glad that you guys enjoyed the video!
Agreed. There is huge pressure to do well academically in hong kong, and there is a lack of facilities. On top of that, you need a lot of financial support. Is the coaching there ok? Probably since the boy plays great, unless he got some of his training outside Hong Kong.

I went to crcopen.com and found the draw. Looks like the old man and Philip King are still in.
 
OP, looks like Philip King and his next opponent have been handing out bagels. Any chance you'll be able to record their match and post it here? :)
 

boramiNYC

Hall of Fame
Didn't someone say he is a currently ranked pro?

Guy looks and plays like a pro. Kid was really good, but guy just steamrolled him. I don't rate open players. What's the point?
I didn't catch the current part but caught somewhere he's in mid thirties. So I assumed his best days are behind him, which could have been 6.5, or between 1000 and 500 in my book. No real point, just for fun! But the score wasn't exactly a steamrol.
 

shindemac

Hall of Fame
I didn't catch the current part but caught somewhere he's in mid thirties. So I assumed his best days are behind him, which could have been 6.5, or between 1000 and 500 in my book. No real point, just for fun! But the score wasn't exactly a steamrol.
No! Don't say that. My best days are ahead of me!

By steamroll, I meant by the way the guy plays and constructs points, the angles he opens up, and the way he's able to thread the needle on those down the line winners. To be able to hit those type of winners is impressive when your opponent is hitting pretty hard too.
 

G&G

New User
in 2004 the older man won the 1st round match of the future tournament against Adrian Ungur, who is ATP108 at the moment.
 

rufus_smith

Professional
Well "old man" Kolev lost the semi-final to 23 yo David Catala-Velasco 6-3 6-4 who will now play 31 yo "old man" Philip King (5'9" 145 lb) for the championship.

Kimiko-Date Krumm (43 yo) would be the play them about even or better and would crush the 14 yo kid I would think.
 
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LeeD

Bionic Poster
Thanks.
There used to be, around mid '70's, a short kinda wide guy named Randy who won several ChineseNationals in San Francisco.
Just before my time.
 

jussumman

Hall of Fame
When I read this I thought that the kid was playing some really old guy (like senior), but turns out he's just 34 (you still have top players in the world at about that age, Haas, Fed).

Kid was outmatched clearly. Let's see how he plays in 5-10 years, if we even see his name or ATP points/Davis Cup play, like the older guy is now.
 
T

Topslice

Guest
When I read this I thought that the kid was playing some really old guy (like senior), but turns out he's just 34 (you still have top players in the world at about that age, Haas, Fed).

Kid was outmatched clearly. Let's see how he plays in 5-10 years, if we even see his name or ATP points/Davis Cup play, like the older guy is now.
What? Are you drunk bro?
The kid is 14, 14! At 14 I was losing to 3.0 70 year old slicers. His level at 14 is outstanding, no doubt the kid will be far far better than the guy. He made it competitive, took a set off him but was a half level at most behind the older guy. That older guy is like 6.0, so the 14 year old is like 5.5. Kid is currently on track to become a professional top 300 player.
 

jussumman

Hall of Fame
What? Are you drunk bro?
The kid is 14, 14! At 14 I was losing to 3.0 70 year old slicers. His level at 14 is outstanding, no doubt the kid will be far far better than the guy. He made it competitive, took a set off him but was a half level at most behind the older guy. That older guy is like 6.0, so the 14 year old is like 5.5. Kid is currently on track to become a professional top 300 player.
It is outstanding for his age. I'm guessing he's played more tennis than you by that age. We'll see.
 

jussumman

Hall of Fame
If you look at the open men's draw results, there is a lot of 6-0, 6-0 results.. that's normal in these tournaments?
 

Ballinbob

Hall of Fame
If you look at the open men's draw results, there is a lot of 6-0, 6-0 results.. that's normal in these tournaments?
Yeah you'll see it happen a lot. Anyone can enter them so you'll get "5.0 teaching pros" like Topslice/MMI and you'll see them lose pretty bad.

Some people also enter because they want to play a good player and don't mind paying the money, even if it means losing 1st round
 
Meh, really I dont know why people would criticise kids out there for this kind of stuff, other than because they're jealous. Good on him I say, he has a great positive role model. If he can be half the player Djokovic is he's going to have a great career.

Federer grew up trying to emulate his heroes, so did a mountain of other superstars.
Now why would I be jealous? That was not criticism or rather not negative criticism. He is a very good, trained player, it's not even worth mention it but I did find it interesting that he looks a lot like Djokovic. Every groundstroke, serve, return and movement. There is the Dimitrov/Federer thing but I never saw a player coming that close to Djokovic's technique and I though it was worth mentioning. That's all.

We all try to mimic the pros, junior players included but I don't think you see this everyday. If it's so common I would really like to see some mini Nadals, Del Potros, Federers etc. Or grown ups, it doesn't matter, though if it's a rec Federer only post it if it's really close... I've seen a few of those :)
 

jussumman

Hall of Fame
Now why would I be jealous? That was not criticism or rather not negative criticism. He is a very good, trained player, it's not even worth mention it but I did find it interesting that he looks a lot like Djokovic. Every groundstroke, serve, return and movement. There is the Dimitrov/Federer thing but I never saw a player coming that close to Djokovic's technique and I though it was worth mentioning. That's all.

We all try to mimic the pros, junior players included but I don't think you see this everyday. If it's so common I would really like to see some mini Nadals, Del Potros, Federers etc. Or grown ups, it doesn't matter, though if it's a rec Federer only post it if it's really close... I've seen a few of those :)
Same here, I thought Djokovic when I watched the video. Serve and ground strokes. That's cool. Though I liked the older guy's game a lot more.
 

Maximagq

Banned
I'm not really surprised that this kid, along with many other players, has a Djokovic-like game because that is really the trend modern tennis is going to. I mean, Djokovic is really the cookie-cutter baseliner of the game but what makes him so good is his self-belief, movement, fitness, and consistency. Lots of players in the ATP and in the juniors have very similar games: Western forehand, two handed backhand, fleet-of-foot.
 

Lukhas

Legend
I'm not really surprised that this kid, along with many other players, has a Djokovic-like game because that is really the trend modern tennis is going to. I mean, Djokovic is really the cookie-cutter baseliner of the game but what makes him so good is his self-belief, movement, fitness, and consistency. Lots of players in the ATP and in the juniors have very similar games: Western forehand, two handed backhand, fleet-of-foot.
You must feel lonely with your 1HBH. :)
 
T

Topslice

Guest
Yeah you'll see it happen a lot. Anyone can enter them so you'll get "5.0 teaching pros" like Topslice/MMI and you'll see them lose pretty bad.

Some people also enter because they want to play a good player and don't mind paying the money, even if it means losing 1st round
Good one! Not as bad as losing first round at a 4.5 tourney!
 

West Coast Ace

G.O.A.T.
No. They're from CA.
Yup. Straight outta Long Beach...

You must feel lonely with your 1HBH. :)
Last time I checked there were 17 1HBHs in the top 100 ATP. Might be more now.

Forthegame, here's the draw:

http://www.crcopen.com/CRC_ViewDraw.aspx

Thanks for the video martini1.
Did anyone see the name Karan Rastogi? Pro from India - has (or had - not sure if he's still making a go of it) 6 (1-5) ATP/DC matches in singles.
 

jussumman

Hall of Fame
Yup. Straight outta Long Beach...

Last time I checked there were 17 1HBHs in the top 100 ATP. Might be more now.

Did anyone see the name Karan Rastogi? Pro from India - has (or had - not sure if he's still making a go of it) 6 (1-5) ATP/DC matches in singles.
Still that's only 17%. But do whatever works best for you.
 

Lukhas

Legend
Last time I checked there were 17 1HBHs in the top 100 ATP. Might be more now.
Last time I checked I haven't seen a lot of guys hugging on the baseline with Djokovic in though... and a 1HBH. That's why I said he must feel a bit lonely. Not because he uses a 1HBH or because I'm against it (I use one). Both Kohlschreiber and Wawrinka are just much better at net and less good at the baseline than Djokovic actually is.
 

martini1

Hall of Fame
Well "old man" Kolev lost the semi-final to 23 yo David Catala-Velasco 6-3 6-4 who will now play 31 yo "old man" Philip King (5'9" 145 lb) for the championship.

Kimiko-Date Krumm (43 yo) would be the play them about even or better and would crush the 14 yo kid I would think.
I'm not a big fan of the 23yr old's style of play. He is a ball basher and grunt loudly at every stroke. A lot of pts end up being ue from both sides.

King is good. But if u look at his atp record he got beat pretty badly. Tells you how brutal the tour is. :twisted:

And no, kimiko won't kill the kid and destroys his confidence. Lol middle age women won't make 14yr old cry.
 
I'm not a big fan of the 23yr old's style of play. He is a ball basher and grunt loudly at every stroke. A lot of pts end up being ue from both sides.

King is good. But if u look at his atp record he got beat pretty badly. Tells you how brutal the tour is. :twisted:

And no, kimiko won't kill the kid and destroys his confidence. Lol middle age women won't make 14yr old cry.
I would think that Kimiko and the 14 year old kid would actually have a pretty good match. I'd still give a edge to Kimiko because the kid is too young to serve her off the court, and she is more match tough than he is.
 

martini1

Hall of Fame
You can see the ball speed at that angle, but can't see what's going on with the far end of the court. There are pros and cons.
 
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