BeatlesFan
Bionic Poster
He just dialed in this match. His ROS was singularly atrocious. He wouldn't have beaten Rafa even had he put forth a decent effort, but he didn't even bother to give 50%.LOL at Waw! What a joke
He just dialed in this match. His ROS was singularly atrocious. He wouldn't have beaten Rafa even had he put forth a decent effort, but he didn't even bother to give 50%.LOL at Waw! What a joke
I don't want Monfils. We know he sucks against the top players. His performances against Djokovic at 2016 USO and Thiem at 2019 FO were despicable.So now only either Berrettini or Monfils can qualify for the WTF.
IMO Murray was actually destroyed sooner barring that one RG run. Seemed so after Dubai 2017.That match against Murray destroyed both of their careers.
Now now, let's not disparage him. He has actually won 3 slams by beating the best players for them and he hasn't been at his best since 2018.
Stan today is a shadow of 2014-2016 Stan.
IMO Murray was actually destroyed sooner barring that one RG run. Seemed so after Dubai 2017.
At 2014 AO he defeated the AO GOAT, Djokovic. Rafa was injured, yes, but his win over Djokovic in the QF already makes him the deserving winner of that event.Injured Rafa and 2016 he played Djokovic who shouldn't even have been in the final. He got several Walk overs. He was a mess and even playing with physical pain. 2015 win was good, but a fluke.
Probably the final finishing blow but was showing signs after his impressive 2016 season.I agree however that RG match against Stan is a finishing blow. Even Murray admitted that.
You really think Tsonga can't beat him? Tsonga played a few marathons in Shanghai 2015 but still beat Nadal after that. (and Nadal was actually playing well in this tournament, not his usual 2015 level)Rafa will make the semis easily. He has a backhand-less Tsonga next who has just played a marathon against Struff.
But maybe he would at least completed 2017 without that match.IMO Murray was actually destroyed sooner barring that one RG run. Seemed so after Dubai 2017.
He has had a good run.Stan is Finnish
A total mug who beat Djokovic a few times in slams, including slam finals.
I don't want Nadal to lose. I am completely neutral. This isn't a slam.You really think Tsonga can't beat him? Tsonga played a few marathons in Shanghai 2015 but still beat Nadal after that. (and Nadal was actually playing well in this tournament, not his usual 2015 level)
Yes, Tsonga is a declined player, but I don't know what a player needs to be in order not to have a chance against Nadal on these courts.
I think one more deep slam run beyond the QF is in the cards fro him.I'm disappointed to see Wawrinka wasn't able to at least push this into a 3rd set. He was playing better in the 2nd but he basically gave up at 4-4 in the 2nd, bad finish.
Even though he's had a better year in 2019 compared to 2018, I do wonder where does he go from there? He hasn't won a single title since 2017.
A prime Federer and Nadal can challenge as well. Djokovic would certainly have trouble with say AO 2007 Federer or AO 2009 Nadal or something like that.It's called MATCHUP issues. Literally the only player in the universe who could trouble PRIME Novak on Hards is Peak Wawrinka.
No one else can beat Djokovic on hards if the Serb is playing his best.
Wawrinka benefits against Novak by the dynamics of their matchup.
And he most likely won't.So far Djokovic hasn't gained any points of Rafa stillme gusta!
Might be reaching here but defo think there's something weird in the air. Don't know about Paris but here a lot of people (myself included) have been getting sick the last week or so. Random throat inflammation, fatigue, feeling of extreme dehydration even after having couple of cups of water (again related to throat lining). Might have breathed in some weird chemical.
Hmmm, I was thinking that the guy with 11 HC slams may have a chance too, but what do I know?It's called MATCHUP issues. Literally the only player in the universe who could trouble PRIME Novak on Hards is Peak Wawrinka.
No one else can beat Djokovic on hards if the Serb is playing his best.
Wawrinka benefits against Novak by the dynamics of their matchup.
Hmm. I doubt that.A prime Federer and Nadal can challenge as well. Djokovic would certainly have trouble with say AO 2007 Federer or AO 2009 Nadal or something like that.
Wasn't Tsonga Rafa's only top 10 win 10 years ago post RG?Nadal and Tsonga will meet again at Paris master QF, exactly a decade later.![]()
Unprovable against Fed. Their best versions have never coincided there.Hmm. I doubt that.
Djokovic is the AO GOAT. Djokovic at his best there beats Fed and Nadal - any version - IMO.
Good point. But I still feel Novak is better at AO than Fed is at AO.Hmmm, I was thinking that the guy with 11 HC slams may have a chance too, but what do I know?
No, he didn't. And how on Earth was he going to win the Masters 1000? He will never win a Masters 1000, it is ridiculous to include him.I think it shows the points as they progress through the rounds of the Bercy. So, Minotaur had a chance, if he won it.
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Nadal and Tsonga will meet again at Paris master QF, exactly a decade later.![]()
If Sock could win one, so could De Minaur.No, he didn't. And how on Earth was he going to win the Masters 1000? He will never win a Masters 1000, it is ridiculous to include him.
ROFL. A disgrace was when he lost 6-3 6-0 to Djokovic in WTF 2014 or 6-4 6-1 in Cincinnati 2015. He was missing like every second shot in these matches. Today he actually fought and only played one really bad game.He'll 100% do better than Wawrinka and atleast show some sort of fight and will have the crowd behind is back. What Wawrinka showed today is a disgrace. Guy has no belief.
It would still be close IMO. Djokovic is better than Nadal at AO though peak wise though. Djokovic would need 5 sets or at the very very very least 4 very tight sets to stop AO 2007 Federer/AO 2009 Nadal IMO.Hmm. I doubt that.
Djokovic is the AO GOAT. Djokovic at his best there beats Fed and Nadal - any version - IMO.
may tsonga denadalize the draw and save tennis...You really think Tsonga can't beat him? Tsonga played a few marathons in Shanghai 2015 but still beat Nadal after that. (and Nadal was actually playing well in this tournament, not his usual 2015 level)
Yes, Tsonga is a declined player, but I don't know what a player needs to be in order not to have a chance against Nadal on these courts.
Based on the H2H at the USO and number of USO titles, I believe anything can happen at the USO between an in form Nadal and an in form Djokovic, meaning that some matches will be won by Nadal and others by Djokovic.Good point. But I still feel Novak is better at AO than Fed is at AO.
And I know Fed's not done well recently at the USOpen and lost a few to Novak there, but peak Fed IMO is better at UsOpen than Peak Novak.
So peak Fed and peak Novak would split HC slams.
Peak Nadal would probably win nothing against peak Novak on HC.
It would still be close IMO. Djokovic is better than Nadal at AO though peak wise though. Djokovic would need 5 sets or at the very very very least 4 very tight sets to stop AO 2007 Federer/AO 2009 Nadal IMO.
ROFL. A disgrace was when he lost 6-3 6-0 to Djokovic in WTF 2014 or 6-4 6-1 in Cincinnati 2015. He was missing like every second shot in these matches. Today he actually fought and only played one really bad game.
Not like Berrettini is much better.I don't want Monfils. We know he sucks against the top players. His performances against Djokovic at 2016 USO and Thiem at 2019 FO were despicable.
At the USO, and as the H2H indicates, I believe anything can happen at the USO between an in form Nadal and an in form Djokovic, meaning that some matches will be won by Nadal and others by Djokovic.
At the AO? I gotta agree with you definetely. Novak at his best is too much for both Federer and Nadal at the AO. He has proved it too many times. Defeated Federer in 2008 in 3, in 2011, when Federer was only 29, in 3. In the AO 2015 also defeated Federer in 4. At the AO 2012, the match was close, but still Djokovic proved he is too much even for an in form Nadal. At the AO 2019 he just easily defeated poor Nadal in 3.
Berrettini is still an unknown factor. I have already seen everything that Monfils can do.Not like Berrettini is much better.
How about we compromise, take neither and give Andeh Murray a WC.
Berrettini is definitely better. At least he showed some decent results this year. As for Monfils, I already forgot such a player exists.Not like Berrettini is much better.
How about we compromise, take neither and give Andeh Murray a WC.
2011 Djokovic was more aggressive I think he would match up better with Stan. Stan does do well in slams vs Djokovic but that times he faced Djokovic out of shape like USO 2019 and people forget this. Somebody like Federer is harder for Stan.Yeah. Absolutely. I'm not saying the matches would be a cakewalk. He might take 5 sets to beat peak Fed/peak Nadal at AO. But one would still think he would win.
The equation changes when you put in Wawrinka. Even though Stan won't trouble other top players, his game still works against Novak.
Even a peak Novak shifts to defensive against Stan and the Swiss can belt winners from all over. It's like Stan brings the WORST out of Novak. He controls the center of the court and runs Djokovic ragged.
So even though Novak is a far far superior player to Stan, he still feels inferior when they both play at their peaks on HC and clay.
Get routined by dudes like Zverev or geriatric Tsonga?Berrettini is still an unknown factor. I have already seen everything that Monfils can do.
may tsonga denadalize the draw and save tennis...
He still has victories over Thiem and Zverev this year.Get routined by dudes like Zverev or geriatric Tsonga?
2011 Djokovic was more aggressive I think he would match up better with Stan. Stan does do well in slams vs Djokovic but that times he faced Djokovic out of shape like USO 2019 and people forget this. Somebody like Federer is harder for Stan.
I think Djokovic is the best at AO overall his record shows it.
No offense, but that comment (that Nadal is returning nearer the baseline because his legs are not the same) makes no logic. Nadal started returning near the baseline. Watch his Wimbledon 2006-2008 matches agaisnt Federer. He returned so near the baseline, if not even on the baseline itself. It is only that in recent years he got used to return far behind the baseline. After the Wimbledon 2019 SF, his coaching team told him to return nearer the baseline and he is gradually adapting to that new tactic, as we can clearly see in this tournament.Well his legs are not what they used to be to begin with.
No offense, but that comment (that Nadal is returning nearer the baseline because his legs are not the same) makes no logic. Nadal started returning near the baseline. Watch his Wimbledon 2006-2008 matches agaisnt Federer. He returned so near the baseline, if not even on the baseline itself. It is only that in recent years he got used to return far behind the baseline. After the Wimbledon 2019 SF, his coaching team told him to return nearer the baseline and he is gradually adpating to that new tactic, as we can clearly see in this tournament.
It would be nice to see him peak at another slam. I'll guess the fan in me would like to see him regain his pre-surgery level and re-integrate the top 8 but I wonder if this will materialize.I think one more deep slam run beyond the QF is in the cards fro him.
And even a title along the way. There is always Geneva.