2022 Wimbledon R64: [1] Novak Djokovic vs Thanasi Kokkinakis

Your prediction:


  • Total voters
    36
  • Poll closed .

Bubcay

Legend
I think I will wait to see him play an opponent with a ranking above 80 something who has a game to offer on grass. In ten years Kokkinakis has rarely got past qualies at any slam and rarely manages an appearance at a Masters, in all of which he loses and only occasionally manages to win a single match. There is a huge gulf between them in terms of ability.
No doubt. I am just impressed by the level Djokovic is showing here, no matter the opponent...
 

TennisFan3

Talk Tennis Guru
Poor Alcaraz might not get his match done today. R2 late match on court 2 at the mercy of weather and light. Might have to play consecutive days, disastrous for the Spaniard.
 

darthrafa

Hall of Fame
That's pretty generous given Nadal's performances at Wimbledon.
The current Novak is far better than 2018 Wimbledon Novak. The serve is far better for one and so is the net play.
r u serious?
i think djoker will be unhappy to play against such crap opponent coz it would make him get not well prepared enough in the final
lucky that only rafa is his threat this year
 
Federer is the smoothest mover on the grass though. We have to give him that. His footwork is sublime. Djokovic is extremely fluid and limber, and just gets to everything but footwork is not as good. Two different types of movement but equally effective.
Federer footwork was better for sure, but pure speed wise I think Djokovic is slightly better. Remember Federer was having problem running to his forehand side almost throughout his whole career. ;)
 

The Green Mile

Bionic Poster
Match over, 6/1 6/4 6/2, that was rather brilliant tbh... Kokk less so. Good to see actual quality tennis played at Wimbledon lol
 

TennisFan3

Talk Tennis Guru
Federer's movement at his peak was feather-light though. And his first step was devastatingly explosive.
I know man. Fed's explosiveness is a sight to watch. Much more entertaining.
But just in terms of effectiveness, Novak defends like a gazelle on grass.
The dude is effortlessly reaching balls and sliding like clay. Just stretching and effortlessly going from defense to offense.
With Fed you could attack his backhand and push him back. What do you do with Novak?
 

TennisFan3

Talk Tennis Guru
You're the one who said Djokovic's serve is as good as Sampras, aren't you? Lol
That was a joke Sir. It was clearly meant to be seen that way.
I said the opponents were making Novak look like he was serving like Sampras.
No one in their right mind would say Novak's serve is as good as Sampras. It isn't even close to as good as Fed's.
 

TennisFan3

Talk Tennis Guru
Anyone know what the boobthrow means? Why does Novak do this celebration every time? What's the history - what made him do this etc etc. Thanks.
 

NoleFam

Bionic Poster
Federer footwork was better for sure, but pure speed wise I think Djokovic is slightly better. Remember Federer was having problem running to his forehand side almost throughout his whole career. ;)

I think in 2004 and 2005, Federer would go neck and neck with Djokovic in speed on grass. He was insane in those years. 2014 and 2015 Djokovic is right there with him though. Sampras is no slouch either which has to be said.
 

Nadal15thslam

Hall of Fame
That was a joke Sir. It was clearly meant to be seen that way.
I said the opponents were making Novak look like he was serving like Sampras.
No one in their right mind would say Novak's serve is as good as Sampras. It isn't even close to as good as Fed's.
I remember very well that many were saying that when he won against Kevin Anderson at Wimbledon. It was early in the tournament, 2nd or 3rd I think.
 

Checkmate

Legend
I know man. Fed's explosiveness is a sight to watch. Much more entertaining.
But just in terms of effectiveness, Novak defends like a gazelle on grass.
The dude is effortlessly reaching balls and sliding like clay. Just stretching and effortlessly going from defense to offense.
With Fed you could attack his backhand and push him back. What do you do with Novak?

You are over-exaggerating Djokovic's movement compared to ponytail, 05/06/07 Federer IMO.

Offensive Movement wise, Peak Fed is much ahead IMO.

Djokovic's other strengths like Backhand Aggression , never conceding the central position due to unbearable depth and Return of Serve are up there with anyone's weapons.

But still , footwork and Movement especially belong to peak Fed. His footwork was so light at times that it felt he was barely running, almost walking on the grass.
 

onyxrose81

Hall of Fame
You are over-exaggerating Djokovic's movement compared to ponytail, 05/06/07 Federer IMO.

Offensive Movement wise, Peak Fed is much ahead IMO.

Djokovic's other strengths like Backhand Aggression , never conceding the central position due to unbearable depth and Return of Serve are up there with anyone's weapons.

But still , footwork and Movement especially belong to peak Fed. His footwork was so light at times that it felt he was barely running, almost walking on the grass.
As someone who couldn’t stand Fed, I was always in awe of his footwork. Just light and effortless.

On topic, good win for Novak. Much better today.
 

NeutralFan

G.O.A.T.
Brutal level from the Earth's Mightiest Warrior. :oops:

Hello Djnago son ,welcome back.didnt see you at RG time, were you banned?
Exactly man this is how information works.

Novak plays bad - I say he played bad, worried about his form

Novak plays better - I give him credit for playing well and like his chances

Nadal plays bad - I say he played bad, worried about his form

Nadal will have to play better to get credit from me.

Novak looked quite impressive today, imo. Rafa needs to raise his level.
 

TennisFan3

Talk Tennis Guru
I remember very well that many were saying that when he won against Kevin Anderson at Wimbledon. It was early in the tournament, 2nd or 3rd I think.
I know that's just reactionary. Bottom line is Novak is NOT an elite Top tier server. Nowhere near Sampras. Not even as good as Fed.
However, he has improved late in his career. Remember the days when Todd Martin made him serve on his knees?
Compare to that he has come a long way. His serve since AO 2020 was a step up from prior years. With higher speed and more aces consistently.
One of the main reasons why Novak/Fed have gotten better of Nadal on grass (and hards as well) is that they both have OUTSERVED Nadal pretty handily. Rafa can hold his own from the back, but he comes short on the serve-return dynamic on faster courts.
 
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Deleted member 765728

Guest
Zezam se, ali sjajno. U ponedeljak ćemo se pravo svi upoznati. Jednu star da ćete morati oprostiti je moj naglasak, jer živeo sam 20 godina u Americi.
Kad su oprostili meni niški naglasak, oprostiće i tebi američki. Samo opušteno :D
 
Federer is the smoothest mover on the grass though. We have to give him that. His footwork is sublime. Djokovic is extremely fluid and limber, and just gets to everything but footwork is not as good. Two different types of movement but equally effective.
Neah, Fed is more effective. The footwork makes a huge difference because Fed is quite fast in terms of footspeed too.

2006-2008 Ned is also a better grass mover. That explains why he peaked so early here even though he is a claycourter.
 

NoleFam

Bionic Poster
Neah, Fed is more effective. The footwork makes a huge difference because Fed is quite fast in terms of footspeed too.

2006-2008 Ned is also a better grass mover. That explains why he peaked so early here even though he is a claycourter.

I don't know about more effective but definitely smoother and lighter on his feet. Different. I don't think Federer or Nadal maintained a top level of speed as long as Djokovic has either. That's where he's the clear winner. As for who was faster at their peaks, we're threading the needle. The difference is pretty small and can be argued in any direction.
 

DSH

Talk Tennis Guru
Neah, Fed is more effective. The footwork makes a huge difference because Fed is quite fast in terms of footspeed too.

2006-2008 Ned is also a better grass mover. That explains why he peaked so early here even though he is a claycourter.
Calling him "a claycourter" at this point is sacrilege.
:whistle:
 

chicagodude

Hall of Fame
Great performance from DJokovic today, but TBH Kokkinakis was also not good, and has very little to trouble DJokovic in general.

Actually, his injuries notwithstanding, Kokkinakis has been disappointing in terms of his career, I expected much more for and from him.
 

Enceladus

Legend
Compared to the first round, Nole has improved a lot. He served and returned great (only faced break point while serving for the match), created very little UEs and was finishing points very well at the net. Overall a very solid performance.
 
I don't know about more effective but definitely smoother and lighter on his feet. Different. I don't think Federer or Nadal maintained a top level of speed as long as Djokovic has either. That's where he's the clear winner. As for who was faster at their peaks, we're threading the needle. The difference is pretty small and can be argued in any direction.
Well I am talking about prime-peak anyway.
Novak is definitely the fastest of the 3 in his old age, yet Fed could move and defend quite impressively even at near 38 during Wimby 19.

Nadal's footwork was way off during that 2012-2014 stretch, even if his speed wasn't bad otherwise and it made a huge difference.
Clay and grass reward great footwork more than HCs imo
 

NoleFam

Bionic Poster
Well I am talking about prime-peak anyway.
Novak is definitely the fastest of the 3 in his old age, yet Fed could move and defend quite impressively even at near 38 during Wimby 19.

Nadal's footwork was way off during that 2012-2014 stretch, even if his speed wasn't bad otherwise and it made a huge difference.
Clay and grass reward great footwork more than HCs imo

All 3 are different but in the comparison with Federer and Djokovic, it's hard for me to say Federer was a more effective mover. I think Federer is a better grass court player but movement wise I think they are equally effective. Federer has the best footwork and able to take those small steps to get to more shots than most other players and still be able to remain offensive, but then Djokovic will slide on grass and have enough balance to hit an aggressive shot when other players wouldn't dare try that.

I think you can actually be kind of sloppy on clay with your footwork but you need good balance and be able to master the slide. On grass, mastering the movement is harder. It's easiest to move on hardcourt though, so I totally agree on that.
 
All 3 are different but in the comparison with Federer and Djokovic, it's hard for me to say Federer was a more effective mover. I think Federer is a better grass court player but movement wise I think they are equally effective. Federer has the best footwork and able to take those small steps to get to more shots than most other players and still be able to remain offensive, but then Djokovic will slide on grass and have enough balance to hit an aggressive shot when other players wouldn't dare try that.

I think you can actually be kind of sloppy on clay with your footwork but you need good balance and be able to master the slide. On grass, mastering the movement is harder. It's easiest to move on hardcourt though, so I totally agree on that.
Grass definitely rewards precise movement over sliding.

Generally speaking Fed relies on balance and anticipation, Novak on flexibility and great reach and Nadal on raw footspeed and explosive footwork.

First is clearly best for grass, 2nd for HCs and 3rd for clay. It's quite fitting to why each have a specific best surface
 

Mainad

Bionic Poster
Well, after that demolition job I think we can safely say that there is no sign of any Covid symptoms which some posters seemed to think he might be suffering from! :cool:
 

NoleFam

Bionic Poster
Grass definitely rewards precise movement over sliding.

Generally speaking Fed relies on balance and anticipation, Novak on flexibility and great reach and Nadal on raw footspeed and explosive footwork.

First is clearly best for grass, 2nd for HCs and 3rd for clay. It's quite fitting to why each have a specific best surface

Yes agreed, well said.
 

Kralingen

Bionic Poster
Monday - 4
Today - 8.5

He was probably close to a 9 today honestly.
Backhand was sick today. Forehand penetrating power, that was completely non-existent in the 1st round, was there. Serve was good. Didn't hit many aces because Kokk got a racket on so many. Return and movement were great. Net play was also great. Solid 8.5-8.7.
Agreed with the caveat that this is a 8.5 and close to as well as 35 yr old Djokovic can play.

I would not be sure how to rate it compared to his prime form, 2011/15 Djokovic for example was still an elevated clear level or two above this.
 
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