20for20 #2: 2013 4R, Djokovic vs Wawrinka

Cabeza del Demonio

Professional
"We expected the routine. We got the extraordinary."
Chris Fowler's post-match comment perfectly summed up one of the greatest and most unexpected matches of all time. The Serb superstar was chasing a 3rd consecutive AO title and a spot in the history books, and he looked every bit the favorite through his first 3 rounds.
But Wawrinka made sure he would have to earn it the hard way. Out of nowhere, he came out guns blazing, producing his best tennis yet to put Djokovic on the back foot and race to a 6-1 5-2 lead. The stunned Melbourne crowd looked on in disbelief as their champion stumbled around helplessly, trying to stop the barrage of brilliance coming from the other side of the net.
But the champion dug deep, defending against Wawrinka's haymakers like his life depended on it, reeling off 5 games in a row to level the match. Djokovic was back.
The quality did not let up one bit, both players playing at their very highest level and giving the crowd a treat. The commentators and analysts kept waiting for Stan to fade away, but he matched the Djoker step for step, earning a break in the final set and putting Djokovic's quest for sporting immortality in serious danger.
As the match entered its 6th hour, not a single spectator had left - they were seeing something like a movie play out before them in real time. Game after game, both players held onto their serves, putting all their vast reserves of talent, passion, and grit on full display. The match hit its climax in the last game, with both players producing scintillating winners out of nowhere, bringing the crowd to their feet every point. The match seemed all but lost for the young champion as he struggled physically trying to retrieve the haymakers thrown at him, but Nole showed the world one more time why he was the world's best player, scrambling for one last epic backhand pass to come out victorious, 1-6 7-5 6-4 6-7(5) 12-10.
Djokovic ripped his shirt off in triumph, bringing back memories of his iconic win against Nadal here. Once more he had to dig deep physically and mentally, playing at the peak of his game for 5 hours to slay the monster of an opponent in Wawrinka, who had brought all his world-destroying passion and power to the court. "The champion lives on to fight another day."

Djokovic went on to win the tournament, featuring some masterclass performances and reaffirming his place at the top of the world. But he wouldn't be so lucky the next time around - Wawrinka snapped several of Djokovic's record-setting streaks with an upset win one year later.

This match couldn't have been written better if it were a movie. No matter how many times you see it, you're always in for a thrill. Sit back, grab the popcorn, and enjoy!
 
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Cabeza del Demonio

Professional
In case you missed it, these were my picks for the 20 best AO matches of the century:
3. 2009 SF, Nadal vs Verdasco
4. 2005 SF, Safin vs Federer
5. 2009 Final, Nadal vs Federer
6. 2006 QF, Roddick vs El Aynaoui
7. 2008 3R, Federer vs Tipsarevic
8. 2000 SF, Agassi vs Sampras
9. 2017 SF, Nadal vs Dimitrov
10. 2017 Final, Federer vs Nadal
11. 2008 3R, Hewitt vs Baghdatis
12. 2014 QF, Wawrinka vs Djokovic
13. 2004 SF, Safin vs Agassi
14. 2006 SF, Baghdatis vs Nalbandian
15. 2008 3R, Kohlschreiber vs Roddick
16. 2013 SF, Murray vs Federer
17. 2012 SF, Djokovic vs Murray
18. 2017 2R, Istomin vs Djokovic
19. 2011 1R, Hewitt vs Nalbandian
20. 2001 SF, Agassi vs Rafter

Tomorrow, the grand finale!
 

StrongRule

Talk Tennis Guru
Truly phenomenal match. As a Stan fan, I’m still salty that he missed a great opportunity to serve for the match by not challenging an obviously bad call that would have given him the break. He should have won that one.

But credit to Djokovic for pulling through such a match.
Wawrinka has only himself to blame. He was 6-1 5-2 up, served for the second set at 5-3 and was 30-0 ahead. What stopped him from going 2-0 up? But no, then he suddenly hit a few bad unforced errors in a row and lost it from there.
 

Jonesy

Legend
Wawrinka has only himself to blame. He was 6-1 5-2 up, served for the second set at 5-3 and was 30-0 ahead. What stopped him from going 2-0 up? But no, then he suddenly hit a few bad unforced errors in a row and lost it from there.
It is known as the swiss choke disease. I heard it has no cure.
 

Goosehead

Legend
jan 2013..age 27years 10months, the start of new stan.

new coach, fully committed, fit, though he lost, gave stan confidence to go for the big prizes.
 

mike danny

Bionic Poster
Wawrinka has only himself to blame. He was 6-1 5-2 up, served for the second set at 5-3 and was 30-0 ahead. What stopped him from going 2-0 up? But no, then he suddenly hit a few bad unforced errors in a row and lost it from there.
That's what inexperience does to you.
 
D

Deleted member 758560

Guest
This match is #1 and Saferer is #2. Djokodal is #3, no better.
имеешь в виду чисто качество игры?..а где кстати там тот матч 18 года полуфинала в этом списке, далеко внизу*?
 

King No1e

G.O.A.T.
Yeah, I will never understand the people putting any of the last 3 matches over Djokodal. They were all outstanding matches but none of them tested the players' physical and mental endurance or were as high-stakes as the 2012 final. Both players were hitting and sprinting just as hard 5 hours in as they were in game 1. It wasn't even considered physically possible until Nadal and Djokovic actually did it.
 

StrongRule

Talk Tennis Guru
Yeah, I kinda implied that:
I mean, Wawrinka had a lot more chances to win the match, it's not all about the bad call. Yeah, the call was terrible, and Djokovic didn't say anything (I laugh when somebody talks about his "good sportmanship"), but this is not the only reason why Wawrinka lost. Anyway, even if he challenged, the point would only be replayed.
 

King No1e

G.O.A.T.
Some of the crispiest tennis I've ever seen in my life.
baked-chicken-wings-5-1200.jpg


A match like this deserves some crispy wings to go along with it
 

StrongRule

Talk Tennis Guru
Yeah, I will never understand the people putting any of the last 3 matches over Djokodal. They were all outstanding matches but none of them tested the players' physical and mental endurance or were as high-stakes as the 2012 final. Both players were hitting and sprinting just as hard 5 hours in as they were in game 1. It wasn't even considered physically possible until Nadal and Djokovic actually did it.
Thing is, I don't remember any great points from AO 2012 final. The other matches clearly had some exciting points which are remembered for a long time.
 
I mean, Wawrinka had a lot more chances to win the match, it's not all about the bad call. Yeah, the call was terrible, and Djokovic didn't say anything (I laugh when somebody talks about his "good sportmanship"), but this is not the only reason why Wawrinka lost. Anyway, even if he challenged, the point would only be replayed.
If he challenged, the ball would have been shown to be out and the point would have gone to Stan.
 

Third Serve

Talk Tennis Guru
Yeah, I will never understand the people putting any of the last 3 matches over Djokodal. They were all outstanding matches but none of them tested the players' physical and mental endurance or were as high-stakes as the 2012 final. Both players were hitting and sprinting just as hard 5 hours in as they were in game 1. It wasn't even considered physically possible until Nadal and Djokovic actually did it.
Yeah, but the shotmaking was of excellent quality in the previous matches. The AO 2012 final was more of a war of attrition than anything else. I honestly can’t remember many points from the match.
 
D

Deleted member 758560

Guest
Thing is, I don't remember any great points from AO 2012 final. The other matches clearly had some exciting points which are remembered for a long time.
you're not a ultimate barometer.. so if someone don't remember anything it doesn't mean it didn't happen
 
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King No1e

G.O.A.T.
Thing is, I don't remember any great points from AO 2012 final. The other matches clearly had some exciting points which are remembered for a long time.
If you can't remember any points I suggest a rewatch ;)
The Nadal BH pass after barely returning a FH over the net in set 1, Djokovic's BHDTL after an epic rally in set 2, Nadal's inside-out FH and BHTDL winners to get back from 0-40 in set 4, Djo's massive running FH in the next game, Nadal's off-balance FH after a long rally in set 5, and ofc the 31-shot rally near the end.
 

King No1e

G.O.A.T.
No, it was the opposite situation. Wawrinka's shot was in, but it was called out. The challenge would show it was in, and since Djokovic touched the ball, the point would have been replayed. Here is a video:

Even if the point was replayed I don't think it was any foregone conclusion that Wawrinka would win it. It was obviously a bad call, but it didn't somehow stop Stan from winning.
 

StrongRule

Talk Tennis Guru
If you can't remember any points I suggest a rewatch ;)
The Nadal BH pass after barely returning a FH over the net in set 1, Djokovic's BHDTL after an epic rally in set 2, Nadal's inside-out FH and BHTDL winners to get back from 0-40 in set 4, Djo's massive running FH in the next game, Nadal's off-balance FH after a long rally in set 5, and ofc the 31-shot rally near the end.
For me this wasn't nearly as exciting as some points from the other matches. It felt like in the 2012 final both players were more suffering on court. Maybe it has to do with the fact that the court in 2012 was very slow.
 

King No1e

G.O.A.T.
For me this wasn't nearly as exciting as some points from the other matches. It felt like in the 2012 final both players were more suffering on court. Maybe it has to do with the fact that the court in 2012 was very slow.
Not to mention really hot, humid conditions. Both players were clearly suffering on the court, but they still produced exceptional quality tennis. Even if both players had negative W-UE ratios, they were still going back and forth in incredible rallies. Wasn't exactly the Isner-Mahut type of match.

Still, it's all a matter of opinion here. But I definitely call this match the GOAT, followed closely by Fedal W08 and McEnborg W80.
 

StrongRule

Talk Tennis Guru
That's what inexperience does to you.
No excuses here. Wawrinka was not even a young player who just started playing. He already played lots of matches against top players. This is what people forget. Truth is, he had the game to challenge Djokovic long before 2013, you could see this in some of their matches, especially on clay. But he had two problems: he couldn't hold the level for long enough time, and even when he did he kept losing the big points. (it happened many times in the past that he suddenly started missing easy shots, so him not serving for the second set wasn't unexpected)

In 2013 he fixed the first problem, in 2014 he fixed the second one.
 

StrongRule

Talk Tennis Guru
Not to mention really hot, humid conditions. Both players were clearly suffering on the court, but they still produced exceptional quality tennis. Even if both players had negative W-UE ratios, they were still going back and forth in incredible rallies. Wasn't exactly the Isner-Mahut type of match.

Still, it's all a matter of opinion here. But I definitely call this match the GOAT, followed closely by Fedal W08 and McEnborg W80.
Yes, it's a matter of opinion. I really can't put it above the other matches. As you mentioned, the match stats were also not very impressive.
 

King No1e

G.O.A.T.
No excuses here. Wawrinka was not even a young player who just started playing. He already played lots of matches against top players. This is what people forget. Truth is, he had the game to challenge Djokovic long before 2013, you could see this in some of their matches, especially on clay. But he had two problems: he couldn't hold the level for long enough time, and even when he did he kept losing the big points. (it happened many times in the past that he suddenly started missing easy shots, so him not serving for the second set wasn't unexpected)

In 2013 he fixed the first problem, in 2014 he fixed the second one.
Pre-2014 Wawrinka was just another mug like Berdych and Almagro
 

JaoSousa

Hall of Fame
Yeah, I will never understand the people putting any of the last 3 matches over Djokodal. They were all outstanding matches but none of them tested the players' physical and mental endurance or were as high-stakes as the 2012 final. Both players were hitting and sprinting just as hard 5 hours in as they were in game 1. It wasn't even considered physically possible until Nadal and Djokovic actually did it.
I guess it depends on the tennis that you like. Both Rafa and Novak were playing semi-agressive. If you like to see people blasting winners all over the place, dynamic tennis with lots of variety, then Safin-Federer, Federer-Nadal, and Nadal-Verdasco are the matches for you. But if you want to see two athletes going toe to toe, shot for shot, with seemingly unending endurance, then you would probably like Nadal-Djokovic, Djokovic Wawrinka, Roddick-El Aynaoui, etc.
 

Phoenix1983

G.O.A.T.
Yeah, I will never understand the people putting any of the last 3 matches over Djokodal. They were all outstanding matches but none of them tested the players' physical and mental endurance or were as high-stakes as the 2012 final. Both players were hitting and sprinting just as hard 5 hours in as they were in game 1. It wasn't even considered physically possible until Nadal and Djokovic actually did it.

People don't have to put Novak Djokovic No 1 all the time you know.
 

Fridge

Professional
You should have also included the 2009 Gasquet vs Gonzalez match. I think the fans were setting off smoke grenades or fireworks
 

fundrazer

G.O.A.T.
One of my personal favorites getting ignored from the list, Haas vs Safin 2002. :( And as guy above me just mentioned, the 2009 Gasquet Gonzo one is a classic too. Gasquet went to net almost a hundred times that match I think.

If #1 is the 2012 final...okay. For me it's not as exciting as many of the other great AO matches I've watched. Admittedly some of that is probably bias though... 2005 match the pace of play seems to be at a different level, and by what I mean by that is both guys are on their toes constantly due to the aggressive hitting from both. Every shot feels like it has a purpose whereas some of the grindier matches you feel like there's a lot of "filler." That, and both Federer and Safin are awesome at the aggressive baseline/all court style.
 

The Guru

Legend
Not to mention really hot, humid conditions. Both players were clearly suffering on the court, but they still produced exceptional quality tennis. Even if both players had negative W-UE ratios, they were still going back and forth in incredible rallies. Wasn't exactly the Isner-Mahut type of match.

Still, it's all a matter of opinion here. But I definitely call this match the GOAT, followed closely by Fedal W08 and McEnborg W80.
Looking at W-UE is such a bad way to judge match quality. Federer hit 26 winners in one set against one of if not the best returners and defenders of all time. Super high quality tennis right? Well it was the first set of AO 2020 SF. W-UE is just a horrible gauge of quality and entertainment value imo.
 

metsman

Talk Tennis Guru
Even if the point was replayed I don't think it was any foregone conclusion that Wawrinka would win it. It was obviously a bad call, but it didn't somehow stop Stan from winning.
If the ball wasn't called out to begin with Wawrinka would have had a very strong chance to win the point. He was screwed twice.
 

King No1e

G.O.A.T.
Looking at W-UE is such a bad way to judge match quality. Federer hit 26 winners in one set against one of if not the best returners and defenders of all time. Super high quality tennis right? Well it was the first set of AO 2020 SF. W-UE is just a horrible gauge of quality and entertainment value imo.
My point exactly. I'm sure Isner-Opelka matches have a superb W-UE ratios because they're always getting either aces or easy putaways. Doesn't somehow make those servebot-fests greater than the AO12 final.
 

AnOctorokForDinner

Talk Tennis Guru
Looking at W-UE is such a bad way to judge match quality. Federer hit 26 winners in one set against one of if not the best returners and defenders of all time. Super high quality tennis right? Well it was the first set of AO 2020 SF. W-UE is just a horrible gauge of quality and entertainment value imo.

One of the weirdest sets we remember though. Both were going from mug to amazing to mug back and forth.

Error demarcation and analysis is the problem/key since some styles and players lend themselves easier to 'unforced' errors than others. Pure W-UE tends to underrate defending somewhat, true. Most points can be analysed more than one way.
 

metsman

Talk Tennis Guru
Nadal-Verdasco is the clear #1.

As for the 2012 final, this is indeed an extremely overrated match. To be honest, I don't remember any great points from it.
The 2012 final was pretty good for the first 4 sets (if you like that style of tennis), but I feel like both guys wore down a bit in the 5th and it was a war of attrition, which Djokovic won, quite incredibly.
 

metsman

Talk Tennis Guru
My point exactly. I'm sure Isner-Opelka matches have a superb W-UE ratios because they're always getting either aces or easy putaways. Doesn't somehow make those servebot-fests greater than the AO12 final.
I mean obviously you have to compare the same tier of opponent. Isner/Opelka or 2020 Fed/Djokovic are not nearly on the same level as 12 Djokodal so it's comparing apples to oranges. Basically comparing stats that are accumulated in different leagues. However, 09 Fedal/Nadal-Fiasco or Safin/Fed are as players, even if the styles are different, so there it matters a bit more.
 

JoelSandwich

Hall of Fame
For me Nadal Djokovic is def the worst out of nadal Verdasco, Fed Nadal, Djokovic Stan, and Fed Safin but I understand the people who put it higher up
 

ibbi

G.O.A.T.
This is the kind of match that kicks ass if you just watch the highlights. Way too much of it was middle of the road, or worse.
 

metsman

Talk Tennis Guru
This is the kind of match that kicks ass if you just watch the highlights. Way too much of it was middle of the road, or worse.
I think the 4th was legit excellent but too much of the rest was a bit sloppy. Obviously the 5th set was very dramatic.
 
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