A 38-year old player is the world no 3. Weak era?

NatF

Bionic Poster
Yes, I do. Annacone and Gullickson period Pete were vastly different tactical players, as anyone familiar with Pete knows.
EDIT: It's rich to hear it from a Fedfan that I'm trying to have my cake and eat it too, i.e. the entire psychology of your fanbase.
More generalisations. You Fed haters have become what you hate o_O

"10x the player."

"Players overall weren't as good."

But yeah Pete just meant he just hit a harder second serve and approached more :unsure: :-D

Being able to hit your serve harder is definitely technical btw.
 

SaintPetros

Hall of Fame
More generalisations. You Fed haters have become what you hate o_O

"10x the player."

"Players overall weren't as good."

But yeah Pete just meant he just hit a harder second serve and approached more :unsure: :-D

Being able to hit your serve harder is definitely technical btw.
The article you cited literally said right after the quotes about 10x the player blah blah that Pete clarified what he meant as going bigger on the 2nd and approaching behind it more...LOL!
EDIT: No, it's not, most pros can go way bigger on their serves than they do and choose not to. Has nothing to do with technique.
 
ROFLMAOboy definitely needs a bigger head(size). I don't pull out my Radicals for slackers.
:
:unsure:
It may be called for shortly.

It is rare that a GPPD thread breaches 1,000 posts. More than halfway there now.

Who will bring it home? Wasn't going to intrude on their mano-a-mano but others entered the fray.

The only thing is... Can a free-for-all royal rumble carry on for another day or two?! o_Oo_Oo_O:oops:
 

NatF

Bionic Poster
The article you cited literally said right after the quotes about 10x the player blah blah that Pete clarified what he meant as going bigger on the 2nd and approaching behind it more...LOL!
EDIT: No, it's not, most pros can go way bigger on their serves than they do and choose not to. Has nothing to do with technique.
Pete says the players were getting better as he got older too. So much for that weak era.

And lol if you think Sampras was referring to only tactical changes for why he was 10x the player later on. I've reread the article and he actually says he became a more effective e.g. better volleyer because he came in more. So that would be a technical improvement...

On the serve he does say the second serve becoming a weapon he could approach behind was worth the extra doubles so it looks like that at least was mindset.
 

NatF

Bionic Poster
Come on man. The wind only blew for Federer
Refer back to Djokovic's match with Ferrer at the USO and theb stop talking out your backside. Wind was obviously there for both but it's called an equaliser for a reason.

I can't imagine the amount of whining and excuses from your fanbase if Djokovic was 2-1 up with the momentum and then had to come back and play the next day in a hurricane.
 

SaintPetros

Hall of Fame
Pete says the players were getting better as he got older too. So much for that weak era.

And lol if you think Sampras was referring to only tactical changes for why he was 10x the player later on. I've reread the article and he actually says he became a more effective e.g. better volleyer because he came in more. So that would be a technical improvement...

On the serve he does say the second serve becoming a weapon he could approach behind was worth the extra doubles so it looks like that at least was mindset.
I actually never said the 2000-2003 era was weak. That's something that's said here on TT, but I've been pretty consistent: 2004-2007 was the Great Weak Era.
On the volleys, it sounds like he's saying he became a more effective volleyer because he came in behind his second serve more, i.e. he was set up for success by the serve which had become bigger as a result of him going for it more. That's how I take it at least.
Having said all this, I do think Pete got better in some ways as he got older. His main issue was injury, stamina, and lack of commitment to training. Once he broke the record, his motivation also decreased.
Will you ever hear Fedfans saying that Fed has gotten better than what he was during his "prime", or even acknowledge what their own hero says about himself?
 

Noleberic123

G.O.A.T.
Refer back to Djokovic's match with Ferrer at the USO and theb stop talking out your backside. Wind was obviously there for both but it's called an equaliser for a reason.

I can't imagine the amount of whining and excuses from your fanbase if Djokovic was 2-1 up with the momentum and then had to come back and play the next day in a hurricane.
Djokovic has been skrewed by poor scheduling enough.
 

SaintPetros

Hall of Fame
Refer back to Djokovic's match with Ferrer at the USO and theb stop talking out your backside. Wind was obviously there for both but it's called an equaliser for a reason.

I can't imagine the amount of whining and excuses from your fanbase if Djokovic was 2-1 up with the momentum and then had to come back and play the next day in a hurricane.
Okay, so peakiest of peak Feds had to go 5 with grandPassi under "equalized" conditions...how has this changed anything?
 

SaintPetros

Hall of Fame
Refer back to Djokovic's match with Ferrer at the USO and theb stop talking out your backside. Wind was obviously there for both but it's called an equaliser for a reason.

I can't imagine the amount of whining and excuses from your fanbase if Djokovic was 2-1 up with the momentum and then had to come back and play the next day in a hurricane.
Also, you realize the ONLY reason I brought up this whole match with Agassi was because your fanbase was using the Wimbledon final as proof that Djokovic wasn't a worthy #1, right?
 
@SaintPetros

Are you aware of the goals for the thread in terms of quantity?

We're targeting 1,000 posts. It's not impossible.

But your efforts will be key.

Sir, are you willing to sustain the battle for a minimum of 10 more hours, consecutively?
 

NatF

Bionic Poster
I actually never said the 2000-2003 era was weak. That's something that's said here on TT, but I've been pretty consistent: 2004-2007 was the Great Weak Era.
On the volleys, it sounds like he's saying he became a more effective volleyer because he came in behind his second serve more, i.e. he was set up for success by the serve which had become better as a result of him going for it more. That's how I take it at least.
Having said all this, I do think Pete got better in some ways as he got older. His main issue was injury, stamina, and lack of commitment to training. Once he broke the record, his motivation also decreased.
Will you ever hear Fedfans saying that Fed has gotten better than what he was during his "prime", or even acknowledge what their own hero says about himself?
I cba anymore lol.

I think Fed has improved some aspects but not enough to counter act clear decline in others. I don't care what he or Sampras says about being better when they're older...Having said that I've never denied Federer is still a very high level.

As far as weak eras go unlike some I prefer not to bash eras and players. All I'll say is people in glasses houses shouldn't throw stones. All great players have easy draws and harder ones, that's what happens when you're on top for so long.
 

NatF

Bionic Poster
Okay, so peakiest of peak Feds had to go 5 with grandPassi under "equalized" conditions...how has this changed anything?
I don't think you understand the expression great equaliser. Perhaps you're just being facetious instead of dense though.
 

Noleberic123

G.O.A.T.
I cba anymore lol.

I think Fed has improved some aspects but not enough to counter act clear decline in others. I don't care what he or Sampras says about being better when they're older...Having said that I've never denied Federer is still a very high level.

As far as weak eras go unlike some I prefer not to bash eras and players. All I'll say is people in glasses houses shouldn't throw stones. All great players have easy draws and harder ones, that's what happens when you're on top for so long.
After seeing what a 32 year old Djokovic can do how have you not changed your opinion
 

SaintPetros

Hall of Fame
Alright, I understand what you're driving at.

But whence the salt?

Never got the full story from you.

I've got nothing against Pete Sampras. U-S-A, brother!

But Federer has left him in the dust. Have you come to terms with it?
On the surface, sure. More slams, more weeks #1 etc. (though not more YE#1 which is big, and PETE'S were consecutive, also big)
PETE'S a generational GOAT, which is all anyone can objectively be GOAT of.
Fred's a generational bronze medalist/slam vulture.
 
Busy moving goal posts for Fed with "2004-2007" weak era theory. Been going on and on for last one month. It means only one thing.
Is he bringing anything new to the table?

We are some seasoned keyboard warriors up in this piece.

And no stone has been left unturned.

What I'm getting at is that I'd really rather give this fellow a sporting chance.
 
On the surface, sure. More slams, more weeks #1 etc. (though not more YE#1 which is big, and PETE'S were consecutive, also big)
PETE'S a generational GOAT, which is all anyone can objectively be GOAT of.
Fred's a generational bronze medalist/slam vulture.
You are pursuing your case aggressively.

But the backstory cannot simply be left untended.

You have promised time and again to come clean. Yet now you are refusing?

What are your origins? :unsure:
 

AceSalvo

Legend
Is he bringing anything new to the table?

We are some seasoned keyboard warriors up in this piece.

And no stone has been left unturned.

What I'm getting at is that I'd really rather give this fellow a sporting chance.
I do feel some pity when I see people grasping at straws. At some point the straw gives out. The fellow is past that evidently.
 

NatF

Bionic Poster
Also, you realize the ONLY reason I brought up this whole match with Agassi was because your fanbase was using the Wimbledon final as proof that Djokovic wasn't a worthy #1, right?
The only reason you care so much is because you're bitter Federer took most of Sampras' records and you don't think Sampras' awesome record speaks for itself. And before you say it I'm aware of why so many Fedfsns hate on Nadal and Djokovic too...
 

NatF

Bionic Poster
After seeing what a 32 year old Djokovic can do how have you not changed your opinion
What can 32 year old Djokovic do that 2015 or 2011 Djokovic couldn't do better? All these guys are playing very well in their 30's but I don't believe any of them are better than ever.
 

SaintPetros

Hall of Fame
The only reason you care so much is because you're bitter Federer took most of Sampras' records and you don't think Sampras' awesome record speaks for itself. And before you say it I'm aware of why so many Fedfsns hate on Nadal and Djokovic too...
Not really actually. I'm happy with what Pete did. Again, I've been pretty consistent on my reasons for posting: to counter the Fedfanatic fanbase's hype machine which would put out the narrative that the current top players are the best in the history of the sport (each GOAT coming after the other, within a span of 10 years, no less lol).
I'd be more than happy if we all just accepted generational GOATs and put aside the overall "GOAT" argument - course that wouldn't sit well with Fedfans because then Fed will play second or even third fiddle.
 

Fedforever

Hall of Fame
Hitting EvilPetros outta the ground.
I missed 2005 Federer first time round (had just had a baby) but love watching the videos now. I know he had better results in other years but he just plays like he's loving every shot. Ultimate in sexy tennis.
 
Not really actually. I'm happy with what Pete did. Again, I've been pretty consistent on my reasons for posting: to counter the Fedfanatic fanbase's hype machine which would put out the narrative that the current top players are the best in the history of the sport.
I'd be more than happy if we all just accepted generational GOATs and put aside the overall "GOAT" argument.
But why on earth have you taken up this battle on July 27, 2019?

Had sufficient time passed by then for formulation of initial arguments?
 

AceSalvo

Legend
I missed 2005 Federer first time round (had just had a baby) but love watching the videos now. I know he had better results in other years but he just plays like he's loving every shot. Ultimate in sexy tennis.
Exactly. Fed's FH has been in the rearview mirror for quite some time. He still manages to win matches because of his sexy tennis.
 

Noleberic123

G.O.A.T.
What can 32 year old Djokovic do that 2015 or 2011 Djokovic couldn't do better? All these guys are playing very well in their 30's but I don't believe any of them are better than ever.
2019 Djokovic is pretty much a mentally tougher 2012-2014 Djokovic. Back then he was a mental midget. My point is Djokovic is playing as well as he did in his prime. Not as well as 2011 or 2015 but those kinds of years don't happen very often.
 

Fedforever

Hall of Fame
Fedfanatic fanbase's hype machine which would put out the narrative that the current top players are the best in the history of the sport.
Thats's more a Djokovic fan thing. Fed fans can have their own daft arguments but generally we're not guilty of that one.
 

NatF

Bionic Poster
Not really actually. I'm happy with what Pete did. Again, I've been pretty consistent on my reasons for posting: to counter the Fedfanatic fanbase's hype machine which would put out the narrative that the current top players are the best in the history of the sport.
I'd be more than happy if we all just accepted generational GOATs and put aside the overall "GOAT" argument.
Sure, all this hate is because of the Fed fans lol. Not fooling anyone. Also the Nadal and Djokovic fans are just as blatant with their "Best era ever" garbage. There have been people putting Nadal and Djokovic above Sampras since they ere on like 12 slams. Hell Nadal has even said what Sampras played wasn't tennis - as opposed to Fed who idolised Sampras.

Yet Federer is the only one you go after...

Yeah you're basic mate.
 

SaintPetros

Hall of Fame
But why on earth have you taken up this battle on July 27, 2019?

Had sufficient time passed by then for formulation of initial arguments?
Why didn't you take up the point I raised about Peakerer needing 5 sets to handle Grandpassi on your thread about Djokovic needing 5 sets to handle Federer? lmao
 

NatF

Bionic Poster
2019 Djokovic is pretty much a mentally tougher 2012-2014 Djokovic. Back then he was a mental midget. My point is Djokovic is playing as well as he did in his prime. Not as well as 2011 or 2015 but those kinds of years don't happen very often.
Djokovic under achieved in those years though, there was nothing GKAT'y about 2012-2014 besides a few epic wins.

I'd argue Djokovic is clearly not playing as well as 2011 and 2015 anyway, certainly not with the same consistency.
 

SaintPetros

Hall of Fame
Sure, all this hate is because of the Fed fans lol. Not fooling anyone. Also the Nadal and Djokovic fans are just as blatant with their "Best era ever" garbage. There have been people putting Nadal and Djokovic above Sampras since they ere on like 12 slams. Hell Nadal has even said what Sampras played wasn't tennis - as opposed to Fed who idolised Sampras.

Yet Federer is the only one you go after...

Yeah you're basic mate.
I see a lot more respect from Nadalovic fans towards Petros than Fedfans. Simple as that. Fedfans around here still take huge self-validating dukes on Pete like he did something to them personally.
 
Why didn't you take up the point I raised about Peakerer needing 5 sets to handle Grandpassi on your thread about Djokovic needing 5 sets to handle Federer? lmao
How many questions have you dodged since I entered the fray here?

By my count, it is at least 72.

Must we return to the drawing board until we become physically ill?
 

AceSalvo

Legend
Sure, all this hate is because of the Fed fans lol. Not fooling anyone. Also the Nadal and Djokovic fans are just as blatant with their "Best era ever" garbage. There have been people putting Nadal and Djokovic above Sampras since they ere on like 12 slams. Hell Nadal has even said what Sampras played wasn't tennis - as opposed to Fed who idolised Sampras.

Yet Federer is the only one you go after...

Yeah you're basic mate.
"I'd be more than happy if we all just accepted generational GOATs and put aside the overall "GOAT" argument "

Thats the trick. Somehow, blend Fed into all the others even though Fed has played/achieved way beyond that with the competition he faced.

Fed greater than Sampras is not on the table.
 

Noleberic123

G.O.A.T.
Djokovic under achieved in those years though, there was nothing GKAT'y about 2012-2014 besides a few epic wins.

I'd argue Djokovic is clearly not playing as well as 2011 and 2015 anyway, certainly not with the same consistency.
His performance at the AO is certainly worthy
 

SaintPetros

Hall of Fame
"I'd be more than happy if we all just accepted generational GOATs and put aside the overall "GOAT" argument "

Thats the trick. Somehow, blend Fed into all the others even though Fed has played/achieved way beyond that with the competition he faced.
This has been considered the reasonable stance until individuals such as yourself moved the goalposts (out of fear of Feddie's records being struck down by Djokovic within a year or two)
 

NatF

Bionic Poster
I see a lot more respect from Nadalovic fans towards Petros than Fedfans. Simple as that. Fedfans around here still take huge self-validating dukes on Pete like he did something to them personally.
Maybe get some glasses. A lot of Fed fans liked Pete first. Maybe if you trolled less there would be less negativity thrown back at you.
 
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