2021 US Open Final - [1] Novak Djokovic vs. [2] Daniil Medvedev

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Rina

Professional
Except he wasn't finally accepted. A heavily pro-Djokovic crowd attended the final to witness the CYGS, as evidenced by the incredible number of Djokovic/Serbia flags and banners in the building. The same fans who don't like him didn't start liking him yesterday.
Except they did like him, not Serbs. I was there in earlier rounds and Novak was still perhaps not getting too much love, but after his third-round win, the crowd went nuts for him. During the first set they were all for Kei, but it charged in the second set. I can tell you there were two of us who were pro-Novak at that match, other than his wife and his team. And it continued. Bcs the crowd wanted to see a CYGS. And they are not losers like you. Will he have the same next year? Probably not, but he had it in the second week this year.
 

weakera

G.O.A.T.
Except they did like him, not Serbs. I was there in earlier rounds and Novak was still perhaps not getting too much love, but after his third-round win, the crowd went nuts for him. During the first set they were all for Kei, but it charged in the second set. I can tell you there were two of us who were pro-Novak at that match, other than his wife and his team. And it continued. Bcs the crowd wanted to see a CYGS. And they are not losers like you. Will he have the same next year? Probably not, but he had it in the second week this year.

Ah yes. There were two pro-Djokovic fans in Arthur Ashe arena out of a crowd of 23,000. Thank you for that insider scoop :laughing:
 

Vamos Rafa Nadal

Hall of Fame
I am waiting for someone to present a realistic way this match can go that results in Medvedev winning, other than just throwing a hissy fit about Novak winning.
I laid out a case for Medvedev winning in post after post. Stats in a tournament matter. It's amusing reading the posts from before the match with Djokovic fans 100% certain he would win and ridiculing the few of us who told you guys that Medvedev was going to win and why he was going to win. Djokovic fans clung to the past and expected results from when Djokovic was younger and Medvedev hadn't developed better coping skills on the court. AO is not USO - Djokovic has a winning record at AO and a losing record at USO. Every single point I made before the match was valid but his fans wanted Djokovic to win so badly they couldn't accept the validity of my arguments. Stats matter!
 

Rina

Professional
I couldn't watch it lives due to work....but i got some pop corn and beer, and I am going to watch the replay now and savour every moments of the match with this 74 pages threads like tasting a glass of fine wine...this is going to be a glorious Monday evening for me... :-D :-D :-D :-D
Becuse you are a true fan of Med? Or bcs you are happy Novak did not surpass the number of grand slams of Federer?
 

Vamos Rafa Nadal

Hall of Fame
I was looking up Medvedev's stats and for some reason they were available for every match except his second round match with Andujar? I searched all over for the stats to that match but he won that match easily. So I only have stats for his 5 other matches but they show that he is averaging less than 3 break points against him in his matches, he is serving an average of 70% first serves, winning an average of 83% of them, and over 60% of his second serves, he has broken serve 36 times and had at least 24 more break points beyond that, he has had zero tiebreaks. These are incredibly impressive stats. I know Djokovic fans will do what they always do, try to punch holes in his extraordinary achievement during this tournament, but the point is that Medvedev is playing at a level in which he can win. (I can hear it now: "but Djokovic can walk on water and will win anyway despite the fact that he has been on the court longer, played far less well than Medvedev, faces far more break points, served far less well, and besides Medvedev hasn't been tested - blah blah blech!).

This USO will be the greatest tournament ever if Djokovic loses. The transitional tournament away from the big 3 era that tennis needs right now.
I kept making the case over and over for why Medvedev was going to win. Djokovic fans refused to believe it. It was clear to me that he was going to win. When so many tell you that you are wrong you start to doubt yourself but I was telling my friends who don't snark at me that I was quite confident in Medvedev's winning the tournament. I predicted it on the Thursday that the draw came out over two weeks ago and never changed my prediction. I predicted 3 sets once the dust settled on the semis and I looked closely at their match stats throughout the tournament.
 

stringertom

Bionic Poster
Med is very genuine, loveable guy
He’s gradually getting there but his first few years on tour were a publicist’s nightmare with the default over a racial innuendo and then throwing coins at a Wimby chair umpire after an early round loss. The bout with the camera last month in Cincinnati was not a “lovable” moment either.

I have to applaud the tag team female brain team in his box. Meddle always gives great credit to his wife and sports psychologist for taming his inner beast. The results speak for themselves.
 

Rina

Professional
They only cheered for him because that crowd just wanted to see history. Otherwise that crowd today didn’t care for Joker. He plays against Fed or Nadal next year that same crowd cheer against him all over again, just like the good old days.
So unlike you, on occasion, they can be bigger human beings than you?
 

Vamos Rafa Nadal

Hall of Fame
Nobody knows what will happen, but trolling here is off the charts! I mean Medveded might win, but people actually confidently posting he will win is nothing but being butt hurt for your players' sake.
Sad and pathetic and shows what sore losers you all are.
Maybe we honestly felt he was going to win? I know I did!
 

Rina

Professional
Maybe we honestly felt he was going to win? I know I did!
You looked over the thread while the match was happening and after the match? Posters even admitting they were just jerks cheering against Nole, to save Rafa and Fed's count. Did you miss this part? The IDs of pps hating on Novak were mostly pics of Fed and Nadal and of course, there is Michael Nadal...
 

Vamos Rafa Nadal

Hall of Fame
I think Medvedev has to shake the CYGS hoopla and go out and concentrate on his game. He has to have shot tolerance and accept that Djokovic's shot selection will win him points (but that is the same for Medvedev). I have not understood why people thought Zverev was the more likely to defeat Djokovic - I have felt the opposite, because Zverev defeats himself so often and has had a poor record at the Grand Slams. I have confidence that Medvedev can do it so long as he does not get rattled like he did when he ran into the camera a few weeks ago. I disagree with those who say Medvedev has to improve his level of play; I think he needs to maintain his level of play and not allow Djokovic to take that level of play away from him.
I have been re-reading earlier posts and was genuinely puzzled as to why so many of you thought Zverev had the better chance of defeating Djokovic.
 

Vamos Rafa Nadal

Hall of Fame
Wow. I remember before the match began someone on here was sure Daniil would win in straights.... didn't think it would actually happen!
I was one of the people who said he would win in straights. I looked at the stats from both Medvedev and Djokovic and came to the conclusion that Medvedev would win in 3 sets.
 

guga_fan

Semi-Pro
I was one of the people who said he would win in straights. I looked at the stats from both Medvedev and Djokovic and came to the conclusion that Medvedev would win in 3 sets.
Ok, man, but you also predicted the same before Zverev’s match based on stats. If you keep predicting something for every thread, eventually you will be right. This happens a lot around here.

I expected an upset because of fatigue, but straight sets was really astonishing.
 
Except he wasn't finally accepted. A heavily pro-Djokovic crowd attended the final to witness the CYGS, as evidenced by the incredible number of Djokovic/Serbia flags and banners in the building. The same fans who don't like him didn't start liking him yesterday.
Many Serbians spent their life savings in order to go to New York to be able to live a spiritual experience.
A experience that woulda made them extremely proud of being Serbian.
After all Serbia is kinda pariah in the western society.
That is why Flushing Meadows was loaded with Serbians.
Those very Serbians were the ones whistling and yelling thru Med's serves.

In every match, the crowd is divided in 3 sides, one supports player A, another supports player B, and then the neutral crowd, that went there to
watch a good match (in this case historic match)
The neutral crowd always want to watch 5 sets (when playing bo5) so they will side with the one losing in order to help him play another set.
That is why Serbians and neutral crowd were cheering for Djokovic.
You can imagine that the pro-Russian crowd didn't want 5 sets, they were happy with 3 straight sets.

As you said, he was not accepted, and will never be.

It is quite possible that in the future, if Djokovic is playing in NY, and is losing the match, he'll get the crowd on his side, but that will be because
they want to see more tennis, not because they like him.

Yesterday Djokovic broke a racket, and was about to hit a ball when the ball-girl was coming to retrieve it.
No matter how you slice it, those moments are a turn off.
 

weakera

G.O.A.T.
Many Serbians spent their life savings in order to go to New York to be able to live a spiritual experience.
A experience that woulda made them extremely proud of being Serbian.
After all Serbia is kinda pariah in the western society.
That is why Flushing Meadows was loaded with Serbians.
Those very Serbians were the ones whistling and yelling thru Med's serves.

In every match, the crowd is divided in 3 sides, one supports player A, another supports player B, and then the neutral crowd, that went there to
watch a good match (in this case historic match)
The neutral crowd always want to watch 5 sets (when playing bo5) so they will side with the one losing in order to help him play another set.
That is why Serbians and neutral crowd were cheering for Djokovic.
You can imagine that the pro-Russian crowd didn't want 5 sets, they were happy with 3 straight sets.

As you said, he was not accepted, and will never be.

It is quite possible that in the future, if Djokovic is playing in NY, and is losing the match, he'll get the crowd on his side, but that will be because
they want to see more tennis, not because they like him.

Yesterday Djokovic broke a racket, and was about to hit a ball when the ball-girl was coming to retrieve it.
No matter how you slice it, those moments are a turn off.

Excellent and truthful post.
 

The Fedfather

Hall of Fame
Still watching the final game of Set 2...but he was hitting deep and hard right from the get go and that won him the first two sets.
He let his game flow more freely in the 2nd, yes. In the 1st I remember him putting far too many balls in the middle of the court.
 

Rina

Professional
Why do you care? :)
I don't necessarily care about you, but I work with kids, and I worked in a tennis academy classroom. I am a mom and a teacher, and love tennis, hence I care to teach younger people some human decency. Cheering for someone to fail so that you can feel better about your favorite tennis player is not what good decent people do and you should strive to do better. You can be relieved that your fav's record is still even, but to cheer for failure so ardently is not a becoming trait.
 

gameovais

Rookie
After years of watch Novak and Medvedev for that matter here's a fair take I think.

Medvedev was serving his spots very well and soaked up the pressure off the groundstrokes nicely. He was allowed to dominate all match because:

Djokovic was awful in all areas. Djokovic's serve was attrocious not just the percentages but the accuracy. Djokovic's return was non-existent, against even bigger servers he's done better this tournament. Djokovic's ground game was very slow, his FH and BH speeds were on average down 6mph and 4mph, which is huge.

A lot of people are saying this match was because of Medvedev, actually this match was almost entirely unfolding the way it did because Novak didn't show up.
 

The Fedfather

Hall of Fame
After years of watch Novak and Medvedev for that matter here's a fair take I think.

Medvedev was serving his spots very well and soaked up the pressure off the groundstrokes nicely. He was allowed to dominate all match because:

Djokovic was awful in all areas. Djokovic's serve was attrocious not just the percentages but the accuracy. Djokovic's return was non-existent, against even bigger servers he's done better this tournament. Djokovic's ground game was very slow, his FH and BH speeds were on average down 6mph and 4mph, which is huge.

A lot of people are saying this match was because of Medvedev, actually this match was almost entirely unfolding the way it did because Novak didn't show up.
I partly agree that Novak's undoing was his own poor level first and foremost, but if it weren't for Medevedev's amazing serving performance right from the start, the maych could turn. Daniil didn't bring a very high level overall from the start but he did bring a very strong weapon, regardless of Djokovic's level and despite his own nerves. That eventually helped him force Novak out of the match without letting him come back. So it wasn't all about Djokovic who regularly can play poorly in some games and then his opponents yield the lead nonetheless.
 
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Fedinkum

Legend
I don't necessarily care about you, but I work with kids, and I worked in a tennis academy classroom. I am a mom and a teacher, and love tennis, hence I care to teach younger people some human decency. Cheering for someone to fail so that you can feel better about your favorite tennis player is not what good decent people do and you should strive to do better. You can be relieved that your fav's record is still even, but to cheer for failure so ardently is not a becoming trait.
I applaud your works and love for tennis. But you really should not take internet trolls too seriously. Dont waste your time on us :D
 

Fedinkum

Legend
He let his game flow more freely in the 2nd, yes. In the 1st I remember him putting far too many balls in the middle of the court.
I thought it was a great strategy to put deep balls in the middle against Djoke, to cut out his angle. Djoke can chase balls and turns defence into offence like no others. The way i saw the first two sets was Med hit deep and hard to overwhelm Novak. The pace was too fast and Novak never had a chance to get into his usual rhythm.
 

stringertom

Bionic Poster
I don't necessarily care about you, but I work with kids, and I worked in a tennis academy classroom. I am a mom and a teacher, and love tennis, hence I care to teach younger people some human decency. Cheering for someone to fail so that you can feel better about your favorite tennis player is not what good decent people do and you should strive to do better. You can be relieved that your fav's record is still even, but to cheer for failure so ardently is not a becoming trait.
You should have had access to the chair umpire’s microphone and then have addressed this sermon to the morons in the stands cheering for Medvedev faults and DFs, interrupting his fair chance to compete without distraction at the end of the match.
 

The Fedfather

Hall of Fame
I thought it was a great strategy to put deep balls in the middle against Djoke, to cut out his angle. Djoke can chase balls and turns defence into offence like no others. The way i saw the first two sets was Med hit deep and hard to overwhelm Novak. The pace was too fast and Novak never had a chance to get into his usual rhythm.
Hm, maybe. To me a lot of the balls seemed neutral to force Novak to go for attack and miss, I presume. I don't think Daniil's ****s there were overwhelming. Anyway, he stepped it up from the 2nd set on, more angles and corners, some drop shots even.

I made the initial comment when Medvedev was playing passively and even with Djokovic's level being quite poor he still couldn't capitalize at first. So my thinking was that if Novak raises his level, Daniil would be screwed.
 

Zetty

Hall of Fame
I know how Djokovic fans must feel, I felt like that after AO.

You lose sometimes. Your guy already has his NCYGS. Don't worry. He will get ahead in the slam race. The media is starting to see him as GOAT.

His time is coming , like Fedal, to have that mantle in the eye of both pundits and fans.
This, he'll occupy that role simply by being the last of his generation of elites to still be around and able to win slams. The more vulnerable he becomes to the youth the more loved he'll be. I mean look at Fed. His love really came from Nadal breaking him down.
 

73west

Semi-Pro
Tokyo is what cost him. He was too greedy, even his dad didn't want him to go.
Sometimes, these feel like ex post facto analyses.
Maybe something happened in Tokyo that sapped him of energy or fitness. It's plausible. But it's equally plausible that Tokyo was the first indicator that he was not on form, not the reason for it. The loss to Zverev, the meltdown against Busta ...that may be your red flag that he *went to Tokyo* with something wrong.

And in the end, it's a weird thing to try to find some external justification for losing in a FINAL to a great hard court player. It's not like Djokovic waltzed into a final. He beat Berretinni and Zverev, and must have played some really good tennis that makes "he was exhausted and spent and didn't want to be there" hard to swallow explanations. An exhausted guy who didn't want to be there would not have beaten Zverev in the 5th to make the final.

His focus and intensity seemed to come and go, but I'll be the contrarian and say I think that has always been the case with Djokovic. It's just never played out quite like this. The difference is he often (usually / almost always) drifts for a set, then gets his focus back and plays peak tennis. This year, and particularly at the USO, it just kept taking longer and longer for the switch to go on and peak tennis to appear, until he ran into someone that never gave him the opening.
 
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