2017 Monte Carlo SF: [4] R. Nadal vs. [10] D. Goffin

Who wins?

  • Total voters
    43
cc0509 said:
It's very clear what I'm implying. Pointing fingers at one Big Three player and pretending that the other Big Three players are not doing the same is beyond ridiculous IMO. But that's not a topic for this thread.
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Are you implying, cc0509, that the rest of the top 100 is in theory on the level of the Trifecta, but that they do not make effective concoctions.
 
Pavla said:
Love Goffin. But he should have been able to put that terrible call behind him. These ain't the bunny slopes.
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Agreed, but there are a few things to consider:
- he had a tough match yesterday, and yes, it takes a toll on his mental strength
- he was playing against Nadal, and against Nadal every ball counts
- one can lose his mind when a point like that is so stupidly being stolen right in front of one's eyes

In the end he won just one more game after that... he said "that's enough". Sometimes this is the only thing between greatness and the rest :(
 
-NN- said:
Don't worry you will when you read the thread back LOL!!!
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:eek:

Seems Kaito Kid was in the house!

tumblr_ndbll4c6fh1qfrcg7o1_500.gif
 
-NN- said:
Are you implying, cc0509, that the rest of the top 100 is in theory on the level of the Trifecta, but that they do not make effective concoctions.
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I'm not saying anything about the top 100. I'm only talking about the Big Three in this discussion. The top 100 is another discussion. I've made my opinions on pro sports and PEDS clear many times on this forum. I don't need to rehash it. Check my history.
 
cc0509 said:
I'm not saying anything about the top 100. I'm only talking about the Big Three in this discussion. The top 100 is another discussion. I've made my opinions on pro sports and PEDS clear many times on this forum. I don't need to rehash it. Check my history.
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No thanks that would take a very long time. PEDs and sport go hand in hand.
 
bad development of this match because of the bad umpire.

no challenge from nadal, everybody saw the ball was wide and the ump checked it on a false ball.

i´m a nadal fan and i thougt..c´mon rafa you know that the ball was out. say something.
on the other side...he was on the other side an way back. so he couldn´t sya somthing. its not his turn.
the only way, if he thought the ball was wide, he could have let the next serve go away and don´t hit the return.

but i dont know...it is not the issue of nadal.

big credits to goffin for giving the ace to nadal after an out call.

very sad that this match goes in that way. but goffin is a pro and had to get his things together...
 
Bogdan_TT said:
Agreed, but there are a few things to consider:
- he had a tough match yesterday, and yes, it takes a toll on his mental strength
- he was playing against Nadal, and against Nadal every ball counts
- one can lose his mind when a point like that is so stupidly being stolen right in front of one's eyes

In the end he won just one more game after that... he said "that's enough". Sometimes this is the only thing between greatness and the rest :(
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No argument. I've had enough mental breakdowns on the court to feel nothing but compassion for the wee man.
 
Steve0904 said:
Yeah, you like getting told off by former pros turned commentators, don't you? :)
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again, your judgement is obviously lacking; look no further than your participation in such a silly, stupid, made up topic. so you're the last one to surmise who or who hasn't been told off.

if i did tweet Carillo, i have a much better chance to get a response than you would because she should know her comments regarding Nadal are ridiculous in this episode. but, she knows there are enough ignorant and/or emotional Nadal haters out there (like yourself) to get her some attention.
 
On one side it's Goffin's job to move on and keep doing his best. On another side, the call was so frustrating and he still fought hard for that game, only losing focus afterwards - how many/which players would remain unaffected? And against Nadal on clay?

Even at 4-2 I would still consider Nadal the favorite, but it's undeniable the umpire killed the match and the tournament...

Ohh, and btw, only Nadal haters will crucify him here. He was on the other side of the court, the umpire did get down from the chair to look at the ball mark, even if he felt it was out, how could he challenge that? When the umpire makes the call he doubts his feeling at least as much as he doubts the call...

Guess I'll skip the match tomorrow and sleep a little longer...


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 
NaomiKonjuhPotapova said:
Anyone can fill me in happened at what score?

Trying to replay on the moment on tennistv
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Nadal 2 - 3 ; 40-adv Goffin
Nadal sends it long, linesman calls it out. Both think the game is done (making it 2-4) but suddenly Cedric decides it's time for his weekly 10 meter jogging session and waddles over to the mark and says it's in. He's obviously pointing at the wrong mark but the linesman doesn't correct him. Afterwards HawkEye shows that it's clearly 10cm long. Goffin is furious and unable to focus well for the rest of the match, wins only 1 more game.
 
merwy said:
Nadal 2 - 3 ; 40-adv Goffin
Nadal sends it long, linesman calls it out. Both think the game is done (making it 2-4) but suddenly Cedric decides it's time for his weekly 10 meter jogging session and waddles over to the mark and says it's in. He's obviously pointing at the wrong mark but the linesman doesn't correct him. Afterwards HawkEye shows that it's clearly 10cm long. Goffin is furious and unable to focus well for the rest of the match, wins only 1 more game.
Click to expand...

Thanks! Lol that game alone is 20 minutes.
 
DRII said:
again, your judgement is obviously lacking; look no further than your participation in such a silly, stupid, made up topic. so you're the last one to surmise who or who hasn't been told off.

if i did tweet Carillo, i have a much better chance to get a response than you would because she should know her comments regarding Nadal are ridiculous in this episode. but, she knows there are enough ignorant and/or emotional Nadal haters out there (like yourself) to get her some attention.
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what did she say?
 
As a Nadal fan, I wanted Goffin to go up 4-2 after the bad call, but I think Nadal would still have taken this. I feel bad for Goffin, he got screwed big time.

All the haters that are ripping on Nadal are desperate morons. Here are some ideas in easily-digestible bullet point form before I advise you resort to lobotomy.

1. Nadal thought the ball was out, but he wasn't sure. Players make mistakes all the time on balls being in or out, even on their own end of the court, let alone on the opponent's side.

2. When Mourier overruled, any player not 100% sure, would accept the chair umpire's overrule. Why?

2.a. Because the chair umpire has about the best spot in the whole stadium to see if a ball is in or out.
2.b. Because the chair umpire has (theoretically) his focus on the ball and is highly experienced.
2.c. And because for a chair umpire to overrule, requires a level of conviction on his part which is hard to question by a player who can't be 100% sure.

3. LOL about your conjectures about Fed or Djoker forfeiting, you idiots. I've seen Fed and Djoker REQUEST unfair overrules, yet you assume they would forfeit this point without being 100% sure?

Heck, I've seen Djokovic throw a fit with the umpire when a ball by Tsonga that was perfectly in (with Djoker looking up on it a few feet away) wasn't called out.

4. Haters: Please stick some lemons in your lower intestine and set up a roadside stand.
 
Rusty Shackleford said:
As a Nadal fan, I wanted Goffin to go up 4-2 after the bad call, but I think Nadal would still have taken this. I feel bad for Goffin, he got screwed big time.

All the haters that are ripping on Nadal are desperate morons. Here are some ideas in easily-digestible bullet point form before I advise you resort to lobotomy.

1. Nadal thought the ball was out, but he wasn't sure. Players make mistakes all the time on balls being in or out, even on their own end of the court, let alone on the opponent's side.

2. When Mourier overruled, any player not 100% sure, would accept the chair umpire's overrule. Why?

2.a. Because the chair umpire has about the best spot in the whole stadium to see if a ball is in or out.
2.b. Because the chair umpire has (theoretically) his focus on the ball and is highly experienced.
2.c. And because for a chair umpire to overrule, requires a level of conviction on his part which is hard to question by a player who can't be 100% sure.

3. LOL about your conjectures about Fed or Djoker forfeiting, you idiots. I've seen Fed and Djoker REQUEST unfair overrules, yet you assume they would forfeit this point without being 100% sure?

Heck, I've seen Djokovic throw a fit with the umpire when a ball by Tsonga that was perfectly in (with Djoker looking up on it a few feet away) wasn't called out.

4. Haters: Please stick some lemons in your lower intestine and set up a roadside stand.
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+ videos or it didn't happen.
 
Rusty Shackleford said:
As a Nadal fan, I wanted Goffin to go up 4-2 after the bad call, but I think Nadal would still have taken this. I feel bad for Goffin, he got screwed big time.

All the haters that are ripping on Nadal are desperate morons. Here are some ideas in easily-digestible bullet point form before I advise you resort to lobotomy.

1. Nadal thought the ball was out, but he wasn't sure. Players make mistakes all the time on balls being in or out, even on their own end of the court, let alone on the opponent's side.

2. When Mourier overruled, any player not 100% sure, would accept the chair umpire's overrule. Why?

2.a. Because the chair umpire has about the best spot in the whole stadium to see if a ball is in or out.
2.b. Because the chair umpire has (theoretically) his focus on the ball and is highly experienced.
2.c. And because for a chair umpire to overrule, requires a level of conviction on his part which is hard to question by a player who can't be 100% sure.

3. LOL about your conjectures about Fed or Djoker forfeiting, you idiots. I've seen Fed and Djoker REQUEST unfair overrules, yet you assume they would forfeit this point without being 100% sure?

Heck, I've seen Djokovic throw a fit with the umpire when a ball by Tsonga that was perfectly in (with Djoker looking up on it a few feet away) wasn't called out.

4. Haters: Please stick some lemons in your lower intestine and set up a roadside stand.
Click to expand...
Disagree with the bold (if he wasn't sure, he surely would have asked for the mark to be checked on such a big point, instead he turned away and went for his towel), but all of 2 are excellent points.

There's still a small argument to be made that by the reaction of Goffin, a player not known to be unfair, and the crowd, he should have known that the umpire was actually wrong in this instance. But that's a tough ask given the magnitude of the match for his clay season and whatever uncertainty he may have had regardless.
 
Rusty Shackleford said:
As a Nadal fan, I wanted Goffin to go up 4-2 after the bad call, but I think Nadal would still have taken this. I feel bad for Goffin, he got screwed big time.

All the haters that are ripping on Nadal are desperate morons. Here are some ideas in easily-digestible bullet point form before I advise you resort to lobotomy.

1. Nadal thought the ball was out, but he wasn't sure. Players make mistakes all the time on balls being in or out, even on their own end of the court, let alone on the opponent's side.

2. When Mourier overruled, any player not 100% sure, would accept the chair umpire's overrule. Why?

2.a. Because the chair umpire has about the best spot in the whole stadium to see if a ball is in or out.
2.b. Because the chair umpire has (theoretically) his focus on the ball and is highly experienced.
2.c. And because for a chair umpire to overrule, requires a level of conviction on his part which is hard to question by a player who can't be 100% sure.

3. LOL about your conjectures about Fed or Djoker forfeiting, you idiots. I've seen Fed and Djoker REQUEST unfair overrules, yet you assume they would forfeit this point without being 100% sure?

Heck, I've seen Djokovic throw a fit with the umpire when a ball by Tsonga that was perfectly in (with Djoker looking up on it a few feet away) wasn't called out.

4. Haters: Please stick some lemons in your lower intestine and set up a roadside stand.
Click to expand...

dont stop.

let it OUT! :rolleyes:
 
Well well. Of course the outcome was like totally predicted; Nadal IS back, perhaps not at his best-ever, but certainly good enough to reclaim his title of undisputed King of Clay in 2017.
Reaching no less than FOUR finals on HC already should have been a tell-tale for anyone who still doubted him.

As such: congrats to Rafa, and get that #10 tomorrow! (I'll be mighty surprised should he fail at this...)


Awww... Goffin - it's been a very long, long time ago that I've ever seen a player get ROBBED like happened here.
I wasn't able to watch this match live, but darn, I saw the rerun of this incident, and it made my eyes bleed.
Absolutely ridiculous, and I guess even an ATG would have been rattled after such a stupid mistake, let alone a fellow reaching the semi of a Masters for his first time ever.

I can well understand umps, linesmen, and even players making mistakes at times - they're all just human beings after all.
But this... that ball wasn't even being CLOSE to the line, it was at least 10 cm behind!
Not a close call at all, in fact even a Stevie Wonder would perhaps be able to have called it correctly.

So not merely an ump having dozed off on the chair, but also a linesman (who refused to point out the ump that he was pointing at the wrong mark) with a questionable attention span.

I barely ever say things like I do now, but I think neither of the two should be allowed to referee/line-judge any top match for the upcoming season anymore.
BAN THEM!
That boo-ing and whistling Mourier got from the crowd? Totally and absolutely deserved.

Goffin's outburst / implosion thereafter may not have been very 'professional', but it is totally understandable.
Mind you, I'm not saying the outcome of this match would have turned out any different if this incident hadn't happened, but it's just something that should not happen at this level of a top tournament. I can totally understand it if Goffin might have thought, "well, apparently the outcome of this match has already been decided from the ATP PTB beforehand..."
At least Goffin can find some comfort in the fact that the crowd was totally with him. I hope so.
 
Chanwan said:
:confused::confused: What's the relevant comparison here? The call is made after Rafa has hit his shot as far as I can hear
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What I'm getting at is the mental fortitude to erase a bad call from memory and keep chugging along. Goffin was playing brilliant tennis up until that point, then only managed to win 1 game.
 
Chanwan said:
Disagree with the bold (if he wasn't sure, he surely would have asked for the mark to be checked on such a big point, instead he turned away and went for his towel), but all of 2 are excellent points.

There's still a small argument to be made that by the reaction of Goffin, a player not known to be unfair, and the crowd, he should have known that the umpire was actually wrong in this instance. But that's a tough ask given the magnitude of the match for his clay season and whatever uncertainty he may have had regardless.
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The point is players are rarely sure on close balls on the opposite end of the court. You have to trust the line judge, chair umpire, etc. He obviously thought it was out, but it is tough to be sure. Why? Players are wrong all the time, so if the chair umpire overrules, even checks the mark (specially on clay), etc, how the heck can you be sure?

Seriously, man. I know you are a very reasonable poster, and my post wasn't addressed to you though.

@vive le beau jeu ! also has diplomatic immunity. LOL
 
fundrazer said:
No guarantee goffin pulls out the win but umpire killed the tournament. People pissed today, and I can't imagine most tennis fans are gonna be interested in Rafa vs no name Spanish grinder tomorrow.
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The whole tournament has been a dud. This MC no better than those random 250 clay tournies Thiem loves to win.
 
DRII said:
basically that Nadal is evil for not going against the umpire and assuming that he must have looked at the wrong mark and giving Goffin the point...
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Stay in school kids, otherwise you'll end up like Carillo, or worse - Mourier!

Mourier gets 100% of the blame here. Never seen someone with such limited intelligence and an inherent lack of match awareness.
 
duaneeo said:
It's a natural thing to do when you know the call is right. If you're unsure or think the call is wrong, you call for the chair to take a second look.
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no, because that ist the job of you´re opponent, if its called in. Here we have a referee that most likely just had seen it wrong, went there, and overruled the linesperson, wich also don´t corrects the call/refree looking at the same mark. So it was clearly a wrong and bad decision, but i never would blame Nadal for it, simply because, many times on clay, way back from over the net, you cannot decide whether its in or out ... sometimes you can, and sometimes you cant.

Thats the point why in social matches (at least here in germany) if my opponent calls a ball out on his side i simply accept it, until it hits the fence before ... because its hard to see, and i have made a lot of wrong calls that were corrected, that i was certain i was right, and get it afterwards that i was completely wrong.
And, at least, in a Tournee, an Umpire gives me a point that he has checked and seen as correct, why should i question his decision. He has linespersons he also can talk to, he can see a lot better, he has replay and everything ... all this we also have on TV, but not the Players on the field.


And what I REALLY HATE is this thing that you just wanted to follow a mach, and to get whats going on without actually watching it, and all this Games with Participation of Federer/Nadal/Djokovic sooner or later explode because of this dumb mass of Fanbase morons (of every Player) sittig their arses flat in some betting office pounding their tapatalk and drinking the 10 can of Lager ... haven´t had played a single ball of Tennis, or even ever seen a tennis court in all their lives ...
 
AceSalvo said:
oh and btw, Nadal was already crucified by Fed at the start of this year.

I dont think Nadal haters would need to do that here.
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I dislike Nadal's antics, but I cannot see bad sportsmanship from him in the match. We cannot assume he did wrong now just because he doesn't have a perfect record. The umpire and he alone is to blame for what happened today.
 
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