7-0 at Wimbledon or 9-0 at AO?

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reef58

Rookie
Slowtwitcher said:
You people do have issues with the facts.

FACT: nobody dreams of winning the AO. FACT: Plenty of players grew up dreaming of winning Wimbledon

Win Wimbledon once and you're a legend for life, just look at Goran. Is Thomas Johansson a legend? I. Don't. Think. So.
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I had no idea no one cares about winning AO. Seems to be a lot of buzz around a tournament no one cares about. That being said I agree WB is the most prestigious of them all. Order 2-4 is debatable.
 
Sunny Ali

Sunny Ali

Hall of Fame
PETEhammer said:
Lol, Pete was the dominator, not the dominated. The record stands at 0-3 (1-3 if we generously include Fed's semifinal win against an off-Nole)
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I'm really tempted to hammer the Federer fans that still bring up the age nonsense even after having witnessed what a nearly 34 year old man did to a 25 year old player in the peak of his strength and abilities in the Australian Open final last Sunday. Stop the age nonsense!
 
Slowtwitcher

Slowtwitcher

Hall of Fame
reef58 said:
I had no idea no one cares about winning AO. Seems to be a lot of buzz around a tournament no one cares about. That being said I agree WB is the most prestigious of them all. Order 2-4 is debatable.
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I didn’t use the word "care", did I? I believe that's called a strawman argument.
 
Adman

Adman

New User
The AO is becoming the modern slam that players and fans both like.

Right now, it has left the atrocious US Open behind, is par with the FO (which until the roof was a prehistoric relic) and follows only Wimbledon in popularity and prestige.
 
ForehandRF

ForehandRF

Hall of Fame
Sunny Ali said:
I'm really tempted to hammer the Federer fans that still bring up the age nonsense even after having witnessed what a nearly 34 year old man did to a 25 year old player in the peak of his strength and abilities in the Australian Open final last Sunday. Stop the age nonsense!
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Although I am not the one who says that age is paramount, I have to disagree with you here.One thing is to have a Medvedev in the finals, at nearly 34 and other thing is, at the same age, to have to deal with Djokovic playing some of his best tennis, like Fed had to deal in 2015.When it comes to the BIG 3, margins are small.
 
Sunny Ali

Sunny Ali

Hall of Fame
ForehandRF said:
Although I am not the one who says that age is paramount, I have to disagree with you here.One thing is to have a Medvedev in the finals, at nearly 34 and other thing is, at the same age, to have to deal with Djokovic playing some of his best tennis, like Fed had to deal in 2015.When it comes to the BIG 3, margins are small.
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Wonderful post Machan (y) What about the 2014 final? :)
 
PETEhammer

PETEhammer

Professional
ForehandRF said:
Djokovic insisted to choke the match away, but Federer didn't let him down.Both shaky, but in the end the one who could held off his nerves better and maintain focus in the 5th won.
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This is pretty much the story of Fed-Nole. They present no obvious matchup problems to each other, usually play exciting, tense matches that are a tossup, and Nole tends to win because of his better nerve/clutch.
 
NoleFam

NoleFam

Talk Tennis Guru
I'm amazed at both but for Djokovic to win 9 Slams on a hardcourt, where the competition has usually been tougher than on clay and grass because it's neutral, and never get defeated in a SF or F is beyond astonishing. I never dreamed he would achieve this when he won #2 back in 2011. This going to be so hard to top because most players are really good on hardcourt.
 
Beckerserve

Beckerserve

Hall of Fame
reef58 said:
It seems you are painting some sort of false narrative so you can post 100 times per day about FO2020 and 20-18. I think you have made your point. I am a Joker fan and have no salt. The 2020 FO was a dominant performance by Nadal. What else would you like to say about it? Be specific. Thanks
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My point is simple. Djokovic fans here think another AO has made him GOAT. Clearly he is 3rd of his era as 20-20-18 attests to. However when that is mentioned Djokovic fans here get grumpy and start trolling.
By all means they can celebrate a 9th AO. Goat claims though are nonsensical and allow for a response
 
Nole Slam

Nole Slam

Legend
Phoenix1983 said:
Wimbledon remains the pinnacle of the sport, no matter what others might state.

PETE's perfect 7 are therefore roughly equal to Djoker's 9 at the AO.
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Wait... If that is true, then what about Djokovic winning Wimbledon 5 times and Nadal only winning it 2 times?

I think that you just proved that Djokovic is greater than Nadal.
 
Eren

Eren

Professional
Sunny Ali said:
yes I agree that from a numbers perspective 9 is greater than 7 but numbers don't always tell the story. for example Federer has 8 Wimbledon titles which is one more than Sampras’ 7 yet Sampras is the greater Wimbledon champion because Federer lost three finals all to the same player and someone who loses so many times to the same player of his own generation cannot be considered the greatest at that tournament.
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In that case, Sampras lost to the guy who lost in three finals. Sampras was only 29 years then. If Sampras was so much better than Federer, why did he not win more than 7 finals?

The only thing that actually makes sense is to say that Sampras was better in his first seven finals than Federer since 7-0 > 6-1. At the end of the day, 8>7.

Spare the pathetic excuse about nutrition. In the 1900-1920 (before steroids were synthesised in labs) there were male and female bodybuilders who had impressive physiques. If those guys were good enough to do that with the nutrional knowledge of more than 100 years ago, Sampras has no excuses whatsoever. Not to say that building mass is the only physical trait a tennis player is looking for, cardio matters as well.

It's just that some idiots think that our nutrition knowledge has exploded since 2010 lol. Not the case at all. We're still in the dark for lots of things, one of them being nutrition.

Someone should actually make a thread on nutrition and examine what benefits 2000s players (which Federer belongs to) had relative to 1990s players. What 100% factual benefits (with no uncertainty around it) did those players have. Not much.

Sampras wasn't adviced to eat hamburgers from the McDonald's lol.
 
P

Phoenix1983

G.O.A.T.
Nole Slam said:
Wait... If that is true, then what about Djokovic winning Wimbledon 5 times and Nadal only winning it 2 times?

I think that you just proved that Djokovic is greater than Nadal.
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You won't believe me, but I was considering doing another thread about who was greater of the two. Every time Novak Djokovic gets within 2 slams of Nadal, I consider the topic.
 
NoleFam

NoleFam

Talk Tennis Guru
Slowtwitcher said:
You people do have issues with the facts.

FACT: nobody dreams of winning the AO. FACT: Plenty of players grew up dreaming of winning Wimbledon

Win Wimbledon once and you're a legend for life, just look at Goran. Is Thomas Johansson a legend? I. Don't. Think. So.
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If Johannson had the same history at AO that Goran had at Wimbledon by beating great champions, going deep in the tournament year after year, losing in 3 finals and 2 SFs, I guarantee you his legend at AO would be close to Goran's at Wimbledon. However, he never even made it to the QF in any other year than the year he won it so of course no one remembers him or his run really. Wimbledon is the most prestigious of the 4 but that doesn't mean winning the AO isn't as impressive.
 
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GabeT

GabeT

Legend
Beckerserve said:
Nadal won 2 Majors and ended no.1. What is there to forget. Federer won 2 Majors. Probably the year that ended Djokovic dreams
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I’m very happy to engage in banter but it has to be based in reality. The year that ended Djokovic dreams? Since then Novak has won 6 of 10 slams and remains the top player in the world. Nadal is disappearing as a force in HC and Novak is much better in grass. Why would Novak dreams be over?
 
Beckerserve

Beckerserve

Hall of Fame
GabeT said:
I’m very happy to engage in banter but it has to be based in reality. The year that ended Djokovic dreams? Since then Novak has won 6 of 10 slams and remains the top player in the world. Nadal is disappearing as a force in HC and Novak is much better in grass. Why would Novak dreams be over?
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Nadal is better at USO. Won it more recently than Djokovic. Nadal is a lock at FO. Djokovic just too far behind. He needs to get to 20 this year realistically. Not happening. He only has one 3 slam season. 2011.
 
GabeT

GabeT

Legend
Beckerserve said:
Nadal is better at USO. Won it more recently than Djokovic. Nadal is a lock at FO. Djokovic just too far behind. He needs to get to 20 this year realistically. Not happening. He only has one 3 slam season. 2011.
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we need to talk about today, not the past. If the USO started tomorrow Novak would be the favorite and by far. You thought Medvedev was the future and Novak was done for. Look what happened

and he doesn’t need to reach 20 this year (although it would be nice). He’s likely to play for several more years and is the favorite at three of the slams.

oh, and Novak had two 3 slam seasons (2011 and 2015). Nadal had only one (2010)
 
Eren

Eren

Professional
Beckerserve said:
Nadal is better at USO. Won it more recently than Djokovic. Nadal is a lock at FO. Djokovic just too far behind. He needs to get to 20 this year realistically. Not happening. He only has one 3 slam season. 2011.
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I admire the enthusiasm. As a Federer fan, I want Fed to have the record and if not, then Nadal.

But Djokovic will reach >20 in no time tbh.

He has no competitors at Wimbledon and can handle anyone at the AO for years to come it seems. Nadal has the FO, but that alone is too little to be the record holder for a long time I am afraid.

USO between Djokovic and Nadal is a 50/50 IMO.
 
Eren

Eren

Professional
GabeT said:
we need to talk about today, not the past. If the USO started tomorrow Novak would be the favorite and by far. You thought Medvedev was the future and Novak was done for. Look what happened

and he doesn’t need to reach 20 this year (although it would be nice). He’s likely to play for several more years and is the favorite at three of the slams.

oh, and Novak had two 3 slam seasons (2011 and 2015). Nadal had only one (2010)
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Pretty much this. I still think USO is a 50/50 match if they meet in the finals. Just my hunch. AO and Wimbledon clearly for Djokovic and RG clearly Nadal.
 
GabeT

GabeT

Legend
Eren said:
Pretty much this. I still think USO is a 50/50 match if they meet in the finals. Just my hunch. AO and Wimbledon clearly for Djokovic and RG clearly Nadal.
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If they meet in the final i expect a battle but hard to gloss over the fact that Nadal hasn’t so much as won a set off Novak in HCs for years now. There was a time when Nadal posed a clear threat to Novak outside of clay. I think those times are gone.
 
Eren

Eren

Professional
GabeT said:
If they meet in the final i expect a battle but hard to gloss over the fact that Nadal hasn’t so much as won a set off Novak in HCs for years now. There was a time when Nadal posed a clear threat to Novak outside of clay. I think those times are gone.
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If you put it that way, I guess you're right. I still want to see another USO final between the two.
 
Beckerserve

Beckerserve

Hall of Fame
GabeT said:
we need to talk about today, not the past. If the USO started tomorrow Novak would be the favorite and by far. You thought Medvedev was the future and Novak was done for. Look what happened

and he doesn’t need to reach 20 this year (although it would be nice). He’s likely to play for several more years and is the favorite at three of the slams.

oh, and Novak had two 3 slam seasons (2011 and 2015). Nadal had only one (2010)
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If if if. The USO is not in February. It is September. Nadal will always be favoured over Djokovic has history shows he is better there. Djokovic is favourite at 2 of 4 slams. But what does it matter. Winning counts. Not being favourite. As we saw in FO 2020 and USO 2020 for example.
 
Beckerserve

Beckerserve

Hall of Fame
Eren said:
I admire the enthusiasm. As a Federer fan, I want Fed to have the record and if not, then Nadal.

But Djokovic will reach >20 in no time tbh.

He has no competitors at Wimbledon and can handle anyone at the AO for years to come it seems. Nadal has the FO, but that alone is too little to be the record holder for a long time I am afraid.

USO between Djokovic and Nadal is a 50/50 IMO.
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This hypothetical stuff is odd. For Djokovic every year is he will do this wont do that and every year bar 2011 and 2015 he falls short of these projected goals.
He is too far behind Nadal and Federer. The assumption that the Next Gen are just walkovers is so misguided. After the next FO Nadal probably has a 3 slam lead. Im not saying he will but he is as much a lock at RG as any sportsperson is at any event. There is no way Djokovic pulls back a 3 Major gap.
Djokovic messed up last year.
 
GabeT

GabeT

Legend
Beckerserve said:
This hypothetical stuff is odd. For Djokovic every year is he will do this wont do that and every year bar 2011 and 2015 he falls short of these projected goals.
He is too far behind Nadal and Federer. The assumption that the Next Gen are just walkovers is so misguided. After the next FO Nadal probably has a 3 slam lead. Im not saying he will but he is as much a lock at RG as any sportsperson is at any event. There is no way Djokovic pulls back a 3 Major gap.
Djokovic messed up last year.
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He is one slam ahead of Federer and one behind Nadal. Come on, you can do better than that!
 
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