2012 RG semi final is the decisive Djokovic - Federer RG match.

[NoleIsBoat]

Every Federer fan loves to point out how Fed beat "peak Djokovic" at RG in 4 tight sets, so he is superior peak for peak on clay.

Nonsense. Firstly Djokovic had a walkover which affected his rhythm. Secondly that tournament was using lightning fast balls and conditions for the SF were damp and low bouncing. The stars aligned for Federer to score his only 1 of 2 slam wins over peak Djokovic vs 9 losses.

The year later they played in proper clay court conditions, and Djokovic swept about to be number 1 Federer aside in straight sets


Enjoy.

 

[King No1e]

Great poast. 1 match does not always entirely decide who's peak is better. It's like calling Murray > Peak Fed because he won their only match in 06.

 

[Tennis Analyst]

Yes, I agree, the walkover played a role in that match. Federer for sure wouldn't have won the first two sets if Djokovic played his QF match and maintained his play rhythm. Moreover, RG experimenting lighter balls for men gave the servebots a huge advantage in the tournament. They were able to play non-clay game on clay. Federer was able to bot his way to victory against Djokovic and Isner managed to push Nadal to the fifth set.

Despite all of that, their match was so close that it literally could have gone either way. It was basically a tie. Let both players play it one more time and no one would put his money on Federer, absolutely no one. Only one mini-break in two sets saved Federer's a**. In 2012 though you could clearly see the difference in class between these two on clay. It always amuses me seeing Fed fans talking about their RG 2011 match where the stars perfectly aligned for Federer as op mentioned and act like their next-year meeting didn't happen at all but whatever helps them sleep at night I guess lol.

 

[MeatTornado]

So 2012 Novak is important for discussion on clay but not on grass.

Gotcha.

 

[PilotPete]

What about the wind in 2011? It was 15.5 km/hr from the west instead of Djokovic's preferred wind velocity of 14.8 km/hr from the southwest.

 

[fundrazer]

And less than a month later Federer beat Djokovic along the way to winning Wimbledon.

I'm not sure what the point of this thread is.

 

[blablavla]

Great poast. 1 match does not always entirely decide who's peak is better. It's like calling Murray > Peak Fed because he won their only match in 06.

how about 2 matches:
RG 2011
Wim 2012

is this representative enough?

 

[Phoenix1983]

Every Federer fan loves to point out how Fed beat "peak Djokovic" at RG in 4 tight sets, so he is superior peak for peak on clay.

Nonsense. Firstly Djokovic had a walkover which affected his rhythm. Secondly that tournament was using lightning fast balls and conditions for the SF were damp and low bouncing. The stars aligned for Federer to score his only 1 of 2 slam wins over peak Djokovic vs 9 losses.

He can't be the GOAT if he couldn't cope with that.

 

[Deleted member 748597]

how about 2 matches:
RG 2011
Wim 2012

is this representative enough?

It's not actually.

 

[PilotPete]

And less than a month later Federer beat Djokovic along the way to winning Wimbledon.

I'm not sure what the point of this thread is.

you don't understand the point? Clearly it means Djokovic played peak tennis at FO2012, but he decided not the play his peak at W2012. The reason is a mystery.

 

[Deleted member 777746]

Great post. Hilarious how when the conditions align for Fed and he manages to limp over the finish line, the match "counts" but the other 2 matches Fed and Nole played in 2011 (AO, UO) don't.
You can't make this stuff up

 

[King No1e]

how about 2 matches:
RG 2011
Wim 2012

is this representative enough?

Wimb 2012: yes, neither were peak but it's reasonable to say peak Fed would beat peak Djoker on grass.
RG11: Fed played out of his mind while Djokovic didn't quite play at his peak that day. A Herculean achievement for Fed regardless, but their 2012 rematch just proved that 2011 was not perfectly representative of who's better on clay.

This is of course untestable/unprovable/irrelevant, but IMO if 2011 Djoker and 2011 Fed played each other 10 times at RG, Djokovic would win more than half.

 

[Tennis Analyst]

So 2012 Novak is important for discussion on clay but not on grass.
Gotcha.

Wimbledon 2012 is important but not as much as the THREE FINALS between them. Federer dreams of holding his favorite trophy next to Djokovic and Djokovic is like: over my dead body.

 

[MeatTornado]

Wimbledon 2012 is important but not as much as the THREE FINALS between them. Federer dreams of holding his favorite trophy next to Djokovic and Djokovic is like: over my dead body.

Stop cheating the readers, good sir.

 

[Deleted member 777746]

Federer: I'm greatest grasscourter of my generation
Nole: Hold my 3-0

 

[Deleted member 777746]

Fed must hold the record for most matches lost against a rival from ahead. What was he, up 2 breaks in the second set and STILL donated it?

 

[blablavla]

Federer: I'm greatest grasscourter of my generation
Nole: Hold my 3-0

right
1. the amount of Wim titles says a different story
2. since when Roddick, Hewitt, Safin, are of the same generation with Novak?

lol, you dude like being spanked

 

[Deleted member 777746]

right
1. the amount of Wim titles says a different story
2. since when Roddick, Hewitt, Safin, are of the same generation with Novak?

lol, you dude like being spanked

I understand you like me, but this is getting creepy

 

[blablavla]

I understand you like me, but this is getting creepy

at least you tried to delete your own st*pidity
got unlucky this time though

 

[USO]

Every Federer fan loves to point out how Fed beat "peak Djokovic" at RG in 4 tight sets, so he is superior peak for peak on clay.

Nonsense. Firstly Djokovic had a walkover which affected his rhythm. Secondly that tournament was using lightning fast balls and conditions for the SF were damp and low bouncing. The stars aligned for Federer to score his only 1 of 2 slam wins over peak Djokovic vs 9 losses.

The year later they played in proper clay court conditions, and Djokovic swept about to be number 1 Federer aside in straight sets


Enjoy.

What a joke of a thread... This has to be one of the worst matches I have seen Federer ever play.

 

[Deleted member 748597]

Wimb 2012: yes, neither were peak but it's reasonable to say peak Fed would beat peak Djoker on grass.
RG11: Fed played out of his mind while Djokovic didn't quite play at his peak that day. A Herculean achievement for Fed regardless, but their 2012 rematch just proved that 2011 was not perfectly representative of who's better on clay.

This is of course untestable/unprovable/irrelevant, but IMO if 2011 Djoker and 2011 Fed played each other 10 times at RG, Djokovic would win more than half.

Good poast. But let's just say that Federer playing post-prime tennis somehow destroyed peak godly Djokovic. Because that's not trolling at all.

 

[Deleted member 777746]

Good poast. But let's just say that Federer playing post-prime tennis somehow destroyed peak godly Djokovic. Because that's not trolling at all.

That's the thing though. RG Semis 11 wasn't post-prime tennis. It was in the top 5 matches Fed has played in a GS in his life. Meanwhile Nole's performance wouldn't even be in the top 10 of his...

 

[Lew II]

RG h2h is 1-1. Simple.

 

[Nadal_Django]

Good poast. But let's just say that Federer playing post-prime tennis somehow destroyed peak godly Djokovic. Because that's not trolling at all.

Of course is not trolling. Here on TTW is called knowledgeable posting. Or in other words "my eye test is stronger than your eye test".

 

[beltsman]

Djokovic fanbase inferiority complex is out of control. If you know your guy is the best, why are you so desperate for validation?

 

[Deleted member 748597]

Djokovic fanbase inferiority complex is out of control. If you know your guy is the best, why are you so desperate for validation?

Oh, come on. Fed fans are more and more starting to behave like they have that complex.

 

[mehdimike]

The fact that Novak lost to Federer and Wawrinka during his peak 3 slam winning seasons in 2011 and 2015 makes me wonder if he really has had a higher peak than Federer at RG. If he had lost to Nadal it would be ok but losing to Roger and Wawrinka in a similar style should have never happened.

 

[Deleted member 777746]

RG h2h is 1-1. Simple.

This is true, but context matters as well. Nole's walkover definitely affected his rhythm, and the fact that this match decided whether he'd be world #1 also put additional pressure on him. Credit to Federer for getting it done in such style though.

 

[StrongRule]

Lol. 2011 AO till 2011 USO was the absolute peak of Djokovic's career, he never played better than that. It's ridiculous that some bring excuses to his loss in RG semifinal. He played great and couldn't do much better, but Federer outplayed him that day. The walkover didn't change anything, I saw Djokovic playing on exactly the same level as during the whole year.

 

[NoleFam]

Now you guys know by now that the 2012 RG SF doesn't exist. It is the minority report, forever erased from record and memory.

 

[Krish0608]

2012 Wimbledon is their decisive Wimbledon match

 

[pj80]

how about 2 matches:
RG 2011
Wim 2012

is this representative enough?

no, the best indication is their overall H2H, especially at the slams.

 

[Deleted member 748597]

Lol. 2011 AO till 2011 USO was the absolute peak of Djokovic's career, he never played better than that. It's ridiculous that some bring excuses to his loss in RG semifinal. He played great and couldn't do much better, but Federer outplayed him that day. The walkover didn't change anything, I saw Djokovic playing on exactly the same level as during the whole year.

It was probably peak Djokovic, but Federer's form was not post-prime in that match.

 

[Towny]

They were both better in RG 2011 than 2012. Federer dropped zero sets en-route to the SF. Djokovic dropped 1 set to Delpo. Compare that to 2012 when Federer was down 2 sets to 0 against Delpo in the QF and dropped sets in R2, R3 and R4, and Djokovic was down 2 sets to 0 against Seppi in R4 and then 2 sets to 1 against Tsonga in the QF. The closest match to Peak vs Peak was clearly the 2011 match.

Yes Djokovic had a walkover in the QF and yes there were lighter balls. However, if you watch the match, Djokovic clearly played well. It was a close match that was a couple of points away from going the distance. Djokovic was just unlucky that Federer had wound back the clock and was playing peak level tennis.

That being said, I really don't think much can be drawn from a sample size of 1 or 2, especially when they both have similar resumés at RG. Djokovic was a bit better against Nadal and has been a little more consistent. Difficult to give either of them a significant edge in terms of Peak vs Peak IMO.

 

[DSH]

The level of Djokovic and Federer on clay is almost identical although the style of the Swiss player is better suited to this surface.

 

[ADuck]

Djokovic fans always have some excuse for why he loses at the French Open.

2006-2010 - Probably don't count in their eyes
2011 - Match rhythm affected by a withdrawal
2012 - Someone in his family died?
2013 - He touched the net
2014 - Sick
2015 - Tired or bad scheduling or something blah blah blah
2017-2018 - doesn't count
2019 - Weather
2020 - Played bad/was tired

The truth is he just isn't good as good at the French Open as his fans think he is.

 

[metsman]

What about the wind in 2011? It was 15.5 km/hr from the west instead of Djokovic's preferred wind velocity of 14.8 km/hr from the southwest.

don't forget that the crowd was .67 decibels too loud at times in 2011, particularly late in the 4th.

 

[junior74]

2012 Wimbledon is their decisive Wimbledon match

 

[D.Nalby12]

Federer' form wasn't that much impressive. Goffin and Potro pushed him to five sets before he he met Djokovic. In 2011 both were close to their best and Federer beat him in very tight contest. IMO 90erer was bad matchup for Djokovic. Whenever Fed played himself in form before 2012 he managed to beat him. Yes it was very close often but Federer used to come on top on crucial points which shows his matchup advantage.

 

[StrongRule]

Djokovic fans always have some excuse for why he loses at the French Open.

2006-2010 - Probably don't count in their eyes
2011 - Match rhythm affected by a withdrawal
2012 - He started to own Nadal but was unlucky with the weather
2013 - He touched the net+got robbed by a bad call in the third set
2014 - Poisoned with gluten+very hot weather
2015 - Tired or bad scheduling or something blah blah blah
2017-2018 - doesn't count
2019 - Weather
2020 - Played bad/was tired

The truth is he just isn't good as good at the French Open as his fans think he is.

Fixed a few parts.

 

[Deleted member 775898]

Fixed a few parts.

I can't even tell if these are the Djoker fans excuses or what you think happened.

 

[junior74]

Djokovic fans always have some excuse for why he loses at the French Open.

The truth is he just isn't good as good at the French Open as his fans think he is.

But... that's impossible. He is The Chosen One!

 

[Tennis_Hands]

No. The "decisive" Federer - Djokovic match at RG was the RG 2011 SF, where Federer snapped Djoke's streak bang in the middle of his super Sayan mode, deprived him of a CYGS AND started his ascend to the number 1 the next year, which happened to materialise after another beatdown over the same opponent in the SF of Wimbledon 2012.

 

[mike danny]

Now you guys know by now that the 2012 RG SF doesn't exist. It is the minority report, forever erased from record and memory.

Well, the fact that 2012 Fed had no business even making the semis might have something to do with that

 

[TearTheRoofOff]

Yes, I agree, the walkover played a role in that match. Federer for sure wouldn't have won the first two sets if Djokovic played his QF match and maintained his play rhythm. Moreover, RG experimenting lighter balls for men gave the servebots a huge advantage in the tournament. They were able to play non-clay game on clay. Federer was able to bot his way to victory against Djokovic and Isner managed to push Nadal to the fifth set.

Despite all of that, their match was so close that it literally could have gone either way. It was basically a tie. Let both players play it one more time and no one would put his money on Federer, absolutely no one. Only one mini-break in two sets saved Federer's a**. In 2012 though you could clearly see the difference in class between these two on clay. It always amuses me seeing Fed fans talking about their RG 2011 match where the stars perfectly aligned for Federer as op mentioned and act like their next-year meeting didn't happen at all but whatever helps them sleep at night I guess lol.

'Analyst' is beyond generous.

 

[Im(moral) Winner]

Tactical tank

 

[ADuck]

Fixed a few parts.

Too much tennis(RG15,20), not enough tennis (RG11)
Too sunny (RG13), too windy(RG19), too rainy(RG12).
Too fast (RG11), too slow (RG20)

I think every box has been ticked. Every angle covered.

 

[mehdimike]

Too much tennis(RG15,20), not enough tennis (RG11)
Too sunny (RG13), too windy(RG19), too rainy(RG12).
Too fast (RG11), too slow (RG20)

I think every box has been ticked. Every angle covered.

I've never thought about this but you are right!

 

[StrongRule]

I can't even tell if these are the Djoker fans excuses or what you think happened.

I heard all of them from some Djokovic fanboys on Russian Eurosport.

 

[ibbi]

Enjoy.

You can try and convince us you're so aloof and above it, but you clearly actually believe every word you've written, and the condescending close cannot mask the petulance of it.