2024 WTA Finals - General Discussion

[Winners or Errors]

Zheng and Gauff easily the best two in this tournament. C’mon Gauff. Get it going!!!

 

[marc45]

excellent athleticism and ball striking on display here

 

[NaomiKonjuhPotapova]

Gauff collapse on that service game cost her the set. So many chances on Zheng service game but she can't take the advantages yet.

 

[travlerajm]

Just want to point this out because it's really poor in my opinion.

In Gauff's last 3 matches:

Gauff v Sabalenka:
Gauff hit 14 winners and 27 unforced errors.
Sabalenka hit 14 winners and 47 unforced errors!!!

Gauff wins.

Gauff v Krejcikova:
Gauff hit 20 winners and 40 unforced errors!!!
Krejcikova hit 22 winners and 29 unforced errors.

Krejcikova wins.

Gauff v Swiatek:
Gauff hit 10 winners and 33 unforced errors.
Swiatek hit 15 winners and 47 unforced errors!!!

Gauff wins.

In her last 3 matches, Gauff has hit a disgusting 100 unforced errors but just 44 winners. So before people start hyping her and thinking she's turned a new leaf, i'd point out that it literally is that her opponents have just played far worse. Sabalenka and Swiatek each hitting 47 unforced errors? And then when an opponent didn't hit over 40 unforced errors (Krejcikova), Coco loses.

If Zheng can keep this match clean by numbers, it'll be easy.

The number of unforced errors a player hits is not independent of the opponent.

Gauff has a significant court coverage advantage over every other player in the WTA field. She can use this advantage to trade shots in a rally without having to pull the trigger and take excess risk. This forces the opponent to take risk and make more errors than usual, because continuing to rally will eventually favor the player with faster footspeed.

Every WTA player has more unforced errors than usual against coco.

 

[Winners or Errors]

Gauff just doesn’t have it today. We will see if she can win ugly…

 

[norcal]

Gauff just doesn’t have it today. We will see if she can win ugly…

She is spraying like a graffiti artist.

Hopefully she cleans up cause Zheng is crushing it.

 

[NaomiKonjuhPotapova]

The number of unforced errors a player hits is not independent of the opponent.

Gauff has a significant court coverage advantage over every other player in the WTA field. She can use this advantage to trade shots in a rally without having to pull the trigger and take excess risk. This forces the opponent to take risk and make more errors than usual, because continuing to rally will eventually favor the player with faster footspeed.

Every WTA player has more unforced errors than usual against coco.

This and also, W/UE ratios do not really tell the match's quality to warrant a really poor mark.
This final both players have horrific W/UE ratios on the first set and if you didn't watch and just look at the stats you are probably thinking the quality is so bad.

 

[NaomiKonjuhPotapova]

After that chasing drop shot winner, CG won 9 points in a row.

 

[travlerajm]

Gauff just doesn’t have it today. We will see if she can win ugly…

The moonballing has begun.

 

[travlerajm]

This and also, W/UE ratios do not really tell the match's quality to warrant a really poor mark.
This final both players have horrific W/UE ratios on the first set and if you didn't watch and just look at the stats you are probably thinking the quality is so bad.

Exactly. This has been one of the highest level WTA matches I’ve seen.

We haven’t really witnessed a WTA fh with this level of heaviness and security as Zheng’s hitting it right now.

Gauff doesn’t have her ball security, but her footspeed evens the gap.

 

[D-Lite]

Zheng is renowned for 3 setters. As much as her overall level has improved this year she's still erratic during matches. It will be really interesting who can keep their composure if this goes 3. Back on serve now with Gauff up 5-4. That was big for Zheng to break the run of games Gauff won from 3-1 down to go up 5-3 and serve for the set with set points.

 

[NaomiKonjuhPotapova]

Wow Zheng really steps up and she breaks.

 

[Mr.Lob]

Coco takes the 2nd set.

 

[travlerajm]

Appropriately, 1 more set to determine the best female player in the world right now!

 

[Mr.Lob]

Coco comes back from 0-40, only to double fault the game away.
Tough hold by Zheng. 2-0

 

[D-Lite]

Appropriately, 1 more set to determine the best female player in the world right now!

I still think it's Sabalenka but she's gassed and I'd say I prefer Zheng and Gauff to her. Hopefully this tussle for top spot continues to the AO. I'd love Gauff, Zheng or Rybakina to win it there but hopefully by beating Sabalenka on the way.

 

[Aussie Darcy]

Zheng is on fire while Gauff is yet again, an unforced error machine.

Break point

 

[D-Lite]

Will this be the biggest payday in women's tennis history?

Participation fee: $335,000
2x RR group wins: $700,000
Winner's prize: $3,770,000

Total: $4,805,000

 

[Dominic & Andrey]

This match is grueling lol.

 

[Mr.Lob]

Coco's body language and attitude much better post Brad Gilbert. More positive and focused.

Zhang getting the better of Coco in the long rallies. Coco gets a tough hold though 1-2

 

[Aussie Darcy]

Will this be the biggest payday in women's tennis history?

I believe so. I think it’s the most money since Barty won the 2019 WTA Finals in Shenzhen!

 

[Aussie Darcy]

Zheng needs to stop bouncing the ball so many times and maybe she’d land a shot in.

Deuce. Coco prime to break back here.

 

[Aussie Darcy]

Coco does break back, this isn’t exactly high quality stuff. The unforced errors from both players is insane. Zheng is spraying balls and Coco isn’t doing much better either.

 

[Aussie Darcy]

So far:
Gauff with 16 winners and 37 unforced errors…
Zheng with 15 winners and 44 unforced errors…

Yikes

 

[BenC]

great point for the break back though

 

[Mr.Lob]

Both players are hitting hard towards the middle of the court. Both can chase down balls. Good rallies. You're going to have more errors.

 

[roysid]

WTA next year will be interesting. Gauff, Zheng to challenge swiatek and Sabalenka. Rybakina should be back too

 

[Aussie Darcy]

Both players are hitting hard towards the middle of the court. Both can chase down balls. Good rallies. You're going to have more errors.

Zheng just hit belted a ball way wide while she had the easy winner at the net. Let’s not make excuses for why she’s going to hit over 50+ unforced errors this match and barely hit 20 winners, which was what that point should’ve been.

 

[roysid]

So far:
Gauff with 16 winners and 37 unforced errors…
Zheng with 15 winners and 44 unforced errors…

Yikes

In a slower court, unforced errors will be more. One wins the rally by error more than outright winner

 

[Aussie Darcy]

In a slower court, unforced errors will be more. One wins the rally by error more than outright winner

I just saw Zheng have an absolute sitter for a winner at the net and instead send the ball so far long she might as well have been in Singapore (where this tournament should be). Spare me the slow court conditions excuse.

 

[Aussie Darcy]

Great game by Zheng and she breaks.

2 games from the title.

 

[Mr.Lob]

Zheng just hit belted a ball way wide while she had the easy winner at the net. Let’s not make excuses for why she’s going to hit over 50+ unforced errors this match and barely hit 20 winners, which was what that point should’ve been.

I'm not seeing a lot of "bad" errors. The vast majority are grinding out the point until there's an opening to hit a winner.

 

[Aussie Darcy]

It’s sad/annoying the Olympics doesn’t award points because Zheng should be higher than #7 in the rankings. With the title here today she’ll go up to #4 just 190 points behind #3 Coco but she deserves to be the #3 as the Gold medallist.

 

[Mr.Lob]

Now that was a bad u.e by Coco in the net for 30-15

Zheng up now 5-3

 

[Aussie Darcy]

I'm not seeing a lot of "bad" errors. The vast majority are grinding out the point until there's an opening to hit a winner.

Those 2 unforced errors by Coco to finish the game were pretty poor in my opinion.

But it’s been a great match I’ll give them that.

 

[Mr.Lob]

Coco needs to hold here. 15-15

 

[Mr.Lob]

Lucky net cord by Coco. 40-30

 

[Aussie Darcy]

Stunning winner by Gauff at deuce there. Game point to stay in this

 

[Aussie Darcy]

Pressure on Zheng to serve this out now!

 

[Mr.Lob]

Nice volley by Coco. Gets the ad, then the hold.

Zheng serving for the match

 

[Aussie Darcy]

Ug back to back unforced errors by Zheng gives Coco an opening. Just keep it clean Zheng!

 

[Pheasant]

Zheng is showing some serious nerves here, has hit 3 straight UE errors. double break point.

 

[Aussie Darcy]

And another hideous unforced error puts it back at 5-5.

Yikes this is hard to watch.

 

[Mr.Lob]

Nerves creeping in there for Zheng.
Coco breaks. 5-5

 

[bluetrain4]

I'm not surprised by all the breaks and back and forth, but I thought Zheng would close once up 5-3. Obviously, she still could, but I mean without it getting to 5-5.

 

[Aussie Darcy]

Stats:

Gauff: 19 winners and 46 unforced errors

Zheng: 19 winners and 53 unforced errors

That’s… something. Hideous is the word I want to use.

 

[Mr.Lob]

Insane defense by Zheng.

 

[Aussie Darcy]

These two are hitting great rallies like that point but can’t execute a winner if their lives depended on it. Instead they hit awful unforced errors out wide as Zheng just did. Try a drop shot or change play up. My goodness.

 

[bluetrain4]

Players make errors and quality can still be good with errors - but the ratio in this match is just awful. 50/50 winners/unforced errors is a good baseline for good play overall - even slightly less. I've only followed scores so I can't attest to the quality of this match, but the stats are pretty bad. I guess if the unforced errors come after a fairly long point, and UE is from a player out of position and reaching to get the ball - that's less of a poor quality UE than simply missing a rally ball or midcourt sitter.

 

[Aussie Darcy]

Yet another unforced error by Zheng as she hits the ball long and Gauff holds. She takes the lead 6-5.

I think she breaks now to win the title.