[2]Rafael Nadal vs [3] Roger Federer 2012 Australian Open Semifinal

Federer or Nadal

  • Federer in 3

    Votes: 39 13.6%
  • Federer in 4

    Votes: 96 33.6%
  • Federer in 5

    Votes: 34 11.9%
  • Federer Retires( Bad Back)

    Votes: 2 0.7%
  • Nadal in 3

    Votes: 11 3.8%
  • Nadal in 4

    Votes: 77 26.9%
  • Nadal in 5

    Votes: 24 8.4%
  • Nadal Retires( Bad Knees)

    Votes: 3 1.0%

  • Total voters
    286

Tammo

Banned
The fact that trollforthewin is reacting so badly to The Egg's pigeon winning this semi is more than enough proof that he is nothing but a Fed fan in disguise. Most people already know that anyway,but he has more than proved it tonight.
+1 Next he will say how the fireworks affected the outcome of the match, and ramble on about other things.:)
 

cucio

Legend
There has been no "real final" since early 2011, when The King took his rightful Scepter Of Line Painting Awesomeness. Don't think that has changed yet, we still have final-less tournaments.
 
really pulling to see a djoker nadal final now. wanted fed to win. his chances of getting another slam had to go down 5-10% now, he'll be 5 months older before he can try for another slam (wimby).

seems like federer's confidence against nadal outdoors is gone
 

niff

Legend
Aww all those FHs into the net from Feds at the end of the third set were lame. I was listening on the radio at that point and the commentators were groaning every time.
 

purge

Hall of Fame
i do think fed doesnt get enough credit for the way hes still playing tho. apart from the motivation that is already remarkable in itself he keeps it up against all odds.
nadal has been and will always be the ultimate nightmare matchup and he will not go away, hes well past his physical and mental prime, the conditions dont suit him at all anymore (except for indoor HC), and STILL.. hes right up there. virtually one step away from winning the big titles. all it wouldve taken is one little push at the right time and the last 2 years couldve been very different title wise.

im really happy hes still there playing his kind of tennis. and as long as i can watch him play matches like he did here en route to that SF im not complaining. im actually afaraid of what will happen when he eventually does decide to quit. if tomic is all we have to look forward to in terms of tennis finesse there are dark times ahead of us
 
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aprilfool

Guest
Screw that, I'm not pulling for Djokovic just because he's likely to beat Nadal again and stop him from winning another slam. I won't spite Nadal like that.

Go Murray!
I will. Two timer wasters going neck to neck. It's perfect!
 

Boricua

Hall of Fame
I have not slept for 24 hours the match was like an energy drink now I am cranky and down from teh aftereffects.

It was a stupid prediction....possible but it would come down to Federer in key moments.
I could not see the game, I recorded it. Just saw a few games early this morning as I had to go to work. But, based on what Ive seen about Federer lately, he still has that great talent but commits errors in a more regular basis and gives out free points. And, if that is done in crucial moments of the match, that will cost him the match.

If Federer can maintain his concentration and reduce unforced errors, he can beat Nadal. This is my reasoning eventhough Im a Nadal follower and appreciate his style of play.

The good thing is that if the rankings dont change, we will see more Nadal-Fed matchups as they will be in the same side of the draw. This, considering they are not eliminated in the early rounds.

I really think Fed has at least two-three more years of quality tennis in him at this level.
 

CMM

Legend
Rafa is not beating Djokovic. He had a huge lead in the third set tie break and he almost choked it away. In the fourth set Federer had lots of chances.
I think Djokovic will win in straight sets.
 

zagor

Bionic Poster
i do think fed doesnt get enough credit for the way hes still playing tho. apart from the motivation that is already remarkable in itself he keeps it up against all odds.
nadal has been and will always be the ultimate nightmare matchup and he will not go away, hes well past his physical and mental prime, the conditions dont suit him at all anymore (except for indoor HC), and STILL.. hes right up there. virtually one step away from winning the big titles. all it wouldve taken is one little push at the right time and the last 2 years couldve been very different title wise.

im really happy hes still there playing his kind of tennis. and as long as i can watch him play matches like he did here en route to that SF im not complaining. im actually afaraid of what will happen when he eventually does decide to quit. if tomic is all we have to look forward to in terms of tennis finesse there are dark times ahead of us
I mostly agree, I still enjoyed Fed's tennis immensely this tourney, his game is still in good shape.
 
I didn't pay attention to the stats during this match. Focusing on the dramatic moments was enough. Looking at the match stats now, here are 3 things that stand out:

* Federer only had 10 more winners than Rafa. Even when Rafa beats Federer, I expect Federer to have a lot more winners than Rafa.

* Federer came to the net 57 times. That is a huge number for a 4 set match. Can't say Federer didn't attack.

* Rafa had 16 break points. 6 more than Federer! That is different to most of their other meetings.
 

ledwix

Hall of Fame
Federer was in control of the match as usual. It seems that it's up to him as to whether he will ever win another much. But he always seems to be so close every time..
 

Big_Dangerous

Talk Tennis Guru
really pulling to see a djoker nadal final now. wanted fed to win. his chances of getting another slam had to go down 5-10% now, he'll be 5 months older before he can try for another slam (wimby).

seems like federer's confidence against nadal outdoors is gone
Same here. I think the new rivalry is Nadal vs Djokovic.

They now have a much closer h2h than Fedal.
 
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aprilfool

Guest
Laver has the accomplishments to warrant such priase. Federer does not.
Laver didn't have a rival whose game plan included intentionally slowing down his pace, something that is prohibited and strictly enforced in every other popular sport.

Our commentators have been dishing out the justifications to this over the years by saying that players don't mind because they need the rest after a rally with Nadal. That is ridiculous.It's Nadal that needs to rest after a typical rally.
It benefits Nadal in two ways. It breaks the concentration of his main rival who is famous for his brisk pace. Actually his pace is normal. It just seems brisk because the game is slowing down.

Nothing against Nadal personally.
 

ruerooo

Legend
Fed cant beat nadal in a 3 set match anymore.
The only chance fed has to win a gs is murray at #2 spot so that he could only face nadal in the final
Another possibility is to go back to older faster courts. Even hitting te strongest fh, nadal could defend easily today.
Speed
Seeds
What in the world are you talking about? Roger breadsticked Rafa in the WTF just last year. The way he was playing in the first set, I was terribly afraid it might happen again. Do people here have no memories?

:shock:
 

Sid_Vicious

G.O.A.T.
Oh, so winning the Grand Slam means nothing? That is the implication of your response.
What's the big deal? You continuously belittle Federer and Sampras's 16/14 grand slams as if they are nothing. If someone tries debate with you, all you do is continuously talk about how winning 4 majors in one season is the be-all-end -all of tennis achievement. You ignore everyone's arguments and continue to mention how Laver won 4 slams in one season over and over again. Very similar to a Federer fan going "16>>>11. LOL!" in response to anyone who disagrees about Federer being GOAT.
 
No, the game plan was fine.

He tried playing more into the court, more S-V, more aggressive returning, all from Annacone. His BH was stronger.

There were too many errors though from all sides, on all shots, to a large extent as a result of the pressure from Nadal. Not very bad, but bad enough to lose to Nadal.

And, mainly, too low a 1st serve in percentage. You can't win against Nadal with that.
Perfect analysis.

Conclusions/Questions from match:

1. Rafa still has it - it being iron will, unbelievable retrieval skills to match the crazy good dipping forehand and super reliable backhand. No sign of legs bothering him.

2. Roger finally has the game plan to beat Rafa. He finally has a reasonable topspin backhand again Nadal. He finally figured out he can't just take abuse from Rafa's forehand to his backhand - it's worth risking the big BH crosscourt to Nadal's backhand with the follow up backhand smacked DTL. (There is no sense hitting slice backhands to Rafa - he smacks those hit to his forehand crosscourt and runs around those to his backhand and smacks them either down the line, or if short at all, croscourt for a winner.)

3. As I mentioned before the match, Rog doesn't stand a chance to beat Nadal unless he serves well. He didn't serve well. Will he ever serve well again in a TOUGH, physical match after the first set?

4. There is another thread that questioned Roger saying in an interview that in practice he mainly works on his strengths. Most posters wondered why he would work on his forehand when his backhand was what glaringly needed more work. (note that Rog didn't actually mention what "strengths" mean.)
Well, his forehand let him down big time in this match. Way to many unforced errors. Has he lost the ability to consistently hit winners off the FH in a tough, physical match after the first set?

Looking ahead:
There is a pretty good chance Rafa and Rog will remain 2,3 for the next 6 months. I'm going to go way out on a limb here and predict Rafa winning at the FO. The potentially interesting matchup would be at Wimbledon. Can Rog serve and hit forehand winners there after the first set?
[Sadly, there is a also pretty good chance this was the last Fed-Nadal grand slam meeting with Fed playing well enough to have even a chance of winning. There is a pretty good chance he will soon "lose it" for a couple of months like last year - but this time never "find it" again.]

P.S.
Congrats to Nadal fans. What a force! Would love to see him knock off Djokovic in the finals.
 

Sid_Vicious

G.O.A.T.
What in the world are you talking about? Roger breadsticked Rafa in the WTF just last year. The way he was playing in the first set, I was terribly afraid it might happen again. Do people here have no memories?

:shock:
I am sure he mean't to say 5 sets. He would be completely correct about that as well. The whole Fedal thing that started in 2007 is running on fumes now. These matches they play are garbage. Almost 5 years since Federer has beaten Nadal in a grand slam.

That is one poor rivalry. I feel ashamed that I thought it was greater than Borg/Mcenroe a few years ago.
 
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namelessone

Legend
Perfect analysis.

Conclusions/Questions from match:

1. Rafa still has it - it being iron will, unbelievable retrieval skills to match the crazy good dipping forehand and super reliable backhand. No sign of legs bothering him.
Rafa never really lost the will to fight, in fact it was his sole weapon at times in 2011 but his game is very shaky. And how can you call Rafa's BH super reliable when most of his errors came off that wing, not to mention missing some sitters.

Rafa's BH wing is anything but reliable. Used to be in a time but nowadays it is breaking down with alarming ease. Fed's best moments came when his forehand wasn't hitting the netcord or going out and focusing his efforts(both fh and bh) on breaking down Rafa's BH.
 
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I was extremely happy with Rafa's backhand vs Berdych and Federer. It's better in 2012. It's not supposed to be as good as his forehand. He'd never lose a match if that were the case.
 

cc0509

Talk Tennis Guru
I hope Fed says something of value in his presser. He has to acknowledge that Nadal has his number and he has to make some major change in his game. Not sure what, but something. Annacone certainly isn't it.
What is Federer going to change at 30 that will magically allow him to defeat Nadal in slams moving forward? The mental edge Nadal has in their match-up is too great now. If Federer made these changes earlier in his career before the mental edge for Nadal got too great, he may have had a chance, but honestly, now it is too late especially since he will only decline further as time goes on.
 

cc0509

Talk Tennis Guru
I have to say that was a serious issue, esp quality of serving after the fireworks ... it changed everything ... and being broken back immediately in the 3rd, I guess ...
That is just an excuse, come on, you don't really believe that deep down do you?
 

cc0509

Talk Tennis Guru
No way. Fed has every shot in the book and is better in just about every part of the game. If he could screw his head on straight against Nadal he would beat him more often than not.
And this was a trash match from Nadal,and I expect him lose badly in the final. Just rinse and repeat what happened over and over last year and you have the result of the final already.


Oh,and smooches,Beasty. :)


That is what the biggest problem is. Roger has no self-belief when he plays Nadal, you can see it as soon as Roger steps on the court. Hopefully your man Nadal can change things with Djokovic before the mental aspect gets too great.
 

TennisLovaLova

Hall of Fame
What in the world are you talking about? Roger breadsticked Rafa in the WTF just last year. The way he was playing in the first set, I was terribly afraid it might happen again. Do people here have no memories?

:shock:
Of course I meant 5 sets matches
I might also add indoor on fast carpet
 

THUNDERVOLLEY

G.O.A.T.
What's the big deal? You continuously belittle Federer and Sampras's 16/14 grand slams as if they are nothing.
....oh, you mean how in this & other TW forums play host to numeros threads where Laver's historically recognised achievement is crapped on by those claiming his was a "weak era," or actually launch troll threads about how "inferior" Laver is to low-ranked current players (see Former Player forum) all in an attempt to (at the end of it all) lift Federer's status? Yeah, there's a lot of fair-minded members around here.

Funny how you skip over that.....
 

cc0509

Talk Tennis Guru
I am sure he mean't to say 5 sets. He would be completely correct about that as well. The whole Fedal thing that started in 2007 is running on fumes now. These matches they play are garbage. Almost 5 years since Federer has beaten Nadal in a grand slam.

That is one poor rivalry. I feel ashamed that I thought it was greater than Borg/Mcenroe a few years ago.


Agree. Borg/McEnroe was a much better rivalry.
 

TennisLovaLova

Hall of Fame
As sureshs said one day, the key to fed's game vs nadal is his first serve winning percentage.
Today it was:
1st serve pct fed vs nadal
64% / 77%
 

Clarky21

Banned
That is what the biggest problem is. Roger has no self-belief when he plays Nadal, you can see it as soon as Roger steps on the court. Hopefully your man Nadal can change things with Djokovic before the mental aspect gets too great.

I agree with you,but I think it's too late for Nadal as well. Sunday will make the 7th straight final loss to The Egg in less than a year. I'm afraid that The Egg has taken up permanent residence in Nadal's head for good.
 

interjim

Rookie
Hmmm. Interesting points being made here this morning. Taped the match, but haven't watched it yet. Caught the result online before driving my son to school on the way to work, and told him about it. He's six. He said "that's OK, even though Roger is my favorite, Rafa with the crazy shirts is my second favorite." Though I was pushing strongly for Fed here, well, that's life. For my part, I do wonder how well Nadal will be playing when he's 30.

We'll check it out tonight.
 

purge

Hall of Fame
its not even just the "fighting spirit" alone in terms of mental assets. alot of people get that mixed up i think.

the one tremendously useful mental ability that rafa has against fed is that he can get himself right into the match off just 1 or 2 little situations and thus in the long run punish every wrong shot selection fed makes through a match.
and those situations always happen in fed matches. its like you sometimes feel that the big variety of shots that he has is actually his undoing against nadal. that hed be better off in this particular matchup if he was more limited in that area oO

but usually it doesnt hurt him when he loses a point here and there in that manner. rogs game and success largely builds up on just completely taking the opponent out of the match, preferrably from very early on. with super aggressive tennis, being right on the baseline, hitting massive winners and completely belittling you with his isnane variety and just showing you what he can do.

and against almost everyone that leads to people just shrugging their shoulders thinking "well what the hell can i do against that?" and losing faith in their own game.

but nadal even if he barely touched a ball on feds serve for 15 minutes you just give him 1 or 2 points that he shouldnt have won and hes right in there. out of nowhere. one misplaced drop shot in an otherwise 20 minute beatdown is enough for him to instantly catch fire. and thats always been a massive problem for fed since he always plays these points at some point maybe giving the opponment 30-15 instead of 40-0 on his serve with an unnescessary drop shot or whatever. but hes used to people not being able to take just that one moment to get all fired up because they will still be caught up in the 10 clean winners he nailed past them during the course of the last 3 games.

if you take hewitt for example who is unquestionably right up there as one of the biggest fighters the game has ever known. after fed really hit his prime hewitt was basically chanceless whenever they met. fed completely dominated him and nullified hewitts fighting spirit so that it wouldnt even show. youd wonder why he seemingly wouldnt put up as big a fight against fed than he would against all the others. feds game just wouldnt let him

if you ask players about what makes it so hard to play against fed alot of them say its his ability to just roll away and extend leads when he has them. like you thought you were hanging with him quite well and then you get broken and next thing you know hes serving for the set at 5-1 and you dont even know how that happened. and it breaks their spirit

not so with nadal. he will just wake up and come back from whatever score just because fed misplaced one dropper lol. thats just a remarkable skill that nadal has that goes beyond the sole "fighting spirit" thing. and it obviously helps massively against federers way of playing
 

MichaelNadal

Bionic Poster
I agree with you,but I think it's too late for Nadal as well. Sunday will make the 7th straight final loss to The Egg in less than a year. I'm afraid that The Egg has taken up permanent residence in Nadal's head for good.
Hopefully Murray runs Majin Buu from side to side for about 6 hours.
 
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