2016 WTA Rogers Cup.

Who will win?

  • Total voters
    7
  • Poll closed .
PDJ said:
You can understand why she does it. And it seems to happen fairly frequently.
I wonder how many times over the last few years?
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Well, she's just being smarter than the rest of them. That's what it boils down to. And if you have that cushion of being world number 1, it becomes much easier to concentrate your efforts on the ones that matter for posterity.
 
Knowing when to peak is extremely important. All the current two digit Slam winners, both in the men's and the women's game, know that very well. I don't like to bet, but I'm pretty sure after Serena, Federer, Djokovic and Nadal retire, we won't see four contemporary double digit Slam winners in a very very long time.
 
ScentOfDefeat said:
Knowing when to peak is extremely important. All the current two digit Slam winners, both in the men's and the women's game, know that very well. I don't like to bet, but I'm pretty sure after Serena, Federer, Djokovic and Nadal retire, we won't see four contemporary double digit Slam winners in a very very long time.
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Probably...certainly not on the mens' side, where the younger generation cannot even manage a majors victory.
 
THUNDERVOLLEY said:
Probably...certainly not on the mens' side, where the younger generation cannot even manage a majors victory.
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That's because there are three Serenas instead of just one. Still, Cilic and Wawrinka managed to win three out of the last million. With Kerber, Pennetta, Li Na and Sharapova (not young players either), you have 4 people not called Serena vs. 3 not in the big 4 on the men's side, not that much of a difference. I'd say it's comparatively easier for a surprise to happen in the men's game than in the WTA because 3 all-time greats should be a bigger obstacle for opponents than only 1 all-time great, and yet the difference is quite negligible. Muguruza has yet to prove she's in Murray's category before we can even talk about her being an all-time great.
 
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THUNDERVOLLEY said:
PDJ has managed to turn this..like so many threads...into his one man "attack Serena" rally.

Not a surprise.
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That's just silly. You took exception to @Mainad perfectly reasonable post re Serena pulling out of tournaments. I asked you to provide evidence this wasn't so- you haven't thus far aside from the reason why she lost to Henin in 2007!
Myself and other posters have given multiple examples for this year and last where she did indeed withdraw.
I don't see how providing facts to your post is an attack.
It's just that, facts.
 
skyline said:
She's likely to win more GSs. But you're right, I don't see her as a double-digit Slam winner.
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Yeah, I think this era was favourable for some players to get to double-digit Slams because of the rare transitional period in the early 2000's where it was still possible to win big titles when you were very young and now the current status quo where it's seemingly easier for those who are already established to keep winning as opposed to young up and comers. Which means you can have a Serena and a Federer who started winning relatively young and can/could still win in their 30's, whereas now it seems you have to be over 25 to start making your mark in the record books, but I very much doubt these careers will extend beyond 35 to give them a chance of overtaking this generation's records.
 
PDJ said:
That's just silly. You took exception to @Mainad perfectly reasonable post re Serena pulling out of tournaments. I asked you to provide evidence this wasn't so- you haven't thus far aside from the reason why she lost to Henin in 2007!
Myself and other posters have given multiple examples for this year and last where she did indeed withdraw.
I don't see how providing facts to your post is an attack.
It's just that, facts.
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Again, TV just trying to instigate a "us" (insiders) against "them" (outsiders) atmosphere. Don't you know we all have to agree with her opinion?
 
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ScentOfDefeat said:
Again, TV just trying to instigate a "us" (insiders) against "them" (outsiders) atmosphere. Don't you know we all have to agree with her opinion?
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Of course. But she is given the option to rebuke any one that disagrees with her with FACTS.
That's debate. That's a forum.
 
skyline said:
I don't remember that she was scheduled for either Stanford or Dubai this year. But could be wrong of course. I do recall her pulling out of Stanford last year.
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@spystud is right. She did pull out of Dubai this year- indeed for the third time in four years.
 
PDJ said:
@spystud is right. She did pull out of Dubai this year- indeed for the third time in four years.
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Gotcha, thanks.

i think going forward she should just keep it to: Hopman (since she seems to like it so much - I think that withdrawal was legitimate for sure) - AO - Miami - Rome or Madrid = FO - Wimbledon - Montreal - Cincy - USO - one tournament in Asia post-AO - WTF. Just pay the fine for IW and whatever other mandatory you skip.
 
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skyline said:
Gotcha, thanks.

i think going forward she should just keep it to: Hopman (since she seems to like it so much - I think that withdrawal was legitimate for sure) - AO - Miami - Rome or Madrid = FO - Wimbledon - Montreal - Cincy - USO - one tournament in Asia post-AO - WTF. Just pay the fine for IW and whatever other mandatory you skip.
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How many tournaments should they play each year?
 
PDJ said:
How many tournaments should they play each year?
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You mean players in general? I wouldn't recommend that reduced of a schedule to anyone else. For a younger player, I'd in fact favor they play as much as they reasonably can to get the valuable experience.
 
skyline said:
You mean players in general? I wouldn't recommend that reduced of a schedule to anyone else. For a younger player, I'd in fact favor they play as much as they reasonably can to get the valuable experience.
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No, I thought there was a minimum number of events top players had to enter, some being mandatory? Maybe that's the ATP?
 
McHale appears to be destroying Zheng. Took the first set @2 and now up a break in the second.

Errani and Pavs are up a set over Wozniak and Poots, respectively. We're not on schedule for upsets in this time slot, it seems. :)

EDIT: Poots up a break on Pavs in the second. Hope it goes to third.
 
Lol what a way for Putintseva to lose the match: up a double break in the third, served for it twice, was broken twice and loses her serve to lose the match because of a netcord winner.
 
RSH said:
Lol what a way for Putintseva to lose the match: up a double break in the third, served for it twice, was broken twice and loses her serve to lose the match because of a netcord winner.
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Damnnnn....painful. Didn't realize it went down like that. She'll be angry with herself a long while for that one.
 
Soianka said:
Serena has had plenty of injuries at slams.
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Not according to the non-fact checkers of Hate Serena - TW Branch.


Serena's longevity is a testament to her intelligently planned scheduling and exercising caution with her body. But I'm sure you know better...
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But according the Hate Serena group, this is bad, since she should see small events the same as what matters to history, such as the majors, and the Olympics.
 
Apparently Muguruza has pulled out of the tournament just now. Down to Kerber to have a go at the #1 ranking
 
THUNDERVOLLEY said:
Not according to the non-fact checkers of Hate Serena - TW Branch.




But according the Hate Serena group, this is bad, since she should see small events the same as what matters to history, such as the majors, and the Olympics.
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And yet you have no facts to the contrary. She has pulled out of many events. Fact.
Deal with it. Dress it up any way you want. But she has withdrawn from a lot, for what ever reason. Maybe some one knocked on the door too late?
Or maybe.....
 
Last edited:
...and that is all PDJ lives for: attacking Serena with his neverending fantasies only he believes. Immature and desperate in the extreme. But he will continue to derail the thread, meanwhile...
 
ScentOfDefeat said:
That's because there are three Serenas instead of just one.
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Two. Only Djokovic and Murray are a genuine force at the majors (at present, and even that is conditional), while Federer is struggling to win that final major as the door closes on his career. Nadal is not in any majors conversation anymore, and cannot be expected to win the 2017 French Open.

The rest of the more "notable" names in the field--Thiem, Isner, Nishikori, Kyrgios, Dimitrov, Simon, and a boatload of other ATP failures are doing nothing, except collecting checks for aging.

Still, Cilic and Wawrinka managed to win three out of the last million. With Kerber, Pennetta, Li Na and Sharapova (not young players either), you have 4 people not called Serena vs. 3 not in the big 4 on the men's side, not that much of a difference. I'd say it's comparatively easier for a surprise to happen in the men's game than in the WTA because 3 all-time greats should be a bigger obstacle for opponents than only 1 all-time great, and yet the difference is quite negligible. Muguruza has yet to prove she's in Murray's category before we can even talk about her being an all-time great.
Click to expand...

Keep in mind that the ATP's "younger generation" are all aging and could not steal a major if their lives depended on it. On the WTA side, Muguruza made her breakthrough by reaching the Wimbledon final in 2015, and followed that by winning a major in 2016. That is progression that does not exist among the non "big two" ATP. And on that note, your:

Muguruza has yet to prove she's in Murray's category before we can even talk about her being an all-time great.
Click to expand...

..is a poor comparison, for two reasons:
  • Muguruza--unlike a veteran such as Murray (yes, he is a veteran)--is a fresh player who broke through in fairly quick time, and is just getting started, but you're comparing her to a man who has been neck deep in his pro career for 11 years? By the way, that's 11 years and he only has 3 majors. Comparisons are not necessarily in Murray's favor.
  • Murray is not yet an "all time great" player with only three majors. "All time great"--in theory--should be players who won a number not so common as three majors (which can be easily found throughout tennis history). It is great for a career, and he is forever a class above the innumerable players who never won a major, but there are levels of consideration to any list.
 
ScentOfDefeat said:
You never know! Kerber isn't exactly a steamroller.
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She's not. But MLB is one of those people (so common on WTA tour, it seems) who are either in the zone and super dangerous or completely out of it. And so far Kerber's always managed to get her on a bad day.

Mirjana has no plan B. If plan A works, it works. If it doesn't....

Makes me so sad. She was in that last generation where winning GS as a teen was possible. Was in W semis as a teen. Was totally derailed by family abuse. I believe she might have developed plan B if she hadn't lost so much of her career to personal problems.

Anyway, I like Angie just fine and I do believe tour needs stability, but I still hope MLB takes her out. :-)
 
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THUNDERVOLLEY said:
Two. Only Djokovic and Murray are a genuine force at the majors (at present, and even that is conditional), while Federer is struggling to win that final major as the door closes on his career. Nadal is not in any majors conversation anymore, and cannot be expected to win the 2017 French Open.

The rest of the more "notable" names in the field--Thiem, Isner, Nishikori, Kyrgios, Dimitrov, Simon, and a boatload of other ATP failures are doing nothing, except collecting checks for aging.



Keep in mind that the ATP's "younger generation" are all aging and could not steal a major if their lives depended on it. On the WTA side, Muguruza made her breakthrough by reaching the Wimbledon final in 2015, and followed that by winning a major in 2016. That is progression that does not exist among the non "big two" ATP. And on that note, your:



..is a poor comparison, for two reasons:
  • Muguruza--unlike a veteran such as Murray (yes, he is a veteran)--is a fresh player who broke through in fairly quick time, and is just getting started, but you're comparing her to a man who has been neck deep in his pro career for 11 years? By the way, that's 11 years and he only has 3 majors. Comparisons are not necessarily in Murray's favor.
  • Murray is not yet an "all time great" player with only three majors. "All time great"--in theory--should be players who won a number not so common as three majors (which can be easily found throughout tennis history). It is great for a career, and he is forever a class above the innumerable players who never won a major, but there are levels of consideration to any list.
Click to expand...

That whole post is you building a giant strawman and then setting it on fire.
 
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Fedole said:
Apparently Muguruza has pulled out of the tournament just now. Down to Kerber to have a go at the #1 ranking
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Kerber is losing her title points from Stanford in 2 weeks so can't see her doing much damage to the number 1 ranking unless she wins here
 
Not great about Muguruza, it's like these players don't want to get number 1. Yikes. As Spystud said, no points for Serena to defend post USO so it's now or never (and by never I mean like mid next year). At which point Serena would have taken the record from Graf of most consecutive weeks at number 1.
 
I see a few surprise results overnight. Not huge but makes the 2R/3R matches a bit less interesting.
Vania King beat Babos. Surprise
Kucova over recent titelist Wickmayer
Lucky loser McHale over AO QFist Zhang Shuai
Kudryatseva over Kiki
Abanda over Zheng
 
Aussie Darcy said:
I see a few surprise results overnight. Not huge but makes the 2R/3R matches a bit less interesting.
Vania King beat Babos. Surprise
Kucova over recent titelist Wickmayer
Lucky loser McHale over AO QFist Zhang Shuai
Kudryatseva over Kiki
Abanda over Zheng
Click to expand...

Thank you for this.

McHale appears to have had the benefit of injured Shuai, just as an aside.
 
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