2023 Australian Open QF: [5] Andrey Rublev vs Novak Djokovic [4]

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P

paolo2143

Professional
I agree that a peak Fed would be crushing these guys almost as easily as Novak but one difference is a peak Fed still got brat by Rafa here in 2009 whereas peak Novak was still too good for Rafa.
 
zvelf

zvelf

Hall of Fame
weakera said:
They will play the same game with Tommy Paul and Sissypas as well. It's hilarious. Short of getting hit by a car (which would need to be traveling pretty fast at that), nothing can stop the inevitable Djokovic conclusion here and that has been abundantly clear all along. Why he felt the need to play the fake injury game is beyond me.
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When you believe Djokovic faked an injury which you just admitted you have no reasons for believing, that just means you hate the player and have to come up with something to support that hate. Just think about it. Djokovic skipped practice on off-days in the middle of this slam. That would be insane just to fake an injury.

duaneeo said:
Do you still see the disrespect for Rublev disappointing?
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Wel, I see it as disappointing. This forum massively disrespects 90% of players and basically calls anyone who hasn't won a slam a mug. Who among them has put in thousands of hours of hard work and gotten to #5 in the world like Rublev has. No one. No one here could even take a game off Rublev. Yeah, Rublev may never win a slam and he couldn't beat one of the greatest players to have ever played tennis today (and he does have one win against Djokovic), but that hardly means he is deserving of disrespect.
 
weakera

weakera

Talk Tennis Guru
zvelf said:
When you believe Djokovic faked an injury which you just admitted you have no reasons for believing, that just means you hate the player and have to come up with something to support that hate. Just think about it. Djokovic skipped practice on off-days in the middle of this slam. That would be insane just to fake an injury.



Wel, I see it as disappointing. This forum massively disrespects 90% of players and basically calls anyone who hasn't won a slam a mug. Who among them has put in thousands of hours of hard work and gotten to #5 in the world like Rublev has. No one. No one here could even take a game off Rublev. Yeah, Rublev may never win a slam and he couldn't beat one of the greatest players to have ever played tennis today (and he does have one win against Djokovic), but that hardly means he is deserving of disrespect.
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I don't attempt to get inside the minds of crazy people. It's not healthy.
 
weakera

weakera

Talk Tennis Guru
zvelf said:
That's an easy rationalization. Even if Djokovic is crazy, that doesn't mean you're not too.
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I wouldn't rule it out entirely. Anyone who wouldn't consider the possibility that they are wrong, or crazy, is an NPC by definition.
 
Keystoner

Keystoner

Semi-Pro
Hitman said:
Should never be overconfident regardless. Confidence is good, but not overconfidence.
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Yep, I believe that's your guiding principle in everything you post here. It's noble, to be sure, but laughable from my perspective all the same. I believe, apart from what you publicly submit to this forum, you know damn well nobody has a chance against Djokovic. Ok, where you'll merely concede "chance," we ALL know it's miniscule at best. Oh, he's injured you say? Please. You're killing me here.
 
duaneeo

duaneeo

Legend
zvelf said:
Wel, I see it as disappointing. This forum massively disrespects 90% of players and basically calls anyone who hasn't won a slam a mug. Who among them has put in thousands of hours of hard work and gotten to #5 in the world like Rublev has.
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Newsflash: Fans (of all sports) criticize players. Putting in "thousands of hours of hard work" isn't a requirement to be critical.

Regarding Rublev, if you want to praise a player who's never won a slam or Masters, never made it beyond the QF of a slam, and has now lost in straight sets to a player 10 years his senior suffering from a hamstring injury, that's your prerogative.
 
T

tudwell

G.O.A.T.
zvelf said:
Wel, I see it as disappointing. This forum massively disrespects 90% of players and basically calls anyone who hasn't won a slam a mug. Who among them has put in thousands of hours of hard work and gotten to #5 in the world like Rublev has. No one. No one here could even take a game off Rublev. Yeah, Rublev may never win a slam and he couldn't beat one of the greatest players to have ever played tennis today (and he does have one win against Djokovic), but that hardly means he is deserving of disrespect.
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You're not wrong, but most of the "disrespect" for Rublev in this thread (when that initial post quoted was made) was just people stating – accurately, as it turned out – that Rublev had very little chance to beat Novak and would likely get destroyed. There were and are, of course, a few people calling him a mug and what-not, which isn't necessary and is disrespectful, but I don't think it's disrespectful simply to predict a lopsided result or to point out obvious holes in someone's game.
 
Hitman

Hitman

Bionic Poster
Keystoner said:
Yep, I believe that's your guiding principle in everything you post here. It's noble, to be sure, but laughable from my perspective all the same. I believe, apart from what you publicly submit to this forum, you know damn well nobody has a chance against Djokovic. Ok, where you'll merely concede "chance," we ALL know it's miniscule at best. Oh, he's injured you say? Please. You're killing me here.
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He is the favorite, especially now we are into the semis, no doubt. I agree on that. I'm just not going to hand him the trophy though, with all due respect. :)
 
zvelf

zvelf

Hall of Fame
duaneeo said:
Newsflash: Fans (of all sports) criticize players. Putting in "thousands of hours of hard work" isn't a requirement to be critical.
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I didn't say being critical was disappointing behavior. I said being disrespectful was.

duaneeo said:
Regarding Rublev, if you want to praise a player who's never won a slam or Masters, never made it beyond the QF of a slam, and has now lost in straight sets to a player 10 years his senior suffering from a hamstring injury, that's your prerogative.
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Again, you're moving the goal post of the point I'm making. Not being disrespectful is not the same thing as praise.

tudwell said:
You're not wrong, but most of the "disrespect" for Rublev in this thread (when that initial post quoted was made) was just people stating – accurately, as it turned out – that Rublev had very little chance to beat Novak and would likely get destroyed. There were and are, of course, a few people calling him a mug and what-not, which isn't necessary and is disrespectful, but I don't think it's disrespectful simply to predict a lopsided result or to point out obvious holes in someone's game.
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And I'm not saying predicting Rublev to get trounced by Djokovic is being disrespectful. In fact, in a post just earlier, I complimented Chanwan on his prediction that Rublev would win so few games in the match. But in post 707 right on this page, we get D.Nalby calling everyone Djokovic faces a mug.
 
R

Rina

Hall of Fame
So I was traveling and only saw the result. How did Novak manage to tame the beast that Rublev was going to be?
 
Nadal15thslam

Nadal15thslam

Hall of Fame
Hitman said:
OK, how did you see it, before the draw was made. Who had the biggest chances, relatively speaking? Med? Rafa? Someone else?
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If Tsitsipas loses to Karen it would be tragic really. Sinner, Korda, Rune, even Zverev would've done better than anyone Djokovic has faced so far.
 
Keystoner

Keystoner

Semi-Pro
Hitman said:
OK, how did you see it, before the draw was made. Who had the biggest chances, relatively speaking? Med? Rafa? Someone else?
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You were careful with your words there. "Biggest" and "relatively speaking." That's good, because I know you know that whoever had the biggest chance to beat Djokovic, Djokovic's chance to win was, and is, overwhelmingly greater. As far as who that person is, you're much more of an expert to assess that than me.
 
Hitman

Hitman

Bionic Poster
Keystoner said:
You were careful with your words there. "Biggest" and "relatively speaking." That's good, because I know you know that whoever had the biggest chance to beat Djokovic, Djokovic's chance to win was, and is, overwhelmingly greater. As far as who that person is, you're much more of an expert to assess that than me.
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Fair enough. (y)
 
Hitman

Hitman

Bionic Poster
Keystoner said:
So do you admit it--do you hold back? Afraid of offending others? Not wanting to come off as "over confident" or arrogant? Pride--not wanting to be wrong in case Djokovic loses? No way you believe in jinxes.
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I don't really hold back to that extent. For instance, when RG 2016 was going to happen, before the event had even started, I predicted outright that Djokovic will win the title. Now, considering that it was RG and Djokovic had never won it at that point, including losing the last few finals, it was a bold statement to make. But even in that prediction, I never felt I was over confident, I just felt where his level of tennis was that it was his time.

Another example was Federer at W 2017, I said that I fully expect Federer to carve up the draw and to do it in dominant fashion, he went onto win the title in straight sets for the only time in his career. Again, it wasn't about holding back, it was being confident in what I believed.

Here, I said, if you read some of my posts and threads, that I have been very impressed with Tsitsipas, and predicted he will make the final at the very least. Still has the semi to play, but he on track, he has been very clutch in tight moment, and playing some of his best tennis. What I didn't say was that Tsitsipas will win the title, especially if Novak is in form, just that he has a good shot at it.

I don't believe in jinxes if I have made bold predictions likes the ones above, here my only concern is the hamstring. If it flares up, then he could be in trouble, if the issue doesn't impact him like the last two matches, then should be walking away with the title, considering his record at this stage of the event. So confident yes, but not overly confident by any means.
 
InsideOut900

InsideOut900

Legend
Nadal15thslam said:
If Tsitsipas loses to Karen it would be tragic really. Sinner, Korda, Rune, even Zverev would've done better than anyone Djokovic has faced so far.
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Bruh, these guys lost to players much worse than Djokovic except for Sinner pushing Tsitsi to 5.

It's always easy to say someone would have done better in hypothetical matches, just like Rublev was seen as a strong opponent, just to get crushed.

Djoko is way above anyone on these courts and only Tsitsipas has a shot.
 
Winners or Errors

Winners or Errors

Legend
Hitman said:
OK, how did you see it, before the draw was made. Who had the biggest chances, relatively speaking? Med? Rafa? Someone else?
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To jump in, Med and Rafa both playing like garbage leading up to the event, so no way were they ever contenders, no matter what Wilander said. Maybe Rune, Tsitsipas, Korda (if playing above his normal level - by the way, I think Korda's patterns in the Med match pretty much looked like what I'd expect Djokovic to do to Med), some other dark-horse. Watching Djokovic progress through this tournament, it is his to lose. I'm loving the aggression. I enjoyed 2007 Djokovic, and he's both trying to be aggressive and has better form than he had then + can serve-bot now - which makes him a very tough out. I don't see Tommy Paul making a dent. I think Tsitsipas has the flexibility, but will he be there mentally? I'm expecting 22... Djokovic has really impressed. How long can he hang on as the last of the Big 3? = a very interesting question.
 
Hitman

Hitman

Bionic Poster
Winners or Errors said:
To jump in, Med and Rafa both playing like garbage leading up to the event, so no way were they ever contenders, no matter what Wilander said. Maybe Rune, Tsitsipas, Korda (if playing above his normal level - by the way, I think Korda's patterns in the Med match pretty much looked like what I'd expect Djokovic to do to Med), some other dark-horse. Watching Djokovic progress through this tournament, it is his to lose. I'm loving the aggression. I enjoyed 2007 Djokovic, and he's both trying to be aggressive and has better form than he had then + can serve-bot now - which makes him a very tough out. I don't see Tommy Paul making a dent. I think Tsitsipas has the flexibility, but will he be there mentally? I'm expecting 22... Djokovic has really impressed. How long can he hang on as the last of the Big 3? = a very interesting question.
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Good points
 
Rattie

Rattie

Legend
Nadal15thslam said:
Let's see things as they are. Djokovic is healthy, in very good form and is the heavy favourite to win the title. If you say anyone other than maybe Tsitsipas has a chance to win AO other than him it sounds kind of trollish.
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I agree. It’s now reached the point of being super dull. Who wants an uncontested slam with a slam dunk winner. So boring. Good luck to Djokovic as no one else seems capable of winning more than a handful of games off him right now.
 
Rattie

Rattie

Legend
jm1980 said:
Welcome to every non-Nadal fan's take on RG in the last 18 years
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Good point! Although arguably Rafa has had some battles, so as a fan I’ve never felt a win was a given. In AO23 Novak is winning in straights with opponents just being spanked. It’s very, very dull.
 
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zvelf

zvelf

Hall of Fame
What’s bizarre here is that so many people who are on record for disliking Djokovic have been saying for most of the tournament that Djokovic was a shoo-in to win it, but at the same time, many of them lament that some higher ranked players got upset as if they could have taken Djokovic out and that as a result, Djokovic’s draw is too easy. You can’t have it both ways. Either Djokovic is the big favorite or he’s not. Either the field is weak or it’s not. Just a short while ago, he beat 5 top 9 players in a row to win the YEC. He’s breezed through Dimitrov, de Minaur, and Rublev. Given all that, would a tough draw here really stop Djokovic in best-of-5?

My own take is it’s more in the middle. Djokovic is the best player and the field is relatively weak but they still had a decent shot. I think that the betting markets were correct giving Djokovic roughly a 50% chance against the field at the start. The big question was whether his hamstring would act up. So Djokovic was easily the favorite among any single player, not a shoo-in against the entire field, but about 50/50. Even now, Tennis Abstract gives Tsitsipas a 27% chance to win the title. I’d say that’s pretty accurate. Djokovic beat Tsitsipas 6-2, 3-6, 7-6 (7-4) in Paris and 6-4, 7-6 (7-4) at the YEC. That shows Tsitsipas can play Novak pretty close, so one somewhat off-day from Djokovic could give Tsitsipas the title.
 
P

paolo2143

Professional
Keystoner said:
Yep, I believe that's your guiding principle in everything you post here. It's noble, to be sure, but laughable from my perspective all the same. I believe, apart from what you publicly submit to this forum, you know damn well nobody has a chance against Djokovic. Ok, where you'll merely concede "chance," we ALL know it's miniscule at best. Oh, he's injured you say? Please. You're killing me here.
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if sport was as straight forward as you say it was we would all have stopped watching it years ago.

over the years we have witnessed spectacular upsets in every sport and no one should ever be over confident as it usually backfires big time.

Yes i would expect Novak to win his S/F against Tommy Paul with bit to spare, but it like anything in life is not 100%.

If Novak reaches the final of course he will start favorite but Khacha & Tsitsipas would have a chance. Especially Stefanos who has pushed Novak to 5 sets in a GS final just over 18 months ago
 
Hitman

Hitman

Bionic Poster
Rattie said:
Good point! Although arguably Rafa has had some battles, so as a fan I’ve never felt a win was a given. In AO23 Novak is winning in straights with opponents just being spanked. It’s very, very dull.
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Nadal has won four RG without a losing a set....Djokovic hasn't even done that once in a slam. How do you think non-Nadal's felt about that?
 
Djokovic_is_the_best#1

Djokovic_is_the_best#1

Bionic Poster
Hitman said:
Nadal has won four RG without a losing a set....Djokovic hasn't even done that once in a slam. How do you think non-Nadal's felt about that?
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Exactly right. RG has been the most predictable and dull slam for the best 18 years bar a few odd exceptions. How Rafa fans can call any other slam the most dull or predictable is beyond me, after what’s happened at RG in most years.
 
Keystoner

Keystoner

Semi-Pro
paolo2143 said:
if sport was as straight forward as you say it was we would all have stopped watching it years ago.

over the years we have witnessed spectacular upsets in every sport and no one should ever be over confident as it usually backfires big time.

Yes i would expect Novak to win his S/F against Tommy Paul with bit to spare, but it like anything in life is not 100%.

If Novak reaches the final of course he will start favorite but Khacha & Tsitsipas would have a chance. Especially Stefanos who has pushed Novak to 5 sets in a GS final just over 18 months ago
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I really love posts like this. This guy acts like he's educating the masses with the profound, "In life, nothing is 100%." "IN LIFE." Oh brother. "Player X always has a chance." Sure thing, babe. It's like saying the boxer fighting Mike Tyson has a puncher's chance. Oh wait, yep, Buster Douglas. You got me there.
 
socallefty

socallefty

G.O.A.T.
Djokovic_is_the_best#1 said:
Exactly right. RG has been the most predictable and dull slam for the best 18 years bar a few odd exceptions. How Rafa fans can call any other slam the most dull or predictable is beyond me, after what’s happened at RG in most years.
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I enjoy watching a high level of tennis even if it is one-sided. Novak‘s matches this week have been phenomenal to watch in terms of the skill level he has showed hitting big to small targets near the lines and hitting the ball on the rise early. Similarly, I enjoy watching Rafa show his clay craft at RG and it is not dull for me to watch him play at RG. It is dull for me instead to watch Nadal play on low-bouncing fast indoor courts where he plays poorly and gets upset losses often.

Watching Djokovic this week has been like watching him in the AO finals in 2019/2021 or during the BOAT period in 2015-1H2016 when he was equally dominant. I like his super-aggressive style trying to keep matches short and it is like watching a master class of how to play power baseline tennis.
 
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